Author Topic: As I see it  (Read 4703 times)

Disgusted

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #50 on: September 29, 2007, 01:05:45 PM »
so how did dorian get the gut if it wasn't for insulin? it has to be the gh.

also if milos brought insulin to bbing why doesn't he have the gut? or hide etc

milos was reckless when chasing the dream - he would no doubt have pushed the envelope in regard to dosages of insulin - and he says himself he still uses insulin - thats about 10 years of use now - yet no belly.

i agree its either 1 or the other but not sure 100% which. the gh receptors in the stomach would make me think its the gh, but dusgusted you seem really sure its the insulin.

judgeing from the era's of bbing - the early 90's was a peak imho , so whatever was introduced after then should not be used.

Never ending debate, but I agree that whatever it is it should stop. Seriously, these guys are looking really bad. Once these guys got up above 250 to 260 they all started losing striations and symmetry. Ronnie was the only one who could come in over 260 and beyond and still look great. All the others including Jay look terrible. Hell even Dorian only weighed 254 at his best.

The Coach

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #51 on: September 29, 2007, 01:06:35 PM »

you want to see my face?

go find this muscle and fitness and check out the biceps training.


Well one thing for sure....it sure as hell wasn't for leg training!!

You're traveling down the wrong road junour, there are plenty of people on hear that can own your ass from here to kingdom come, myself and disgusted included, don't go down that road....trust me!

Master Blaster

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #52 on: September 29, 2007, 01:08:24 PM »
why dont you go post my pics all over every message board and then see if someone can legitimatley call me out as being a fake. someone has to know " taht guy" right?  :oguess what, im for real bitch.

Thanks for the idea.  ;)

Captain Slin

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #53 on: September 29, 2007, 01:09:19 PM »
Well one thing for sure....it sure as hell wasn't for leg training!!

You're traveling down the wrong road junour, there are plenty of people on hear that can own your ass from here to kingdom come, myself and disgusted included, don't go down that road....trust me!

 i dont know you coach but ive seen you talk about insulin being the cause and thats not right. i know disgusted  is making a lot of shit up though thats for sure.

I have NEVER seen someone do insulin only cycles and get a gh gut. i have seen people do only gh and get it though.

The Coach

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #54 on: September 29, 2007, 01:26:03 PM »
i dont know you coach but ive seen you talk about insulin being the cause and thats not right. i know disgusted  is making a lot of shit up though thats for sure.

I have NEVER seen someone do insulin only cycles and get a gh gut. i have seen people do only gh and get it though.

Use some commonsense, the "GH" gut as everyone puts it, is bullshit, it should be renamed "insulin" gut. When you see guys on stage with "GH" gut it isn't from what they have done from months prior....now think, the last few weeks or so more are low carbs but still taking insulin, the week or days before the show they start carb loading while still taking insulin, being on low carbs then suddenly introducing carbs (usually about 100grms or more and increasing the carbs each day up to the show) will cause and even more influx of insulin to be released and then loading with insulin will cause an even more, by increasing the carbs day by day along with the insulin along with stimulants WILL cause and OVER production of insulin, they will be bigger, fuller and harder but they will also lose straitions usually from spilling over, the OVER production of insulin will cause the distention in the gut.

Carbs are a stimulant and with any stimulant you will have an increase in insulin. I know when I take a stimulant (eca) along with just a little carbs (150grs) my stomach comes right out and bloats, imagine if insulin was added. IMO, insulin is the worst thing that has ever happend to BBing.

Captain Slin

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #55 on: September 29, 2007, 02:04:09 PM »
Use some commonsense, the "GH" gut as everyone puts it, is bullshit, it should be renamed "insulin" gut. When you see guys on stage with "GH" gut it isn't from what they have done from months prior....now think, the last few weeks or so more are low carbs but still taking insulin, the week or days before the show they start carb loading while still taking insulin, being on low carbs then suddenly introducing carbs (usually about 100grms or more and increasing the carbs each day up to the show) will cause and even more influx of insulin to be released and then loading with insulin will cause an even more, by increasing the carbs day by day along with the insulin along with stimulants WILL cause and OVER production of insulin, they will be bigger, fuller and harder but they will also lose straitions usually from spilling over, the OVER production of insulin will cause the distention in the gut.

Carbs are a stimulant and with any stimulant you will have an increase in insulin. I know when I take a stimulant (eca) along with just a little carbs (150grs) my stomach comes right out and bloats, imagine if insulin was added. IMO, insulin is the worst thing that has ever happend to BBing.


so your belief is the distetion is fromlast minute prep and the growth in the stomach comes out from the last few days before the show????

now come on coach, does that make sense? honestly. you think someones stomach is going to grow that much from carb loading with insulin prior to a show? rather than long term use that causes growth of the intestines, abdominal wall, bones and all organs?

INSULIN is what is saving these bodybuilders from becoming diabetic. GH causes insulin resistance and hyperglycemia and that is a scientific fact. go look up side effects of GH and those are them along with others.

Insulin only cycles are not very popular, in fact I only know of maybe 2 other people that have done this. GH cycles are though and distention is almost immediately seen at the end of a good sized cycle for every single person I have ever known or seen.

Type 1 diabetics and type 2 diabetics ( yes there are type 2 diabetics that also use insulin althought they are not dependant on it) DO NOT have distentended mid section. Nor do they have thick skin and less visiblity of muscle defintiion.

It does not matter that type 1 diabetics do not have a fully functioning pancreas, most type 1 diabetics take more insulin than their body would normally produce after eating and before bed with the long acting insulin. In fact drs have actually UPPED the dosage on diabetics for regulation of their blood sugars. The body would clearly show signs of what we see with top bodybuilders, but it doesnt.

The Coach

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #56 on: September 29, 2007, 02:17:54 PM »
so your belief is the distetion is fromlast minute prep and the growth in the stomach comes out from the last few days before the show????

now come on coach, does that make sense? honestly. you think someones stomach is going to grow that much from carb loading with insulin prior to a show? rather than long term use that causes growth of the intestines, abdominal wall, bones and all organs?

INSULIN is what is saving these bodybuilders from becoming diabetic. GH causes insulin resistance and hyperglycemia and that is a scientific fact. go look up side effects of GH and those are them along with others.

Insulin only cycles are not very popular, in fact I only know of maybe 2 other people that have done this. GH cycles are though and distention is almost immediately seen at the end of a good sized cycle for every single person I have ever known or seen.

Type 1 diabetics and type 2 diabetics ( yes there are type 2 diabetics that also use insulin althought they are not dependant on it) DO NOT have distentended mid section. Nor do they have thick skin and less visiblity of muscle defintiion.

It does not matter that type 1 diabetics do not have a fully functioning pancreas, most type 1 diabetics take more insulin than their body would normally produce after eating and before bed with the long acting insulin. In fact drs have actually UPPED the dosage on diabetics for regulation of their blood sugars. The body would clearly show signs of what we see with top bodybuilders, but it doesnt.

It absoluley makes sense for the reasons I've stated, GH has been around since the days of Arnold, Insulin has been around fo about 10 or so years. True GH will cause an influx of insulin, but so do many, many other things, not only do I feel that insulin is the cause of distention it's also the reason for these guys coming in with lack of conditioning and striations, look at the soft backs, lack of detail, Glass made reference to muscles "not moving", lack of detail in the arm/delt tie in from the rear.....soft, soft, soft and I don't think it's from lack or dieting. It's very, VERY difficult to hit a peak with insulin, the only one that I can see that did it correctly was Wolf, but he even lacks the detail the competiors once had.

Captain Slin

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #57 on: September 29, 2007, 02:19:13 PM »
It absoluley makes sense for the reasons I've stated, GH has been around since the days of Arnold, Insulin has been around fo about 10 or so years. True GH will cause an influx of insulin, but so do many, many other things, not only do I feel that insulin is the cause of distention it's also the reason for these guys coming in with lack of conditioning and striations, look at the soft backs, lack of detail, Glass made reference to muscles "not moving", lack of detail in the arm/delt tie in from the rear.....soft, soft, soft and I don't think it's from lack or dieting. It's very, VERY difficult to hit a peak with insulin, the only one that I can see that did it correctly was Wolf, but he even lacks the detail the competiors once had.

Show me one of Milos competitors at the O that was out of hsape. They were all shredded.

Muscles arent moving because oil doesnt move  ;)

The Coach

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #58 on: September 29, 2007, 02:22:44 PM »
Show me one of Milos competitors at the O that was out of hsape. They were all shredded.

Muscles arent moving because oil doesnt move  ;)

LOL....last part was funny. Hide looked great (can't believe he was 176) Wolf looked great, but I'm referring to actual detail. Think of how much sharper they would be with out slin. You can't possibly disagree with that.

Captain Slin

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #59 on: September 29, 2007, 02:37:18 PM »
LOL....last part was funny. Hide looked great (can't believe he was 176) Wolf looked great, but I'm referring to actual detail. Think of how much sharper they would be with out slin. You can't possibly disagree with that.

i do disagree.

you and disgusted have got t make a choice here.

i think you guys are making the claim that gh is not responsible for this look right? ok.

then disgusted is telling me that insulin was being used by dorian prior to 1997 and he was informed by dan duchaine about its use. even though milos said himself he faxed over the information to dorian.

ok so some how dorian peaked with insulin somwhere between 93-95.. then fell off the face of the planet because of its use? thats the idea vs long term gh use right?

ok.. so coleman then wasnt using insulin in 98? 99? 2001? 2003? 2005? these are his best showins ever. surely he just didnt start using insulin  for 06 and 07.

cutler didnt use it in 2001?or 2006? 2003 arnold?

levrone wasnt using it in 99? 2000?

wheeler wasnt using it 98 and 99?

dennis wolf wasnt using 07?

johnnie jackson 07?

hide 07?

Gustavo at the Ironman I forget which year I think 05?

What about Toney Freeman at the Iron Man?

Some of these bodybuilders are the best bodybuilders WHO HAVE EVER LIVED. AND AFTER THE INTRODUCTION OF INSULIN,  they peaked or some people would say they made the best appearences of their life. These guys were ripped to shreds the years i mentioned.

If insulin were the cause of the current look from last minute prep as you say coach, there is no way they would have been able to peak in conditioning like this.

And the GH that was using way back when is COMPLETLEY different than GH today.That gh was extracted from cadevers and could cause serious immediate health issues. Many bodybuilders did not use it as it was also fairly new in the 80s. Synthetic GH was created in the late 80s early 90s and that is when the guts started coming out. It was new, that is why everyone was so ripped. After long term use, conditioning will fade.




PANDAEMONIUM

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #60 on: September 29, 2007, 02:46:37 PM »
Captain Slin getting shitcanned in this thread.  We've never seen that happen before ::)

Fatpanda

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #61 on: September 29, 2007, 03:30:43 PM »
i thought one of gh's side effects was thicker skin? wouldn't that explain the lack of conditioning in some?
175lbs by 31st July

njflex

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #62 on: September 29, 2007, 06:59:13 PM »
well it seems its a yr to year progression of great to bad and if insulin usage and overusage makes badell a bottomfeeder and then 1 to 2 yrs he's hanging top 4 and then saying he is on same protocal or more is better then he starts finishing back out of top 5 what gives?it is like the magic pill with a short shelf life return.

BEAST 8692

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Re: As I see it
« Reply #63 on: September 29, 2007, 07:20:16 PM »
jay looks like he belongs in the wwf. not an olympia stage.

i know it's old knews about ronnie's lat and tri, but does anyone know exactly how/what he did to cause this. his entire left side is fucked up, including his left leg.

ronnie might have still been in the race if he had a much tighter midsection (impossible now) and the old sweep in his quads.

victor looks pretty good from the front but he looks bottom heavy from the back. he needs to put some serious work into his back density. so does wolf (as long as he doesn't blow his waist out in the process ala yates).

wolf might not be the hardest guy up there but he has too many good points to be denied. he is the direction that pro bbing NEEDS to go and this is why he is the crowd favourite.