For Any Getbigger Considering Becoming a Lawlyer

[syntaxmachine]

The average junior lawlyer's salary is $79,362, while their average debt load from their lawlerly studies is $100,584. [1,2] Meanwhile, only about half of law school graduates can expect to land in a job requiring a law degree due to the disastrous oversupply of graduates relative to positions available. [3] So, all things being equal, the average graduate's expected salary qua lawlyer is about $40K.

The US Senate recently passed a bill linking graduate student loan interest rates to 10-year Treasury rates (10 year T-rate + 3.6% = grad interest rate) and capping them at 9.5%. [4] 10-year Treasury rates are expected to increase in the not too distant future, given the slowly improving economy and the gradual winding up of The Federal Reserve's QE. Consistent with this narrative, 10-year rates have increased ~66% over the last year. [5] In other words, if current trends continue, within a couple of years the average lawl school graduate will be paying the full 9.5% on her $100K loan.

The moral is this: if you're anything like the average lawl school graduate, you shouldn't go to lawl school -- unless, that is, the idea of paying roughly 25% of your expected salary (the said 9.5% of your $100K loan) in interest payments alone towards non-dischargeable debt is attractive to you, all whilst figuring out whether you even like being a lawyer in the first place. If you hate lawlyering, you've made a horrendous mistake, but then again, even if you do like it, your investment is unlikely to achieve a positive return.

Moral: you better be fucking sure you're significantly above average before going! (I'd say you ought to be able to get into the top 10-20 schools just to be extra safe. Otherwise, there are simply too many other options available to justify the cost)

1 http://www1.salary.com/Attorney-I-Salary.html

2 http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/03/23/law-students-how-much-debt-do-you-want/

3 http://www.salon.com/2013/04/06/law_school_is_a_sham/

4 http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_STUDENT_LOANS?SITE=MYPSP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-17-19-32-40

5 http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us/

[Army of One]

Lawlz

[Big Chiro Flex]

Aren't you a lawyer/law student syntax?

[ESFitness]

Correction...

Only go go law school if you're jewish and have a job waiting for you BEFORE you start law school.


- or, you could just start your own practice. I train a couple lawyers. The lawyer 'salary' doesn't include the under-the-table money they take in.

Lawyers are snakes though, like taddle-tales. I'd rather have my children become engineers. Instead of building something better, Americans build shit products and we run to the cops and courts and SUE people. Fucking cowards, and bloodsucking leaches.

[Kwon_2]

Lawlz

Lawlz indeed!




"Lawlyer..."

[Dokey111]

.

[Kwon_2]

"Ruthless" Robbie Lawler VS "Vicious" Bobby Voelker

SHUTDOWN!

[kh300]

My GF is a lawyer in her own firm with 3 other partners. She don't make that much money. I'd say 100k which is more then me and thats all that matters. What a shitty job though. Work all fucking day then work at home the rest of the night. Girl can barley spare 10 minutes for a blow job.

[njflex]

ASK 333336666663333666666666 ....

[Skeletor]

I hope this thread doesn't get deleted.

[Teutonic Knight]

Anabolichalo have "some" of Lawyers potential 
he's was considering morticians career 

[arce1988]

[Abacab]

[OneMoreRep]

I know a few lawyers and from what they say, unless you go into corporate law, it just isn't worth it.

Most lawyers that go into corporate law in New York City, start off at around 125K and can see serious salary increases over small increments of time.

Aside from that specialty, I am not too sure how much the average lawyer makes, but have heard that lawyers practicing criminal law can start off at 50K (insulting, as I've heard criminal law is one of the most complicated forms of law to study and practice).

Actual lawyers on the forum feel free to correct me if I am wrong..
"1"

[O.Z.]

The average junior lawlyer's salary is $79,362, while their average debt load from their lawlerly studies is $100,584. [1,2] Meanwhile, only about half of law school graduates can expect to land in a job requiring a law degree due to the disastrous oversupply of graduates relative to positions available. [3] So, all things being equal, the average graduate's expected salary qua lawlyer is about $40K.

The US Senate recently passed a bill linking graduate student loan interest rates to 10-year Treasury rates (10 year T-rate + 3.6% = grad interest rate) and capping them at 9.5%. [4] 10-year Treasury rates are expected to increase in the not too distant future, given the slowly improving economy and the gradual winding up of The Federal Reserve's QE. Consistent with this narrative, 10-year rates have increased ~66% over the last year. [5] In other words, if current trends continue, within a couple of years the average lawl school graduate will be paying the full 9.5% on her $100K loan.

The moral is this: if you're anything like the average lawl school graduate, you shouldn't go to lawl school -- unless, that is, the idea of paying roughly 25% of your expected salary (the said 9.5% of your $100K loan) in interest payments alone towards non-dischargeable debt is attractive to you, all whilst figuring out whether you even like being a lawyer in the first place. If you hate lawlyering, you've made a horrendous mistake, but then again, even if you do like it, your investment is unlikely to achieve a positive return.

Moral: you better be fucking sure you're significantly above average before going! (I'd say you ought to be able to get into the top 10-20 schools just to be extra safe. Otherwise, there are simply too many other options available to justify the cost)

1 http://www1.salary.com/Attorney-I-Salary.html

2 http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/03/23/law-students-how-much-debt-do-you-want/

3 http://www.salon.com/2013/04/06/law_school_is_a_sham/

4 http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_STUDENT_LOANS?SITE=MYPSP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-17-19-32-40

5 http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us/

lol, fishing again

[MAXX]

don't know why but they call me the rainmaker up in the firms

[Rhino]

Here in Canada a lot of the people that went to law school became cops and corrections. Cops and corrections get crazy pay here. Spoiled Union fuckers. So they fall back on cops or corrections. States does not pay so good for cops and corrections so yaa... Make sure you're exceptional :/

[syntaxmachine]

Most lawyers that go into corporate law in New York City, start off at around 125K and can see serious salary increases over small increments of time.

Aside from that specialty, I am not too sure how much the average lawyer makes, but have heard that lawyers practicing criminal law can start off at 50K (insulting, as I've heard criminal law is one of the most complicated forms of law to study and practice).

My analysis was misleading because it used a single average value that ranges over all lawyers; the reality is that the distribution has two peaks (i.e., is bimodal): one with mostly 'public interest' lawyers, and one for the sort of elite lawyer you refer to. Public interest lawyers earn shit for pay ($40-60K) but get loan forgiveness after 10 years of consistent payments -- as long as they stay put in the same type of job, with the same shit pay. The elite peak, meanwhile, hovers around ~160K but represents only 14% of lawyers.

So, add to the fact that the prospective law school student has only a 50% chance of landing a job that requires a JD anyway -- in which case they could have earned a relevant masters degree in the field they did end up in and make more money that way -- they also face the challenge of avoiding ending up as another piece of lawlerly detritus on the mountain of shit salaries along the left side of the distribution (a challenge which they will fail, probabilistically speaking).



But this just reinforces my initial prescription: people shouldn't go at all unless they are really certain they are above average (the best metric being the schools they can get into), unless they just can't imagine being anything other than a public interest attorney or some such.

[oldtimer1]

There is a saturation of lawyers. Sure if you are one of the few to get a corporate business to hire you then you could make decent money. These jobs are competitive to get and the openings are few. New lawyers need not apply.  There isn't that many jobs to go around. The big money is being a certified trial attorney. Most lawyers are not certified and cannot get into this big money field. Most are working like dogs doing house closings and municipal court. They also get paid when they refer someone to a certified trial attorney. Most law school graduates are lucky if they break a 100K after 5 years of work. The few that make money in law suits are the ones with the money. About 5 guys on my job are lawyers and they do it on the side knowing the money is better on my occupation.

[BIG AL MCKECHNIE]

Over in the UK the number of law firms which have shrunk drastically or merged with others or simply gone bust is amazing over the past 5 years. One of the best known chains of lawyers specialising in house purchase deals went bust last year after it was revealed they had stolen client funds to remain afloat.
I have used one corporate firm and one family firm for years. Both have lost 75% of their associates and partners since 2008 and these 2 firms actually merged this year. They now have 10% of the office space they both occupied before. They were all hit so badly when the private and corporate property deals dried up in the credit crunch.
Funnily enough, the accounting firms have not been hit so hard. Apart from Arthur Anderson a few years back the rest of the big 4 plus smaller firms are doing fine and graduate accountants are still in demand.
Seems like accounting and engineering are the degrees to go for these days if you actually want a job at the end of it.

[HockeyFightFan]

The average junior lawlyer's salary is $79,362, while their average debt load from their lawlerly studies is $100,584. [1,2] Meanwhile, only about half of law school graduates can expect to land in a job requiring a law degree due to the disastrous oversupply of graduates relative to positions available. [3] So, all things being equal, the average graduate's expected salary qua lawlyer is about $40K.

The US Senate recently passed a bill linking graduate student loan interest rates to 10-year Treasury rates (10 year T-rate + 3.6% = grad interest rate) and capping them at 9.5%. [4] 10-year Treasury rates are expected to increase in the not too distant future, given the slowly improving economy and the gradual winding up of The Federal Reserve's QE. Consistent with this narrative, 10-year rates have increased ~66% over the last year. [5] In other words, if current trends continue, within a couple of years the average lawl school graduate will be paying the full 9.5% on her $100K loan.

The moral is this: if you're anything like the average lawl school graduate, you shouldn't go to lawl school -- unless, that is, the idea of paying roughly 25% of your expected salary (the said 9.5% of your $100K loan) in interest payments alone towards non-dischargeable debt is attractive to you, all whilst figuring out whether you even like being a lawyer in the first place. If you hate lawlyering, you've made a horrendous mistake, but then again, even if you do like it, your investment is unlikely to achieve a positive return.

Moral: you better be fucking sure you're significantly above average before going! (I'd say you ought to be able to get into the top 10-20 schools just to be extra safe. Otherwise, there are simply too many other options available to justify the cost)

1 http://www1.salary.com/Attorney-I-Salary.html

2 http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/03/23/law-students-how-much-debt-do-you-want/

3 http://www.salon.com/2013/04/06/law_school_is_a_sham/

4 http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_STUDENT_LOANS?SITE=MYPSP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-17-19-32-40

5 http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us/

Plus the rent they make for owning space in someone's mind.

333386 is whupping you like a redheaded step child.

[Thespritz0]

.

^^
BEST response so far!!!!!