Lost Season 5

[Dos Equis]

Very good finale.  I'm glad they finally put a face on Jacob, because I was starting to become convinced that he didn't exist.  Was it just a coincidence that he touched all of the Oceanic 6?   

What language was Richard speaking when he was asked the "shadow of the statue" question? 

[MB_722]

Very good finale.  I'm glad they finally put a face on Jacob, because I was starting to become convinced that he didn't exist.  Was it just a coincidence that he touched all of the Oceanic 6?    doubt it was a coincidence,

What language was Richard speaking when he was asked the "shadow of the statue" question? Latin 

[Dos Equis]

Thanks.

[TrapsMcLats]

That was a damn good episode. No idea where they're going with this though.  who cares, great writing.

[andreisdaman]

That was a damn good episode. No idea where they're going with this though.  who cares, great writing.

you guys think Jacob is the good guy or bad guy?

what about the part when Ben is yelling at Jacob and says "what about me"?
and Jacob nonchalantly says "what about you, Ben"?..like he didn't care about Ben and as if Ben were a flea compared to him.

[Dos Equis]

I think he was bad.  He distracted Sayid so Sayid's wife could be killed.

But he's toast now anyway.   

[MindSpin]

Coooool.  Didn't know there was a Lost thread in GB.  I'm a huge fan and have not missed an episode since the first.  BTW, the best podcast of all can be found here: http://www.hawaiiup.com/lost/

[TrapsMcLats]

I think he was a good guy, no doubt.

you guys think Jacob is the good guy or bad guy?

what about the part when Ben is yelling at Jacob and says "what about me"?
and Jacob nonchalantly says "what about you, Ben"?..like he didn't care about Ben and as if Ben were a flea compared to him.

[Desolate]

What language was Richard speaking when he was asked the "shadow of the statue" question?

Yep. MB_722 is right. It was Latin and this is the translation:

Ilana asks, "What lies in the shadow of the statue?" Richard replies in Latin, "Ille qui nos omnes servabit", which translated means "He who will protect/save us all".

I think he was bad.  He distracted Sayid so Sayid's wife could be killed.

No. He prevented Sayid from getting killed.

Think about it.

Also, I think Richard was on The Black Rock (old slave ship) that we’ve seen in previous seasons and at the beginning of this episode.

[Desolate]

I think the entire premise of the show was finally revealed at the beginning of this episode.

The island is like Eden. It may be Eden.

These two beings are playing a game.

If you listen to what they say, Jacob believes in humanity. He keeps trying to help them grow, evolve. He is the good guy.

The other being doesn't believe in humanity. He believes that no matter how many times they try, humans always end up destroying. He is the bad guy who believes humans are a lost cause.

Jacob states that even though they blow it time and again, they always end up in a slightly better (more evolved) position then when they started. Think of it as climbing rungs on a ladder.

The other being wants to kill Jacob, but it appears that he is forbidden from doing so. He is looking for a loophole.

This is where it gets interesting.

Ilana said that Jacob wasn't in the cabin and hadn't been there for a long time. I believe that the other being tricked The Others into thinking he was Jacob. He used Jack's father Christian as a proxy to speak for him.

Is Jack's dad evil? No, I don't think so. I think Christian believed he was speaking for Jacob. He was a dupe.

What does it matter?

Well, if you look at the big picture, it was Christian who told Locke to move the island. It was Christian who told Locke he had to bring everybody back who left to the island.

I believe this evil being got Locke to do these things so that he could get back to the island. He needed to find that loophole. By saying that everyone who left needed to come back, he created the means to get back. When Locke was really murdered by Ben, he could assume Locke's identity and get The Others/Richard to take him right to Jacob.

Notice that he doesn't kill Jacob. He can't. He's not allowed. So he gets Ben to do it by playing on Ben's anger and bitterness. Jacob tells Ben that it is his choice (i.e. free will). Ben can't see the forest for the trees. He kills Jacob and the evil being wins.

However, all of this might be mute if setting off of the nuke resets things so that the Swan station is never built, the button never needs to be pushed, and the plane never crashes on that day because Desmond didn’t get back to the Swan to push the button in time because of his following/killing of that guy Kelvin.

[andreisdaman]

I think the entire premise of the show was finally revealed at the beginning of this episode.

The island is like Eden. It may be Eden.

These two beings are playing a game.

If you listen to what they say, Jacob believes in humanity. He keeps trying to help them grow, evolve. He is the good guy.

The other being doesn't believe in humanity. He believes that no matter how many times they try, humans always end up destroying. He is the bad guy who believes humans are a lost cause.

Jacob states that even though they blow it time and again, they always end up in a slightly better (more evolved) position then when they started. Think of it as climbing rungs on a ladder.

The other being wants to kill Jacob, but it appears that he is forbidden from doing so. He is looking for a loophole.

This is where it gets interesting.

Ilana said that Jacob wasn't in the cabin and hadn't been there for a long time. I believe that the other being tricked The Others into thinking he was Jacob. He used Jack's father Christian as a proxy to speak for him.

Is Jack's dad evil? No, I don't think so. I think Christian believed he was speaking for Jacob. He was a dupe.

What does it matter?

Well, if you look at the big picture, it was Christian who told Locke to move the island. It was Christian who told Locke he had to bring everybody back who left to the island.

I believe this evil being got Locke to do these things so that he could get back to the island. He needed to find that loophole. By saying that everyone who left needed to come back, he created the means to get back. When Locke was really murdered by Ben, he could assume Locke's identity and get The Others/Richard to take him right to Jacob.

Notice that he doesn't kill Jacob. He can't. He's not allowed. So he gets Ben to do it by playing on Ben's anger and bitterness. Jacob tells Ben that it is his choice (i.e. free will). Ben can't see the forest for the trees. He kills Jacob and the evil being wins.

However, all of this might be mute if setting off of the nuke resets things so that the Swan station is never built, the button never needs to be pushed, and the plane never crashes on that day because Desmond didn’t get back to the Swan to push the button in time because of his following/killing of that guy Kelvin.

awesome theory..thanks for sharing

[danielson]

I think the entire premise of the show was finally revealed at the beginning of this episode.

The island is like Eden. It may be Eden.

These two beings are playing a game.

If you listen to what they say, Jacob believes in humanity. He keeps trying to help them grow, evolve. He is the good guy.

The other being doesn't believe in humanity. He believes that no matter how many times they try, humans always end up destroying. He is the bad guy who believes humans are a lost cause.

Jacob states that even though they blow it time and again, they always end up in a slightly better (more evolved) position then when they started. Think of it as climbing rungs on a ladder.

The other being wants to kill Jacob, but it appears that he is forbidden from doing so. He is looking for a loophole.

This is where it gets interesting.

Ilana said that Jacob wasn't in the cabin and hadn't been there for a long time. I believe that the other being tricked The Others into thinking he was Jacob. He used Jack's father Christian as a proxy to speak for him.

Is Jack's dad evil? No, I don't think so. I think Christian believed he was speaking for Jacob. He was a dupe.

What does it matter?

Well, if you look at the big picture, it was Christian who told Locke to move the island. It was Christian who told Locke he had to bring everybody back who left to the island.

I believe this evil being got Locke to do these things so that he could get back to the island. He needed to find that loophole. By saying that everyone who left needed to come back, he created the means to get back. When Locke was really murdered by Ben, he could assume Locke's identity and get The Others/Richard to take him right to Jacob.

Notice that he doesn't kill Jacob. He can't. He's not allowed. So he gets Ben to do it by playing on Ben's anger and bitterness. Jacob tells Ben that it is his choice (i.e. free will). Ben can't see the forest for the trees. He kills Jacob and the evil being wins.

However, all of this might be mute if setting off of the nuke resets things so that the Swan station is never built, the button never needs to be pushed, and the plane never crashes on that day because Desmond didn’t get back to the Swan to push the button in time because of his following/killing of that guy Kelvin.

Interesting theories. There are only 16 episodes left, I hope they can wrap up all the loose ends in such a short time.

[andreisdaman]

I think the entire premise of the show was finally revealed at the beginning of this episode.

The island is like Eden. It may be Eden.

These two beings are playing a game.

If you listen to what they say, Jacob believes in humanity. He keeps trying to help them grow, evolve. He is the good guy.

The other being doesn't believe in humanity. He believes that no matter how many times they try, humans always end up destroying. He is the bad guy who believes humans are a lost cause.

Jacob states that even though they blow it time and again, they always end up in a slightly better (more evolved) position then when they started. Think of it as climbing rungs on a ladder.

The other being wants to kill Jacob, but it appears that he is forbidden from doing so. He is looking for a loophole.

This is where it gets interesting.

Ilana said that Jacob wasn't in the cabin and hadn't been there for a long time. I believe that the other being tricked The Others into thinking he was Jacob. He used Jack's father Christian as a proxy to speak for him.

Is Jack's dad evil? No, I don't think so. I think Christian believed he was speaking for Jacob. He was a dupe.

What does it matter?

Well, if you look at the big picture, it was Christian who told Locke to move the island. It was Christian who told Locke he had to bring everybody back who left to the island.

I believe this evil being got Locke to do these things so that he could get back to the island. He needed to find that loophole. By saying that everyone who left needed to come back, he created the means to get back. When Locke was really murdered by Ben, he could assume Locke's identity and get The Others/Richard to take him right to Jacob.

Notice that he doesn't kill Jacob. He can't. He's not allowed. So he gets Ben to do it by playing on Ben's anger and bitterness. Jacob tells Ben that it is his choice (i.e. free will). Ben can't see the forest for the trees. He kills Jacob and the evil being wins.

However, all of this might be mute if setting off of the nuke resets things so that the Swan station is never built, the button never needs to be pushed, and the plane never crashes on that day because Desmond didn’t get back to the Swan to push the button in time because of his following/killing of that guy Kelvin.

okay but what exactly was the loophole?

[Desolate]

I think the opportunity…the ‘loophole’ was the plane crash.

The Oceanic 815 plane crash brought people who didn’t want to be on that island. This makes them different from the people on The Black Rock. I believe those people are The Others. Well, their descendants are The Others, except for Richard who I believe may have been the captain of that old slave ship. This also makes the crash survivors different from the members of the Dharma Initiative, a group of people who definitely wanted to be on the island.

The only one of the plane crash survivors who really wanted to stay on the island is John Locke. The game begins. Locke thinks Ben was in the cabin, but it wasn’t him. It was the evil being using Jack’s dead father to speak for him.

Let’s look at how he manipulated Locke.

He told Locke to move the island to protect it. Why? It’s because he didn’t want Charles Widmore or Eloise Hawking to come back there.

Later, he told Locke that he had to bring the Oceanic 6 back to the island. If not, terrible things would happen to everyone left behind and the island would be in danger. Why? It’s because he needed to get Locke’s body.

By pretending to be Locke, he could be around The Others (followers of Jacob) and convince Ben to kill Jacob for him. I don’t think he can inhabit a body unless one is dead. This is why he didn't just inhabit Locke (or anyone else for that matter) while they were alive. But there was only so much he could do with Jack’s father’s body. See, it’s not like Christian could go up to The Others...to Richard and say, “Yo, take me to Jacob.”

The crash was the loophole because the survivors didn’t want to stay there.

Locke was enamored by the island. He wanted to stay. He knew there was something special about it after it cured his paralysis. Locke was used. The evil being played on Locke’s fears by saying that the island was in danger. This is why Locke wanted to bring the Oceanic 6 back. But did you notice that when they came back there wasn’t any danger threatening the island? Nor was there anything threatening those left behind. Did you notice how Sawyer kept saying that everything was fine in Dharmaville until they (Oceanic 6) showed up?

So the Oceanic 6 are told that they all have to go back to save their friends because they (and the island) are in danger. Locke wants to protect the island. The Oceanic 6 want to rescue everyone left behind. But nothing ever happened. At first, I thought it was bad writing. But it wasn’t, it was brilliant.

See, there wasn’t any great tragedy that happened because the Oceanic 6 left the island. The evil being knew that the Oceanic 6 wouldn’t want to come back. So he put it in Locke’s head that he was probably going to have to die to get them to return. Remember, Christian said this to him before Locke reset the wheel. He even said, “That’s why they call it sacrifice.” When they came back, he now had the chance, the opportunity to inhabit Locke’s body. Why is that important?

It’s because Locke was the new leader of The Others. As Locke, he could make Richard take him to Jacob. On the way, he could manipulate Ben to do the deed by playing on Ben’s anger and bitterness toward Jacob.

He’s a puppet master pulling the strings on what he sees as these stupid, pathetic and pointless human beings. Don't forget what he said about them to Jacob at the beginning of the episode. The great irony in all of this is that he got one of these humans…these creatures that Jacob truly believes in to actually murder him.

It rings of the betrayal of Jesus, doesn’t it? Ben Linus in the role of Judas.

[Dos Equis]

Verrrry interesting.  I think you make a great point about the being inhabiting dead bodies.  My daughter also mentioned Yemi and how he talked to Mr. Eko on the island. 

But what do you make of Eloise Hawking?  Why was she trying to get the people back to the island? 

[Desolate]

I think that she sent them to help Jacob.

As Jacob was dying he looked up at the evil being and said, “They’re coming.” Who did he mean?

I think he means Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley, Sayid, Jin, and Miles.

I don’t think the bomb is going to reset the timeline and put everybody back on the plane. What I think it is going to do is bring Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley, Sayid, Jin, Miles and possibly Juliet back to 2007.

The only negative I can think of is how long have The Others believed that they were following and taking orders from Jacob when in actuality they were being used by this evil being?

Richard seemed to know where Jacob was all along (statue). Ileana claimed that Jacob once resided in the cabin but hadn’t been there in a long time. How long? We don’t know yet. So we don’t know how long this evil guy has been manipulating people on the island while pretending to be Jacob. Even Richard was fooled by this being.

[andreisdaman]

I think the opportunity…the ‘loophole’ was the plane crash.

The Oceanic 815 plane crash brought people who didn’t want to be on that island. This makes them different from the people on The Black Rock. I believe those people are The Others. Well, their descendants are The Others, except for Richard who I believe may have been the captain of that old slave ship. This also makes the crash survivors different from the members of the Dharma Initiative, a group of people who definitely wanted to be on the island.

The only one of the plane crash survivors who really wanted to stay on the island is John Locke. The game begins. Locke thinks Ben was in the cabin, but it wasn’t him. It was the evil being using Jack’s dead father to speak for him.

Let’s look at how he manipulated Locke.

He told Locke to move the island to protect it. Why? It’s because he didn’t want Charles Widmore or Eloise Hawking to come back there.

Later, he told Locke that he had to bring the Oceanic 6 back to the island. If not, terrible things would happen to everyone left behind and the island would be in danger. Why? It’s because he needed to get Locke’s body.

By pretending to be Locke, he could be around The Others (followers of Jacob) and convince Ben to kill Jacob for him. I don’t think he can inhabit a body unless one is dead. This is why he didn't just inhabit Locke (or anyone else for that matter) while they were alive. But there was only so much he could do with Jack’s father’s body. See, it’s not like Christian could go up to The Others...to Richard and say, “Yo, take me to Jacob.”

The crash was the loophole because the survivors didn’t want to stay there.

Locke was enamored by the island. He wanted to stay. He knew there was something special about it after it cured his paralysis. Locke was used. The evil being played on Locke’s fears by saying that the island was in danger. This is why Locke wanted to bring the Oceanic 6 back. But did you notice that when they came back there wasn’t any danger threatening the island? Nor was there anything threatening those left behind. Did you notice how Sawyer kept saying that everything was fine in Dharmaville until they (Oceanic 6) showed up?

So the Oceanic 6 are told that they all have to go back to save their friends because they (and the island) are in danger. Locke wants to protect the island. The Oceanic 6 want to rescue everyone left behind. But nothing ever happened. At first, I thought it was bad writing. But it wasn’t, it was brilliant.

See, there wasn’t any great tragedy that happened because the Oceanic 6 left the island. The evil being knew that the Oceanic 6 wouldn’t want to come back. So he put it in Locke’s head that he was probably going to have to die to get them to return. Remember, Christian said this to him before Locke reset the wheel. He even said, “That’s why they call it sacrifice.” When they came back, he now had the chance, the opportunity to inhabit Locke’s body. Why is that important?

It’s because Locke was the new leader of The Others. As Locke, he could make Richard take him to Jacob. On the way, he could manipulate Ben to do the deed by playing on Ben’s anger and bitterness toward Jacob.

He’s a puppet master pulling the strings on what he sees as these stupid, pathetic and pointless human beings. Don't forget what he said about them to Jacob at the beginning of the episode. The great irony in all of this is that he got one of these humans…these creatures that Jacob truly believes in to actually murder him.

It rings of the betrayal of Jesus, doesn’t it? Ben Linus in the role of Judas.

I agre with about 75% of what you've said...you deserve accolades for coming up with such a compelling theory....but there is a specific reason why all of the guys on the plane were chosen to come to the island...there was some form of grand manipulation that got them together on that plane....I can't believe that all that Locke did was manipulated by the evil being...if it is simply a good v.s evil thing, then there are a lot of stuff in Lost that is simply filler and makes no sense...the numbers for example..the whole Dharma Inititive thing...they still haven't explained what happened to all the children...and also I have wondered whether Ben is still actually a child himself (emotionally)....his lying and scheming seems to indicate a certain level of immaturity....

also remember when Ben went to the young french woman and took her baby?...He had another kid with him which I felt was really odd.....why would he take a kid with him to take the baby?...

Maybe Locke was manipulated by both the evil being and by Jacob at various times...both realizing that he was the key somehow.....

Jacob visited all of the Oceanic survivors for a reason.....but why did he visit some as children (such as Kate) and some as adults?...(such as John and Jack)

and if Jacob can leave the island to visit others, why can't the evil being?   Or maybe the being can leave the island and manipulate others...maybe like Locke's father..who was a really evil guy.....

and they never explained the "Magic Box"..what it is and how it was used... and how they brought Locke's father to the island so that he could be killed by Sawyer...and the funny thing is that Locke couldn't bring himself to kill his father or Jacob but he killed that woman (Naomi?) from the freighter with a knife to the back

lots more to discover....

[MindSpin]

Who is the "new Lock"?  It would seem like he is perhaps the smoke monster or the guy that Jacob was speaking two at the beginning of the season finally (smokey and this guy may be one in the same).  However, if that is the case, how does this other Lock know so many details about the real Locks life?  Watch the finally again and pay special attention to the conversations the "new Lock" has with Ben... 

[Desolate]

Who is the "new Lock"?  It would seem like he is perhaps the smoke monster or the guy that Jacob was speaking two at the beginning of the season finally (smokey and this guy may be one in the same).

 
It is that guy. However, he is not smokey. Smokey may work for him. Smokey appeared to Ben as his daughter and told him not to harm John Locke. It also told him to do whatever John asked him. So it seems clear that smokey serves this evil being and knew that was really him and not Locke. By the way, Lost fan sites are now calling the evil being Esau. This is because Esau was the name of Jacob's brother in the Bible. It's just a name for now until we get an official name.

However, if that is the case, how does this other Lock know so many details about the real Locks life?  Watch the finally again and pay special attention to the conversations the "new Lock" has with Ben... 

It seems that when the being takes over a body, he has the dead person's knowledge and memories. This also happened with Jack's father Chrisitian. The evil being Esau knew all about Jack once he took over Christian's body.

[andreisdaman]

I agree that this evil being can't possibly be the smoke monster.....especially if you remember that Ben was able to summon it when he wanted to and was able to control it somehow

[Desolate]

There is a slim possibility that there are two smokeys.

Do you remember in the first season when Locke saw the smoke monster? Kate saw it heading Locke's way. Locke came out into the clearing and saw it. He looked up at it and it seemed to give off a bright (possibly white) light. We only saw Locke, the monster was not shown. However, it made the same noise/sound we've come to recognize.

Later, Locke denied that he saw anything. But at a later time, he told Jack that he "looked into the eye of this island" and what he saw "was beautiful." Some people think there are two smoke monsters. One that serves Jacob (white) and the one we have all seen that serves Esau.

Why would Locke say that smokey was beautiful? Also, Locke talked to Eko about it. I think Locke described it as beautiful (or something similar) again. Eko said, "That's not what I saw."

There's a possibility that Locke saw Jacob's smokey, not the smokey that we all know. Also, when black smokey tried to drag Locke down underground, Locke didn't seem to say that was what he'd seen earlier in that first season.

[MindSpin]

There is a slim possibility that there are two smokeys.

Do you remember in the first season when Locke saw the smoke monster? Kate saw it heading Locke's way. Locke came out into the clearing and saw it. He looked up at it and it seemed to give off a bright (possibly white) light. We only saw Locke, the monster was not shown. However, it made the same noise/sound we've come to recognize.

Later, Locke denied that he saw anything. But at a later time, he told Jack that he "looked into the eye of this island" and what he saw "was beautiful." Some people think there are two smoke monsters. One that serves Jacob (white) and the one we have all seen that serves Esau.

Why would Locke say that smokey was beautiful? Also, Locke talked to Eko about it. I think Locke described it as beautiful (or something similar) again. Eko said, "That's not what I saw."

There's a possibility that Locke saw Jacob's smokey, not the smokey that we all know. Also, when black smokey tried to drag Locke down underground, Locke didn't seem to say that was what he'd seen earlier in that first season.

That seems to be one of the more popular theories...

[Desolate]

I agree with about 75% of what you've said...you deserve accolades for coming up with such a compelling theory....but there is a specific reason why all of the guys on the plane were chosen to come to the island...

I definitely agree. However, I don't think everyone was important. For example, it doesn't seem people like Boone or his step-sister Shannon were important to the overall plan that Jacob appears to have.

I can't believe that all that Locke did was manipulated by the evil being...if it is simply a good vs evil thing

I don't think Locke was being manipulated until after his first meeting with Jacob when he saw him in the chair and Ben didn't. And as we know, it now appears that this wasn't Jacob, but Esau. After that meeting, Locke seems to become hell bent on protecting the island at any cost. Esau tricks Locke into believing the island was in danger if the Oceanic 6 didn't come back. Esau did this knowing that Locke would have to die in order to get them to come back. This would allow him to take Locke's place.

then there are a lot of stuff in Lost that is simply filler and makes no sense...the numbers for example..the whole Dharma Initiative thing...they still haven't explained what happened to all the children...and also I have wondered whether Ben is still actually a child himself (emotionally)....his lying and scheming seems to indicate a certain level of immaturity....

The numbers supposedly refer to the famous Valenzetti Equation. This was revealed in that online game (The Lost Experience) a couple of years back. It is a mathematical formula designed to predict the end of humanity. The numbers in actuality are said to represent human and environmental factors in the equation (given numerical form), though their precise meaning is uncertain.

But you're right. It hasn't been explained properly on the show. It's definitely a major question that needs answering.

I think the DI has been explained. I wouldn't expect any more on that especially if the bomb brings Jack and co. back to 2007; a time long after the DI was murdered by Ben and The Others with the poison gas.

And you're right about the children from the plane. They were kidnapped from the beach and we haven't seen them since. I guess we are supposed to assume they are with The Others, but I didn't see any children as The Others trekked with Locke/Esau to go and see Jacob.

It is possible they are waiting somewhere and that what we have seen isn't everyone from The Others. Don't forget that the stewardess is missing as well. She was the one flirting with Jack on the plane in the very first episode. We saw her only twice since she was taken. Once, she came to see Jack when he was in the polar bear cage. She said “they (The Others) told her to come and watch." Jack got pissed and yelled at her. The second time is when she spoke to Locke at The Others campsite.

Also remember when Ben went to the young french woman and took her baby?...He had another kid with him which I felt was really odd.....why would he take a kid with him to take the baby?

Training. That was Ethan. Ethan is the guy who kidnapped Claire and left Charlie for dead. Charlie eventually killed him with a gun. The amazing thing is that Ethan was not one of The Others. He was the son of Horace, the Dharma leader and his wife Amy.

Don’t forget that with this show, you have to pay very close attention to everything that is said and everything you see. Amy said the baby's name when Juliet came to get the submarine manifest so that Sawyer could sneak Jack, Kate and Hurley into Dharma.

So Ethan was either spared by Ben when he poisoned the rest of Dharma, or Ethan was taken by The Others at some earlier time. We don’t know.

A bit of trivia: The actor who plays Ethan is the first cousin of actor Tom Cruise.

Maybe Locke was manipulated by both the evil being and by Jacob at various times...both realizing that he was the key somehow.....

Very possible.

Jacob visited all of the Oceanic survivors for a reason.....but why did he visit some as children (such as Kate) and some as adults?...(such as John and Jack)

Excellent question. Notice that it was Kate and Sawyer that he visited as children. Everyone else was an adult. Are Kate and Sawyer his new Adam and Eve?

And if Jacob can leave the island to visit others, why can't the evil being?   Or maybe the being can leave the island and manipulate others...maybe like Locke's father..who was a really evil guy.....

Good point. I can’t answer that. The best I can figure is that Esau may not be allowed to leave the island. It may be his prison.

And they never explained the "Magic Box"..what it is and how it was used... and how they brought Locke's father to the island so that he could be killed by Sawyer...and the funny thing is that Locke couldn't bring himself to kill his father or Jacob but he killed that woman (Naomi?) from the freighter with a knife to the back

I think the magic box was just a metaphor. It either referred to the room that transports them through time because of the dark matter (anti-matter), or they simply brought him there with the sub, kidnapping him from the hospital after his car crash. I do believe they ran him off the road in the first place, forcing his car into the median. Instead of waking up in the hospital, he woke up on the island. I‘d vote submarine since the exit portal from the island portal is Tunisia, Africa.

Real Locke couldn’t kill his father because there are still feelings there. Locke couldn’t understand why his real Dad would screw him over for a kidney when Locke would willingly give it to him. As an orphan, Locke wished for a real family, a chance to know his Dad. While a part of him hated him, he couldn’t kill him. But he knew his Dad was a bad guy and wouldn’t stop grifting. So he put it into the hands of someone who wanted revenge and would kill him:

Sawyer/James Ford

Also, Real Locke never wanted to kill Jacob. That’s Esau. Real Locke digs Jacob.

As for Naomi, this goes back to Locke’s new mission: Protect the island. Locke believed they were a threat. He was right. The mercenaries were going to kill everybody on the island, bring Ben back to Widmore, and reveal the location of the island to him. This is why Ben moved it. Naomi wasn’t as shady as the mercenaries, but we now know that she was working for Widmore. As a threat to the island, Real Locke did what he felt he had to do.

[andreisdaman]

so what did you guys think about the ending of LOST now that its over?

[MindSpin]

i cried.  it was awesome.