How does this happen?

[trab]

trab is an idiot....

so instead of reasoning with him & trying to change his mind....we should treat him like he would to his own dogs & take it out back...tie a heavy chain to him....& shoot him.

....since he's incapable of having a civilized or an intelligent conversation.

I wish you'd try. You'd make good fertalizer, your full of shit.

[Al-Gebra]

oh, this is getting good. 

[knny187]

I wish you'd try. You'd make good fertalizer, your full of shit.

you're an idiot

[trab]

you're an idiot

Why dont you and Flower get married and have little  PET-Tards!

[knny187]

someone sounds pretty fragile

[trab]

someone sounds pretty fragile

Exactly my thoughts about whats between your ears.



Maybee Vet can be Best Man?    

[Vet]

dayummn . . . that's harsh.

I agree.   I really don't understand where trab is coming from.  He's preaching muzzling, control, and what not, but then says its the irresponsible owners faults the dogs cant help themselves and no pitbull owners are responsible---or at least 99.9% aren't.  When called on the realistic truth of the dog, he then says he's got years of experience with them, but they should be chained with heavy chains and padlocks and its the irresponsible owners.  These dogs are innate killers. They will eat you.  But he's loved his and spent thousands of dollars on them becuase of generations of breeding that has made them mindless killing machines incapable of reacting like the animal they are----a dog. 

I'm kinda confused..... 

I will agree with him, I've seen my fair share of irresponsible pit owners.  But i've also seen irresponsible lab, chihuahua, rotweiler, pointer, border collie, great dane..... the list goes on and on.  Its not just a pitbull issue, its a DOG issue. 

I also don't think its an inner city issue--although I do not agree with the bullshit mentality of having to have a dog as a status symbol.   Saying its all inner city is a racist comment that borders on stupid.  Yes, there are punk kids out there buying pitbulls to have them as status symbols, but i've worked "vaccination" clinics in some pretty bad neighborhoods in Brooklyn, Queens, and Harlem.  There were people there who would come to the clinic and get exactly 7 days worth of antibiotic----we know theyd show up at the next clinic and buy 7 additional days worth to treat an ear infection in their dogs---their pitbulls.   One indiviudal with an older dog with heart disease and prostate cancer literally followed me around Brooklyn so the dog could be checked every week and his heart disease monitored.  That dog ultimately died, but the part that got to me was the owner showing up one saturday with a pitcher of tea for me and my crew.   He couldn't afford anything else, but it was a hot day and he wanted to say thank you.


 

[trab]

Your putting words in my mouth again...
Your in TOTAL DENIAL about these dogs. If they were not a problem, you wouldn't be running rescues for them.

Whats that last other breed to Rape a child? Bust into a strangers home and chew her up?

You can talk all you want, but you cant change the facts.

I'm sure your dogs are as well trained as a dog can be, and are allways under control. Ive never seen a Vet that was not like that and We got plenty of Vets here by me in Mo Cow Land.

But YOU ain't the average Pitt Bull owner. You end up with dogs that others couldn't handle or misshandled.
Its a rapidly increasing number.
Everybody and his brother is NOT cut out to own one of these dogs.

[knny187]

Your putting words in my mouth again...
Your in TOTAL DENIAL about these dogs. If they were not a problem, you wouldn't be running rescues for them.

Whats that last other breed to Rape a child? Bust into a strangers home and chew her up?

You can talk all you want, but you cant change the facts.

I'm sure your dogs are as well trained as a dog can be, and are allways under control. Ive never seen a Vet that was not like that and We got plenty of Vets here by me in Mo Cow Land.

But YOU ain't the average Pitt Bull owner. You end up with dogs that others couldn't handle or misshandled.
Its a rapidly increasing number.
Everybody and his brother is NOT cut out to own one of these dogs.

How many dogs have you heard about raping people.....












& thats not counting the ones mounting you

[trab]

Hey Knny187 I have a GREAT IDEA !

Not only can VET Be YOURs and Flowers Best Man -   He can also DELIVER your Baby PET-Tards!!

But, I'd prefer he put you both to sleep....

[big L dawg]

just ask body88 why.these dogs were not properly socialized,It's not there fault.Who cares how many of these dogs maul people?ME THATS WHO!fvCK THEM DOGS!thats the problem with animal lovers there so blinded by there love for these dogs they can't read the writing on the wall.

[knny187]

Hey Knny187 I have a GREAT IDEA !

Not only can VET Be YOURs and Flowers Best Man -   He can also DELIVER your Baby PET-Tards!!

But, I'd prefer he put you both to sleep....

I have a question for you killer.....

since you have all of these dangerous out of control animals that can snap at any moment...








where are your kids?

[Princess L]

'comon you guys    There have been PLENTY of threads to have your argument(s) on.

No one had addressed my question. 

[Hustle Man]

I wonder what the past trouble was exactly?   

Those two dogs are like a Canine Bonnie and Clyde!

[knny187]

'comon you guys    There have been PLENTY of threads to have your argument(s) on.

No one had addressed my question. 

ok...

what question?

[Princess L]

ok...

what question?

Okay.
Here's my question.  Let's put EVERYTHING aside (the breed, the owner, lack of training, past trouble...EVERYTHING).    What causes a canine(s) (domestic or wild) to enter an occupied dwelling and attack a sleeping adult human being  

[knny187]

they were bored & nothing good was on tv

[big L dawg]

It's an animal and no matter what,You can never predict what there actions will be period.

[Vet]

It's an animal and no matter what,You can never predict what there actions will be period.

Bullshit.  The only animal that you can say that with with any certianty is Homo sapiens.   

All other species of animal by and large are very, very predictable.  If they weren't I wouldn't be able to do my job with the type of dangerous animals I work with every day---from big cats to giant constrictors to crocodilians to african elephants.  I spent 2 hours this morning evaluating an Indian Rhino with cataracts with an ophthalmologist colleague.  She had never worked with this species---this is a more than 6000 lb male, one of the biggest in North America, who is blind in 1 eye because of a cataract.  We planned carefully, and he responded exactly as we predicted he would, allowing the ophthalmologist to do as complete and thorough of an eye exam as she could have done with the dogs and cats that make up the majority of her patients.  We also evaluated a female Indian Rhino and I just got done evaluating a corneal ulcer on an Aardwolf.   In each case, we planned, we predicted, we executed the plan, and we diagnosed and treated the animals medical problems.

Anyone who says you cannot predict an animals actions, no matter what because they are an animal has absolutely no understanding of the animal they are saying that about. 


As far as these dogs go.... I've said it from the beginning, the story doesnt' add up.  There have to be parts of it missing that we don't know about---someone agitating the dogs, prior behaviors, the woman chasing the dogs, something.  The behavior is just too uncharacteristic of domestic dogs, especially considering the uninjured service dog.   I'm willing to bet what really happened is probably pretty different from the report we read. 

[big L dawg]

unfortunately I cannot reply the way I would like because I would receive a lifetime ban like trab did.this board is  ran like a dictatorship not a democracy.we will just agree to disagree.

[~flower~]

unfortunately I cannot reply the way I would like because I would receive a lifetime ban like trab did.this board is  ran like a dictatorship not a democracy.we will just agree to disagree.

you can have any opinion you want as long as you say it with some intelligence and not just to rile things up. trab was told the same thing, he chose to continue with what he was doing.  I hope that clears up your confusion. 

[Vet]

you can have any opinion you want as long as you say it with some intelligence and not just to rile things up. trab was told the same thing, he chose to continue with what he was doing.  I hope that clears up your confusion. 

Flower, thank you.  I do not agree with the statement that "they are animals and no matter what,You can never predict what there actions will be period".  Such a statement is asanine.  I'm interested in his reply, because based on the the first animal, the post was, in my opinion one made by a person with very, very little animal experience and understanding.   

The predictibility of animals---ie inate action of a spieces is the basis of operant conditioning---a training method used with many different forms of wildlife (like elephants in zoos) and animals, includinig dogs, both service and pets----ie this is the basis for "clicker" training.    You predict the behavior of the animal and set up the initial situation to deliver the anticipate behavior (or a near behavior that can then be modified) that behavior is then captured through positive reinforcement (the preferred method) although negative reinforcement may also be used dependng on the situation.

Traditionally service and police dogs the activaton of prey drive through fixed action patterns is also used.  Even this type of training requires a degree of predictability with in the species to anticipate desired behavior and shape activation of the prey drive appropriately for the desired behavior. 

[big L dawg]

well since you can predict with 100% accuracy how they will respond to every situation,Everyone that owns an animal that attacks someone should be charged with felonious assault.And anyone that owns an animal that attacks(and kills)someone should be charged with murder.There will be no defense against these charges either because experts like you guys can come in to testify that the owner knew for sure what the dogs actions would be.

[Vet]

well since you can predict with 100% accuracy how they will respond to every situation,Everyone that owns an animal that attacks someone should be charged with felonious assault.And anyone that owns an animal that attacks(and kills)someone should be charged with murder.There will be no defense against these charges either because experts like you guys can come in to testify that the owner knew for sure what the dogs actions would be.

LOL.  Did I say 100% accuracy 100% of the time?  NO. 

You said that you absolutely cannot predict an animals actions because they are an animal.  I said I disagree, there is plenty of incidence and evidence that animals are predictable along species lines.   Now you warp what I said to try to keep your point.   Obviously this is again another case of a person with very little animal experience or knowledge making a blanket statement and of course the dog example is brought in because its the current topic of debate for the forum.   

[big L dawg]

thats exactly right the dog is the current topic of debate on this forum.and since you got so hung up by the 100%statement that you did not respond to what my post was referring to,I'll retort the 100%.Now do you or don't you agree that if a person chooses to own an animal that attacks,or kills another human being they should be charged with felonious assault,or murder?