Would you agree...?

[Hustle Man]

If someone is in a (previously agreed to) “financially dependent” relationship, is it correct to presuppose that this person has given up all privileges to make any final financial decisions for example; purchasing gas, groceries or clothing, etc. without first consulting with (getting the ok to spend) the person in whom they are dependent upon? In this particular situation, the independent and the dependent argue incessantly about whether it is fair or not for the dependent to make final financial decisions, what say you?

P.S. The dependent does not know how much is coming in or going out financially and the arguments usually begin when the independent refuses to allow the dependent to make impulse purchases i.e., (wants vice needs) and qualifies the explaination with "That's not in the budget" or "That's not necessary".

I will post my opinion and recomendation for this couple later.

[Hustle Man]

Linda,

Your suggestions are noted and opinions read but now do you mind answering the question?

[BayGBM]

If someone is in a (previously agreed to) “financially dependent” relationship, is it correct to presuppose that this person has given up all privileges to make any final financial decisions for example; purchasing gas, groceries or clothing, etc. without first consulting with (getting the ok to spend) the person in whom they are dependent upon? In this particular situation, the independent and the dependent argue incessantly about whether it is fair or not for the dependent to make final financial decisions, what say you?

P.S. The dependent does not know how much is coming in or going out financially and the arguments usually begin when the independent refuses to allow the dependent to make impulse purchases i.e., (wants vice needs) and qualifies the explaination with "That's not in the budget" or "That's not necessary".

I will post my opinion and recomendation for this couple later.

No. I would not agree.

Every adult person--even people in financially dependent relationships-- require, and are entitled to, a degree of financial autonomy.  That means the freedom to make purchases without the approval of anyone else.  This is true even when those purchases are frivolous.  btw, is there anyone who has not made a frivolous purchase?  What is frivolous to you may not be frivolous to someone else.

Obviously, the dependent person should use good judgment and not abuse his or her privilege, but if every purchase has to be approved by someone else then you don’t have man/wife or partner relationship.  What you have is a parent/child relationship.  If you want a child then go have one, but don’t try to live with your child as a spouse.

When person A makes A LOT more than person B it is common and appropriate for person A to give person B an allowance every month, but person A should not routinely (or ever) ask to see a month of receipts from person B unless B is clearly abusing the allowance.  When minor abuses are evident (these things always start small) then the two parties should have a conversation about the responsible use of resources and come to some sort of an agreement that is consistent with their joint long term financial goals.

Depending on where this relationship is going, person B should have some idea of how much money is coming in. 

If you want to be a financial control freak, stay single and control yourself--no one wants to be a puppet on someone else’s string.

[xxxLinda]

No. I would not agree.

Every adult person--even people in financially dependent relationships-- require, and are entitled to, a degree of financial autonomy.  That means the freedom to make purchases without the approval of anyone else.  This is true even when those purchases are frivolous.  btw, is there anyone who has not made a frivolous purchase?  What is frivolous to you may not be frivolous to someone else.

Obviously, the dependent person should use good judgment and not abuse his or her privilege, but if every purchase has to be approved by someone else then you don’t have man/wife or partner relationship.  What you have is a parent/child relationship.  If you want a child then go have one, but don’t try to live with your child as a spouse.

When person A makes A LOT more than person B it is common and appropriate for person A to give person B an allowance every month, but person A should not routinely (or ever) ask to see a month of receipts from person B unless B is clearly abusing the allowance.  When minor abuses are evident (these things always start small) then the two parties should have a conversation about the responsible use of resources and come to some sort of an agreement that is consistent with their joint long term financial goals.

Depending on where this relationship is going, person B should have some idea of how much money is coming in. 

If you want to be a financial control freak, stay single and control yourself--no one wants to be a puppet on someone else’s string.

exactly, completely and precisely.

Why would I answer when you are able to receive responses as perfect as the above?



Also (I always reread the thread to check what we are talking about), why would someone delete my immediate response to HustleMan's post about financial co-dependence?  I've gone and wrecked this thread. xL 

I may have to now remove this post which was in answer to your previous to mine which was deleted whilst I was writing this (in order that I am able to appear to understand and appreciate continuity...

[Hustle Man]

Good reply BayGBM!

Linda 

[BayGBM]

I wonder why your reply was deleted as well.  Oh well, this is a thread about control after all. 

[mbell]

No. I would not agree.

Every adult person--even people in financially dependent relationships-- require, and are entitled to, a degree of financial autonomy.  That means the freedom to make purchases without the approval of anyone else.  This is true even when those purchases are frivolous.  btw, is there anyone who has not made a frivolous purchase?  What is frivolous to you may not be frivolous to someone else.

Obviously, the dependent person should use good judgment and not abuse his or her privilege, but if every purchase has to be approved by someone else then you don’t have man/wife or partner relationship.  What you have is a parent/child relationship.  If you want a child then go have one, but don’t try to live with your child as a spouse.

When person A makes A LOT more than person B it is common and appropriate for person A to give person B an allowance every month, but person A should not routinely (or ever) ask to see a month of receipts from person B unless B is clearly abusing the allowance.  When minor abuses are evident (these things always start small) then the two parties should have a conversation about the responsible use of resources and come to some sort of an agreement that is consistent with their joint long term financial goals.

Depending on where this relationship is going, person B should have some idea of how much money is coming in. 

If you want to be a financial control freak, stay single and control yourself--no one wants to be a puppet on someone else’s string.

VERY well stated! I agree 100%

[xxxLinda]

I wonder why your reply was deleted as well.  Oh well, this is a thread about control after all. 

guess it was deleted because I suggested that any woman who would agree to be a slave is in fact pretending to be a prostitute, or something like that.  Whatever.

Either that or I was rude and putting people off and making our girly board an unwelcome place?  STella deleted me, I'm amazed.  Nice pm.  Hope I hit that on the head.

xL


I thought it was a good thread we were having and a topic which I was enjoying learning and hypothicating about.

but you live and learn


perhaps we should go google the Heather Mills website and chat on her forum instead?

[Hustle Man]

guess it was deleted because I suggested that any woman who would agree to be a slave is in fact pretending to be a prostitute, or something like that.  Whatever.

Either that or I was rude and putting people off and making our girly board an unwelcome place?  STella deleted me, I'm amazed.  Nice pm.  Hope I hit that on the head.

xL


I thought it was a good thread we were having and a topic which I was enjoying learning and hypothicating about.

but you live and learn


perhaps we should go google the Heather Mills website and chat on her forum instead?

Well I am sorry that this happened! Linda I never stated which person (A or B) was male or female but you quickly assumed person (A) was male, now why is that? Maybe this assumption is worthy of a separate thread?

[24KT]

Sounds to me like a control issue is taking place. To place a financially dependent person in the position of constantly seeking appoval for how those funds are spent is demeaning, and will cause an even bigger rift and a bigger wedge of resentment in the relationship. I say even bigger, because being financially dependent on someone will cause a wedge of resentment. The giver has to give with no strings attached in order to overcome this naturally occurring barrier. And heaven help them if they throw it in the person's face that they are paying for things. It will breed a incredible mountain of resentment that will take incredible measures to overcome

[w8m8]

If someone is in a (previously agreed to) “financially dependent” relationship, is it correct to presuppose that this person has given up all privileges to make any final financial decisions for example; purchasing gas, groceries or clothing, etc. without first consulting with (getting the ok to spend) the person in whom they are dependent upon? In this particular situation, the independent and the dependent argue incessantly about whether it is fair or not for the dependent to make final financial decisions, what say you?

P.S. The dependent does not know how much is coming in or going out financially and the arguments usually begin when the independent refuses to allow the dependent to make impulse purchases i.e., (wants vice needs) and qualifies the explaination with "That's not in the budget" or "That's not necessary".

I will post my opinion and recomendation for this couple later.

My mind works in the way that this couple did not previously agree with full disclosure , which leads me to think they were in the euphoria of a new relationship and wanting to just be with each other so they jumped in and now have these issues.
The information shared was limited as it seems and of course that is appearing to me as the main cause of the dissention.

If they would have been open and shared honestly then both parties would be aware of the "budget" and it's limits and wouldn't be in the position of having someone "refuse" to "allow" them to make a purchase.

I can also understand that a new relationship would cause me to pause , before I divulged my financial standing so my new partner would not be aware completely , so I'm seeing two differing situations and not thinking either of them are a long lasting love affair that will be lasting for years to come.

I personally couldn't become the sole support of another and have it feel like a equal partner.

[Hustle Man]

Let me offer some background on this young couple.

They met in College; the “independent” henceforth referred to as (A) was from out of state, comes from a blue collar background and is now a Podiatrist (FYI, the first person in the family to earn a Degree). The “dependent” henceforth referred to as (B) is local and from one of the well known (wealthy) families in the area (FYI, I am told the family has major interest in most of the real estate in the area).

They met; they fell in love and married soon after. From the beginning when they were dating (and I saw it coming) they both wanted to "keep up appearances" within the social circle they were in, which consisted of well established middle aged (40-50 yrs old) married couples. Person (A) agreed to make the money and (B) agreed to forego employment prepare the home for the planned arrival of an addition to this single family!

In my opinion (A) is pressured to keep up or fit in to this unfamiliar circle and (B) wants the same lifestyle once enjoyed while single and living off the family’s money. Now, reality has set in and pride is rearing its ugly head! More to come, I have to go sale some Xmas trees for the kids!

[Butterbean]

Another good thread from Hustle Man!

Good posts in this thread also.

P.S. The dependent does not know how much is coming in or going out financially and the arguments usually begin when the independent refuses to allow the dependent to make impulse purchases i.e., (wants vice needs) and qualifies the explaination with "That's not in the budget" or "That's not necessary".

Let me offer some background on this young couple.

They met in College; the “independent” henceforth referred to as (A) was from out of state, comes from a blue collar background and is now a Podiatrist (FYI, the first person in the family to earn a Degree). The “dependent” henceforth referred to as (B) is local and from one of the well known (wealthy) families in the area (FYI, I am told the family has major interest in most of the real estate in the area).

So they're married.  B needs to know how much is coming in financially and adjust their spending.  Sounds like the Podiatrist's salary is probably no where near what B is used to money wise and B is overspending but maybe through no fault of B's own.

Why won't A tell B how much $ is coming in?  Reminds me of a friend of mine who married a guy who in the beginning of their marriage he wouldn't even let her see the tax return except for where she should sign it

Bay's post was very good.  IMO, B should be able to buy groceries, gas, have their medical expenses paid for etc., but A could think about giving B a large yearly or (monthly to begin with so B can get used to it) lump sum where B can feel free to buy whatever that money would cover on what A would consider "unecessary luxuries."

[24KT]

Reminds of a similar situation I recently heard about. They don't share similar backgrounds or anything. The only similarities both couples have is that the wife was completely dependent on the husband who was a control freak when it comes to money. He gave her an allowance, but it was never enough, ...so she did whatever she had to to get the money she needed. Including applying for charge cards which her husband had to pay off, and stealing checks from his business. Made sense to her, ...his empl0yees were embezzling funds and robbing him blind, ...why not her too?

btw, they're now divorcing. Any surprise? I think not!

[Samourai Pizzacat]

No. I would not agree.

Every adult person--even people in financially dependent relationships-- require, and are entitled to, a degree of financial autonomy.  That means the freedom to make purchases without the approval of anyone else.  This is true even when those purchases are frivolous.  btw, is there anyone who has not made a frivolous purchase?  What is frivolous to you may not be frivolous to someone else.

Obviously, the dependent person should use good judgment and not abuse his or her privilege, but if every purchase has to be approved by someone else then you don’t have man/wife or partner relationship.  What you have is a parent/child relationship.  If you want a child then go have one, but don’t try to live with your child as a spouse.

When person A makes A LOT more than person B it is common and appropriate for person A to give person B an allowance every month, but person A should not routinely (or ever) ask to see a month of receipts from person B unless B is clearly abusing the allowance.  When minor abuses are evident (these things always start small) then the two parties should have a conversation about the responsible use of resources and come to some sort of an agreement that is consistent with their joint long term financial goals.

Depending on where this relationship is going, person B should have some idea of how much money is coming in. 

If you want to be a financial control freak, stay single and control yourself--no one wants to be a puppet on someone else’s string.

Well said!