Author Topic: See you in heaven, Coach - Pope Francis  (Read 1307 times)

SF1900

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See you in heaven, Coach - Pope Francis
« on: May 22, 2013, 11:21:16 PM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/22/pope-francis-good-atheists_n_3320757.html

Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds today when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists.

During his homily at Wednesday Mass in Rome, Francis emphasized the importance of "doing good" as a principle that unites all humanity, and a "culture of encounter" to support peace.

Using scripture from the Gospel of Mark, Francis explained how upset Jesus' disciples were that someone outside their group was doing good, according to a report from Vatican Radio.

“They complain,” the Pope said in his homily, because they say, “If he is not one of us, he cannot do good. If he is not of our party, he cannot do good.” And Jesus corrects them: “Do not hinder him, he says, let him do good.” The disciples, Pope Francis explains, “were a little intolerant,” closed off by the idea of ​​possessing the truth, convinced that “those who do not have the truth, cannot do good.” “This was wrong . . . Jesus broadens the horizon.” Pope Francis said, “The root of this possibility of doing good – that we all have – is in creation”

Pope Francis went further in his sermon to say:

"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can... "The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!".. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”

Responding to the leader of the Roman Catholic church's homily, Father James Martin, S.J. wrote in an email to The Huffington Post:

"Pope Francis is saying, more clearly than ever before, that Christ offered himself as a sacrifice for everyone. That's always been a Christian belief. You can find St. Paul saying in the First Letter to Timothy that Jesus gave himself as a "ransom for all." But rarely do you hear it said by Catholics so forcefully, and with such evident joy. And in this era of religious controversies, it's a timely reminder that God cannot be confined to our narrow categories."

Of course, not all Christians believe that those who don't believe will be redeemed, and the Pope's words may spark memories of the deep divisions from the Protestant reformation over the belief in redemption through grace versus redemption through works.

The pope's comment has also struck a chord on Reddit, where it is the second most-shared piece.

More from Reuters:

Atheists should be seen as good people if they do good, Pope Francis said on Wednesday in his latest urging that people of all religions - or no religion - work together.

The leader of the world's 1.2 billion Roman Catholics made his comments in the homily of his morning Mass in his residence, a daily event where he speaks without prepared comments.

He told the story of a Catholic who asked a priest if even atheists had been redeemed by Jesus.

"Even them, everyone," the pope answered, according to Vatican Radio. "We all have the duty to do good," he said.

"Just do good and we'll find a meeting point," the pope said in a hypothetical conversation in which someone told a priest: "But I don't believe. I'm an atheist."


Francis's reaching out to atheists and people who belong to no religion is a marked contrast to the attitude of former Pope Benedict, who sometimes left non-Catholics feeling that he saw them as second-class believers.
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Roger Bacon

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2013, 11:24:22 PM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/22/pope-francis-good-atheists_n_3320757.html

Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds today when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists.

During his homily at Wednesday Mass in Rome, Francis emphasized the importance of "doing good" as a principle that unites all humanity, and a "culture of encounter" to support peace.

Using scripture from the Gospel of Mark, Francis explained how upset Jesus' disciples were that someone outside their group was doing good, according to a report from Vatican Radio.

“They complain,” the Pope said in his homily, because they say, “If he is not one of us, he cannot do good. If he is not of our party, he cannot do good.” And Jesus corrects them: “Do not hinder him, he says, let him do good.” The disciples, Pope Francis explains, “were a little intolerant,” closed off by the idea of ​​possessing the truth, convinced that “those who do not have the truth, cannot do good.” “This was wrong . . . Jesus broadens the horizon.” Pope Francis said, “The root of this possibility of doing good – that we all have – is in creation”

Pope Francis went further in his sermon to say:

"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can... "The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!".. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”

Responding to the leader of the Roman Catholic church's homily, Father James Martin, S.J. wrote in an email to The Huffington Post:

"Pope Francis is saying, more clearly than ever before, that Christ offered himself as a sacrifice for everyone. That's always been a Christian belief. You can find St. Paul saying in the First Letter to Timothy that Jesus gave himself as a "ransom for all." But rarely do you hear it said by Catholics so forcefully, and with such evident joy. And in this era of religious controversies, it's a timely reminder that God cannot be confined to our narrow categories."

Of course, not all Christians believe that those who don't believe will be redeemed, and the Pope's words may spark memories of the deep divisions from the Protestant reformation over the belief in redemption through grace versus redemption through works.

The pope's comment has also struck a chord on Reddit, where it is the second most-shared piece.

More from Reuters:

Atheists should be seen as good people if they do good, Pope Francis said on Wednesday in his latest urging that people of all religions - or no religion - work together.

The leader of the world's 1.2 billion Roman Catholics made his comments in the homily of his morning Mass in his residence, a daily event where he speaks without prepared comments.

He told the story of a Catholic who asked a priest if even atheists had been redeemed by Jesus.

"Even them, everyone," the pope answered, according to Vatican Radio. "We all have the duty to do good," he said.

"Just do good and we'll find a meeting point," the pope said in a hypothetical conversation in which someone told a priest: "But I don't believe. I'm an atheist."


Francis's reaching out to atheists and people who belong to no religion is a marked contrast to the attitude of former Pope Benedict, who sometimes left non-Catholics feeling that he saw them as second-class believers.

That's something that's always kind of annoyed me about religions.  If Heaven exists, I don't want to go if certain people I like/love aren't going.

I took a religious test and it said I should be a Jew.  :o

SF1900

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2013, 11:24:59 PM »
That's something that's always kind of annoyed me about religions.  If Heaven exists, I don't want to go if certain people I like/love aren't going.

I took a religious test and it said I should be a Jew.  :o


According to the pope it does not matter any more.  :-X :-X :D :D
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Coach is Back!

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2013, 11:27:10 PM »
Who said athiests cannot be good people? As I've said. I'm not catholic. I disagree with with that , that is NOT what the bible states.

SF1900

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2013, 11:29:36 PM »
Who said athiests cannot be good people? As I've said. I'm not catholic. I disagree with with that , that is NOT what the bible states.

 

Does not the bible state that one must accept JC in order to go to heaven?  :-X :-X Or something of the like. Those may not be the exact words, but from what I know, one must accept JC to make it to the pearly gates.
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Roger Bacon

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2013, 11:29:55 PM »
Who said athiests cannot be good people? As I've said. I'm not catholic. I disagree with with that , that is NOT what the bible states.


Coach, I'm not trying to start a debate and I don't care either way...  Just curious, and I know this is a typical douche bag question...

What happens to babies/retarded people/native islanders and others that don't know about Christianity and can't be saved?

???


Coach is Back!

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2013, 11:31:20 PM »
 

Does not the bible state that one must accept JC in order to go to heaven?  :-X :-X Or something of the like. Those may not be the exact words, but from what I know, one must accept JC to make it to the pearly gates.

In the catholic religion, it works + faith.

Roger Bacon

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2013, 11:31:50 PM »
http://www.beliefnet.com/Entertainment/Quizzes/BeliefOMatic.aspx

My results

1. Liberal Quaker
2. Unitarian Universalist
3. Reform Judaism

calfzilla

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2013, 11:39:57 PM »
Coach, I'm not trying to start a debate and I don't care either way...  Just curious, and I know this is a typical douche bag question...

What happens to babies/retarded people/native islanders and others that don't know about Christianity and can't be saved?

???



Great groups of people.  :)

Roger Bacon

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2013, 11:42:06 PM »

99 Bananas

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2013, 11:42:44 PM »
“Visualize for a moment sand dunes. And notice, when you look at these sand dunes in your mind, that they look like wind. Sand dunes look like wind in some sense.

“Well, then analyze the situation: what is wind? Wind is a pressure variant phenomena that fluctuates over time. In a way, the sand grains moved about by the wind are like a lower dimensional slice of the wind itself. And from photographic analysis of dunes, you can calculate the speed and duration of the wind that made them. So the dune is a lower dimensional slice of time, of the wind ebbing and flowing that made it.”Now lets change the metaphor a little bit. Instead of grains of sand, let’s think of genes; instead of a windstorm, let’s think of a billion years of evolution. It moves the genes around in a pattern, which is a lower dimensional slice of the force which created the situation.

“In other words, on every living organism there is the imprint of the higher dimensional force which made it. Now, somebody could say, ‘Well, that’s God.’ Well, but in a scientific context, we don’t speak like that. But whatever it is that made blind matter into whales, squirrels and human beings, it left its calling card inside each human being, each squirrel, each whale.''

Bad Boy Dazza

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2013, 12:35:28 AM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/22/pope-francis-good-atheists_n_3320757.html

Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds today when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists.

This is nothing new.  It's catholic theology.  Just that the American press is pretty ignorant.

cephissus

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2013, 12:42:59 AM »
 

Does not the bible state that one must accept JC in order to go to heaven?  :-X :-X Or something of the like. Those may not be the exact words, but from what I know, one must accept JC to make it to the pearly gates.

It does not, as far as I know, say this.  This is something I was always confused on, having read the Bible cover to cover.  I'm not sure why protestants believe you just need to say a prayer in which you "accept Jesus", and then, that's it, you're going to heaven, no more questions asked! (unless, of course, if you slander the holy spirit)

???

Roger Bacon

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Re: See you in heaven, Coach.
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2013, 01:36:16 AM »
It does not, as far as I know, say this.  This is something I was always confused on, having read the Bible cover to cover.  I'm not sure why protestants believe you just need to say a prayer in which you "accept Jesus", and then, that's it, you're going to heaven, no more questions asked! (unless, of course, if you slander the holy spirit)

???

I don't think Methodists are big on being saved or saying you accept Jesus either, but I could be wrong? ???