Shawn Ray signs 2 year deal with MD - discuss

[jonsande]

Sounds like a Ruhl fan.   

[suckmymuscle]

Present somebody with a more complete package then....

  There are many if you define "complete package" or "aesthetic ideal" as I do: overral beauty(face and body) . Just a few examples:

 - Steve Reeeves.

 - Sergio Oliva.

 - Flex Wheeler.

 - Dennis Newman.

 - Larry Scott.

   None  of these men, with the possible exception of Reeeves, fullfils the aesthetic ideal completely, but all of them come a lot closer to it than Shawn Ray.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[G o a t b o y]

What's with this "facial beauty" crap?  It's a bodybuilding contest FFS!  What are you, a fag? 

[Hedgehog]

  I am tired of all the nut-hugging that goes on for Shawn since his competitor days. People are always putting him as the example of the Greek ideal, of aesthetics personified, etc. Well, guess what? They are wrong. Shawn was far from an aesthetic ideal. How so? Well, if you're going to try to win bodybuilding contests on aesthetics, then you need to approach bodybuilding as you would a male beauty pageant, where muscles are only part of the equation. Shawn Ray is not an aesthetic ideal because aesthetics is not limited to muscles, but to the whole body. To me, aesthetics is about overral beauty and not only muscles. Overral beauty is related to genetic superiority, and Shawn Ray is quite simply a genetically inferior man. You don't believe me? Well, Shawn Ray:

 - Is short.

- Has an average face.

 - His thighs are too short.

 - His torso is too long.

 - His clavicle is too narrow.

 - His calves are high.

  I am sorry, but that is not aesthetic. His muscles were developed proportionally, but his body as a whole was too flawed for him to qualify as an aesthetic ideal. Also, in many cases, having "muscles proportionally developed" is an euphemism for lack of muscles. It is much easier to have good proportions between your muscle groups when you carry 50 lbs less of muscle than your competitors. The more you grow, the harder it is to maintain muscle proportions. Even Sergio Oliva, who had a combination of perfect structure with perfect muscular proportions, still does not qualify as an aesthetic ideal to me because he was somewhat lacking in height and had an ugly face. The only one I can think of that truly fullfils an aesthetic ideal in my book is Steve Reeves. Wheeler also except for the face - in his case I'll open an exception because Wheeler's structure and muscle proportionality were really superb. I can accept a 210 lbs Mr.Olympia as long as he has the structure, muscle proportionality and facial beauty of Michaelangelo's David.

  People are so smitten by Ray's excellent muscle proportionality that they completely ignore his flaws in:

 1. structure(short, narrow clavicle, long torso, short thighs)

 2. Facial beauty(not a face that the Ancient Greeks would regard as worthy of a statue).

 basically, I believe that there are two ways a man can win the Mr.Olympia. By:

 1. Being the most heavily muscles man on Earth

   or

 2. being the most genetically gifted man on Earth(height, skeletal frame proportionality, muscular proportionality, facial beauty, skin tone)

  Shawn Ray is not Mr.Olympia by either of these two criterias. I know that I'm gona get lots of hatered for stating this, but I needed to make it clear how stupid the people who believe that Shawn Ray was an aesthetic ideal are.

SUCKMYMUSCLE
 

No offence "Suckmymuscle", but you sure seems a bit on the gay side today.

As I stated, no offence, but you're going off the charts on this one.

[suckmymuscle]

Only problem he has is that he's too short.

  there are many other flaws which I have already mentioned: his clavicle is narrow, his legs are too short and his torso is too long. That is not an aesthetic skeletal frame.

And wtf does an average face have to do with anything?

  It is part of aesthetics. In the old days, bodybuilders were also judged on how healthy they looked, on how symmetrical(beautiful) their faces were and how glowy their skin tones were.

Epic amounts of faggotry

  i am not gay and I personally don't care about what a bodybuilder's face looks like. However, you cannot claim to be an aesthetic ideal with an ugly face. In the old days, when the criteria for bodybuilding ws far more complete, between two bodybuilders who were the same at everything else, the one with the prettir face won. Again, it's part of aesthetics. And BTW, guys who make homophobic comments are usually projecting their own insecurities about their sexuality. I am happily married, secure in my sexuality and have a 4 year-old son, so I don't really care what you think.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Master Blaster]

What's with this "facial beauty" crap?  It's a bodybuilding contest FFS!  What are you, a fag? 

Well, Paul Dillet's cancer face probably caused him some points.  

[Andre Nickatina]

No offence "Suckmymuscle", but you sure seems a bit on the gay side today.

As I stated, no offence, but you're going off the charts on this one.

I agree he's way too concerned with "male beauty"

[suckmymuscle]

No offence "Suckmymuscle", but you sure seems a bit on the gay side today.

As I stated, no offence, but you're going off the charts on this one.

  Ok, I'll keep that in mind while I'm fucking my wife tonight.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Bruffy]

Sounds like suckmymuscle is putting in to be an IFBB judge at the next Mr. Olympia.  Did you sit around today and think "Maybe I'll start a thread on Getbig regarding Shawn Ray and the lack of.................."
Strange indeed?

[Andre Nickatina]

 there are many other flaws which I have already mentioned: his clavicle is narrow, his legs are too short and his torso is too long. That is not an aesthetic skeletal frame.

  It is part of aesthetics. In the old days, bodybuilders were also judged on how healthy they looked, on how symmetrical(beautiful) their faces were and how glowy their skin tones were.

  i am not gay and I personally don't care about what a bodybuilder's face looks like. However, you cannot claim to be an aesthetic ideal with an ugly face. In the old days, when the criteria for bodybuilding ws far more complete, between two bodybuilders who were the same at everything else, the one with the prettir face won. Again, it's part of aesthetics. And BTW, guys who make homophobic comments are usually projecting their own insecurities about their sexuality. I am happily married, secure in my sexuality and have a 4 year-old son, so I don't really care what you think.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

How in the hell can you say he isn't aesthetic? Hes so good that he made his "unaesthetic" structure look to be in many peoples opinion perfect.

Shawn is well groomed and his face is fine. He's got a smile brighter than a summer day.

You're being ridiculous. He's not ovverated. He's balanced and proportionate with no overwhelming bodyparts.

Lines on top of lines and Mean seperation.

I'd say that all adds up to an aesthetic physique. Narrow clavicles and short frame big deal.

For a guy thats 5'6 he's as aesthetic as you can be. Get over the fact that he's short.

How can you say tyhere is ANY flaw here?

He may be short and have narrow clavicles but he in fact DID make them work for him.

No flaws.

[JediKnight]

He was good in his younger days,,but so was OJ Simpson., and look how that turned out.

[G o a t b o y]

I am happily married, secure in my sexuality and have a 4 year-old son

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Does your son know you're gay?

[suckmymuscle]

How in the hell can you say he isn't aesthetic? Hes so good that he made his "unaesthetic" structure look to be in many peoples opinion perfect.

Shawn is well groomed and his face is fine. He's got a smile brighter than a summer day.

You're being ridiculous. He's not ovverated. He's balanced and proportionate with no overwhelming bodyparts.

Lines on top of lines and Mean seperation.

I'd say that all adds up to an aesthetic physique. Narrow clavicles and short frame big deal.

For a guy thats 5'6 he's as aesthetic as you can be. Get over the fact that he's short.

How can you say tyhere is ANY flaw here?

He may be short and have narrow clavicles but he in fact DID make them work for him.

No flaws.

  thank you for posting a few pics proving exactly what I said: he is short, with narrow clavicle, short thighs, long torso and average face. That's not the complete package; that's not an aesthetic ideal.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[corinth]

Shawn is a lot of things.... short, cheap, talkative, backstabbing, conceited, arrogant, cheap, annoying, coneiving, dishonest, opportunistic, tranny loving, cheap.... but he has an amazing physique.

It's a crime that Jay Gutler has two Sandows and guys like Shawn, Flex and Levrone have none.

[YoungBlood]

- Steve Reeeves.

Legs too small, not enough definition.

 

- Sergio Oliva.

Brutally huge, but hardly cut in todays standards.

 

- Flex Wheeler.

Oil in his delts, calves, and arms. How can you claim he's absolutely PERFECT if he's got fake body parts? Roids are one thing, they enhance what you got, but when you morph yourself using substances, that's another ballgame.

 

- Dennis Newman.

Arms and shoulders too big for his chest.

 

- Larry Scott.

Not defined enough, back detail sucked like Belladonna in her latest flick, not enough vascularity, and he was generally soft as your pudgy ass.

*The above comments are to point out that, in fact, you can pick apart ANYONE. Shawn Ray may be an asshole, fucked TV's, and only leased his cars. But, he is most often looked at as the BBer with the LEAST amount of imperfections in the modern era.

[Andre Nickatina]

 thank you for posting a few pics proving exactly what I said: he is short, with narrow clavicle, short thighs, long torso and average face. That's not the complete package; that's not an aesthetic ideal.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

You are ridiculous. I didn't wannt to resort to petty insults but you are a HOMO

[Hedgehog]

Legs too small, not enough definition.

 
Brutally huge, but hardly cut in todays standards.

 
Oil in his delts, calves, and arms. How can you claim he's absolutely PERFECT if he's got fake body parts? Roids are one thing, they enhance what you got, but when you morph yourself using substances, that's another ballgame.

 
Arms and shoulders too big for his chest.

 
Not defined enough, back detail sucked like Belladonna in her latest flick, not enough vascularity, and he was generally soft as your pudgy ass.

*The above comments are to point out that, in fact, you can pick apart ANYONE. Shawn Ray may be an asshole, fucked TV's, and only leased his cars. But, he is most often looked at as the BBer with the LEAST amount of imperfections in the modern era.

Excellent post.

[Andre Nickatina]

Legs too small, not enough definition.

 
Brutally huge, but hardly cut in todays standards.

 
Oil in his delts, calves, and arms. How can you claim he's absolutely PERFECT if he's got fake body parts? Roids are one thing, they enhance what you got, but when you morph yourself using substances, that's another ballgame.

 
Arms and shoulders too big for his chest.

 
Not defined enough, back detail sucked like Belladonna in her latest flick, not enough vascularity, and he was generally soft as your pudgy ass.

*The above comments are to point out that, in fact, you can pick apart ANYONE. Shawn Ray may be an asshole, fucked TV's, and only leased his cars. But, he is most often looked at as the BBer with the LEAST amount of imperfections in the modern era.

EPIC TRUTH

"Suckmymuscle" (gay name) has officially been owned toughly. Reeves has no business being compoared to Ray.

[suckmymuscle]

Legs too small, not enough definition.

 
Brutally huge, but hardly cut in todays standards.

 
Oil in his delts, calves, and arms. How can you claim he's absolutely PERFECT if he's got fake body parts? Roids are one thing, they enhance what you got, but when you morph yourself using substances, that's another ballgame.

 
Arms and shoulders too big for his chest.

 
Not defined enough, back detail sucked like Belladonna in her latest flick, not enough vascularity, and he was generally soft as your pudgy ass.

*The above comments are to point out that, in fact, you can pick apart ANYONE. Shawn Ray may be an asshole, fucked TV's, and only leased his cars. But, he is most often looked at as the BBer with the LEAST amount of imperfections in the modern era.

  Did you even read my post? I said that none of these men fullfil an aesthetic ideal, but that they come a lot closer than Shawn Ray. Furthermore, you made lots of things up in your post, like saying that Reeves had small legs, or that Newman's arms and shoulders are too big for his chest. And then, you also mentioned completely irrelevant crap, like saying that Oliva would not be considered cut by today's stadards. So what? That's included in the category of conditioning and not aesthetics.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[NarcissisticDeity]

Shawn Ray is overrated in MY OPINION 2 pros wins in 13 years WOW-WEE he's lucky if he added 10 pounds of muscle over his entire career since turning pro , Shawn was good as marketing himself , he had a very nice physique but to hear people say he's top 10 of all-time is laughable .

[YoungBlood]

  Did you even read my post? I said that none of these men fullfil an aesthetic ideal, but that they come a lot closer than Shawn Ray. Furthermore, you made lots of things up in your post, like saying that Reeves had small legs, or that Newman's arms and shoulders are too big for his chest. And then, you also mentioned completely irrelevant crap, like saying that Oliva would not be considered cut by today's stadards. So what? That's included in the category of conditioning and not aesthetics.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

I'll give you a bit of advice, for free;

Just shut the fuck up.

I didn't make anything up. Reeves' legs were too small, by todays standards. Newmans chest was undersized (compared to his arms and delts...have you ever heard of a bodybuilder claiming X part is TOO BIG?), which you can read in various publications. Doesn't make them bad BBer's at all- but does detract from them having the perfect build, just as you say Shawn has a less than perfect build.
No matter what, there is no such thing as 100% perfect. If so, whose mind is he/she perfect in? What makes them perfect? There's a thread over at Mayhem by Rich Piana where he says he believes that a particular set of measurements would make the best BBer IN HIS EYES. Steve Reeves had his own ideals- neither Steve or Rich attained their very own "perfect standard."

[suckmymuscle]

  I don't care what you people think. Shawn Ray was overrated when it comes to aesthetics. You cannot be considered as an aesthetic ideal when you are short, with narrow clavicle, short legs, a long torso and an average face.

  To me, being an aesthetic ideal encompasses overral aesthetics. Having muscles that are proportional in relation to one another is not enough. You also need to have:

 - A skeletal frame that is proportional

 - Height.

 - Good complexion.

 - Facial symmetry(synonymous with facial beauty).

  A man like Shawn Ray would never warrant a statue in Ancient greece, because although his muscles are proportional, he's too flawed elsewhere. the closest to aesthetic idelas i can think of would be Steve Reeves and Dennis Newman. Flex Wheeler, too, except for the face.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Tre]

The guy was a really good bodybuilder for a very long time and neither of his titles were 'gifts'.  

He was fun to have around here on the boards.

He's a pretty decent bodybuilding emcee.

He did a pretty good job as a first-year show promoter in 2006.

He runs a golf tournament that draws dozens of participants and sponsors every year.  

He does a good job of keeping himself in the mix with respect to ensuring that fans are talking about him.

-----

But all those good things mean nothing if Ron's story about what Shawn did to his own mother is true.  

[bigdumbbell]

i bet arnold told weider to dump him

[suckmymuscle]

I'll give you a bit of advice, for free;

Just shut the fuck up.

  STFU noob. You want some advice? Don't argue with me because I'm more intelligent than you.

I didn't make anything up. Reeves' legs were too small, by todays standards.

  By today's standards? Who fucking cares? Oliva would be regarded as small overral for today's stadards, and yet he still would be perfect in terms of structure and muscle proportions. Steve Reeves's legs were perfectly in size for the rest of his body, and that's what matters when it comes to aesthetics. And unlike Ray, his legs were not short for his torso.

Newmans chest was undersized (compared to his arms and delts...have you ever heard of a bodybuilder claiming X part is TOO BIG?), which you can read in various publications. Doesn't make them bad BBer's at all- but does detract from them having the perfect build, just as you say Shawn has a less than perfect build.

  First of all, this is utter bullshit. Secondly, even if it were true, it doesen't matter because I never claimed that he was perfect; I claimed that he is closer to an aesthetic ideal than Ray, which is true. As long as he has less flaws than Ray, I am correct in my statement. And guess what? He has less flaws than Ray.

 No matter what, there is no such thing as 100% perfect.

  This is exactly what I said, dumbass. Regardless, there are many guys who came closer to the aesthetic ideal than Ray.

 If so, whose mind is he/she perfect in? What makes them perfect? There's a thread over at Mayhem by Rich Piana where he says he believes that a particular set of measurements would make the best BBer IN HIS EYES. Steve Reeves had his own ideals- neither Steve or Rich attained their very own "perfect standard."

  yes, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, but beauty correlates strongly with proportions. Ray had good muscular proportions, but he lacked proportions in his skeletal frame, as well as height and facial symmetry(facial beauty). Many guys came closer to that ideal than Ray.

SUCKMYMUSCLE