Author Topic: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax  (Read 1093 times)

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AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« on: August 31, 2009, 08:29:43 PM »
AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
By Alexander Bolton - 08/30/09 10:17 AM ET

The nation’s largest labor union and some allied Democrats are pushing a new tax that would hit big investment firms such as Goldman Sachs reaping billions of dollars in profits while the rest of the economy sputters.

The AFL-CIO, one of the Democratic Party’s most powerful allies, would like to assess a small tax — about a tenth of a percent — on every stock transaction.

Small and medium-sized investors would hardly notice such a tax, but major trading firms, such as Goldman, which reported $3.44 billion in profits during the second quarter of 2009, may see this as a significant threat to their profits.

“It would have two benefits, raise a lot of revenue and discourage speculative financial activity,” said Thea Lee, policy director at the AFL-CIO.

“The big disadvantage of most taxes is that they discourage some really productive activity,” she said. “This would discourage numerous financial transactions. People flip their assets several times in an hour or a day. They make money but does it really add to the productive base of the United States?”

Lee said that taxing every stock transaction a tenth of a percent could raise between $50 billion and $100 billion per year, which could be used to pay for infrastructure projects and other spending priorities. She said the tax could be applied nationwide or internationally.

The proposal would hit especially hard those hedge funds and large banks earning hefty profits despite the shaky economy from a practice known as high-frequency trading. High-frequency traders use powerful computers to conduct hundreds of thousands of orders in mere seconds, taking advantage of slower traders.

Only the biggest investment firms can afford to develop the technology, which delivers handsome profits at little risk. The growing popularity of the practice has contributed to the soaring volume of trades on Wall Street in recent years and, some critics argue, market volatility and rampant speculation.

High-frequency trading is estimated to earn about $20 billion in profits for the nation’s biggest investment firms, who guard the their practices zealously. Goldman Sachs, for example, has accused a former computer programmer of stealing the valuable code, launching a high-profile legal battle.

The AFL-CIO and some allied Democrats would like to cut down on the overall level of trading, or at least give the U.S. government a piece of the action, which would likely tamp down trading.

Democrats and labor officials would also like to take a bite out of Goldman’s profits. Liberals are angry the company, which immersed itself in the frenzy of speculation leading to last year’s financial collapse, is now making huge profits after accepting (and repaying) $10 billion in government aid. Goldman employees are on track to earn an average of more than $700,000 this year. 

There is also a growing realization among Obama administration officials and lawmakers that tax increases may be necessary to curb the ballooning federal deficit.

The idea of taxing financial transactions has gained some support on Capitol Hill and among senior government officials in London, a major foreign financial center.

In Congress, Rep. Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.), chairman of the Highways and Transit Transportation Subcommittee, has seized on the idea as a way to help pay for a new massive surface transportation reauthorization bill, estimated to cost $450 billion over six years.

Instead of taxing all stock transactions, as the AFL-CIO has contemplated, DeFazio wants to focus on oil-based derivatives.

At the end of July, shortly before the House broke for the August recess, DeFazio introduced legislation that would impose a 0.2 percent transaction tax on crude oil futures contracts. The legislation would tax the options for oil futures (in other words, the premium paid to have the option to buy a futures contract) at 0.5 percent.

“The tax is simple; it imposes a small burden that penalizes short-term traders for speculating on the price of oil,” DeFazio said in a statement. “This legislation exempts legitimate hedgers from the transaction tax. Since the tax is on speculation only, it deters speculation and undermines much of the crude oil price bubble.”

DeFazio estimates his proposal, which has been referred to the House Ways and Means Committee, would raise $190 billion over six years. It has 29 cosponsors.

An aide to a liberal Senate Democrat said a transaction tax seems like a good idea but did not know who might champion the cause in the upper chamber. An aide on the Senate Finance Committee was not aware of discussion of the proposal.

Taxing financial transactions has gained some momentum in Europe. Lord Adair Turner, chairman of the Financial Services Authority, Britain’s top banking regulator, voiced support for taxing financial transactions in a recent magazine interview. The French government has endorsed the idea as a way to fund development in poor countries.

The proposal to tax financial transactions is also known as a “Tobin tax,” after the late American economist and Nobel laureate James Tobin. Tobin proposed a transactions tax in the early 1970s to discourage currency speculation after the collapse of the Bretton Woods fixed-exchange-rate system.

________________________ ________________________

Did these jerkoffs ever think to decrease spending for once?

Soul Crusher

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2009, 08:32:50 PM »
2 things on this.


1.  WTF is the AFL CIO to propose this nonsense?

2.  Now we know exactly why Obama just appointed the former head of the AFL CIO to head the NY Fed. 



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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2009, 07:07:30 AM »
A couple of things 333386:

* Obama needs to eventually raise taxes.

* Obama needs to eventually CUT down on government spendings, such as cut into Medicare and Medicaid.

Why?

Because USA, EVEN during the economically booming years of Bush, spended too much.


Everyone wants seniors et al to be taken care of. And who doesn't want a strong military?

But at the same time, everyone wants to have lower taxes.


Those two things doesn't add up.

You can't have high federal spendings on military and expensive medical programs while slashing tax.

But that's exactly what George W Bush did in 2002-2003.

Now it's Obama. He's the current president, no matter how much we want to say that he's inherited lots of problems from Bush.

He sure did. But he decided to run for the presidency, so now he better man up.

Taxes have to go up. And not only for the richest few.

Everyone will have to be taxed more once the recession is dealt with.

And governmental programs likely needs to be cut.

Nobody can spend 10 K a month if the income is only 9 K.

That just doesn't add up.

So if Obama is actually pushing for a tax, then that's something commendable.

The budget has to be balanced in a few years.

Only populists claim that there should be tax cuts.

If, and I write if, a universal health care reform will slash costs for the USA, then it should be introduced ASAP.



Finally:

Why did Bush move to expand Medicaid back in 2002?

Because the benefactors were the seniors, a group that votes more than the national average.

A piece of totally irresponsible election pork from Bush, didn't fund it. Instead - Bush introduced two tax cuts as well.



But Obama has to fix it. There are tough decisions and policies that has to be made.

But that's politics - a desire to change.
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2009, 07:09:01 AM »
we all hate the evil banks.

but now that obama wants to tax the evil banks, we have to defend them.

right?

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2009, 07:22:54 AM »
I love the banks and DESPISE the failure unions!!!!!
Why would taxes have to go up during a recesion?Please tell me how that helps spur the economy?

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2009, 07:36:14 AM »
I love the banks and DESPISE the failure unions!!!!!
Why would taxes have to go up during a recesion?Please tell me how that helps spur the economy?


Read my post more carefully Billy.

I wrote: "Everyone will have to be taxed more once the recession is dealt with."


But that won't be enough.

The government will have to cut gigantic costs as well.

Again, ONCE the recession is taken care of.
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2009, 07:38:11 AM »
I love the banks and DESPISE the failure unions!!!!!

Fair enough. You don't like the unions.

I can definitely see how.

But why do you love the banks that is demanding tax payers money in order to survive?

You do realise that lots of potential tax cuts/or government programs/military could have been expanded if it were not for having to give money to these banks?
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2009, 07:38:50 AM »
we all hate the evil banks.

but now that obama wants to tax the evil banks, we have to defend them.

right?

240 - who do you think will pay this tax?

its not the banks, its all the account holders who own mutual funds and investments who will pay in the form of higher management fees.    

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2009, 07:47:01 AM »
Spending should have been cut a long time ago.  Complete failure of the government in not addressing the deficit spending.  We should not have to be taxed more.
Most of us here complained about the spending under Bush....Obama comes along and at least doubles it.  Granted, some was in responce to the recession (that we're still in) but Obama is not making significant cuts anywhere and has increased spending in many areas.

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2009, 07:54:27 AM »
Spending should have been cut a long time ago.  Complete failure of the government in not addressing the deficit spending.  We should not have to be taxed more.
Most of us here complained about the spending under Bush....Obama comes along and at least doubles it.  Granted, some was in responce to the recession (that we're still in) but Obama is not making significant cuts anywhere and has increased spending in many areas.

Remember his promise to go line by line in the budget and cut waste and abuse?

What ever happened to that promise? 

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2009, 07:55:16 AM »
Yes every American is expected to live within their means accept the government, local, state, federal. When are people going to wake up? It's not like politicians are proposing all these "welfare" programs out of the goodness of their hearts, they are trying to buy votes. And the really funny part is they are doing it with our own money.
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2009, 08:01:20 AM »
Yes every American is expected to live within their means accept the government, local, state, federal. When are people going to wake up? It's not like politicians are proposing all these "welfare" programs out of the goodness of their hearts, they are trying to buy votes. And the really funny part is they are doing it with our own money.


Very true.

Taxes will have to go up - unpopular.

Government spending will have to go down - unpopular.

What are the chances that will ever happen?  ::)
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2009, 08:02:01 AM »
240 - who do you think will pay this tax?

its not the banks, its all the account holders who own mutual funds and investments who will pay in the form of higher management fees.    

So, um, rich people?


Which means we'll have more poor people.


and most poor ppl don't vote repub.

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2009, 08:07:09 AM »
So, um, rich people?


Which means we'll have more poor people.


and most poor ppl don't vote repub.

um - anyone with a 401k,.  over 70% have some type of investment in something 240. 

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2009, 08:37:25 AM »
Fair enough. You don't like the unions.

I can definitely see how.

But why do you love the banks that is demanding tax payers money in order to survive?

You do realise that lots of potential tax cuts/or government programs/military could have been expanded if it were not for having to give money to these banks?

The banks "demand" tax payer money?Why cant Bush and Obama say "fuck you".When did we start saving every enterprise that is going to fail?

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2009, 08:53:40 AM »
Whats the point of raising taxes and curtailing growth if you all your doing is shrinking an already huge deficit? Long term debt is not being addressed and the huge amounts of spending aren't being addressed.

If you want to raise taxes, fine, but you better do more than that. Large cuts in spending, simplified tax code, and a look at our military empire worldwide. Present the plan, include all of those, and I'd be good. But just saying you need to raise taxes on everyone and the end result will still be a large deficit and massive debt simply is a cynical fucking proposition.

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2009, 08:58:17 AM »
Whats the point of raising taxes and curtailing growth if you all your doing is shrinking an already huge deficit? Long term debt is not being addressed and the huge amounts of spending aren't being addressed.

If you want to raise taxes, fine, but you better do more than that. Large cuts in spending, simplified tax code, and a look at our military empire worldwide. Present the plan, include all of those, and I'd be good. But just saying you need to raise taxes on everyone and the end result will still be a large deficit and massive debt simply is a cynical fucking proposition.

giganto:

Isnt it odd how this story came out a week after the former head of the AFL CIO wa sappointed to head the NY Federal Reserve branch? 

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2009, 09:04:19 AM »
giganto:

Isnt it odd how this story came out a week after the former head of the AFL CIO wa sappointed to head the NY Federal Reserve branch? 

I listen to NPR from time to time, and one of the head of the AFL-CIO is on there sometimes...not sure if it was this guy or someone else, but this was def. a topic of conversation. But again, it comes down to the way shareholders and Wall Street in general, operate. It is a Quarter by Quarter process, long term plans aren't really taken into account because the big Firms and Agencies want IMMEDIATE gains and profit. This is all part of the problem and CEO's that are brought in to "turn things around" usually spike earnings in short order by slash and burn practices and cripple the company long term.

Take a look at Home Depot when Nardelli took over. What once was a company that prided itself on competent and qualified employees that provided excellent service and guidance (and were rewarded for it) got turned into a 3rd rate operation with dumb employees, low paid fools and steadily declining customer service. I believe Nardelli spiked a few quarters and then the company was exposed.

If I'm wrong someone correct me.

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2009, 09:07:03 AM »
I listen to NPR from time to time, and one of the head of the AFL-CIO is on there sometimes...not sure if it was this guy or someone else, but this was def. a topic of conversation. But again, it comes down to the way shareholders and Wall Street in general, operate. It is a Quarter by Quarter process, long term plans aren't really taken into account because the big Firms and Agencies want IMMEDIATE gains and profit. This is all part of the problem and CEO's that are brought in to "turn things around" usually spike earnings in short order by slash and burn practices and cripple the company long term.

Take a look at Home Depot when Nardelli took over. What once was a company that prided itself on competent and qualified employees that provided excellent service and guidance (and were rewarded for it) got turned into a 3rd rate operation with dumb employees, low paid fools and steadily declining customer service. I believe Nardelli spiked a few quarters and then the company was exposed.

If I'm wrong someone correct me.

That is how the game is played, yes, but what business is it of the AFL CIO to be demanding tax increases in wall street? 

This admn is completely subverting the constitutional processes and norms in how they do things, whether it be the 32 CZARS, the union nonsense like this, etc. 

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2009, 09:09:32 AM »
That is how the game is played, yes, but what business is it of the AFL CIO to be demanding tax increases in wall street? 

This admn is completely subverting the constitutional processes and norms in how they do things, whether it be the 32 CZARS, the union nonsense like this, etc. 


It isn't any of their business. It is the shareholders business and RESPONSIBILTY to demand solid corporate governance and a fair compensation package.

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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2009, 12:59:53 PM »
Whats the point of raising taxes and curtailing growth if you all your doing is shrinking an already huge deficit? Long term debt is not being addressed and the huge amounts of spending aren't being addressed.

If you want to raise taxes, fine, but you better do more than that. Large cuts in spending, simplified tax code, and a look at our military empire worldwide. Present the plan, include all of those, and I'd be good. But just saying you need to raise taxes on everyone and the end result will still be a large deficit and massive debt simply is a cynical fucking proposition.


This was pretty much the essence of my post.

Once the recession is dealt with - raise taxes and cut down on government spending.

Why waste tax dollars on fighting a war for some aristocracy in the third world?

Those tax dollars couldn't have been used for anything else?
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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2009, 01:04:40 PM »

This was pretty much the essence of my post.

Once the recession is dealt with - raise taxes and cut down on government spending.

Why waste tax dollars on fighting a war for some aristocracy in the third world?

Those tax dollars couldn't have been used for anything else?

The problem hedge is that people are tapped out and most people cant afford higher taxes. 

The other issue is that the govt never cuts spending.  NEVER. 

GWB could not do it with a GOP congress and Senate, and Obama sure as hell cant or wont do it. 


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Re: AFL-CIO, Dems push new Wall Street tax
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2009, 07:27:04 PM »

This was pretty much the essence of my post.

Once the recession is dealt with - raise taxes and cut down on government spending.

Why waste tax dollars on fighting a war for some aristocracy in the third world?

Those tax dollars couldn't have been used for anything else?

I know it was, I just had to get that off my own chest.

We need to be more realistic and more self-sustaining. The voodoo monetization by the Fed, the huge balance sheets, the rigged markets....etc etc are no sustaining. They are just more attempts at a hail mary to kick the can down the road one...last....time.

It is politically convenient and necessary in the political sense, but not in a reality sense. Not even close.

It is just fucking ridiculous, like the junkie that thinks he is fine because he is high all the time...little does he know that eventually his friends and family will abandon him and his own body will shit down out of sheer exhaustion and abuse.