WHY NATURAL BODYBUILDERS ARE NOT NATURAL.

[OTHstrong]

I don't know about stage ready. If we are talking about stage ready, the numbers would be at least 10 pounds lighter.

I actually hold your view, so yes you are right, I am just giving heavy numbers so people do not think I am favoring my point, 10lb less as you say actually pronounces my point all the more. 

[OTHstrong]

Ready for it....because no matter what some people take it just doesn't work.
How many guys are taking multiple grams of gear yet still look like shit?
The gear is in the system, they eat right, they train like animals, and the result is they still look like shit, explain that with your bro science?

PS I notice you have now reverted to "can be" as opposed to will be.

You are splitting hairs in regards to my words, can or will? who gives a shit, stop being a reject here.

Now back to the point, you keep saying looking good or looking like shit, well brother that is not even part of the argument here. the argument is that the worse genetics on the planet will grow shit loads of muscle on gear, wether he looks good with the added muscle or not is irrelevant to this discussion.

[OTHstrong]

I appreciate the advice. I have been on test-e at 500 or more for about at least 9 months (going off memory prob longer cuz I started with hrt dose, can't recall when I bumped). Ran Deca/EQ at some point while on the test. The Deca made a difference, certainly not massive, but noticeable, 12-14 or so weeks isn't a lot of time in the grand scheme of things I guess. Then hopped on the tren/eq/testp, been on this since somewhere in june I want to say. The first batch of tren (different brand) I had was great, either that or I just responded well to it being a new compound. I you are right, this shit takes time. Training is pretty good, I had a trainer a yr ago for the purpose of critiquing things.

Bro I agree, I wouldn't be surprised if they mega dose, it's just that I often hear on the board all one needs to get big is slightly above hrt dose w some mast. Perhaps some can make significant gains on that but I can't. I'm roughly 6'2" sitting at 219lb, not sure of bf at the moment because I was measured a few months back, have full abs but look a little watery/smooth overall, though nothing major (I switched to test e @ 1g); veins pop out everywhere on my arms when working out. I'd say one of my biggest problems is moderating my diet, specifically carbs. Too low and I swear I shrivel up (and it's not glycogen loss, my muscle goes bye bye) and weak in the gym (no access to ephedrine and caffeine isn't much help), too much carbs and well we both know what happens there, but carbs pack muscle on me. Your advice is appreciated

Do you have abs, cause if you do then 219 is not bad at all. Now consider your lifestyle, sleep, rest, food, do you drink, party, rec drugs, this all plays a factor in you not being 240 instead of 220.

[OTHstrong]

And the ones that have shit genetics always point at the ones with good genetics for bodybuilding and say "its all drugs"

Some people have no idea what is actually acheiveable without drugs, in fact they appear to believe litteraly nothing is achievable
FFS we had people in another thread saying Tiger Woods is using PEDS to achive his look  

All you have to do is look at the 50's bodybuilders and maybe some in the 60's to know what is achievable or not and please tell me you are not going to give the same stupid response that everyone else does....


''well we have better supplements now''   please, stop being so naive.

[Kwon_2]

OK let me explain a few things in simple terms so you guys understand.

I have had more blood work done in the last ten years then I can count.

Now the range for human test levels is from 300-1100 and that is being generous, most charts say average 300-850, which means that it is 1 in a million to be above those levels and it is nearly unheard off. in the case that any natural is above that we are talking by just 10%, which I doubt but I will give someone with the most insane genetics a 1200ng PER dl  count, trust me, nobody would score this high naturally.


Now take one guy with shitty genetics and give him 1 shot of test per week, within a couple of weeks his test levels will smash those of the most genetically gifted naturals on the planet and you guys know full well that someone with the shitiest  genetics on a shot a week could never ever look like some of these natural bodybuilder, yet he scores higher.

Even 5 shots of test per week has the charts saying greater then 5000 ng PER dl. So if a natural take even 2 shots per week he is tripling if not quadrupling his natural production, hence this is why they are dumb enough to claim natural cause they feel ''only 2 or 3 shots''  ''nobody will know'', while they don't realize that even that low amounts triples your natural limits.

What about the Heme-Iron though? The community needs to know

[ukjeff]

All you have to do is look at the 50's bodybuilders and maybe some in the 60's to know what is achievable or not and please tell me you are not going to give the same stupid response that everyone else does....


''well we have better supplements now''   please, stop being so naive.

Eugene Sandow looked better than a lot of guys who take multiple grams of PEDS.

Go figure.

[Bevo]

QFT

musclecenter is NOT lifetime natural, ever

i would say MC is on low dose 500mg test./week @ least now

60 year old asian men cannot be muscular and lean liek he is without steroids

Asians are naturally pretty lean and have not so bad genetics

[dustin]

Some guys are born to be flimsy and estrogen filled. I think that when the body's saturated by estrogen for those crucial development years it really sets the stage. However, I have seen some pussies grow into shredded alpha beasts but some guys simply aren't cut out to make muscles.

I think that damn near anyone can juice and grow huge with the right tut kind of mentor. But if he doesn't enjoy it and doesn't have a taste for that iron you can't spoon feed it to them and expect much else.