Author Topic: Voters reject Chavez's referendum  (Read 3240 times)

loco

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #25 on: December 04, 2007, 01:37:05 PM »
Oh yea, you showed your hand with the Pinochet comparison.  It is laughable. If there were even a speck of proof that Chavez is doing what Pinochet did, we'd be all over that country with troops...  The only reason it didn't happen with Pinochet was because he disappeared and tortured leftists or suspected leftists which is something we train people for right here in America at the School of the Americas which is an American santioned terror training camp right here on our soil. This crap has happend all over Central and South America and it's absolutely hilarious you'd try to play that card against Chavez knowing how often it's happened on the right...  If there were hard facts on this being the case, it would be plastered on American Media and we'd have sent troops in so yea, I call bullshit.

Hey, I never said Chavez is currently torturing and murdering the opposition...not yet anyway and I hope he never does, though it is something we fear very much.  Venezuelans have good reason to fear this as they went through this with former Venezuelan dictators general Juan Vicente Gómez between 1908 and 1935, and Marcos Evangelista Pérez Jiménez between 1952 and 1958.  Like most dictators, these two were not tolerant of criticism and their governments ruthlessly pursued and suppressed the opposition in Venezuela.

My comparison was that as the truth about dictators such as Castro and Pinochet abusing their power came to light, likewise the truth about Chavez abusing his power will come to light.  He is a dictator wannabe and he is abusing his power.  Don't believe me?  Will you believe John Pilger, who is a Chavez supporter?  In one of his documentaries, John Pilger admits that Chavez has denied Venezuelans some basic rights and liberties, then he justified it by saying that Chavez says he is doing this only to accelerate reform...yeah right.  Did you not watch the documentary you posted?

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #26 on: December 04, 2007, 02:15:51 PM »
Hey, I never said Chavez is currently torturing and murdering the opposition...not yet anyway and I hope he never does, though it is something we fear very much.  Venezuelans have good reason to fear this as they went through this with former Venezuelan dictators general Juan Vicente Gómez between 1908 and 1935, and Marcos Evangelista Pérez Jiménez between 1952 and 1958.  Like most dictators, these two were not tolerant of criticism and their governments ruthlessly pursued and suppressed the opposition in Venezuela.

My comparison was that as the truth about dictators such as Castro and Pinochet abusing their power came to light, likewise the truth about Chavez abusing his power will come to light.  He is a dictator wannabe and he is abusing his power.  Don't believe me?  Will you believe John Pilger, who is a Chavez supporter?  In one of his documentaries, John Pilger admits that Chavez has denied Venezuelans some basic rights and liberties, then he justified it by saying that Chavez says he is doing this only to accelerate reform...yeah right.  Did you not watch the documentary you posted?
::)  Gee, why on earth would a leader be lead down such a road?  Can you honestly say there would be an issue if crap like this wasn't an issue?  What do you want?  Every single leader that doesn't follow Washington's dictates to just roll over and expose their bellies to the carnivores?   http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=184197.0 Who's really to blame huh???  You want to match up tactics from leftists vs. the right in Central and South America, you're going to lose this argument bigtime...

loco

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2007, 03:00:11 PM »
::)  Gee, why on earth would a leader be lead down such a road?  Can you honestly say there would be an issue if crap like this wasn't an issue?  What do you want?  Every single leader that doesn't follow Washington's dictates to just roll over and expose their bellies to the carnivores?   http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=184197.0 Who's really to blame huh???  You want to match up tactics from leftists vs. the right in Central and South America, you're going to lose this argument bigtime...

Berserker, did or did not  John Pilger admit that Chavez has denied Venezuelans some basic rights and liberties, then he justified it by saying that Chavez says he is doing this only to accelerate reform?

I don't care about winning or losing arguments.  I care about my family.  I don't want Venezuela under a dictatorship again.  Would you want that for your family?  What is it with you and your love for Chavez anyway?  If Washinton is so bad and Chavez so good, then give up your American citizenship and move to Venezuela.

Dos Equis

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2007, 08:59:23 PM »
Jesus Christ... If I ever end up in court, I hope to hell I don't get someone like you on the jury ::)  You can't actually tell me you couldn't imagine why someone would mislead on this subject... For shit sake, I can show you half a dozen misleading stories in the main stream media on Chavez...  It doesn't take a freaking genius to figure out motive ::)

We're not talking about someone.  We're talking about loco.  And no, after reading his posts on this site, I can't imagine why he would try and mislead you on this subject.  I'd say he is pretty credible overall and the fact he lives in Venezuela enhances his credibility even more. 

But not something worth debating. 

Mars

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #29 on: December 05, 2007, 05:17:04 AM »


Two courageous leaders.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #30 on: December 05, 2007, 10:36:56 AM »
Berserker, did or did not  John Pilger admit that Chavez has denied Venezuelans some basic rights and liberties, then he justified it by saying that Chavez says he is doing this only to accelerate reform?

I don't care about winning or losing arguments.  I care about my family.  I don't want Venezuela under a dictatorship again.  Would you want that for your family?  What is it with you and your love for Chavez anyway?  If Washinton is so bad and Chavez so good, then give up your American citizenship and move to Venezuela.
I've posted the whole video, pinned so people can see exactly what John Pilger said.  So glad you bring John into the argument :) and I hope people will take the time to view it and have a better understanding of America's role throughout Latin America.


Hedgehog

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Re: Voters reject Chavez's referendum
« Reply #31 on: December 05, 2007, 07:10:34 PM »
Voters reject Chavez's referendum
"...The most controversial amendment would do away with term limits, thereby allowing the 53-year-old former paratrooper, who has already served almost eight years in power, to hold it indefinitely as long as he is re-elected..."
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/12/03/venezuela.referendum/index.html

Venezuela rejects bid by Chávez to amend charter
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/12/03/america/venez.php

I think it was great that the "No!" side won.

And I was very pleased to see that Chavez accepting the result, it was something that gave me hope that he has a wish for a legit Democracy in Venezuela.

Recent events, eg when Chavez and the Spanish king had their run-in, and Chavez failing in Colombia, had me very worried.



I genuinely hope that the Western world will support Venezuela, and refrain from the gangster methods that is Reagan's legacy of handling the South America region in the 80's.

That kind of stupidity has effectively sabotaged Democracy in the region for 30 years.
As empty as paradise