Where do I fit on the natural vs NON scale?

[Howard]

Like some here I did small amounts of various steroids for awhile. From 83-86, I took moderate amounts of typical steroids ( decca, winnie V, etc). In brief, I took a  shot at hardcore bodybuilding and getting a pro card. Obviously I never got close to that pro card, and I am glad I stopped useing over 20 yrs ago. I competed in the NPC without drugs from 87-95 in over 30 shows.I am most proud of getting 1st in the 94 NPC Ironman Natural in Baton Rouge , La. This was the first, last and only drug tested NPC contest, ever held in Louisiana. About 5 yrs ago,at age 44, I began to feel a bit more lathargic and tired. After a full blood work up, it was determined my testosterone levels were on the low side ( 220mg/dl , ideal is around 500-700).
I was prescribed Androgel by my primary care Doc and my testosterone levels were elevated to the ideal range (600 mg/dl), where they remained, to this day.
Due to my Androgel use, I know I am not 100% natural. But at 49, I need this extra medication to feel good and keep all my key blood levels in the ideal . For personal  ethical reasons, I won't compete in a drug tested show that prohibits any form or testoserone supplement/drug.
I plan on doing a NON tested NPC show before I turn 50 and find it hard these days to stay consistant with my diet  .
Howard in Ga

[jonno gb]

It's good to see someone with integrity and honesty,Howard.You would be unlikely fail a drug test but still won't compete in 'natural' shows.Good luck in your non tested show and get that diet sorted

[Howard]

It's good to see someone with integrity and honesty,Howard.You would be unlikely fail a drug test but still won't compete in 'natural' shows.Good luck in your non tested show and get that diet sorted

I enjoy natural shows, and did some when I was 100% clean and didn't do any drugs.
At my age getting in good enough shape to simply look good on stage is my victory.
Thus, when I enter a non-tested contest, I know some of the guys may be juiced to the gills while I use the legal/prescribed Androgel which only keeps me "normal" LOL.
This would be a real dilemma, if beating others were my main focus, but it is NOT.

[Team Diver]

Do u have pics from your competitive days?

[Howard]

Do u have pics from your competitive days?

I had a few posted over on the main board. I am getting them on to my hard drive and have a friend who has a scanner. 

[musclehedz]

Taking just a little bit of steroids can make a huge advantage when it comes to muscle maturity and size. Even after taking off for years.
This is why "natural" bodybuilding isn't natural at all. All "natural" winner in the higher competitions have juiced in the past.

[JasonH]

I think Howard would qualify as a natural competitor in this instance - 1983-1986 is a bloody long time ago and if he hasn't actively taken anything since then he would be good to go for a natural contest in my eyes.

[musclehedz]

I think Howard would qualify as a natural competitor in this instance - 1983-1986 is a bloody long time ago and if he hasn't actively taken anything since then he would be good to go for a natural contest in my eyes.

No, he still has a huge advantage over real naturals. You will keep a lot of mass years and years after a cycle (considering you eat and train right)

[The ChemistV2]

Like some here I did small amounts of various steroids for awhile. From 83-86, I took moderate amounts of typical steroids ( decca, winnie V, etc). In brief, I took a  shot at hardcore bodybuilding and getting a pro card. Obviously I never got close to that pro card, and I am glad I stopped useing over 20 yrs ago. I competed in the NPC without drugs from 87-95 in over 30 shows.I am most proud of getting 1st in the 94 NPC Ironman Natural in Baton Rouge , La. This was the first, last and only drug tested NPC contest, ever held in Louisiana. About 5 yrs ago,at age 44, I began to feel a bit more lathargic and tired. After a full blood work up, it was determined my testosterone levels were on the low side ( 220mg/dl , ideal is around 500-700).
I was prescribed Androgel by my primary care Doc and my testosterone levels were elevated to the ideal range (600 mg/dl), where they remained, to this day.
Due to my Androgel use, I know I am not 100% natural. But at 49, I need this extra medication to feel good and keep all my key blood levels in the ideal . For personal  ethical reasons, I won't compete in a drug tested show that prohibits any form or testoserone supplement/drug.
I plan on doing a NON tested NPC show before I turn 50 and find it hard these days to stay consistant with my diet  .
Howard in Ga

Do you want to compete as a means of motivating yourself to get into peak condition? If you're not overly concerned with winning, then go in the untested show. Who knows, you might end up placing pretty well. The other solution is to temporarily up your test dosage, add a  "Safe" anabolic like Anavar for 6 weeks or so. You'd probably retain more mass with your dieting, and that protocol shouldn't have much negative health ramifications. And then just resume your normal androgel after that. If you're opposed to doing that, just stick with the gel and diet down slowly. See what happens.

[_bruce_]

Thick arms.

[ASJChaotic]

Like some here I did small amounts of various steroids for awhile. From 83-86, I took moderate amounts of typical steroids ( decca, winnie V, etc). In brief, I took a  shot at hardcore bodybuilding and getting a pro card. Obviously I never got close to that pro card, and I am glad I stopped useing over 20 yrs ago. I competed in the NPC without drugs from 87-95 in over 30 shows.I am most proud of getting 1st in the 94 NPC Ironman Natural in Baton Rouge , La. This was the first, last and only drug tested NPC contest, ever held in Louisiana. About 5 yrs ago,at age 44, I began to feel a bit more lathargic and tired. After a full blood work up, it was determined my testosterone levels were on the low side ( 220mg/dl , ideal is around 500-700).
I was prescribed Androgel by my primary care Doc and my testosterone levels were elevated to the ideal range (600 mg/dl), where they remained, to this day.
Due to my Androgel use, I know I am not 100% natural. But at 49, I need this extra medication to feel good and keep all my key blood levels in the ideal . For personal  ethical reasons, I won't compete in a drug tested show that prohibits any form or testoserone supplement/drug.
I plan on doing a NON tested NPC show before I turn 50 and find it hard these days to stay consistant with my diet  .
Howard in Ga

this is what bugs me, people who use steroids in the past to get massive and then stop for the natural shows, as far as I'm concerned if you have taken steroids in the past you are NOT natural, you are just someone who took steoirds and couldn't make it.........ahhhh no worries i'm sure lots of the guys in natural shows use steroids then stop for the shows, cheating to win an even natural show pfffff

[Tombo]

this is what bugs me, people who use steroids in the past to get massive and then stop for the natural shows, as far as I'm concerned if you have taken steroids in the past you are NOT natural, you are just someone who took steoirds and couldn't make it.........ahhhh no worries i'm sure lots of the guys in natural shows use steroids then stop for the shows, cheating to win an even natural show pfffff

are you serious man? do you know how different someone is after they are off AAS? and im guessing a 10+ years for Howie, cos it would give him absolutely no advantage here, no need to be bitter about it.

[musclehedz]

are you serious man? do you know how different someone is after they are off AAS? and im guessing a 10+ years for Howie, cos it would give him absolutely no advantage here, no need to be bitter about it.

You don't have a clue. I was off for 12 months and i kept all my new size. I even gained more size in some regions.

[G.R.H.]

that's some big guns ya got there big guy! 

[musclehedz]

And epic steroid bloat 

take proviron

[AKR]

in my book your just a fat juice monkey and not natural at all. its sickening to me to work my ass literally to the bone in the gym hardcore style and to do it all natural and then have cheaters like you wondering if your in my league. i can tell you what mister, you arent in my league in any form whatsoever! Im 100 percent natural and you are either natural 100 percent or you are a 100 percent joke cheater. your a cheater and now you gotta drug up even more to make up for all the damage you did to yourself those years ago. once a cheater always a cheater!

[Rimbaud]

in my book your just a fat juice monkey and not natural at all. its sickening to me to work my ass literally to the bone in the gym hardcore style and to do it all natural and then have cheaters like you wondering if your in my league. i can tell you what mister, you arent in my league in any form whatsoever! Im 100 percent natural and you are either natural 100 percent or you are a 100 percent joke cheater. your a cheater and now you gotta drug up even more to make up for all the damage you did to yourself those years ago. once a cheater always a cheater!

Look the gimmick remembered his password. Why don't you start a thread on the hardcore board asking how much juice you can get for $200?

[AKR]

Look the gimmick remembered his password. Why don't you start a thread on the hardcore board asking how much juice you can get for $200?

shove that basketball up your ass, wimp

[ASJChaotic]

shove that basketball up your ass, wimp

hahahhaha best gimmick

[Rimbaud]

shove that basketball up your ass, wimp

Yea...you told me. Keep up the good work gimmick, troll, whatever. 

"Obviously your not a golfer."

[Rimbaud]

hahahhaha best gimmick

Nah, there's better ones out there.

[Below Me]

Prescription or not, you are using testosterone while others are not.

[turnerg31]

this is what bugs me, people who use steroids in the past to get massive and then stop for the natural shows, as far as I'm concerned if you have taken steroids in the past you are NOT natural, you are just someone who took steroids and couldn't make it.........ahhhh no worries i'm sure lots of the guys in natural shows use steroids then stop for the shows, cheating to win an even natural show pfffff

I think you should redefine what you consider cheating.  All Natural Bodybuilding competitions have rules and regulations that all competitors should abide by.  The aim is for everyone to be on somewhat of an equal ground. (to set parameters)  If the rules and regulations state that you must be clean for more than X amount of years they everyone competing should meet (at a minimum) that standard.  Therefore, if one person used one year prior to the time limit and another used 10 yrs prior, as long as they both meet the standards then you can't really call it cheating.  It would only be cheating if the rules stipulate "Lifetime Drug Free".  In my opinion, as long as a person complies with all rules and regulations required for any given competition then it's all good. 

Pat

[jr]

When you are on androgel your testosterone levels stay pretty much constant. Whereas a natural who is for example training hard while dieting will have a depressed testosterone level. This is where you have the advantage.

[benz]

THIS THREAD SUX