Author Topic: Who Is Lying About Iraq?  (Read 2621 times)

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2007, 08:57:39 AM »
In a perfect world u would be right however....

Nobody not us not the folks in Europe, except fro the timy countries actually practice this crap. They may say the right thing but usually when they can take a swipe at the US because they are jealous of lost glories. Any country will, if they can try and exert some manner of control over natural resources. Everybody has done it at some point in their history. We doing it now but so has everybody else. And before u make the argument that its still doesn't make it right...if we don't somebody else will and we won't be calling the shots. If u don't want us to be a superpower then thats one thing but in order to maintain the standard of living that we enjoy..sometimes we have to do what we have to do. As for the Islamics..they are a HUGE threat to the WEst..not just us but Europe as well.  
The US sets the tone and the bar for excellence in the world.  That's why people are dying to come here, live, and contribute to this great experiment.

So Iraq's oil is there for the picking?  If not by the US, then by China or Russia?  The United Nations' charter strongly concerns maintaining peace and security.  We've attacked Iraq twice under that rubric.  If China or Russia attacked Iraq to steal its oil, we could step in to defend against the attack.  Leave the Iraqi oil to the Iraqis and the operation of the free market.

So you advocate conquering Iraq, killing some of its citizenry, permitting lawlessness, and commandeering Iraqi infrastructure to maintain your comfortable way of life?

We part company on that assertion.

Al Qaeda is an organized crime family.  It is a police problem.

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2007, 09:04:05 AM »
Nope those are pretty reasonable......We don't prepare fro the type of attack that was launched on 911. NNORAD was set up to look at outside threats first. Yes they can tract jets I guess but were not doing so 0n 911. They expect to see Nukes not Boeing 707's. They expect to see a massive ground fire..follow by inbound missle tracks. They then try to quickly confirm with our other allies etc. None of this was seen on 911 and by the time the jets hiut it was to late and chaos ensued,
Possibly. 

However, Kamikaze attacks have been around since WWII.  When other planes go off of the flight plan, not to mention breach secured airspace (downtown NY or Washington), planes are routinely scrambled to determine whether it's a mistake or a threat.

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2007, 09:06:12 AM »
Not especially..i'm not exactly in favor of how we have conducted this war either. AQ is a terror threat and all resources should be used to stop em.

As for your second post..yeah now..not before 911 and it was way to late to stop these guys..atleast in New York
L

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #28 on: May 09, 2007, 09:16:41 AM »
Not especially..i'm not exactly in favor of how we have conducted this war either. AQ is a terror threat and all resources should be used to stop em.

As for your second post..yeah now..not before 911 and it was way to late to stop these guys..atleast in New York
Al Qaeda is not an Iraqi problem.  Tying AQ to Iraq was one of the 'lies' Mr. Bush promulgated in the run up to invasion.

I agree with you about destroying Al Qaeda.

Gore Vidal sums up pretty well the questions about the unnatural course of events on 9/11.
http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/EnemyWithin.html

I apologize for the length of this excerpt:

By around 8:15am it should be very apparent that something is terribly wrong. The President is glad-handling teachers. By 8:45am, when American Airlines Flight 11 crashes into the [North Tower], Bush is settling in with children for his photo ops . . . Four planes have obviously been hijacked simultaneously . . . and one has just dived into the . . . twin towers, and still no one notifies the nominal Commander-in-Chief.

`No one has apparently scrambled [sent aloft] Air Force interceptors either. At 9:03, . . . Flight 175 crashes into the [South Tower]. At 9:05 Andrew Card, the . . . Chief of Staff whispers to . . . Bush [who] "briefly turns somber" according to reporters. Does he cancel the school visit and convene an emergency meeting? No. He resumes listening to second-graders . . . and continues the banality even as American Airlines Flight 77 conducts an unscheduled point turn over Ohio and heads in the direction of Washington DC.

`Has he instructed Chief of Staff Card to scramble the Air Force? No. An excruciating 25 minutes later, he finally deigns to give a public statement telling the United States what they have already figured out; that there's been an attack by hijacked planes on the World Trade Center. There's a hijacked plane bee-lining to Washington, but has the Air Force been scrambled to defend anything yet? No. . . .

`At 9:35, this plane conducts another turn, 360 degrees over the Pentagon, all the while being tracked by radar, and the Pentagon is not evacuated, and there are still no fast-movers from the Air Force in the sky over Alexandria and DC. Now, the real kicker: A pilot they want us to believe was trained at a Florida puddle-jumper school for Piper Cubs and Cessnas, conducts a well-controlled downward spiral, descending the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes, brings the plane in so low and flat that it clips the electrical wires across the street from the Pentagon, and flies it with pinpoint accuracy into the side of the building at 460 nauts.

`When the theory about learning to fly this well at the puddle-jumper school began to lose ground, it was added that they received further training on a flight simulator. This is like saying you prepared your teenager for her first drive on [the freeway] at rush hour by buying her a video driving game . . . There is a story being constructed about these events.'

________________________ ________

Do I agree with all of that?  No.  But I do have questions like the ones I posted before.

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2007, 09:19:10 AM »
There are some weird or disturbing thinmgs but I figure people are generally paniced, slightly incompetent and scared and didn't know how to react.
L

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #30 on: May 09, 2007, 09:26:03 AM »
There are some weird or disturbing thinmgs but I figure people are generally paniced, slightly incompetent and scared and didn't know how to react.
I know what you mean.  But by the same token, we have the finest military in the world.  They are trained to operate under most extreme conditions.

Incompetence that runs for about an hour btn the first knowledge of the hijacking and the first impact on the towers is very difficult to accept.

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #31 on: May 09, 2007, 09:28:14 AM »
Yeah but it wasn't a military thing right off and the mechanism's that existed to launch jets and do what needed to be done were very clunky. Its not like the coild war where we had Iterceptors ready...and Bomber crews on 30 min recall.
L

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #32 on: May 09, 2007, 09:33:36 AM »
Yeah but it wasn't a military thing right off and the mechanism's that existed to launch jets and do what needed to be done were very clunky. Its not like the coild war where we had Iterceptors ready...and Bomber crews on 30 min recall.
It is sad that we amateurs have to sit here and conjecture as to the nature of the response to the attacks.

I'd say that's a pretty fair indictment of the official 9/11 report.

240 is Back

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #33 on: May 09, 2007, 09:58:22 AM »
hh6,

I wrote up a detailed responses to your point which showed more than incompetences on 911, the 48 minutes of inaction at the pentagon after the planes hit etc...

then i deleted it.  Cause you're serving our nation, and if you find out 911 was allowed to happen, suddenly it hurts our nations interests.  So keep on doing what you do.  But when you get out, read the "911 report: Ommissions and Distortions" which very clearly lists the holes in the air times and the standdowns on that day, plus multiple contradictions on the stand about it.  Godspeed.

Dos Equis

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2007, 10:39:28 AM »
I believe that someone had foreknowledge of the event.  Why?  Look at all the put options on the airlines that scored after the attack.

I also have questions about how our state-of-the-art national defense web couldn't track and destroy the hijacked airplanes.  Year in and year out half of the US's budget is spent on defense. 

Normal procedures for handling an attack were not executed on 9/11.

I think those are reasonable points and questions.  If that disqualifies me, well, what's a guy to do?

Don't say anymore Decker.  I respect you and would hate for you to carry to CT nut label.   :D

Decker

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #35 on: May 09, 2007, 10:53:51 AM »
Don't say anymore Decker.  I respect you and would hate for you to carry to CT nut label.   :D
It's mutual I'm sure.

My points/questions are a matter of record.  There's nothing to dispute.  They are factual assertions.

I believe that the inadequate explanation from our government has fueled conspiracy theories.

Dos Equis

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #36 on: May 09, 2007, 10:58:07 AM »
It's mutual I'm sure.

My points/questions are a matter of record.  There's nothing to dispute.  They are factual assertions.

I believe that the inadequate explanation from our government has fueled conspiracy theories.

I don't think the government's explanation makes a hill of beans difference to CT nuts.  There are those who believe almost every attack/major event involves some sort of sinister government plot.  We could have another five investigations and you would still have people claiming the government was behind this stuff.  We have an element in our society that feeds on the paranoid belief that the government is constantly planning various ways to kill Americans.     

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #37 on: May 09, 2007, 11:22:11 AM »
240 i'm never getting out or atleast for another 15 years or so..so i guess I'm doomed. Anyway shouldn't u be tacking boards to your house..ur in Florida right?
L

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #38 on: May 09, 2007, 12:48:08 PM »
aw crap, we got a storm coming?  I live in a cat6 house, it can withstand like 175 mph.  we played football in the last one.

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #39 on: May 09, 2007, 12:58:55 PM »
East or west coast..my mom lives in naples...this  one is coming toward the east.
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240 is Back

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #40 on: May 09, 2007, 03:15:48 PM »
East or west coast..my mom lives in naples...this  one is coming toward the east.

oh cool, i live near naples.  she must have had a very hazy day yesterday from the wildfires all over the state.  show her ya care and call and check on her.  I called my mom and checked on her.

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #41 on: May 09, 2007, 04:00:41 PM »
aw crap, we got a storm coming?  I live in a cat6 house, it can withstand like 175 mph.  we played football in the last one.

It's clear and 92 here :D

240 is Back

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #42 on: May 09, 2007, 04:06:26 PM »
It's clear and 92 here :D

we get hurricanes in FL, and you get earthquakes in Cali.

I'm moving to NJ.  I bet that's the perfect environment.

headhuntersix

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #43 on: May 09, 2007, 04:22:45 PM »
Funny she called me worring i was flooded but she mentioned the fires. I'm in KC
L

MikeThaMachine

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Re: Who Is Lying About Iraq?
« Reply #44 on: May 10, 2007, 02:48:43 AM »
we get hurricanes in FL, and you get earthquakes in Cali.

I'm moving to NJ.  I bet that's the perfect environment.


If you move to Jersey you get either robbed and beat up by ####### or by the State Police ;D

Good thing you have a gun for the first group.
I