Author Topic: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad  (Read 2037 times)

dorkeroo

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Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« on: July 29, 2007, 12:23:12 PM »
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/017573.php

Why should this surprise anyone? No effort was made at Gitmo to disabuse them of jihadist sympathies.

"Freed Guantanamo inmates take up arms," from The Age (thanks to all who sent this in):

    AT LEAST 30 former Guantanamo Bay detainees have been killed or recaptured after taking up arms against allied forces following their release.

    They have been discovered mostly in Afghanistan and Pakistan, but not in Iraq, a US Defence Department spokesman told The Age yesterday.

    Commander Jeffrey Gordon said the detainees had, while in custody, falsely claimed to be farmers, truck drivers, cooks, small-arms merchants, low-level combatants or had offered other false explanations for being in Afghanistan.

    "We are aware of dozens of cases where they have returned to militant activities, participated in anti-US propaganda or engaged in other activities," said Commander Gordon.

I am not an American, but, this has got to piss people off that not only are the troops not being given the respect they deserve in many instances, but that they are also being forced to fight the same enemies more than once.

headhuntersix

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2007, 01:17:10 PM »
Which just proves that the libs and media need to shut up sometimes and allows us to do what we have to do.
L

CARTEL

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2007, 09:08:41 PM »
Which just proves that the libs and media need to shut up sometimes and allows us to do what we have to do.

Agreed.

chaos

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2007, 09:13:35 PM »
Which just proves that the libs and media need to shut up sometimes and allows us to do what we have to do.
agreed also
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

24KT

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2007, 12:14:15 AM »
Which just proves that the libs and media need to shut up sometimes and allows us to do what we have to do.

BS - Libs and media weren't in Gitmo. If there was a screw-up, don't blame the media.

btw, ...You're kidding yourself is you don't think being kidnapped, sold for ransom, transported to a penal colony halfway around the world to be both held & tortured indefinately wouldn't inspire a bit of desire for payback? The NIE said it themselves, ...the invasion is creating more of them, not destroying them. You can't kill a fire-breathing hydra by chopping it's head off. Sooner or later, you're going to get burned.
w

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2007, 02:07:31 AM »
I've been trying to point this stuff out since day one... To me, it's obvious as hell... Gitmo and these other detention facilities are basically radicalization camps...  If they didn't belong to a radical organization before, they're sure to afterward.  If they did, they will with greater ferver than before...  What American, under an occupation and detention and humiliating treatment wouldn't get out and seek payback... Oh you know it...  But then again so do the people organizing this crap...  Everything is going according to plan I'm sure ::)

Decker

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2007, 07:26:57 AM »
I find it amazing that this would surprise anyone.  Berserker's point is true.  Short of killing everyone, we have to have a somewhat more sophisticated approach to battling terrorism and eliminating the things that create new terrorists.

"No effort was made at Gitmo to disabuse them of jihadist sympathies."

1.  Is it possible to beat it out of them?

2.  Is the detention creating the hatred of america?

If they are a threat to the US and actively battling the US when they were detained, why not try them and lock them up?  Why release them?


Sounds really strange to me.

Al Doggity

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2007, 07:41:33 AM »
Short of killing everyone, we have to have a somewhat more sophisticated approach to battling terrorism and eliminating the things that create new terrorists.

Our approach to battling terrorism  IS pretty sophisticated.

As long as we're fighting them over there, they can't come over here.




OzmO

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2007, 08:33:30 AM »
Our approach to battling terrorism  IS pretty sophisticated.

As long as we're fighting them over there, they can't come over here.






That's not true at all.   It's an incorrect assumption based in Iraq war propaganda from war supporters.   Al Queda is as strong now as it was pre 9/11.  We didn't finish the job in Afghanistan and opened a new can of worms in Iraq.   We could have close to finished them off in Afghanistan but instead we opened a new play ground for them in Iraq.     

Fighting them there doesn't keep them over there.  We react to THEIR attacks over there for the most part.  If we knew where they were like we did in Afghanistan it would be all but over.( and in BUSH's brilliance we screwed that up)   But we don;t know where they are because Al Queda is all over the place in every country their. 

I agree our tactics in fighting this war seem to be working, but don;t think for second that's why we have no attacks here in the USA, because this country is just as vulnerable to an attack as it was pre-9/11.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2007, 12:08:09 PM »
Our approach to battling terrorism  IS pretty sophisticated.

As long as we're fighting them over there, they can't come over here.




lololololol... yea....

Al Doggity

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2007, 12:30:59 PM »
That's not true at all.   It's an incorrect assumption based in Iraq war propaganda from war supporters.   Al Queda is as strong now as it was pre 9/11.  We didn't finish the job in Afghanistan and opened a new can of worms in Iraq.   We could have close to finished them off in Afghanistan but instead we opened a new play ground for them in Iraq.     

Fighting them there doesn't keep them over there.  We react to THEIR attacks over there for the most part.  If we knew where they were like we did in Afghanistan it would be all but over.( and in BUSH's brilliance we screwed that up)   But we don;t know where they are because Al Queda is all over the place in every country their. 

I agree our tactics in fighting this war seem to be working, but don;t think for second that's why we have no attacks here in the USA, because this country is just as vulnerable to an attack as it was pre-9/11.


I was actually kidding. I guess I should have put one of these ::) after it, but I'm philosophically opposed to smiley icons.

A lot of really stupid people have stated that if we fight them there, they can't come here, so I just assumed everyone would get the joke.

I'm not a supporter of the Bush administration or this war and I don't think it's been particularly well-fought.


OzmO

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2007, 01:29:11 PM »

I was actually kidding. I guess I should have put one of these ::) after it, but I'm philosophically opposed to smiley icons.

A lot of really stupid people have stated that if we fight them there, they can't come here, so I just assumed everyone would get the joke.

I'm not a supporter of the Bush administration or this war and I don't think it's been particularly well-fought.



Yeah,  after reading some of your other posts on this forum i was a bit puzzled.   

You'd be surprised how many people really believe what you said there and have professed it in debates on this board over the last year.

Camel Jockey

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2007, 09:07:46 PM »
Most of the gitmo inmates are bad apples, but some aren't. No one should be thrown into a prison without a proper trail.

This stuff is complicated.. But the invading of foreign countries has to stop first with a full pullout of Iraq. Not practical as the US has put too much into Iraq to leave with nothing. I hope conflict with Iran is avoided(even though they're a bunch of crazy fucks).

US is still the good guy in the end. Those people in the mideast, n. africa and pakistan are the bad guys no matter what amount of oil we take or what nations we invade. When you stand for individual civil liberties and stuff like seperation of church and state, then you are far superior to a bunch of fa ggots who are angry, stupid and base their entire lives on fairy tales from the middle east.

24KT

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2007, 03:16:36 AM »
Most of the gitmo inmates are bad apples, but some aren't. No one should be thrown into a prison without a proper trail.

This stuff is complicated.. But the invading of foreign countries has to stop first with a full pullout of Iraq. Not practical as the US has put too much into Iraq to leave with nothing. I hope conflict with Iran is avoided(even though they're a bunch of crazy fucks).

US is still the good guy in the end. Those people in the mideast, n. africa and pakistan are the bad guys no matter what amount of oil we take or what nations we invade. When you stand for individual civil liberties and stuff like seperation of church and state, then you are far superior to a bunch of fa ggots who are angry, stupid and base their entire lives on fairy tales from the middle east.

Can you be more specific, ...to which group is one far superior to...

Islamic fundamentalist extremists   or   American evangelical Christian fundamentalists?

Based on your description, it's difficult to distinguish which group you're disparaging.
w

headhuntersix

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2007, 08:46:05 AM »
Yeah ok Jag..equating Christian Fundemantalists to Islamic shitbag suicide bombers....if Bush was fighting the Nazi's u'd siide with them as well. A small percentage of the guys in those camps might not desrve to be there, but I'm not willing to take that chance...fuck them, we're at war. The alternative is a nuke cloud in an American city. Canada would be next. Christian wacko's are not, on a daily basis, killing Americans'. Your average Mosque in most Islamic countries preach hate, whether its against America, The West, Christians, Jews, Israel, Women, education, etc etc etc. Your average Christian church is talking about the next potluck supper or pancake breakfast. You have a few who target abortionists, a few who have commited murders. They've been delt with. The two groups are not the same in any way shape or form. One preaches hate on a mass level, one is a fringe movement. One has mass appeal, one is a marginalized group. Most Chritian fundy's rant at church and thats where its stops. The rags go out and kill somebody after it.
L

Al-Gebra

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2007, 08:50:45 AM »
Yeah ok Jag..equating Christian Fundemantalists to Islamic shitbag suicide bombers....if Bush was fighting the Nazi's u'd siide with them as well. A small percentage of the guys in those camps might not desrve to be there, but I'm not willing to take that chance...fuck them, we're at war. The alternative is a nuke cloud in an American city. Canada would be next. Christian wacko's are not, on a daily basis, killing Americans'. Your average Mosque in most Islamic countries preach hate, whether its against America, The West, Christians, Jews, Israel, Women, education, etc etc etc. Your average Christian church is talking about the next potluck supper or pancake breakfast. You have a few who target abortionists, a few who have commited murders. They've been delt with. The two groups are not the same in any way shape or form. One preaches hate on a mass level, one is a fringe movement. One has mass appeal, one is a marginalized group. Most Chritian fundy's rant at church and thats where its stops. The rags go out and kill somebody after it.

now why would you even respond to that dimwit?

Camel Jockey

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2007, 09:00:21 AM »
christian fundies are less evil.. worst they could do = prevent some chick I knocked up from having an abortion..

I hate both, but I'm going to pick the side that'll allows me to keep my lifestyle and my ideals.

Quote
then you are far superior to a bunch of fa ggots who are angry, stupid and base their entire lives on fairy tales from the middle east.

On purpose you missed the entire point of the post. One side is better than the other, can't you see that? Nobody's a fucking saint, but you gotta pick one.

headhuntersix

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2007, 09:07:29 AM »
Yeah I know.....but she always takes the anti-American side. Its crazy.
L

24KT

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2007, 09:22:16 AM »
Yeah I know.....but she always takes the anti-American side. Its crazy.

Who took an anti-American side. Turn the programming off for a minute?
I simply asked for clarification. He could have been referring to the congregation of Westboro baptist church.
w

Al-Gebra

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #19 on: July 31, 2007, 09:24:00 AM »

don't stoop to conquer, hh6.

Colossus_500

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2007, 09:53:21 AM »
From the London Times http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article2169795.ece

Guantanamo cell is better than freedom, says inmate fighting against release
Sean O’Neill

An inmate of Guantanamo Bay who spends 22 hours each day in an isolation cell is fighting for the right to stay in the notorious internment camp.

Ahmed Belbacha fears that he will be tortured or killed if the United States goes ahead with plans to return him to his native Algeria.

The Times has learnt that Mr Belbacha, who lived in Britain for three years, has filed an emergency motion at the US Court of Appeals in Washington DC asking for his transfer out of Guantanamo to be halted. He was cleared for release from Camp Delta in February and his lawyers believe that his return to Algerian custody is imminent.

Mr Belbacha says that if he returns to Algeria, he faces the threat of torture by security services and murder by Islamist terrorists.

Zachary Katznelson, senior counsel with the human rights lawyers Reprieve and Mr Belbacha’s lawyer, has asked the US courts to block any transfer. “Ahmed is being held in camp six, the harshest part of Guantanamo,” he said. “His cell is all steel, there are no windows, he is not allowed to communicate with other prisoners and he gets just two hours exercise each day in a metal cage.

“He says his cell in Guantanamo is like a grave and that although it sounds crazy he would rather stay in those conditions than go back to Algeria. The fact is that he is really, really scared about what might happen to him in Algeria.”

Mr Belbacha, 38, fled Algeria in 1999 at the height of the brutal civil war between the Armed Islamic Group (GIA) and the Algerian Government.

He was an accountant for a state-owned oil company, Sonatrach, when he was called for a second spell of military service. The call-up was followed by death threats to him and his family from the GIA, which killed thousands of state employees during the 1990s.

Mr Belbacha went first to France and then to Britain, where he applied for asylum. He was given exceptional leave to remain pending the outcome of his application.

He lived in Bournemouth, Dorset, and worked as a cleaner at the Highcliff Hotel, where he cleaned John Prescott’s room during the 1999 Labour Party conference. The former Deputy Prime Minister left him a thank-you note and a £30 tip.

Mr Belbacha claims that in July 2001 he was persuaded by friends to go to Pakistan to undertake religious study. While there he crossed the border into Afghanistan.

When the US-led invasion began in response to the September 11 attacks he crossed back into Pakistan. He claims that in December 2001 he was apprehended by villagers near Peshawar, in northwest Pakistan, and sold to the authorities for a bounty.

American agents took him to a prison camp near Kandahar where, Mr Belbacha says, he was repeatedly beaten. In March 2002 he was flown to what was then Camp X-Ray at the US naval base in Cuba.

A military tribunal alleged that he had associated with the Taleban in Afghanistan and ruled that his detention was justified. But in February this year the US deemed him fit for release.

Mr Katznelson said: “Even though the Americans say he poses no threat, Ahmed fears that he has the stamp of Guantanamo Bay on him and he will be treated by the authorities as a terrorist if he is returned to Algeria.

“It is a bizarre situation because the reason he left in the first place was because the Islamist terrorists were threatening to kill him.”

Reprieve has asked the British Government to accept Mr Belbacha’s return here, but ministers have repeatedly said that they will intervene only in the cases of Guantanamo detainees who are British citizens.

Mr Belbacha lost his British asylum claim in 2003 because he failed to turn up for the hearing. Mr Katznelson said: “Ahmed knows he could be stuck in Guantanamo for a long time. However, he could be released tomorrow if the British Government would allow him to come back here.”

Mr Belbacha’s appeal to stay was rejected by a district court last week after the judge ruled that she had no jurisdiction in the case, despite believing the strength of his claims. His lawyers are prepared to go to the Supreme Court to prevent his transfer.

The men who wait

2002 The detention centre at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, opened

750 men have been held there

360 remain

7 Britons were freed in 2004-05

7 British residents are still there

95% Proportion of Guantanamo detainees who posed at least a “potential threat”

Sources: Amnesty International, US Dept of Defence, Times archive, Reprieve

headhuntersix

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #21 on: August 01, 2007, 08:45:54 AM »
Jag u knew exactly what he was refering to.....
L

Dos Equis

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Re: Freed Guantanamo inmates return to jihad
« Reply #22 on: August 01, 2007, 10:00:52 AM »
From the London Times http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article2169795.ece

Guantanamo cell is better than freedom, says inmate fighting against release
Sean O’Neill

An inmate of Guantanamo Bay who spends 22 hours each day in an isolation cell is fighting for the right to stay in the notorious internment camp.

Ahmed Belbacha fears that he will be tortured or killed if the United States goes ahead with plans to return him to his native Algeria.

The Times has learnt that Mr Belbacha, who lived in Britain for three years, has filed an emergency motion at the US Court of Appeals in Washington DC asking for his transfer out of Guantanamo to be halted. He was cleared for release from Camp Delta in February and his lawyers believe that his return to Algerian custody is imminent.

Mr Belbacha says that if he returns to Algeria, he faces the threat of torture by security services and murder by Islamist terrorists.

Zachary Katznelson, senior counsel with the human rights lawyers Reprieve and Mr Belbacha’s lawyer, has asked the US courts to block any transfer. “Ahmed is being held in camp six, the harshest part of Guantanamo,” he said. “His cell is all steel, there are no windows, he is not allowed to communicate with other prisoners and he gets just two hours exercise each day in a metal cage.

“He says his cell in Guantanamo is like a grave and that although it sounds crazy he would rather stay in those conditions than go back to Algeria. The fact is that he is really, really scared about what might happen to him in Algeria.”

Mr Belbacha, 38, fled Algeria in 1999 at the height of the brutal civil war between the Armed Islamic Group (GIA) and the Algerian Government.

He was an accountant for a state-owned oil company, Sonatrach, when he was called for a second spell of military service. The call-up was followed by death threats to him and his family from the GIA, which killed thousands of state employees during the 1990s.

Mr Belbacha went first to France and then to Britain, where he applied for asylum. He was given exceptional leave to remain pending the outcome of his application.

He lived in Bournemouth, Dorset, and worked as a cleaner at the Highcliff Hotel, where he cleaned John Prescott’s room during the 1999 Labour Party conference. The former Deputy Prime Minister left him a thank-you note and a £30 tip.

Mr Belbacha claims that in July 2001 he was persuaded by friends to go to Pakistan to undertake religious study. While there he crossed the border into Afghanistan.

When the US-led invasion began in response to the September 11 attacks he crossed back into Pakistan. He claims that in December 2001 he was apprehended by villagers near Peshawar, in northwest Pakistan, and sold to the authorities for a bounty.

American agents took him to a prison camp near Kandahar where, Mr Belbacha says, he was repeatedly beaten. In March 2002 he was flown to what was then Camp X-Ray at the US naval base in Cuba.

A military tribunal alleged that he had associated with the Taleban in Afghanistan and ruled that his detention was justified. But in February this year the US deemed him fit for release.

Mr Katznelson said: “Even though the Americans say he poses no threat, Ahmed fears that he has the stamp of Guantanamo Bay on him and he will be treated by the authorities as a terrorist if he is returned to Algeria.

“It is a bizarre situation because the reason he left in the first place was because the Islamist terrorists were threatening to kill him.”

Reprieve has asked the British Government to accept Mr Belbacha’s return here, but ministers have repeatedly said that they will intervene only in the cases of Guantanamo detainees who are British citizens.

Mr Belbacha lost his British asylum claim in 2003 because he failed to turn up for the hearing. Mr Katznelson said: “Ahmed knows he could be stuck in Guantanamo for a long time. However, he could be released tomorrow if the British Government would allow him to come back here.”

Mr Belbacha’s appeal to stay was rejected by a district court last week after the judge ruled that she had no jurisdiction in the case, despite believing the strength of his claims. His lawyers are prepared to go to the Supreme Court to prevent his transfer.

The men who wait

2002 The detention centre at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, opened

750 men have been held there

360 remain

7 Britons were freed in 2004-05

7 British residents are still there

95% Proportion of Guantanamo detainees who posed at least a “potential threat”

Sources: Amnesty International, US Dept of Defence, Times archive, Reprieve


You mean he'd rather have specially prepared food at the all-you-can-eat Hotel Guantanamo buffet than face genuine torture at home?  Go figure.