Author Topic: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?  (Read 9410 times)

Butterbean

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2007, 06:35:52 AM »

I disagree, a person can be saved through the belief in what is taught in the bible only, as the book itself says so. any of shoot of Christianity i.e Mormonism isnt the same. the fact that there are glaring differences between the two i think would help support my opinion. for example i can creat a religion that has Jesus Christ as the savior but include the easter bunny as a prophet and claim that going out during the day while the sun is up is a sin, that shouldnt be the same as true Christianity nor should it be good/close enough to get you to heaven

I see what you're saying and I think we're saying the same thing in a way.  We're both saying they need to accept the Jesus of the Bible as Savior.  This means Jesus who is God etc.  I don't think Mormons believe he is God. 

But what I'm also saying is there are people that do believe Jesus of the bible as Savior but also have additional beliefs that come from elsewhere such as people from diff. denominations that teach their people non-scriptural stuff such as Catholics.  If all they're counting on is what Christ did, they're in according to the bible.  The fact that they may pray to Mary or other dead people (an abomination in the eyes of God) or follow other non-scriptural traditions would not necessarily negate them from God's grace in Jesus Christ imo if they truly accepted Him as their only savior.

We had a discussion at church once about people that believe you have to be water-baptized to be saved.  I see where these people may become confused but you do NOT have to be water-baptized to be saved.  It is all faith through grace and not of works so that no one can boast (EPH 2:8,9).

I asked the Pastor if people who believe this are really saved.  He said only God knows because, did they accept Christ and then start to belief the false teaching (as the Galatians)?  Or is the false teaching a part of their belief as a combo between that and Christ?  If they are counting on anything they themselves have done, it's not scriptural. 

I hope you could follow my rambling ;D
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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2007, 06:50:18 AM »
I see what you're saying and I think we're saying the same thing in a way.  We're both saying they need to accept the Jesus of the Bible as Savior.  This means Jesus who is God etc.  I don't think Mormons believe he is God. 

But what I'm also saying is there are people that do believe Jesus of the bible as Savior but also have additional beliefs that come from elsewhere such as people from diff. denominations that teach their people non-scriptural stuff such as Catholics.  If all they're counting on is what Christ did, they're in according to the bible.  The fact that they may pray to Mary or other dead people (an abomination in the eyes of God) or follow other non-scriptural traditions would not necessarily negate them from God's grace in Jesus Christ imo if they truly accepted Him as their only savior.

We had a discussion at church once about people that believe you have to be water-baptized to be saved.  I see where these people may become confused but you do NOT have to be water-baptized to be saved.  It is all faith through grace and not of works so that no one can boast (EPH 2:8,9).

I asked the Pastor if people who believe this are really saved.  He said only God knows because, did they accept Christ and then start to belief the false teaching (as the Galatians)?  Or is the false teaching a part of their belief as a combo between that and Christ?  If they are counting on anything they themselves have done, it's not scriptural. 

I hope you could follow my rambling ;D

I can't believe that grown adults actually believe this shit.
I hate the State.

Tre

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2007, 07:03:48 AM »
I can't believe that grown adults actually believe this shit.

The indoctrination is very strong, primarily because none of 'the faithful' believe they've been brainwashed.  I have to work hard against it in my own home, but thankfully, my kid is smart and I'm making sure that she's got plenty of common sense.  I also do not allow any talk of 'the prophet' at home. 

Deicide

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2007, 07:36:00 AM »
The indoctrination is very strong, primarily because none of 'the faithful' believe they've been brainwashed.  I have to work hard against it in my own home, but thankfully, my kid is smart and I'm making sure that she's got plenty of common sense.  I also do not allow any talk of 'the prophet' at home. 

Tell that to Stella.
I hate the State.

tu_holmes

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2007, 11:17:33 AM »
I can't believe that grown adults actually believe this shit.

Here's a question for you... Which is more believable... Jesus / God... or Santa Clause?

As a talking point, one of them actually can get real mail delivered to them.

;)

Butterbean

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #30 on: December 13, 2007, 12:48:03 PM »
I can't believe that grown adults actually believe this shit.
At what age do you consider someone an adult?  Late teens?  Me too.  BTW, when the moon is in the 7th house, and jupiter aligns w/Mars, will peace guide the planets? ;D


Here's a question for you... Which is more believable... Jesus / God... or Santa Clause?

As a talking point, one of them actually can get real mail delivered to them.

;)

Hi tu_holmes!  Are you talking about Santa imposters  ???  Thought you may get a laugh out of this:



Lord's Mail Gets Special Delivery
Jerusalem Post Office Delivers Mail Addressed To God To Western Wall

JERUSALEM, Oct. 2, 2003

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


(AP) Ever felt your prayers went unanswered? Try sending a letter to God and chances are it will end up, as many do each year, at an Israeli post office in Jerusalem, where they are read and sent on to the holy Western Wall.

The letters come from all over the world in a host of languages. The elderly ask for good health. Others seek heavenly remedies for debts, relationship assistance, or help finding jobs. Children mainly ask God to spring them from homework assignments. The trickle of requests turns into a flood around Christmas and the Jewish holidays.

“We have hundreds and thousands of letters sent to either God or Jesus Christ and for some unknown reason they all come to Jerusalem,” said Yitzhak Rabihiya, a postal spokesman.

“Dear Sir,” begins one letter whose address reads “God of Israel” and whose request is for assistance landing a job as a bulldozer driver.

One Israeli man used to write twice a year in the same distinctive handwriting, addressing the envelopes to “Angels above in Seventh Heaven.”

As long as anyone at the post office can remember, the letters to God have turned up at the Postal Authority's center for undeliverable mail in an industrial zone in Jerusalem.

In the tiny warehouse, eight workers sort problem envelopes into pigeonholes labeled for junk mail, government bureaus, social security and health insurance offices and “Letters to God.”

Ten such pleas for divine intervention have arrived in the last couple of days, some from the United States, France, Nigeria, Australia and Ecuador. One came, somehow, with no stamps.

Puzzled by what to do with the letters, one worker started taking them to the Western Wall, a remnant of the ancient Second Temple compound and Judaism's holiest site, where Jews traditionally stuff tiny notes of prayer in the cracks between its hulking stones.

“From there, it's not in our hands,” Rabihiya said.

Eventually, the notes and letters left at the Wall are buried on Jerusalem's outskirts along with damaged religious texts and other materials considered too holy for the garbage dump.

The notes offer a sometimes charming glimpse into people's private wishes. One man asks for forgiveness for stealing money from a grocery store as a child.

Another man from Saulsbury, Tenn., wrote a tiny message and asked the postmaster to deliver it to the Western Wall, because he heard a rumor that would work. It reads: “Please help me to be happy. Please help me find a nice job in Tallahassee or Monroe or some nice place and find a good wife - soon. Amen, Daryl.”

One writer asked God to answer a friend's prayers, and in a postscript gives the friend's address, adding, “But you knew that.”

A chain letter in Arabic from “the Virgin Mary” called for peace in Bosnia and asked the recipient to send the letter to 20 other people.

The notes also speak of tragedy, relaying desperate prayers from people who are in trouble or lonely.

The postal workers recently suffered their own loss and grief. Yitzhak Moyal, 63, one of the workers who took the letters to the Western Wall, was killed in a suicide bombing on May 18.

Avi Yaniv, head of the undeliverable mail department, said friends have told him he and his crew are like God's deputies because they shuttle people's prayers to the Wall.

Some letters touch him, such as one from a Kenyan man asking God to save his marriage. “I believe in God, so I want to help these people,” the 60-year-old Yaniv said.

The postal workers' favorite anecdote is about an Israeli man who, years ago, wrote a letter to God describing his crippling poverty and asking for 5,000 shekels ($1,000). Postal workers were so moved they collected 4,300 shekels and mailed it back.

“After a month the same person writes again to God,” Rabihiya recalled, “but this time he writes, 'Oh, thank you God for the contribution, but next time please don't send it through those postmen. They're thieves; they stole 700 shekels.”'


 ;D

R

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2007, 10:01:10 AM »
why would Christians agree with Mormon concepts and beliefs?? they are two totally different religions.

 Mormons dont consider themselves CHristians, if you ask them they will all say they are Mormons, and that there is a difference. to Mormons, Christians arent going to heaven and vice versa.

That is not true. Get your facts straight before you make yourself look like a jabroni. Mormons do consider themselves christians. Hence why we have Christs name in the name of our church.... We are the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. We didn't create the word Mormon to describe our religion someone else did..

Tre

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #32 on: December 15, 2007, 05:35:54 PM »
That is not true. Get your facts straight before you make yourself look like a jabroni. Mormons do consider themselves christians. Hence why we have Christs name in the name of our church

What you're saying is true, but for the majority of time your church has been in existence, your leadership did reject the 'Christian' label in large part because you felt mainstream Christianity had fallen too far away from the original guiding principles of the faith. 

In recent times, Mormons have wholeheartedly embraced the Christian label, because it's very good for the bottom line. 

As I said, though, true Christians could never be arrogant enough to be true Mormons.   

ATHEIST

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God'?
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2007, 01:12:07 PM »
That is not true. Get your facts straight before you make yourself look like a jabroni. Mormons do consider themselves christians. Hence why we have Christs name in the name of our church.... We are the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. We didn't create the word Mormon to describe our religion someone else did..

 My facts are great. check yours. Mormons dont consider themselves Christians, they prefer Mormon or LDS. They take much pride in the distinct differences between the two religions (so mush so that they created a another bible  ::))
they used the term "Christianity" to ease the abrasiveness of their religion, thus making the transfer to mainstream easier.
and you lose credibility when you use the word jabroni. what is this 1998?

Tre

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2007, 04:37:11 PM »
As I said, modern Mormons gladly embrace the term 'Christian' in describing themselves. 

When questioned, the latter-day response is: "What do you mean we're not Christians.  Of course we are!  We just believe in a different Godhead, that's all."

ATHEIST

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2007, 06:39:35 PM »
As I said, modern Mormons gladly embrace the term 'Christian' in describing themselves. 

When questioned, the latter-day response is: "What do you mean we're not Christians.  Of course we are!  We just believe in a different Godhead, that's all."

 some may use the term "Christian" but the differences are huge. go to Provo and ask them what religion they are..

would a true Christian consider a LDS a "Christian"? no, according the Bible they should be going to hell.

where did you get that quoted response BTW?

 and the fact that they believe in a different godhead would exclude them from being "Christian".
 

genrommel74

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #36 on: January 14, 2008, 11:44:35 AM »
some may use the term "Christian" but the differences are huge. go to Provo and ask them what religion they are..

would a true Christian consider a LDS a "Christian"? no, according the Bible they should be going to hell.

where did you get that quoted response BTW?

 and the fact that they believe in a different godhead would exclude them from being "Christian".
 

We believe that god and jesus are two separate beings. And jesus is a god. The church name is "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints." The original name was the church of Christ.

tu_holmes

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #37 on: January 14, 2008, 12:08:45 PM »
We believe that god and jesus are two separate beings. And jesus is a god. The church name is "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints." The original name was the church of Christ.

So this whole "one god" thing that the Old Testament speaks about is not for you guys?

Interesting.

genrommel74

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #38 on: January 28, 2008, 06:30:04 PM »
So this whole "one god" thing that the Old Testament speaks about is not for you guys?

Interesting.

Jesus is the son of God that makes him a god a well, however, he still is the SON of god

tu_holmes

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #39 on: January 28, 2008, 07:03:10 PM »
Jesus is the son of God that makes him a god a well, however, he still is the SON of god

You can't be God if you're the son of God... I'm the son of my father and I'm not him.

That just makes no sense.

Now, if you're going to say that Jesus is a "part" of God... then it sounds a little more like what you're describing.

That said, then he's not God's son... He just is God.

You can't have it both ways.

ATHEIST

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #40 on: January 28, 2008, 07:04:26 PM »
We believe that god and jesus are two separate beings.
thats not Christian, it doesnt say that in the Bible.

genrommel74

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #41 on: January 31, 2008, 05:30:38 PM »
thats not Christian, it doesnt say that in the Bible.

Acts 7:55-56
55-But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God
56- ANd said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standingon the right hand of God.

That sounds like two separate beings to me

ATHEIST

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #42 on: January 31, 2008, 06:05:52 PM »
Acts 7:55-56
55-But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God
56- ANd said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standingon the right hand of God.

That sounds like two separate beings to me

than your interpritation on the Gospel is incorrect. they are not two seperate entities, Father,Son and Holy Ghost are the Trinity, all in one. are you implying that they are three seperate beings? I know that is what they preach in the LDS church.
  Stella can you confirm that the Father, Son and HolySpirit are in fact one?

Tre

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #43 on: January 31, 2008, 11:25:27 PM »
Yes, mainstream Christianity swears by the Holy Trinity.  In Mormonism, it's the Holy One-Two-Three.

Butterbean

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #44 on: February 01, 2008, 07:09:01 AM »

than your interpritation on the Gospel is incorrect. they are not two seperate entities, Father,Son and Holy Ghost are the Trinity, all in one. are you implying that they are three seperate beings? I know that is what they preach in the LDS church.
  Stella can you confirm that the Father, Son and HolySpirit are in fact one?
Yes, the concept of the Trinity is pretty hard to grasp but yes, the bible teaches that The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one God in three "persons," not three separate Gods.

Deut 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.

John 1:1-4
The Word becoming flesh
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning.
Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men.

Col 2:9
For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form

Romans 9:5
Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all, forever praised! Amen.

Acts 5:3-4
Then Peter said, "Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? Didn't it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn't the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied to men but to God."




Here is an excerpt from "Mere Christianity" by C.S. Lewis that may help in understanding the TRinity:

A world of one dimension would be a straight line. In a two-dimensional word, you still get straight lines, but many lines make one figure. In a three-dimensional world, you still get figures but many figures make one solid body. In other words, as you advance to more real and more complicated levels, you do not leave behind you the things you found on the simpler levels: you still have them, but combined in new ways--in ways you could not imagine if you knew only the simpler levels.

Now the Christian account of God involves just the same principle. The human level is a simple and rather empty level. On the human level one person is one being, and any two persons are two separate beings- just as in two dimensions (say on a flat sheet of paper) one square is one figure, and two squares are two separate figures. On the Divine level you still find personalities; but up there you find them combined in new ways which we, who do not live on that level, cannot imagine. In God's dimension, so to speak, you find a being who is three Persons while remaining one Being, just as a cube is six squares while remaining one cube. [MERE CHRISTIANITY p. 137-138]


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ATHEIST

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Re: Christians - Do you believe you *become* a 'God' like the Mormons teach?
« Reply #45 on: February 01, 2008, 11:35:47 AM »
Ive always been so fascinated by the Mormon religion, never tempted but very fascinated for some reason. I dont mean to be condescending towards the LDS, but the distinct differences between Christianity as i was taught and LDS are very important, salvation should depend on it right?  For some reason i get defensive when people try to blur the lines between the two religions. And to be honest it always Mormons trying to convince others that their religion can be considered Christian and not the Christians trying to convince others that their religion could also be considered Mormon.