Author Topic: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?  (Read 731 times)

SAMSON123

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'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?

Posted Jun 28, 2010 12:54pm EDT by Aaron Task

http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/double-dip-or-did-the-great-recession-really-never-end-yftt_510021.html

Monday's weak consumer spending data is the latest in a string of reports that has many Americans worried about a "double-dip" recession.
Then again, considering the unemployment rate has remained elevated, many Americans would be forgiven for thinking the recession that began in December 2007 still hasn't ended. Notably, that's the view of the National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER), the nation's official arbiter of economic expansion and contraction.

Among the signs suggesting the NBER is right to hold off in declaring the recession over:

Housing Rolling Over: Last week's housing numbers were horrific, especially the steep drop in new home sales. Still, Coldwell Banker CEO Jim Gillespie tried to put some lipstick on the proverbial pig on Tech Ticker last week.

Jobs Still Hard to Come By: Despite signs of recent progress, "there's no possibility to restore 8 million jobs lost in the Great Recession," a notably candid Vice President Joe Biden said Monday. Friday's jobs report is expected to show overall payrolls declined by 115,000 in June.

'Hair-Shirts' in Fashion, Worldwide: As discussed here, this weekend's G20 meeting shows that policymakers believe the time for fiscal austerity is at hand. From an economic point of view, the G20 confirms that the appeal of government spending (i.e. Keynesian economics) to combat the downturn is on the wane, replaced by a view that it's better to take the pain now and cut spending (i.e. Austrian economics).

Financial Market Distress: While the stock market's recent struggles grab most of the headlines, the real pain of late has been felt in the bond market. Excluding the panic levels of late 2008, the yield on the 10-year Treasury hit its lowest levels since 1962, last week. Meanwhile, the price of default insurance for Greece and other sovereign credits spiked higher and Bloomberg reports the percentage of corporate bonds considered in distress is at the highest in six months.

The Downside of Falling Rates

Of course, the market is not always right but the bond market is signaling that policymakers like Ben Bernanke are right to be much more worried about deflation and economic slowdown vs. inflation and the economy overheating.

A big concern for many is that the economy is sputtering despite the Fed's historically easy policies and the government's huge spending binge. The idea we've spent all this money with little (or nothing) to show for it has some observers worried America is heading down the same path as Japan, which is about to complete its second-straight "lost decade."

Of course, it was unrealistic to expect the economy to indefinitely continue its V-shaped rise from the depths of last year. Most recoveries are uneven so it's premature to say what's happening lately is proof positive the economy is rolling over, as Henry and I discuss in the accompanying video.
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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2010, 07:25:43 AM »
but but but but but . . . . . . . . .

SAMSON123

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2010, 07:59:02 AM »
Yes, We Really Could Be Headed Into Another Depression, Says Dan Alpert

Posted Jun 29, 2010 09:48am EDT by Henry Blodget

Yesterday, economist Paul Krugman said we're headed for another Depression.  The world's new obsession with "austerity" will kill the global recovery, Krugman says, and plunge the economy into a double dip.

Could that really happen? Could we really be headed for a repeat of the 1930s?

Yes, says Dan Alpert, managing director at Westwood Capital.

Last year, Dan described the huge stock market rally that followed the March lows as the "greatest sucker's rally in history."  He also produced a fascinating series of news clippings from early 1930, a few months after the historic market crash of 1929, that showed that market participants in those days had no idea of what was about to hit them.

Specifically, Dan assembled headlines and commentary from the New York Times, Wall Street, Journal and other papers that showed vigorous debate about how strong the recovery would be--with almost no suggestion that the market crash of the previous fall might only be the beginning.  The market rallied strongly in the spring of 1930 amid booming optimism.  Then it crashed to the horrific lows of early 1932.

Dan Alpert says we have not yet addressed the core problem with our economy, which is the massive debt mountain that we have built up over the past 30 years. Until we address that problem, and fix it, the economy will struggle.  And with unemployment still at 10%, global economic indicators turning downward, and the government's stimulus efforts failing to turn things around, it is not a stretch to think that another Depression has already begun.

http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/yes-we-really-could-be-headed-into-another-depression-says-dan-alpert-511661.html;_ylt=AqxHICU3jPofI0Eo6KmoPuNl7ot4;_ylu=X3oDMTE2bDFiZ2l1BHBvcwMyBHNlYwNyZWNlbnRQb3N0cwRzbGsDeWVzd2VyZWFsbHlj?tickers=%5Edji,%5Egspc,gld,udn,uup,tlt,tip
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MCWAY

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2010, 08:06:26 AM »
But, Mr "Hope-and-change", Nobel Peace Prize winner, intellectual said UE wouldn't go above 8 percent. His brilliant stimulus was supposed to save American and create.....er.....save.. .....er.....mininize the losses of jobs.

SAMSON123

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2010, 08:11:25 AM »
Paul Krugman Throws In Towel, Says We're Headed For Another Depression

Posted Jun 28, 2010 11:27am EDT by Henry Blodget in   Recession, Banking, Politics

VIDEO BELOW
http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/fop/embedflv/swf/fop_wrapper.swf?id=20585147&autoStart=0&prepanelEnable=1&infopanelEnable=1&carouselEnable=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash"></embed></object>

For the last several months, Princeton professor Paul Krugman has become increasingly agitated about what he feels is a disastrous mistake in the making -- a sudden global obsession with "austerity" that will lead to spending cuts in many nations in Europe and, possibly, the United States.

Krugman believes that this is exactly the same mistake we made in 1937, when the country was beginning to emerge from the Great Depression.  A sudden focus on austerity in 1937, it is widely believed, halted four years of strong growth and plunged the country back into recession, sending the unemployment rate soaring again.

In Krugman's view, the world should keep spending now, to offset the pain of the recession and high unemployment--and then start cutting back as soon as the economy is robustly healthy again.

Those concerned about the world's massive debt and deficits, however, have seized control of the public debate, and are scaring the world's governments into cutting back.

Which fate is worse?  It depends on your time frame.

Cutting back on spending now would almost certainly make the economy worse, at least for the short run.  Not cutting back on spending later, meanwhile (and Congress has shown no ability to curtail spending), will almost certainly keep us on a road to hell in a handbasket.

The White House's own budget projections show the deficit improving as a percent of GDP to about -4% by 2013.  After that, however, even the White House doesn't think things will get much better.  After a few years of bumping along at about -4%, the deficit will begin to soar at the end of the decade.  And thanks to the ballooning costs of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security--along with inflating interest payments from all the debt we're accumulating--the White House expects the deficit to soar to a staggering -62% of GDP by 2085.

What Krugman and his foes agree on is that that's no way to run a country.  And it's time we finally faced up to that.

In the meantime, we'll continue to fight about what to do in the near-term.  And Krugman thinks he has lost that war and we're headed for another Depression.
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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2010, 08:12:22 AM »
But, Mr "Hope-and-change", Nobel Peace Prize winner, intellectual said UE wouldn't go aboe 8 percent. His brilliant stimulus was supposed to save American and create.....er.....save.. .....er.....mininize the losses of jobs.

McWay - check out my other thread.  Obama is intentionally destroying all productive jobs in this nation on purpose.  There is no doubt left and even the editorial writers are waking up tot his communist sleeper cell POTUS.  

I have said from day 1, he is intentionally trying to crash the system.  

Whats' funny, is that you have dreamers like mal, lurker, 240, straw, et al convimnced palin would do worse.  Fine, how much worse could she be when Obama is INTENTIONALLY destroying thousands of jobs everywhere he can whether it be the Gulf, Wisconsin, west VA, etc?

Soul Crusher

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2010, 11:54:45 AM »
MORON IN CHIEF 

________________________ ________________________ ___________________


Obama: US economy 'strengthening' despite weak data
news.yahoo.com ^ | June 29, 2010 | news.yahoo.com/Obama


 
Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:49:52 PM by NoObamaFightForConservat ives

WASHINGTON (AFP) – President Barack Obama, with Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke at his side, insisted the US economy was "strengthening" Tuesday despite foreboding data and a fresh stock market slump.

Obama admitted there was "great concern" about the recovery, amid increasing anxiety over indicators which may point to a slowing of the rebound, and with expectations low for the latest unemployment figures due out Friday.


(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...

MCWAY

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2010, 12:01:25 PM »
MORON IN CHIEF 

________________________ ________________________ ___________________


Obama: US economy 'strengthening' despite weak data
news.yahoo.com ^ | June 29, 2010 | news.yahoo.com/Obama


 
Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:49:52 PM by NoObamaFightForConservat ives

WASHINGTON (AFP) – President Barack Obama, with Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke at his side, insisted the US economy was "strengthening" Tuesday despite foreboding data and a fresh stock market slump.

Obama admitted there was "great concern" about the recovery, amid increasing anxiety over indicators which may point to a slowing of the rebound, and with expectations low for the latest unemployment figures due out Friday.


(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


Boy, it's a good thing I haven't had my shake, yet. I prefer my monitor be clean.

Soul Crusher

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2010, 12:03:49 PM »
This is the brilliant, empathetic, unappreciated fool Clinton said we need to give thanks to.   ::)  ::)  ::)

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2010, 12:05:28 PM »
if your a liberal fucking assjockey who supports communism then yes you should praise bam bam
down with hussein

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Re: 'Double Dip'? Or Did the 'Great Recession' Really Never End?
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2010, 06:20:10 AM »

ADP Jobs Report WAY Below Expectations

www.businessinsider.com
 
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Vincent Fernando, CFA | Jun. 30, 2010, 8:15 AM | 1,377 |  12



Yet another huge disappointment for markets to digest -- ADP's June employment report showed just 13,000 new jobs were added from May to June on a seasonally-adjusted basis, vs. 61,000 expected. That's clearly a huge miss.

While the report continued to show job creation, the rate of new jobs fell substantially from the 55,000 reported last month. The latest 13,000 new jobs is also far below the five month average of 34,000 new jobs per month, based on ADP. Thus there has been an obvious deceleration.



ADP:

Recent ADP Report data suggest that, following steady improvement through April, private employment may have decelerated heading into the summer. The slow pace of improvement from February through June is consistent with other publicly available data, including a pause in the decline of initial unemployment claims that occurred during the winter months.

Small businesses have even begun to cut jobs:

Large businesses, defined as those with 500 or more workers, saw employment increase by 3,000 and employment among medium-size businesses, defined as those with between 50 and 499 workers increased by 11,000. Employment among small-size businesses, defined as those with fewer than 50 workers, decreased by 1,000 in June.*

This is a huge change from the 13,000 jobs ADP said small businesses created in the previous month.

See the full report below.



Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/adp-employment-report-2010-6#ixzz0sLGhjz9X