Bodybuilding and prize money.

[Matt C]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/radio.htm

[Stavios]

You spoke the truth as always Matt

[Stavios]

Thanks Stavios.

I'm hoping that after Shawn's show he now realizes how difficult it really is to pay these fantasty figures he had in mind.

I would think Shawn would have been intelligent enough to realize this before putting on a show though.

In shawn's defence, He had a lot of sponsor and I think he knew he would lose money.

But yeah if they think one day the winner of the ASC will have a million dollar, they are dreaming

[Ex Coelis]

In the recent interview with Mike Francois he suggested there should be more prize money in bodybuilding:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/radio.htm

Shawn also felt he had the right to "demand" that the Ironman increase their purse.  Bob wanted that too.  Tom Platz used to say in seminars it would be great if the last price prize money was what the current first place prize was.

Here's some food for thought:

Why doesn't bodybuilding pay out more money?  Um...um...maybe because bodybuilding DOESN'T GENERATE ANY MONEY.

Just a thought. 

The supplement companies make many many millions of dollars (maybe even billions worldwide) - I'm sure they can afford to pay pros better

[ether]

 Bob wanted that too. 

Why 10K not enough for 10 weeks of work + Gear + Food --> Monster Profit Margin

[onlyme]

I think whenever a supplement company signs a pro bb'er they ultiamtely hope that sales will increase due to the fact of association.  But, I would also think they must realize that most people will not associate a better product that gets results just because they have a big name behind it.  BSN is the perfect example.  They may have signed Ronnie but I would think 100% of the people who see Ronnie with BSN realize that BSN had absolutely nothing to do with his size or success.  He was huge and successful way before being with BSN.  I am thinking that hopefully BSN will receive more notoriaty now because Ronnie is in their ads.  But overall I highly doubt the end result is a measurable amout increased sales.

Exposure is the biggest reason why BB doesn't have the huge prize money.  If the contests were televised and the athletes got more exposure through mainstream publications and media, then sponsors will recieve more exposure thus higher sponsorship dollars can be demanded.   Right now the BB'er recieves little if any exposure outside the BB circle, which limits the amount of exposure the sponsor gets.  In return the amount of the sponosrship dollars contributed are lower.  Get a BB show on TV (like the Olympia) and major dollars would come rolling in.  Then and only then can million dollar purses be available.

[timfogarty]

as I've said before, I think promoters spend too much time trying to create weekend events with expos and a dozen different types of competetions.  just stick with the basics.

a modest size theater holds 2000 people.   there's a morning show and an evening show, so that's 4000 tickets to be sold.  let's say average price is $50.   That's $200,000.    Rent for the theater, stage crew, sound, lights, etc., say $50,000.    say another $50,000 for prize money.   Of the remaining $100,000 spend some on local advertising, and you'll still have a hefty profit.

Out of 10 million people in the Los Angeles area, surely there are 4000 people willing to drive to Pasadena to see the Ironman.   All you got to do is tell them about it.  Yet I've never seen any local advertisements at the local gyms or in any of the local alternative weeklies.

If nothing else, pay an amateur bodybuilder $15 an hour to stand out in front of gyms handing out glossy cards.

some people say that the expos bring in more people, and some of those people will then go to the show.  but I think it is just as likely that someone who would have gone to the show if that was the only choice decides to just go to the expo.

[onlyme]

as I've said before, I think promoters spend too much time trying to create weekend events with expos and a dozen different types of competetions.  just stick with the basics.

a modest size theater holds 2000 people.   there's a morning show and an evening show, so that's 4000 tickets to be sold.  let's say average price is $50.   That's $200,000.    Rent for the theater, stage crew, sound, lights, etc., say $50,000.    say another $50,000 for prize money.   Of the remaining $100,000 spend some on local advertising, and you'll still have a hefty profit.

Out of 10 million people in the Los Angeles area, surely there are 4000 people willing to drive to Pasadena to see the Ironman.   All you got to do is tell them about it.  Yet I've never seen any local advertisements at the local gyms or in any of the local alternative weeklies.

If nothing else, pay an amateur bodybuilder $15 an hour to stand out in front of gyms handing out glossy cards.

some people say that the expos bring in more people, and some of those people will then go to the show.  but I think it is just as likely that someone who would have gone to the show if that was the only choice decides to just go to the expo.

Well Tim you should every number you put is way off, except for maybe the average 2000 seating capacity.  I don't ever in the history of BB has a pre-judging have 2000 paid ticket holders attend.  Don't forget the cost of the judges.  You have fly each one in and pay for their hotel for 3 days plus per diem plus pay.  You forgot trophy cost.  Any advertising costs and printing costs.  Insurance and sanction fees.  You doing a mens and womens show is $14,000 in fees.  The theater usually take a percentage of ticket sales. More than likely you'll have to rent some cars.  Manion always has to be paid for plus his expenses.  Most of the time you may have to hire security (bonded) and medical to be on hand.  WHen you rent a theater you also pay for A/C and any over time.  There are many hiden costs.  Ifyou can make $200,000 at a show, yes you can make a decent profit.  But it would be hard to make that kind of money on just a BB show and especially in a theater with only 2000 seats.  Fi you can draw the numbers like the ASC and the Olympia then you are doing great.

[timfogarty]

u have fly each one in and pay for their hotel for 3 days plus per diem plus pay.  You forgot trophy cost.  Any advertising costs and printing costs.  Insurance and sanction fees.  You doing a mens and womens show is $14,000 in fees.

I see.  so the solution is don't sanction it with the IFBB.  No sanction fee.  no Manion expense.   use only local judges.  don't have a host hotel.

I don't ever in the history of BB has a pre-judging have 2000 paid ticket holders attend.

I attended a sold out prejudging for the NOC a few years back at the Beacon theater.  NPC Nationals in Miami, too.

but regarding theater costs, they're able to put on plays and make money.  lot more crew to pay for that.  same with insurance and other expenses.

back in the day, they sold out the 5000 seat Shrine Auditorium for bodybuilding contests. 

[onlyme]

Yes back in the day.  Not today. How many tickets were sold last year for the Olympia and for the ASC.  Those are the two biggest shows in BB. 

[timfogarty]

Yes back in the day.  Not today. How many tickets were sold last year for the Olympia and for the ASC.  Those are the two biggest shows in BB. 

that's my point.  these mega events with expos that you're suppose to fly to from across the country aren't working.

the NOC at the Beacon (2800 seats) that I attended in 1999 or 2000 was just a one day theater event.

[ribonucleic]

I don't ever in the history of BB has a pre-judging have 2000 paid ticket holders attend.

"The most we've ever drawn paid [to the Olympia] was New York in '98. 4,646 paid... I've never had 5,000 pay." - Wayne DeMilia, speaking before the 2003 Olympia, as reported in Jon Hotten's "Muscle", pg. 194

A man in a very good position to know the numbers. Speaking about the god-damned Olympia, mind you.

[bb doc]

Good point - there shuold be more ticket options.

I think at the ASC, yuo either buy tickets "a la carte" or 1 expesnive VIP pkg.

There should be a cheaper pkg available too, but then VIP pkg sales migth decr.




Sorta like cable companies bundling their services - noone wants to watch the boring channels, but if you want the good ones, you gotta get the shit too.

Thus bundling female bb competitions w fitness + men's bb comp./

[timfogarty]

Why does bbing have a pre and evening ticket instead of one price for general admission?  Think they could be running away a lot of people who might be interested if the price was $49.95 or something more depending which show.

they often do sell tickets that get you into both.  but not everyone wants to sit there for four hours, wait around four hours, then sit there for another four hours.  they'll attend one or the other.

I usually only attend the judging in the morning.