Author Topic: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war  (Read 5791 times)

Bindare_Dundat

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #50 on: January 24, 2008, 08:17:38 AM »
Follow the money....He  had reasons to ignore certain things...he got money from a bathist to fund his movie....connect the dots..maybe they don't add up but if this guy was doing something froma pro-Bush pro Republican angle then u Libs would be all over this. As for my sources..i cut and pasted from a number of media outlets....

please give us the sources

headhuntersix

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #51 on: January 24, 2008, 08:37:12 AM »
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/unscom/interviews/ritter.html


[CNN excerpt starts here]

….someone's going to have to show to me how Iraq suddenly went from being, you know, contained and fundamentally disarmed [to the opposite].

And remember, even though I say we couldn't account for everything -- even although I say we couldn't account for everything, from 1994 to 1998, we monitored Iraq's weapons programs, their factories, with the most intrusive on-site monitoring inspection program in the history of arms control, and never once found any deviation, never once found retained prohibitive capability or reconstituted [capability].

[CNN excerpt ends here]

And here are two statements Ritter made four years earlier, in 1998, during his Hawk period.  The first is from an interview on the National Public Radio program, 'Morning Edition.' This was on August 28th, just after he resigned from UNSCOM: [5]

[Excerpt from NPR starts here]

RITTER: [...] The problem with disarming Iraq right now is that Iraq has failed across the board. There are major questions in chemical. Iraq has a VX program. VX is one of the most deadly substances on the face of the Earth. And we've uncovered this. They refuse to even address the issue.

We have major problems with stocks of chemical weapons and chemical agents that are unaccounted for. The entire biological program, which (unintelligible) horrible weapons, is a black hole, as Richard Butler says. Ballistic missiles -- there's absolute concern that they still retain the capability to deliver chemical and biological weapons through ballistic missiles that they haven't declared.

[Excerpt from NPR ends here]

The second Hawk statement is from an interview on the US television  network, ABC.  It’s from the 'Good Morning America’ program, November 2, 1998: [6] 

[Excerpt from 'Good Morning America' starts here]

[…]

Lisa McRee: What are they hiding?

SCOTT RITTER: They are hiding their retained capabilities in biological, chemical, nuclear weapons and ballistic missile delivery systems.

Lisa McRee: Can you be more specific about what you believe they have?

Scott Ritter: I think one of the things that has been in the news recently is the VX nerve agent, one of the most deadly substances known to mankind. Iraq clearly produced this agent in large quantities and put it on ballistic missile warheads. They have lied about that, they have said that they have not done this, despite the fact that we have the proof in our hands.

Lisa McRee: What's our appropriate response, then?

Scott Ritter: It's time to call the game for what it is. This is Saddam Hussein's attempt to keep weapons of mass destruction and get sanctions lifted. Saddam is linked with these weapons, there is no way of dealing with the weapons without dealing with Saddam.

Lisa McRee: But do what? Should we have a military strike against Iraq? Should it be unilateral or should we do it only with allies? What do you suggest?

Scott Ritter: These are issues that have to be addressed by the national security policy team in Washington, DC, that's what they get paid the big bucks for.

Lisa McRee: What do you think will work, though? You've been there.

Scott Ritter: I know what won't work, continuing to provide concessions to Iraq only feeds their strength. Iraq is in charge of this game right now. They are the ones calling the shots. It's time for the United Nations, the [national] security council of the United States to seize the initiative to start taking more proactive measures to counter Saddam Hussein. And whatever measures they take, they are going to have to be decisive and not the half steps that have been taken so far.

L

headhuntersix

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #52 on: January 24, 2008, 08:39:20 AM »
From Ritters own book....



B]y 1995 there were no more weapons in Iraq, there were no more documents in Iraq, there was no more production capability in Iraq because we were monitoring the totality of Iraq’s industrial infrastructure with the most technologically advanced, the most intrusive arms control regime in the history of arms control.

Scott Ritter in 1999 (extract from Ritter’s Endgame):

In 1995 Unit 2001 conducted tests on live human subjects taken from the Abu Ghraib prison, using BW and binary CW agent. Around fifty prisoners were chosen for these experiments, which took place at a remote testing ground in western Iraq. The purpose of these experiments was to test the toxicity of available agent to ensure that the biological agent remained viable. As a result, all the prisoners died.

 have never given Iraq a clean bill of health! Never! Never!

Scott Ritter in 1999:



I have grown convinced that there has been a total breakdown in the willingness of the international community to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction. Saddam Hussein is well on the road to getting his sanctions lifted and keeping his weapons in the bargain.

Scott Ritter last month:



[W]e ... allowed ourselves during the decade of the 1990s to be pre-programmed into accepting at face value without question anything that was negative about Saddam Hussein’s regime, and this made selling the war on Iraq on the basis of a lie the easiest task ever faced by the Bush Administration.

Scott Ritter in 1999:
A resurgent Iraq, reinvigorated economically and politically by standing up successfully to the United States and the United Nations, will be a very dangerous Iraq ...






L

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #53 on: January 24, 2008, 08:48:34 AM »
ritter makes good points - but - he advocates WALKING AWAY from iraq and letting their neighbors chistle up the oil.  Idiocy.

headhuntersix

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #54 on: January 24, 2008, 08:51:28 AM »
My point was Ritter is all over the map. Walking away at this point..not a good idea. Our foreign policy since the early 70's oil crunch has been to make sure that we could never be held hostage to OPEC. It was a long term strategy and we're seeing the ultimate pay-off from it.
L

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #55 on: January 24, 2008, 09:08:10 AM »
My point was Ritter is all over the map. Walking away at this point..not a good idea. Our foreign policy since the early 70's oil crunch has been to make sure that we could never be held hostage to OPEC. It was a long term strategy and we're seeing the ultimate pay-off from it.

agreed... i'm starting to like you, HH6.  you're being very honest.

Bush will be remembered as redefining US energy policy.  Getting control of afghan/caspian and Iraqi oil, and setting up bases in those countries.  Yeah, he was unpopular at the time, but in 20 years, no one will remember the dead soldiers, the WMD lies, or the 3000 people from 911 who were allowed to die.  They'll just shrug and be happy their Yukon is still running.

Decker

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #56 on: January 24, 2008, 10:04:41 AM »
ritter makes good points - but - he advocates WALKING AWAY from iraq and letting their neighbors chistle up the oil.  Idiocy.
The short term gain we get from the foreign oil raises the issues that:

-The more the US screws with foreign countries for oil, the more terrorist acts will be directed at our troops and at us

-Putting R&D for a renewable source of energy on the backburner until necessary insures the above point

-We thought Bush was bad with his constitutional assaults, wait till the US is hit again.  Then we'll see what will be done to our liberties to keep us safe

-The access to oil is just that, access.  The price is going to continue to rise as will all other costs related to the energy source (oil is finite/scarce)   Food prices, durable goods...any product that is shipped/transported will inflate the costs to account for the increase in gas prices---we are seeing that already.  We have what?, at best 70 years of gasoline left on the planet?   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossil_fuel#Levels_and_flows

Bodvar

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #57 on: January 24, 2008, 11:20:24 AM »

He didn't murder Americans.

Do you give a shit what a n korean dictator does?  I sure don't.  Unless they fck with americans.

but, americans DID die in iraq - when we went to war with them.

saddam was the butcher, sure.  He butchered those animals that are butchering each other still to this day.  SHould 3000 men and 1 tril be spent - just to prevent him from killing them?  Fck now.  We have crime here that needs stopped.  We have hungry people HERE.  I don' want to spend US money and manpower stopping bad guys from hurting their own people in other nations, when there are still unsolved murders here in the USA.

I care, and I do give a shit about what a North Korean dictator does. Kim Jong Il has turned his people into prisoners and slaves, and he deserves a bullet in the head for it.

So basically Hitler shouldn't have been stopped until everybody was full and there were no unsolved crimes, which is pretty much never. Wonderful.

People are hungry here? In case you haven't noticed we have a bit of an obesity problem here. The issue isn't lack of food, it's excesses of it.

See after 911 we learned that our oceans cannot protect us from our enemies anymore. A bunch of religious nutjobs with box cutters did more damage to the American mainland than Hitler with his 18 million man army could.

If only Iran can be stopped before it develops its nuclear weapons. I'm afraid we can't do anything about Iran because of the crippling effect of the never ended propaganda spewed by people like you day in and day out.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #58 on: January 24, 2008, 11:28:25 AM »
See after 911 we learned that our oceans cannot protect us from our enemies anymore. A bunch of religious nutjobs with box cutters did more damage to the American mainland than Hitler with his 18 million man army could.

Dude, stop right there.

911 was allowed to happen.

NORAD stood down, specific threats were ignored.

You cannot use that as a support.  Sure, maybe it was allowed to happen to squish the islamic bug while it was a puppy instead of letting it grow into a pitbull (once they learned to use their oil).

But until you can answer the many questions surrounding 911, including the insider trading and condi telling mayor willie brown not to fly tomorrow, you can't use 911 as an example for anything, other than a convenient catalyst for already-planned war.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #59 on: January 24, 2008, 11:31:35 AM »
I care, and I do give a shit about what a North Korean dictator does. Kim Jong Il has turned his people into prisoners and slaves, and he deserves a bullet in the head for it.

Please place a value on the # of american soldier lives that should be sacrificed to deliver that bullet.

My # is zero.

Yes, Il is a luniatic and evil dictator.  But... it's their problem, not ours.  Do you want to be the world's police?  When a man like Hitler takes aggressive action into other countries, yes, you crush him like we did saddam in 1991/2.  But you don't barge into every house on your block where the hubby slaps wifey, do you?  No.  When they bring that noise into the yard, and mess up your sleep, theyn by all means go fck him up.  But in-house shit shouldn't cost our troops their lives.

Bodvar

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #60 on: January 24, 2008, 11:36:23 AM »
Dude, stop right there.

911 was allowed to happen.

NORAD stood down, specific threats were ignored.

You cannot use that as a support.  Sure, maybe it was allowed to happen to squish the islamic bug while it was a puppy instead of letting it grow into a pitbull (once they learned to use their oil).

But until you can answer the many questions surrounding 911, including the insider trading and condi telling mayor willie brown not to fly tomorrow, you can't use 911 as an example for anything, other than a convenient catalyst for already-planned war.

So your telling me that government allowed the worst attack on US history to happen so that Bush could engage in an unpopular war, in order to secure oil (which is at around $100 per barrel today).

All this insiders trading and Condi telling whoever to stay home, are just rumors, just because they are repeated frequently doesn't mean they are true.

Tell me if Condi warned Willie Brown, why didn't she warn Barbara Olsen? Ted and Barbara Olsen were much closer to the Bush Administration than Willie Nelson ever was.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #61 on: January 24, 2008, 11:39:56 AM »
So your telling me that government allowed the worst attack on US history to happen so that Bush could engage in an unpopular war, in order to secure oil (which is at around $100 per barrel today).

All this insiders trading and Condi telling whoever to stay home, are just rumors, just because they are repeated frequently doesn't mean they are true.

Tell me if Condi warned Willie Brown, why didn't she warn Barbara Olsen? Ted and Barbara Olsen were much closer to the Bush Administration than Willie Nelson ever was.

bullshit - the insider trading is very real, look it up yourself.
Bulshit - the warnings were real.  newsweek reported the pentagon brass admitted all their flights were cancelled for the 11th, and mayor brown told ABC that condi warned him 8 hours ahead of time. 

LOOK IT UP.

Also, Olsen was on the plane that hit the pentagon.  When you can show me one of the 85 missing clips of the plane hitting the pentagon, I'll believe you on that one.




BTW - oil at 100 a barrel is a GOOD thing for US dollar stability, and many believed it was cheney's goal 5 years ago.

Bodvar

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #62 on: January 24, 2008, 11:44:03 AM »
Please place a value on the # of american soldier lives that should be sacrificed to deliver that bullet.

My # is zero.

Yes, Il is a luniatic and evil dictator.  But... it's their problem, not ours.  Do you want to be the world's police?  When a man like Hitler takes aggressive action into other countries, yes, you crush him like we did saddam in 1991/2.  But you don't barge into every house on your block where the hubby slaps wifey, do you?  No.  When they bring that noise into the yard, and mess up your sleep, theyn by all means go fck him up.  But in-house shit shouldn't cost our troops their lives.

You know, it seems US soldiers never make this argument your making, they actually believe in the mission which is why you almost never see them in the media commenting on the war, they just don't have the "right" opinion about it. The troops are willing to fight for other peoples' freedom, they don't need you to tell them what cause is worth them risking their lives for, that's up to them.

Dude, do you think we live an a vacuum? The world is one big interconnected place, and situations in one country can affect the entire planet. Kim Jong Il is everybody's problem, and no one knows what to do about him. The situation is that if we invade North Korea, then Seoul will be annihilated instantly. Il has about 150,000 pieces of artillery pointed at Seoul. It's a mess.

And yes I want us to be the world police, who else is going to do it, the UN?

But we can't do anything about it since that pudgy little pervert has us by the balls.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #63 on: January 24, 2008, 11:48:35 AM »
And yes I want us to be the world police, who else is going to do it, the UN?

well, that is where you and I differ.

Should we invade darfur and stop the abuses there?  Nothing there except dirt.  NKorea has nothing but rocks.  We only seem to help nations out when they're on oil.

Which is fine.

But are you advocating the US be involved in every nation's humanitarian crisii?

That would cost a great deal of $.  Where shuld that $ come from?

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #64 on: January 24, 2008, 11:49:06 AM »
bullshit - the insider trading is very real, look it up yourself.

Bulshit - the warnings were real.  newsweek reported the pentagon brass admitted all their flights were cancelled for the 11th, and mayor brown told ABC that condi warned him 8 hours ahead of time. 

LOOK IT UP.

No, you look it up, your the one making the claim. Show me all this overwhelming evidence, from credible sources please, and no Moveon.org is not a credible source.


Also, Olsen was on the plane that hit the pentagon.  When you can show me one of the 85 missing clips of the plane hitting the pentagon, I'll believe you on that one.

If she wasn't on the plane where the hell is she? What missing clips? Where do you get this information?


BTW - oil at 100 a barrel is a GOOD thing for US dollar stability, and many believed it was cheney's goal 5 years ago.

Actually the US dollar is very weak right now.

Please explain to me how high oil prices are good for US dollar stability, I haven't heard that one yet, I'd like to know the specifics of how that works.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #65 on: January 24, 2008, 11:51:13 AM »
man i hae such a headache from debating politics.  i keep telling myself i'll stop.

believe what you'd like about 911.  The FBI admitted there are 85 videos of the plane hitting.  pentagon said just one, the blurry 9 screenshots.  You believe who you want.

dollar has to stay in play in middle east, and price high means the reserves stay in dollar.  you study your own economics, or pay me to explain it better lol... i just have been debating too much and really need a brak.  ciao.

Bodvar

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #66 on: January 24, 2008, 11:57:34 AM »
well, that is where you and I differ.

We differ in a lot more places than that :)

Should we invade darfur and stop the abuses there?  Nothing there except dirt.  NKorea has nothing but rocks.  We only seem to help nations out when they're on oil.
Which is fine.

Yes we should, just like we should have in Rwanda.

It's unfortunate but we do spend a lot of energy on nations that have something that we value. But when you want to limit your foreign involvement, it only makes sense to get involved in conflicts when your countries interests are involved.

I have no problem with securing the free flow of oil, without oil our whole way of life will collapse which will result in disaster. But I have no problem with intervening in situations that involve genocide.


But are you advocating the US be involved in every nation's humanitarian crisii?

Not every, only in the case of genocide or foreign invasion.

That would cost a great deal of $.  Where shuld that $ come from?

We could stop the idiotic War and Drugs and free every prisoner convicted of simple possession of marijuana and we'd free up plenty of cash to aggressively stop genocide and slavery around the world with the overwhelming force of our US military.

We could even give our soldiers huge pay raises and increase benefits which would encourage more people join so we wouldn't have a shortage of personnel.

See, problem solved.





Bodvar

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #67 on: January 24, 2008, 12:00:35 PM »
man i hae such a headache from debating politics.  i keep telling myself i'll stop.

believe what you'd like about 911.  The FBI admitted there are 85 videos of the plane hitting.  pentagon said just one, the blurry 9 screenshots.  You believe who you want.

dollar has to stay in play in middle east, and price high means the reserves stay in dollar.  you study your own economics, or pay me to explain it better lol... i just have been debating too much and really need a brak.  ciao.

Yeah, I'm wasting a lot of time arguing about stuff that nobody is going to change their minds on.

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #68 on: January 24, 2008, 12:14:19 PM »

If she wasn't on the plane where the hell is she? What missing clips? Where do you get this information?


This is one of the funniest parts of this conspiracy theory.  I think they have alleged she was secretly released overseas.  Where are the rest of the passengers too?  You won't get a straight, sane answer to this. 

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #69 on: January 24, 2008, 01:34:52 PM »
This is one of the funniest parts of this conspiracy theory.  I think they have alleged she was secretly released overseas.  Where are the rest of the passengers too?  You won't get a straight, sane answer to this. 

You're a sheep, plain and simple.

5 of the 10 911 commissioners have called for a second investigation.

you're trying to sell a recalled car here.

The authors don't even believe it anymore.  But YOU DO!

hahahahaha oh brother what a sucker.

War-Horse

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #70 on: January 24, 2008, 04:08:42 PM »
You're a sheep, plain and simple.

5 of the 10 911 commissioners have called for a second investigation.

you're trying to sell a recalled car here.

The authors don't even believe it anymore.  But YOU DO!

Quote
hahahahaha oh brother what a sucker.



Hey are you an old squad member? >:(






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Bindare_Dundat

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Re: Study: Bush, officials made false statements prior to Iraq war
« Reply #71 on: January 26, 2008, 01:27:50 AM »
man i hae such a headache from debating politics.  i keep telling myself i'll stop.

believe what you'd like about 911.  The FBI admitted there are 85 videos of the plane hitting.  pentagon said just one, the blurry 9 screenshots.  You believe who you want.

dollar has to stay in play in middle east, and price high means the reserves stay in dollar.  you study your own economics, or pay me to explain it better lol... i just have been debating too much and really need a brak.  ciao.

I hear you there. lol