why do people make the drastic change to veganism

[cephissus]

Jesus fuck Christ, what do you "think" is wrong with you now?  

Dont worry, i know its not rational

I planned to switch back several times (most recently at the end of the year), but I keep deciding to push it back.

[gib]

Evolution.

I can eat meat AND plants and get every nutrient needed.

You will inevitably need a vitamin supplement if you are Vegan.

You are saying that only killing things with flesh is wrong.

Like plants are not also living things?

They have been proven to show something similar to pain in studies. So it's ok to harm living plants but not things of meat.

I get it.

If you eat a balanced diet you won't need any supplement. But even if you did, you could buy a multivitamine tablet.

Plants don't have feelings. They don't have a sense of consciousness. It's idiotic to use a belief that "plants have feeling too" to justify the abuse, torture, exploitation and murder of animals. Come on and think sensibly...

[TuHolmes]

How vegans think.

[Parker]

If you eat a balanced diet you won't need any supplement. But even if you did, you could buy a multivitamine tablet.

Plants don't have feelings. They don't have a sense of consciousness. It's idiotic to use a belief that "plants have feeling too" to justify the abuse, torture, exploitation and murder of animals. Come on and think sensibly...

Try yelling and cursing at a plant for 1 week. And see what happens.

[gib]

I've cut out animal products from my diet out of health concerns.

The environmental argument is a little compelling, don't know how accurate the propaganda is though.

Its only normal for people to react to an alternate principle with hostility (see 90% of the responses in thus thread).  I used to react the same way, now I'd rather just see for myself.  Beats making braindead arguments about 'evolution' and 'vitamin supplements' anyway.

I did it out of moral concerns, realizing that there was no way I could justify continuing to hurt others.

But the health benefits have been great. Lost around 5kg initially but that stabilised. Energy levels and strength went through the roof and overall wellbeing is great.

Unlike some vegans who are "grossed out" by dead animal flesh, much like a poedifile trying to suppress his urges but not act on them, I still actually do enjoy the taste of meat - a good steak etc. But morally it cannot be justified (unless the animal has been accidentally killed). Sometimes is someone has meat left over I might eat that, justifying it by knowing that it would otherwise have been thrown away.

From a health perspective it's beyond argument the we eat, as a society much much much more than is "needed" (and quite arguable that it's not needed at all).

[TuHolmes]

I did it out of moral concerns, realizing that there was no way I could justify continuing to hurt others.

But the health benefits have been great. Lost around 5kg initially but that stabilised. Energy levels and strength went through the roof and overall wellbeing is great.

Unlike some vegans who are "grossed out" by dead animal flesh, much like a poedifile trying to suppress his urges but not act on them, I still actually do enjoy the taste of meat - a good steak etc. But morally it cannot be justified (unless the animal has been accidentally killed). Sometimes is someone has meat left over I might eat that, justifying it by knowing that it would otherwise have been thrown away.

From a health perspective it's beyond argument the we eat, as a society much much much more than is "needed" (and quite arguable that it's not needed at all).

So you are a hypocrite.

Got it.

[Parker]

I did it out of moral concerns, realizing that there was no way I could justify continuing to hurt others.

But the health benefits have been great. Lost around 5kg initially but that stabilised. Energy levels and strength went through the roof and overall wellbeing is great.

Unlike some vegans who are "grossed out" by dead animal flesh, much like a poedifile trying to suppress his urges but not act on them, I still actually do enjoy the taste of meat - a good steak etc. But morally it cannot be justified (unless the animal has been accidentally killed). Sometimes is someone has meat left over I might eat that, justifying it by knowing that it would otherwise have been thrown away.

From a health perspective it's beyond argument the we eat, as a society much much much more than is "needed" (and quite arguable that it's not needed at all).

The Inca's and other mesoamericans had a diet that revolved around maize. This caused health issues due to carbs/sugar. I believe Indians (from India) have diabetic issues due to the carbs/sugar from their mostly vegan type diets. Correct me if I am wrong.
Pure carnivorism and pure veganism are extremes, and extremism is bad. What is good is moderation, the middle.

[gib]

So you are a hypocrite.

Got it.

No. I'm being honest.

But please explain how is this being a hypocrite?

[TuHolmes]

No. I'm being honest.

But please explain how is this being a hypocrite?

You are saying how eating meat is a moral choice and you choose to not do it, but yet you do it anyway and convince yourself that it's ok because it would go to waste.

If you have to convince yourself that something wrong is ok, that's hypocritical as hell.

[gib]

It's not about not eating meat. It's about not harming others to fulfill this desire.

If a being has already been killed then rather than having its body parts thrown away I think it's ok to make use of them. But I don't think it's right to kill others in the first place simply to satisfy the totally selfish desire of eating them.

[TuHolmes]

So by your logic, it's ok to eat the meat because I get it at the grocery store and it's already dead.

Don't want it to go to waste after all.

[gib]

So by your logic, it's ok to eat the meat because I get it at the grocery store and it's already dead.

Don't want it to go to waste after all.

Classic example of a stupid person trying to make an intelligent argument. I'll let you think about it a little and work it out ...

[TuHolmes]

Classic example of a stupid person trying to make an intelligent argument. I'll let you think about it a little and work it out ...

So you have no response except "Well you're stupid."

I'll take that.

You see your false logic, but you won't admit it. It's cool.

Enjoy your vegan lifestyle.

[gib]

I'll give you a little clue to help work it out...

Supply and demand.

Stop the demand and then supply will stop also.

This applies whether it's elephant ivory, Japanese whale killings, monkey laboratory experiments, animal butchery.

[TuHolmes]

Please don't.

You are not going to convince enough people to not eat meat to stop the demand for the supply so your "point" that you are trying so hard to make is ridiculous.

In the US, vegans are 1.9% of the population. So please please tell me you are going to get that number up to double digits sometime.

Meat is going to always be eat. To try to pretend otherwise is ridiculous.

Again, you're just convincing yourself you aren't a hypocrite, but really, you are. Sorry man, but that's just reality.

If you were truly completely as good as you claim, you wouldn't eat it no matter what.

I have a friend, she's a Vegan.

She NEVER eats meat. She's also not an uptight bitch about it. We eat PB&Js and tomato soup when we grab lunch. It's fine, but she knows I would never do that on a regular basis.

Also, please stop trying to compare pedophilia to eating meat.  It completely renders your point moot because on NO level is even remotely the same... no matter how much you wish it was.

I worry about someone who can actually compare the two actually. It's a bit off.

[gib]

Please don't.

You are not going to convince enough people to not eat meat to stop the demand for the supply so your "point" that you are trying so hard to make is ridiculous.

In the US, vegans are 1.9% of the population. So please please tell me you are going to get that number up to double digits sometime.

Meat is going to always be eat. To try to pretend otherwise is ridiculous.

Again, you're just convincing yourself you aren't a hypocrite, but really, you are. Sorry man, but that's just reality.

If you were truly completely as good as you claim, you wouldn't eat it no matter what.

I have a friend, she's a Vegan.

She NEVER eats meat. She's also not an uptight bitch about it. We eat PB&Js and tomato soup when we grab lunch. It's fine, but she knows I would never do that on a regular basis.

Also, please stop trying to compare pedophilia to eating meat.  It completely renders your point moot because on NO level is even remotely the same... no matter how much you wish it was.

I worry about someone who can actually compare the two actually. It's a bit off.

Sorry man. Just because you have a vegan as a friend, it doesn't make it any more right morally for you to eat meat. That's a bit like saying it's ok to be racist as I have a black friend.

Nor does the fact that many people in the US eat meat make it morally right do to so. That's a but like nazies in Germany saying that because the majority supported killing Jews it was right to do so.

And just because you say you couldn't never stop eating meat on regular basis does not make it morally right either. That's like a poedifile justifying his rapes because he "could never stop".

Let me ask you, on what basis do you think it's right to kill others for your selfish pleasure? Don't you think us big tough get bigges should be standing up for the weak and try to prevent abuse of those weaker than ourselves? (Whether it's animals, kids, the elderly etc).

[TuHolmes]

Sorry man. Just because you have a vegan as a friend, it doesn't make it any more right morally for you to eat meat. That's a bit like saying it's ok to be racist as I have a black friend.

Nor does the fact that many people in the US eat meat make it morally right do to so. That's a but like nazies in Germany saying that because the majority supported killing Jews it was right to do so.

And just because you say you couldn't never stop eating meat on regular basis does not make it morally right either. That's like a poedifile justifying his rapes because he "could never stop".

Let me ask you, on what basis do you think it's right to kill others for your selfish pleasure? Don't you think us big tough get bigges should be standing up for the weak and try to prevent abuse of those weaker than ourselves? (Whether it's animals, kids, the elderly etc).

Seriously man... comparing eating meat with pedophilia is quite disturbing.

How you can even make that connection says a lot about you.

It's not my job to protect anyone but my family.

Comparing people to wild animals is just simply not the same. No matter how much you wish it to be.

My point in mentioning my Vegan friend isn't to act like I'm cool be cause I have one or not be "racist" as you say... It's to simply say that she would think you're a preachy lunatic.

[polychronopolous]

Seriously man... comparing eating meat with pedophilia is quite disturbing.

How you can even make that connection says a lot about you.

It's not my job to protect anyone but my family.

Comparing people to wild animals is just simply not the same. No matter how much you wish it to be.

My point in mentioning my Vegan friend isn't to act like I'm cool be cause I have one or not be "racist" as you say... It's to simply say that she would think you're a preachy lunatic.

Wtf?? These people are fucking weirdos!! 

[cephissus]

Meat is going to always be eat. To try to pretend otherwise is ridiculous.

I wouldn't be so sure.  While I don't think vegans will ever change anything, synthetic food is already pretty much interchangeable with 'the real thing' in many contexts.   Farming cows and stuff is a pretty ridiculously convoluted task.  I think we'll have more efficient processes in place soon, and on a large scale.  Hell, the 'meat crumbles' I ate tonight were cheaper than some types of ground beef, and I'm willing to bet the average person wouldn't know the difference in a prepared dish.

I wouldn't be surprised if eating real meat became something of a hobby for eccentrics/rich in the near-ish future.

[SuperTed]

I wouldn't be so sure.  While I don't think vegans will ever change anything, synthetic food is already pretty much interchangeable with 'the real thing' in many contexts.   Farming cows and stuff is a pretty ridiculously convoluted task.  I think we'll have more efficient processes in place soon, and on a large scale.  Hell, the 'meat crumbles' I ate tonight were cheaper than some types of ground beef, and I'm willing to bet the average person wouldn't know the difference in a prepared dish.

I wouldn't be surprised if eating real meat became something of a hobby for eccentrics/rich in the near-ish future.

The problem with veganism at the moment is that since it's only followed by a small percentile, not many places cater properly for it. If vegan alternatives were more easily accessible and mainstream, I think many (including myself) would make the switch.

[Weedlejuice]

instead of buying meat from local producers with good ethics

particularly those who have been exposed to mass production meat and dairy, the black twins, dana bailey husband, etc

Vegans rarely take reality and priorities into consideration.

Majority of them are suburban upper class kids that have the time and money (parents money) to be filling their pantries with meat alternative's and pounding out their own nut butter, just so they can laud over everyone else for the most part.

Make the vegan lifestyle as cheap and convenient as the mainstay, garuntee the veg and fruit isn't being stolen, mass produced by underpaid third world slaves that get their land polluted and i'd have no problem converting.

There is no positive without negative, we have a responsibility to our kind and our families before chickens and sheep.

We're all totally fucked at the end of the day anyway.

[wes]

I don`t care to see the slaughter,but still I eat the meat! 

[FitnessFrenzy]

instead of buying meat from local producers with good ethics

particularly those who have been exposed to mass production meat and dairy, the black twins, dana bailey husband, etc

some people go vegan after inhaling a lot of paint fumes and taking weed from strippers mixed with PCP

[mazrim]

So you have no response except "Well you're stupid."

I'll take that.

You see your false logic, but you won't admit it. It's cool.

Enjoy your vegan lifestyle.

Yeah, his argument makes absolutely no sense. If he's so extreme in comparing pedophiles to meat eaters his argument basically comes out to saying cannibilism is wrong but if the body is lying there I guess I'll eat it so it doesn't go to waste. Probably takes home leftovers of his friends at restaurants and freezes them, then takes them out for a treat once on awhile.

[The True Adonis]

I wouldn't be so sure.  While I don't think vegans will ever change anything, synthetic food is already pretty much interchangeable with 'the real thing' in many contexts.   Farming cows and stuff is a pretty ridiculously convoluted task.  I think we'll have more efficient processes in place soon, and on a large scale.  Hell, the 'meat crumbles' I ate tonight were cheaper than some types of ground beef, and I'm willing to bet the average person wouldn't know the difference in a prepared dish.

I wouldn't be surprised if eating real meat became something of a hobby for eccentrics/rich in the near-ish future.

I agree.

I would LOVE synthetic meat, lab grown.  You could have the most perfect cut of beef on demand without any harm to animals.  The problem though is it would harm rural America because their economies are built on farming.