Zell Miller: Abortion Killed Over 45 Million

[Dos Equis]

BB - we've already had this discussion and YES he did offer this as part of the presription to make sure your son grows up straight

No he didn't.  He offered this as part of affirming your son's "maleness": 

"Meanwhile, the boy's father has to do his part. He needs to mirror and affirm his son's maleness. He can play rough-and-tumble games with his son, in ways that are decidedly different from the games he would play with a little girl. He can help his son learn to throw and catch a ball. He can teach him to pound a square wooden peg into a square hole in a pegboard. He can even take his son with him into the shower, where the boy cannot help but notice that Dad has a penis, just like his, only bigger."

Nowhere does he say showing your son your penis prevents homosexuality. 

[ieffinhatecardio]

I can't believe there's an actual debate over what "affirm your son's maleness" means. 

Not to mention the fact that some jackass wants men to take a shower with their sons so that the son can see that his father has a larger penis than he does. This clown makes 240 and his 9/11 conspiracy theories look stable.

BTW, don't forget to have your son pound a square peg into a square hole. 

[Straw Man]

I can't believe there's an actual debate over what "affirm your son's maleness" means. 

Not to mention the fact that some jackass wants men to take a shower with their sons so that the son can see that his father has a larger penis than he does. This clown makes 240 and his 9/11 conspiracy theories look stable.

BTW, don't forget to have your son pound a square peg into a square hole. 

yes, don't use a round peg or it might not work.  It's all very scientific.

[Straw Man]

No he didn't.  He offered this as part of affirming your son's "maleness": 

"Meanwhile, the boy's father has to do his part. He needs to mirror and affirm his son's maleness. He can play rough-and-tumble games with his son, in ways that are decidedly different from the games he would play with a little girl. He can help his son learn to throw and catch a ball. He can teach him to pound a square wooden peg into a square hole in a pegboard. He can even take his son with him into the shower, where the boy cannot help but notice that Dad has a penis, just like his, only bigger."

Nowhere does he say showing your son your penis prevents homosexuality. 

BB - We've had virtually this exact discussion already.

The article (the one you said you read, thought was great read and makes sense) is called:  Can Homosexuality Be Treated and Prevented?
and YES, exposing your penis to your son is one the ways suggested to affirm his males so that you can PREVENT him from being gay.

again, your words:  I read the entire article and it is a great read.  Makes sense to me.

[Dos Equis]

BB - We've had virtually this exact discussion already.

The article (the one you said you read, thought was great read and makes sense) is called:  Can Homosexuality Be Treated and Prevented?
and YES, exposing your penis to your son is one the ways suggested to affirm his males so that you can PREVENT him from being gay.

again, your words:  I read the entire article and it is a great read.  Makes sense to me.

Straw that's your interpretation of his comments.  I read the entire article and yes his comments, in context, make sense to   I think you are taking them out of context.  For example, he also mentioned playing catch with your son.  He didn't say playing catch with your son will prevent him from becoming a homosexual.   

I think Dr. Dobson is absolutely right about teaching your son the differences between men and women.  You cannot raise boys and girls the same way. 

Keep in mind this is a man who has dedicated his life to studying and educating people about how to raise kids.  I don't agree with everything he says, but I trust his advice.  I'm one of more than 200 million people who listens to him on the radio.   

[Straw Man]

Straw that's your interpretation of his comments.  I read the entire article and yes his comments, in context, make sense to   I think you are taking them out of context.  For example, he also mentioned playing catch with your son.  He didn't say playing catch with your son will prevent him from becoming a homosexual.   

I think Dr. Dobson is absolutely right about teaching your son the differences between men and women.  You cannot raise boys and girls the same way. 

Keep in mind this is a man who has dedicated his life to studying and educating people about how to raise kids.  I don't agree with everything he says, but I trust his advice.  I'm one of more than 200 million people who listens to him on the radio.   

BB - this debate is ridiculous.  The title of the article is not my interpretation.  The subject of the article is not my interpretation. 

There's no nuance here.  Why all the semantic contortions?

[Dos Equis]

BB - this debate is ridiculous.  The title of the article is not my interpretation.  The subject of the article is not my interpretation. 

There's no nuance here.  Why all the semantic contortions?

I agree this is ridiculous.  The article no more says a father has to show his son his penis to prevent homosexuality than it says throwing a football with your son will prevent homosexuality.  That really is absurd Straw.

I think what you're trying to do is paint Dobson as a nut.  I think he's incredibly bright and has tremendous insight on raising kids, including how to raise boys. 

We just have to agree to disagree.   

[Straw Man]

I agree this is ridiculous.  The article no more says a father has to show his son his penis to prevent homosexuality than it says throwing a football with your son will prevent homosexuality.  That really is absurd Straw.

I think what you're trying to do is paint Dobson as a nut.  I think he's incredibly bright and has tremendous insight on raising kids, including how to raise boys. 

We just have to agree to disagree.   

Let's say you're right and I have somehow got the wrong impression and that this has nothing to do with "preventing and treating" homosexuality.

I mean, you can't really blame me for being confused given the title of the article.

Maybe you can explain to me the purpose of showering with your son and specifically the purpose of making sure he see's that you have penis just like his, only bigger.    Also, what exactly is the purpose of pounding square pegs in square holes.

If you're going to tell me to "affirm his maleness" I would again ask you for what purpose.  What is it supposed to accomplish?

[Dos Equis]

Let's say you're right and I have somehow got the wrong impression and that this has nothing to do with "preventing and treating" homosexuality.

I mean, you can't really blame me for being confused given the title of the article.

Maybe you can explain to me the purpose of showering with your son and specifically the purpose of making sure he see's that you have penis just like his, only bigger.    Also, what exactly is the purpose of pounding square pegs in square holes.

If you're going to tell me to "affirm his maleness" I would again ask you for what purpose.  What is it supposed to accomplish?

Straw I agree there is room for interpretation and possibly some confusion.   

One of the things I took away from the entire article is that boys and girls are different and cannot be raised the same way.  They don't talk the same way, walk the same way, they are built differently, they look different.  I remember looking at my soon a few years ago and thinking "he walks like a boy."  He's a little soft for my tastes (thanks to his mother), but I don't raise him the same way I do my daughters.  I recently had the "birds and bees" talk with him and one of the things we talked about is the difference between men and woman, complete with pictures.  I have a book that we'll be reading together that talks about, among other things, the different stages of puberty, including how his little wiener will grow, complete with pictures.  I don't do the shower thing, but I do the equivalent by showing him pictures of the different stages of, for example, pubic hair growth.

My son and I also recently had a talk about "crying like man."  He will still occasionally cry when he is punished (not necessarily corporal punishment either).  He was whining like a baby the other day.  We talked about what distinguishes a boy from a sissy (I don't believe sissy = homosexual) and how crying when you don't get your way and/or when you get sent to your room makes you look like a sissy.  I don't want him acting like a little girl.     

So, when I read Dobson's comments, he affirmed what I've already been doing with my own son, namely, highlighting the differences between girls and boys, men and women.  There are multiple ways to do this.     

[Straw Man]

Straw I agree there is room for interpretation and possibly some confusion.   

One of the things I took away from the entire article is that boys and girls are different and cannot be raised the same way.  They don't talk the same way, walk the same way, they are built differently, they look different.  I remember looking at my soon a few years ago and thinking "he walks like a boy."  He's a little soft for my tastes (thanks to his mother), but I don't raise him the same way I do my daughters.  I recently had the "birds and bees" talk with him and one of the things we talked about is the difference between men and woman, complete with pictures.  I have a book that we'll be reading together that talks about, among other things, the different stages of puberty, including how his little wiener will grow, complete with pictures.  I don't do the shower thing, but I do the equivalent by showing him pictures of the different stages of, for example, pubic hair growth.

My son and I also recently had a talk about "crying like man."  He will still occasionally cry when he is punished (not necessarily corporal punishment either).  He was whining like a baby the other day.  We talked about what distinguishes a boy from a sissy (I don't believe sissy = homosexual) and how crying when you don't get your way and/or when you get sent to your room makes you look like a sissy.  I don't want him acting like a little girl.     

So, when I read Dobson's comments, he affirmed what I've already been doing with my own son, namely, highlighting the differences between girls and boys, men and women.  There are multiple ways to do this.     

Wait - you're saying girls and boys are different?   Really?

I wonder how the human race managed to raise their kids before Dobson showed up to explain stuff like this to us.

OK - all joking aside - are you saying that Dobson just decided to throw some all purpose child rearing advice into his article title:  Can Homosexuality be Prevent and Treated? and said advice has nothing whatsoever to do with preventing and treating homosexuality in children?

and what again is the purpose of pounding the square peg in the square hole.   I know is has nothing to do with preventing gayness but I still don't understand why I should be doing that with my kid.

Dobsons stuff is so hard to understand.  I really thought from the title and the content of the article that it was about how to prevent and/or cure your kid from being gay.   

[Dos Equis]

Wait - yuo're saying girls and boys are different?   Really?

OK - all joking aside - are you saying that Dobson just decided to throw some all purpose child rearing advice into his article title:  Can Homosexuality be Prevent and Treated? and said advice has nothing whatsoever to do with preventing and treating homosexuality in children?

Depends on who you talk too.  Some people do actually believe boys and girls should be raised the same way. 

Yes the article talks about how homosexuality can be prevented, treated, etc. 

[ieffinhatecardio]

This debate is still going on? LOL

Don't forget to shower with your son and make sure he sees your penis and after that you can have him pound a square peg into a square hole.

Straw, you're a saint for debating rationally on a topic that isn't rational.

[Straw Man]

Depends on who you talk too.  Some people do actually believe boys and girls should be raised the same way. 

Yes the article talks about how homosexuality can be prevented, treated, etc.  

but showering with your kid specifically so he can see your large adult penis and pounding square pegs into square holes has nothing to do with preventing and treating homosexuality?

[Straw Man]

This debate is still going on? LOL

Don't forget to shower with your son and make sure he sees your penis and after that you can have him pound a square peg into a square hole.

Straw, you're a saint for debating rationally on a topic that isn't rational.

I'm kind of amazed by BB's logical gymnastics. 

[Dos Equis]

but showering with your kid specifically so he can see your large adult penis and pounding square pegs into square holes has nothing to do with preventing and treating homosexuality?

I guess if you want to ask me the same questions, I can give the same answers: 

"Straw that's your interpretation of his comments.  I read the entire article and yes his comments, in context, make sense to [me.]  I think you are taking them out of context.  For example, he also mentioned playing catch with your son.  He didn't say playing catch with your son will prevent him from becoming a homosexual."

"The article no more says a father has to show his son his penis to prevent homosexuality than it says throwing a football with your son will prevent homosexuality.  That really is absurd Straw."

[Straw Man]

I guess if you want to ask me the same questions, I can give the same answers: 

"Straw that's your interpretation of his comments.  I read the entire article and yes his comments, in context, make sense to [me.]  I think you are taking them out of context.  For example, he also mentioned playing catch with your son.  He didn't say playing catch with your son will prevent him from becoming a homosexual."

"The article no more says a father has to show his son his penis to prevent homosexuality than it says throwing a football with your son will prevent homosexuality.  That really is absurd Straw."

OK so you agree that the article IS about the treatment and prevention of homosexuality but the prescription about showering with your kid so he can see your junk and showing him how to pound a square peg in a square hole has NOTHING to do with treatment and prevention of homosexuality.

I guess I just can't follow your logic. You're saying the content of the article has absolutly nothing to do with the title of the article

BTW - you still haven't explained the purpose of the peg pounding. 

I know you'll tell me it's got nothing to do with treating/preventing gayness but what is it for??

[ieffinhatecardio]

OK so you agree that the article IS about the treatment and prevention of homosexuality but the prescription about showering with your kid so he can see your junk and showing him how to pound a square peg in a square hole has NOTHING to do with treatment and prevention of homosexuality.

I guess I just can't follow your logic

BTW - you still haven't explained the purpose of the peg pounding. 

I know you'll tell me it's got nothing to do with treating/preventing gayness but what is it for??

What about showing your son your penis while in the shower? What possible purpose could that serve?

Straw, you need to be a Moderator, you're much more level headed than the rest of us. This insane debate proves that beyond any doubt.

[Dos Equis]

OK so you agree that the article IS about the treatment and prevention of homosexuality but the prescription about showering with your kid so he can see your junk and showing him how to pound a square peg in a square hole has NOTHING to do with treatment and prevention of homosexuality.

I guess I just can't follow your logic. You're saying the content of the article has absolutly nothing to do with the title of the article

BTW - you still haven't explained the purpose of the peg pounding. 

I know you'll tell me it's got nothing to do with treating/preventing gayness but what is it for??

LOL.  Okay, I won't keep repeating the same answers to the same questions.  You are free to go back and read my responses . . . again.    

[Straw Man]

LOL.  Okay, I won't keep repeating the same answers to the same questions.  You are free to go back and read my responses . . . again.    

You've yet to explain the purpose of the peg pounding or the actual purpose for showing your kid your cock.

I do find it amazing that you agree on the premise of the article (wacky all by itself) yet insist that the content of the article has absolutely nothing to do with the premise. 

[Straw Man]

What about showing your son your penis while in the shower? What possible purpose could that serve?

Straw, you need to be a Moderator, you're much more level headed than the rest of us. This insane debate proves that beyond any doubt.

What's so insane?  Dobson wrote an article about how to Treat and Prevent Homosexuality and Beach Bum is just pointing out that in spite of the title, the actual content of the article has nothing whatsoever to do with Treatment and Prevention of Homosexaulity.

It's totally clear and perfectly logical......to Beach Bum

[OKMike]

Yeah, like there's 45 million job openings right now.   

What a jackass.

We should've killed 90 million. 

You can start with yourself.  We'll just call it a really late term abortion.

[OKMike]

Innocent, my ass.

Yes, innocent.  They did nothing wrong, nothing to deserve to die!

[GreatFinn]

Yeah, like there's 45 million job openings right now.   

What a jackass.

We should've killed 90 million. 

Just right. Reading these comments make me wonder why there haven't been even more abortions in past years, like 1970-1996, when all you little wankers have born.

[Camel Jockey]

Yes, innocent.  They did nothing wrong, nothing to deserve to die!

Like you give 2 cents about aborted fetuses. 

[Tre]

Yes, innocent.  They did nothing wrong, nothing to deserve to die!

They got conceived.

Look around, it's clear that most embryos never should've been allowed to continue living.