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Author Topic: BNBF Overall British Champ in Scary Condition  (Read 11947 times)
Vickymc
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« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2006, 03:54:18 AM »

Like I said I dont have great genetics and have trained hard for over 15 odd years trying to work 50 plus hours a week and am also a diabetic.When i first started my arms were a whoping 10 inches and I weighed 59kg.
To me bodybuilding is about goal setting and a healthy lifestyle , am i ripped to shreds?hell no but im extremly muscular and solid,Im a real deal natural but dont wear it on my sleave as its some great acheivment, though to myself im very proud of what iv done.
How can you say im as sad as the cheats?all im doing is pointing out the real situation , you seem hell bent on shutting your eyes and not wanting to look at the real situation or listen.
My comparison of past champs compared to current ""natural"champs is very relavent , i really dont think you understand what im saying here.
Once you get up up into the higher"natural"comps drugs are widely used , this is fact but you dont want to beleive this , its people like you that are the problem with natural bodybuilding as you see the world through star coloured glasses.Reality is lost on people like you.and until you can see whats really going on under your own nose it will remail a sad state that it finds itself in today  Cry

You are so stupid if you dont believe that people can succeed without drugs then Natural acheivements are pointless even your own acheivements become pointless as people will presume your acheivements are through drugs. If everytime we see a successful natural we acuse them of being o  drugs how are we going to encourage youngsters to stay natural.
As far as getting up to the higher Natural competitions I have been 3rd in the WNBF Pro Worlds for the past three years and yes I am lifetime natural.
I believe 95% of natural bodybuilders are Natural. I run the British Natural Bodybuilding Federation and we are working tirelessly to keep the federation clean. Yes there will be cheats but we will catch them and as I said they are not always the winners. the WNBF Pro World champions for the last three years ( Nigel davis and Rob Hope) have been lifetime natural and I would stake my life on it as we are very close friends so therefore if guys are cheating they are getting beat by true Naturals.

Positive attitudes will help natural bodybuilding grow. And all this I know someone who takes drugs and competes naturally is no good for the sport. Stand up point the finger and shame the cheats. Bodybuilders should stick together make them compete where they should not just let them bring down the whole natural side of things.
I am not against bodybuilders who are assisted I have friends who are assisited some who are IFBB Pros and I have the same respect for them as our champions but they are competing where they should be not trying to cheat.
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legbreaker
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« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2006, 09:06:41 AM »

Vicky, you mentioned that you are working tirelessly to stop cheating and will catch the cheats.  Without mentioning the common, urine and polygraphing, what are you doing to assure the guys competing are natural and not using stuff throughout the training year and gh, insulin, ifg1?
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Vickymc
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« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2006, 11:30:58 AM »

Truth Serum, Mind probe and good old fashioned torture.

 Get real you arse!
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DVSGOD
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« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2006, 01:21:57 PM »

You are so stupid if you dont believe that people can succeed without drugs then Natural acheivements are pointless even your own acheivements become pointless as people will presume your acheivements are through drugs. If everytime we see a successful natural we acuse them of being o  drugs how are we going to encourage youngsters to stay natural.
As far as getting up to the higher Natural competitions I have been 3rd in the WNBF Pro Worlds for the past three years and yes I am lifetime natural.
I believe 95% of natural bodybuilders are Natural. I run the British Natural Bodybuilding Federation and we are working tirelessly to keep the federation clean. Yes there will be cheats but we will catch them and as I said they are not always the winners. the WNBF Pro World champions for the last three years ( Nigel davis and Rob Hope) have been lifetime natural and I would stake my life on it as we are very close friends so therefore if guys are cheating they are getting beat by true Naturals.

Positive attitudes will help natural bodybuilding grow. And all this I know someone who takes drugs and competes naturally is no good for the sport. Stand up point the finger and shame the cheats. Bodybuilders should stick together make them compete where they should not just let them bring down the whole natural side of things.
I am not against bodybuilders who are assisted I have friends who are assisited some who are IFBB Pros and I have the same respect for them as our champions but they are competing where they should be not trying to cheat.
You have again just prooved you are an idiot.Go back and re read what Iv said.  Roll Eyes
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Vickymc
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« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2006, 02:11:20 PM »

The only thing that makes me an idiot is spending time communicating with you and leg breaker. Neither of you can understand what I am trying to say you are both far too narrow minded and biased. Rose coloured glasses are much nicer than the black holes you guys live in.

Ps I really dont know what you are trying to say, do you?
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DVSGOD
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« Reply #30 on: October 14, 2006, 05:50:54 PM »

The only thing that makes me an idiot is spending time communicating with you and leg breaker. Neither of you can understand what I am trying to say you are both far too narrow minded and biased. Rose coloured glasses are much nicer than the black holes you guys live in.

Ps I really dont know what you are trying to say, do you?
Again no.Reality is lost on you isnt it? You need to learn how to have a balanced view.

I agree that your average Natural comp(no prize money etc) the majority of those athletes are natural but there will still be some that are using.Then again is using epedrine and other stimulants natural?
But once you get up into the bigger "Natural" comps then drug use is in fact rive.These guys have good genetics(but not the best) but lack that x factor that can take them to the next leval so they claim natural status.How am I and leg breaker living in black holes when we both know that this is happening?This is reality and we are speeking the truth but you slag us off and close your eyes,this is REAL not negative attitude.Keep your head burried in the sand if you must its no skin off my nose.
Im all for positive thinking and bodybuilding has given me this atribute but with you its if I say it isnt happening then it isnt when in fact it really is.  Roll Eyes
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DVSGOD
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« Reply #31 on: October 14, 2006, 06:02:00 PM »

Truth Serum, Mind probe and good old fashioned torture.

 Get real you arse!
You see that makes you a class A  fukwit.
He has asked you a question and you reply with that.
Both leg breaker and I know that non AAS are being used to build these Natural bodies you talk of , stuff that cant be tested for so these "naturals"you worship know they will get away with it but you keep your eyes shut and keep thinking to your self that all is fine and dandy and it will be right? WRONG.
You see just cos YOU think it , it doesnt mean its happeninmg.

Let me ask you this , do you test for masking agents as well? do you do random tests leading up to comps so as the guys that are using the fast acting stuff(in and out of there systems) could in fact get caught?
Remember polygraph tests are very easy to beat , these guys are already lying to them selves that they are "Natural" so lying to a test wont be hard for them.
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Vickymc
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« Reply #32 on: October 15, 2006, 04:02:33 AM »

You see that makes you a class A  fukwit.
He has asked you a question and you reply with that.
Both leg breaker and I know that non AAS are being used to build these Natural bodies you talk of , stuff that cant be tested for so these "naturals"you worship know they will get away with it but you keep your eyes shut and keep thinking to your self that all is fine and dandy and it will be right? WRONG.
You see just cos YOU think it , it doesnt mean its happeninmg.

Let me ask you this , do you test for masking agents as well? do you do random tests leading up to comps so as the guys that are using the fast acting stuff(in and out of there systems) could in fact get caught?
Remember polygraph tests are very easy to beat , these guys are already lying to them selves that they are "Natural" so lying to a test wont be hard for them.

Yes we test for masking agents yes we do out of season random testing, yes we will act on information given to us be genuinely concerned people who have valid information. Polygraphs are not 100% but they do work we know and even before taking the polygraph people have confessed and then been banned from the federation.
You keep saying how niaive I am not true I am totally aware there will be cheats but we are not stupid we have doing this for years but to keep things growing we need to stay positive. It is a vicious circle, to improve natural bodybuilding we need to encourage people both to compete and spectate this brings in the money which allows for more testing and new ways of testing such as blood analysis. If people like yourself keep attacking the natural status we are not only fighting against the media portrayal of bodybuilding but fighting against ourselves if we as naturals dont keep a postive attitide how will we survive. As I said the last two WNBF Pro World Champs are lifetime natural so they alone are proof it can be done.
Sorry you think I am being narrow minded but I have trained for 18 years completely naturally and made 3rd in the WNBF pro Worlds the last three years. I believe in what I have achieved so need to believe in others.

PS I am no fukwit I just forgot some people have no sense of humour. I would use truth serum from Kill Bill 2 if it was available. You guys are the fukwits you keep saying you know this and that about people who are competing as natural but taking ASS still you name no names. Help natural bodybuilding point the finger give out the details shame the cheats. You say you know for sure so stand up and be counted what you afraid of. If I knew for sure someone was a cheat I would point them out.
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Rammer
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« Reply #33 on: October 15, 2006, 06:13:42 AM »

Hey Vickymc, I used to promote an NPC drug tested event back in the 90's in Florida.  I was curious how you deal with drug test failures.  On several occasions I had competitors fail a drug test after they had appeared on stage for the prejudging.  We tried to get testing done before the show but couldn't all the time due to the testers schedule and travelling athletes.  When a competitor doesn't appear for the night show but was in the prejudging the rumors start flying.  We were not allowed to publicly announce who failed the test (NPC rule at the time), we could only say how many failed.  I was also threatened to be sued by someone who said his career as a chiropracter was over because he failed my drug test and everyone knew about it.  Everyone knew about it because he went on a rampage after he failed.  He had won a Natural overall the week before but the results weren't in for the urinalysis test yet as that took 10 days and he failed my polygraph test the Saturday after that prior show(I don't know if he failed that urinalysis).  I've also had competitors ask me to lie to their friends and spouses when they've failed.  They'll openly admit to me they took drugs when they failed but then ask me to lie to their spouses.  They want me to tell them they were disqualified for other reasons like missing the athletes meeting or something.  I had always refused to perpetuate somebody's lie and let them handle it on their own.  And I never ended up getting sued, just threatened and lots of nasty phone calls at my place of business.  So how do you or the WNBF handle the drug test failures and what is your failure rate?  I promoted my show for 5 years before moving and leaving the show in my co-promoters hands but the first year I had 4 failures, 3 the next, 2 the next and none the last 2 years and never had a woman fail (avg show had 50 competitors).  Thanks in advance for your reply.
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Vickymc
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« Reply #34 on: October 15, 2006, 08:34:49 AM »

Hey Vickymc, I used to promote an NPC drug tested event back in the 90's in Florida.  I was curious how you deal with drug test failures.  On several occasions I had competitors fail a drug test after they had appeared on stage for the prejudging.  We tried to get testing done before the show but couldn't all the time due to the testers schedule and travelling athletes.  When a competitor doesn't appear for the night show but was in the prejudging the rumors start flying.  We were not allowed to publicly announce who failed the test (NPC rule at the time), we could only say how many failed.  I was also threatened to be sued by someone who said his career as a chiropracter was over because he failed my drug test and everyone knew about it.  Everyone knew about it because he went on a rampage after he failed.  He had won a Natural overall the week before but the results weren't in for the urinalysis test yet as that took 10 days and he failed my polygraph test the Saturday after that prior show(I don't know if he failed that urinalysis).  I've also had competitors ask me to lie to their friends and spouses when they've failed.  They'll openly admit to me they took drugs when they failed but then ask me to lie to their spouses.  They want me to tell them they were disqualified for other reasons like missing the athletes meeting or something.  I had always refused to perpetuate somebody's lie and let them handle it on their own.  And I never ended up getting sued, just threatened and lots of nasty phone calls at my place of business.  So how do you or the WNBF handle the drug test failures and what is your failure rate?  I promoted my show for 5 years before moving and leaving the show in my co-promoters hands but the first year I had 4 failures, 3 the next, 2 the next and none the last 2 years and never had a woman fail (avg show had 50 competitors).  Thanks in advance for your reply.

The biggest pest is when an athlete fails the test on the day of the comp because someone is done out of the glory on the day. We usually use another show to announce the ammendments to the result. We have a polygraph before the Britain which everyone must take and pass before being allowed on stage. The one thing we find about this is a few athletes dont contest the Britain and I often get confessions over the phone before the event.
We have been threatened with Legal action but we have a great Lawyer who keeps us right on how to handle things. The athletes in question usually use the threat of legal action but then it dawns on them it will bring them even more to the fore front and if they have failed a test they are never going to look good. I think when you test regularly and people see you are serious about keeping your show drug free you will get less people cheating they know it is not an idle threat. I know if we have any knowledge or idea that someone is cheating we keep on it and will eventually catch them out. We have had about 12 people caught in the last 7 years but some did not fail the test just either refuse to take it or came clean when they realised they would need to take a polygraph test. We had our British Championships 2 weeks ago and I had no concerns about any of the competitors but it helps we weeded out 3 before the event.

Keep postive
Vicky
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Rammer
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« Reply #35 on: October 15, 2006, 05:12:20 PM »

Thanks for the reply Vick.  I think what happened at my show the first year was that people didn't know how serious I was at keeping it a natural show and the failures were high.  Each year less and less tried to cheat.  As the promoter I can honestly say that I don't think any of my class winners or overall champions took drugs.  I took pride in the fact that my show had very good testing and that bodybuilders used my show to prove they were natural where competing in other tested shows proved nothing.  I'm glad the WNBF is dilligent in keeping the sport drug free.  I was thinking of turning pro in the WNBF at one time but couldn't justify it because having to pay my own way to shows for little prize money didn't seem worth it and there were no shows in Florida.
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Vickymc
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« Reply #36 on: October 15, 2006, 06:21:19 PM »

The BNBF are no longer affiliated to the wnbf we are now affiliated with the INBA/PNBA and now use only WADA Approved Labs for our testing. We are taking a British Team out to the Natural Universe in California in 4 weeks time.
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jonno gb
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« Reply #37 on: October 16, 2006, 10:49:04 AM »

It sounds like the situation in the US is very different to the UK.I am convinced that the vast majority of competitors in the UK are natural and both natural organisations are doing their very best to get rid of the bad apples.If I thought that there were a lot of drug users I may be put off competing but,at the end of the day,I tend to worry about how I look as I cannot do anything about my competition on the day.

Vicky-I think your glass,like mine,is always half full wheras a few people on here have glasses that are half empty Wink
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Vickymc
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« Reply #38 on: October 16, 2006, 01:42:35 PM »

Jon it is the best way to be or the World can be a depressing place!
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Van_Bilderass
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« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2006, 12:46:40 PM »

Yes we test for masking agents yes we do out of season random testing, yes we will act on information given to us be genuinely concerned people who have valid information. Polygraphs are not 100% but they do work we know and even before taking the polygraph people have confessed and then been banned from the federation.
You keep saying how niaive I am not true I am totally aware there will be cheats but we are not stupid we have doing this for years but to keep things growing we need to stay positive. It is a vicious circle, to improve natural bodybuilding we need to encourage people both to compete and spectate this brings in the money which allows for more testing and new ways of testing such as blood analysis. If people like yourself keep attacking the natural status we are not only fighting against the media portrayal of bodybuilding but fighting against ourselves if we as naturals dont keep a postive attitide how will we survive. As I said the last two WNBF Pro World Champs are lifetime natural so they alone are proof it can be done.
Sorry you think I am being narrow minded but I have trained for 18 years completely naturally and made 3rd in the WNBF pro Worlds the last three years. I believe in what I have achieved so need to believe in others.

PS I am no fukwit I just forgot some people have no sense of humour. I would use truth serum from Kill Bill 2 if it was available. You guys are the fukwits you keep saying you know this and that about people who are competing as natural but taking ASS still you name no names. Help natural bodybuilding point the finger give out the details shame the cheats. You say you know for sure so stand up and be counted what you afraid of. If I knew for sure someone was a cheat I would point them out.
Yes, that's in fact the only way polygraphs work: the person admits because he is too stupid to know how the test works and thinks he will be revealed. If you do a bit of reading on polygraph techniques on the net you'll see that they "catch" the people by them simply admitting to their crimes even before the test is administered.

Regarding the urine tests, they are extremely expensive if you were to administer a reliable test. My bet is that the urine samples are simply poured down the drain. Where would the money come from for testing?
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legbreaker
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« Reply #40 on: November 01, 2006, 12:53:27 PM »

In the old NABF the competitor paid fro their test along with their entry.  The results were sent from testing lab (ERGIS, very well known) to the NABF and the competitor about two weeks later.  The urine also isn't much help because of the number of ways you can beat it, non tested drugs, timing etc.  It basically came down to the fact that a guy is pathetic if he competes against other natural guys while using...in the bigger natural orgs lots of people are taken so it isn't no longer cheating as much as simply keeping up.
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