Need help getting shredded

[vice1]

You can certainly get enough protein from 1500 cals. But I don't think you should have to go that low. I did my cut on 2000cals. Why do you want to lose that fast?

I just wanna get it over with 
at 12-13% bodyfat right now

[wavelength]

I just wanna get it over with 
at 12-13% bodyfat right now

Well, I would always recommend a slow cut. In my experience, everything above 2-3lb/week means increased muscle loss.

[flexingtonsteele]

well, I eat 2800 cals (200g protein rest carbs)a day around for cutting, do about 45-1 hour of elliptical everyday
stuck at 11-12% 

so your eating 400 grams of carbs a day??? I would definetely lower that bro, thats probably whats holding u back. How do u break up those carbs during the day??? Like how much per meal?

I would say keep the cardio the same, theres no need to do over an hour a day. But just lower those carbs a bit.

And are u taking in any essential fats in your diet???

[vice1]

so your eating 400 grams of carbs a day??? I would definetely lower that bro, thats probably whats holding u back. How do u break up those carbs during the day??? Like how much per meal?

I would say keep the cardio the same, theres no need to do over an hour a day. But just lower those carbs a bit.

And are u taking in any essential fats in your diet???

ya bro, about that much proabably 70-100 grams per meal, I eat 4 meals a day
I'm gonna lower them to 150 grams per day
I take 3 essential fats pills in the morning
why do you ask?

[tbombz]

IMO you could diet on 400 carbs per day if you put them only around your workout. for example = pre workout 133 gram , intra workout 133 gram, post workout 133 gram.   then do lean meats veggies and fish oils ONLY for the rest of the day.

[OTHstrong]

IMO you could diet on 400 carbs per day if you put them only around your workout. for example = pre workout 133 gram , intra workout 133 gram, post workout 133 gram.   then do lean meats veggies and fish oils ONLY for the rest of the day.

True, but the plateau will come eventually, with this amount of carbs you can lean to say 6% if good genetics ande 10-12 with bad genetics, but to go deeper then this 6% on this amount of carbs per day is 1 in a million.

[OTHstrong]

so calories don't matter as much as carbs?

Calories matter to lose weight, but when you cut calories towards an end of a diet very low, the body responds by being extremely conservative with the incoming source of energy (matabolism drops), in this case carbs. So as long as you have an outside source of energy your body will adapt to using it conservatively, hence having carbs present will eventually make you hit a plateau, but in the case that the carbs are not present, the body chooses an alternative source of fuel, your own bodyfat and as long as you don't bring in carbs your body will keep using its own fat until its all gone, really there is no limit, but the lower you make your fat levels it becomes more painful, more sufferment, and more discomfort, so in other words its somewhat dangerous and certainly not feasable for the average person. I only would recommand doing this to experience people for safety reasons, hope this helps.

[vice1]

Calories matter to lose weight, but when you cut calories towards an end of a diet very low, the body responds by being extremely conservative with the incoming source of energy (matabolism drops), in this case carbs. So as long as you have an outside source of energy your body will adapt to using it conservatively, hence having carbs present will eventually make you hit a plateau, but in the case that the carbs are not present, the body chooses an alternative source of fuel, your own bodyfat and as long as you don't bring in carbs your body will keep using its own fat until its all gone, really there is no limit, but the lower you make your fat levels it becomes more painful, more sufferment, and more discomfort, so in other words its somewhat dangerous and certainly not feasable for the average person. I only would recommand doing this to experience people for safety reasons, hope this helps.

wow, you really know your stuff, thanks I'm learning a lot
somedays where I have dieted I haven't been able to sleep at nights, my body craved food in the strangest ways, and I had to give in and binge
on a lot of food just to be able to sleep, bodybuilding requires strong willpower

[flexingtonsteele]

And bro, if u arent competing there is really no reason to suffer for just the sake of getting lean.

I would do it the most conservative way possible. Taylor actually made a good point. If u want to have ur carbs, what I would do is. Lower them, 400 grams of carbs per day is a lot. But dont drop them too much, just drop them 100 grams down to 300 per day. This little bit will be a shock to ur body. And place them all around ur workout and for breakfast. And the other meals u have during the day just have protein and veggies. And since u only eat four meals per day, that might just be ur last meal or last two meals. Oh yea, and cut out all sugar and processed foods. This alone will cut some fat off ur body

This isnt what i would do for a contest. But just for a regular guy trying to lose weight, just time ur carbs around ur workout and have em for breakfast and lower em just a bit. Then, once ur fat loss slows, lower them a bit more.

Then when u get lean and stay there for awhile, start upping ur carbs again and see how many carbs u can eat without putting on fat, and stay there.

Just try stuff and see what works.

Hope that helps
Glen

[D-bol]

i don't have scientific studies to back this up, but from personal experience, i find that eating carbs only before noon, sticking to protein-only in the afternoon and not eating any solid food (i.e. only protein shake) after 5 p.m. works quite well...combined w/ morning cardio on empty and plenty of water it really gets you there
i don't think no carbs at all is a good thing...it probably will get you pretty lean but you gonna feel like shit all the time, plus...you cant go on 0 carbs forever, so once you are back on carbs, your body's gonna store every single carb it gets so you basically gonna loose your great condition quite quickly
the point is - extreme dieting can get you to really low bf levels, but such levels are not sustainable

[OTHstrong]

i don't have scientific studies to back this up, but from personal experience, i find that eating carbs only before noon, sticking to protein-only in the afternoon and not eating any solid food (i.e. only protein shake) after 5 p.m. works quite well...combined w/ morning cardio on empty and plenty of water it really gets you there
i don't think no carbs at all is a good thing...it probably will get you pretty lean but you gonna feel like shit all the time, plus...you cant go on 0 carbs forever, so once you are back on carbs, your body's gonna store every single carb it gets so you basically gonna loose your great condition quite quickly
the point is - extreme dieting can get you to really low bf levels, but such levels are not sustainable

Exactly, therefore only intended for the competitve bodybuilder.

[vice1]

And bro, if u arent competing there is really no reason to suffer for just the sake of getting lean.

I would do it the most conservative way possible. Taylor actually made a good point. If u want to have ur carbs, what I would do is. Lower them, 400 grams of carbs per day is a lot. But dont drop them too much, just drop them 100 grams down to 300 per day. This little bit will be a shock to ur body. And place them all around ur workout and for breakfast. And the other meals u have during the day just have protein and veggies. And since u only eat four meals per day, that might just be ur last meal or last two meals. Oh yea, and cut out all sugar and processed foods. This alone will cut some fat off ur body

This isnt what i would do for a contest. But just for a regular guy trying to lose weight, just time ur carbs around ur workout and have em for breakfast and lower em just a bit. Then, once ur fat loss slows, lower them a bit more.

Then when u get lean and stay there for awhile, start upping ur carbs again and see how many carbs u can eat without putting on fat, and stay there.

Just try stuff and see what works.

Hope that helps
Glen

Thank you all for all your inputs
how about High Intensity Interval Training cardio?
is it superior to long steady cardio?
for example sprints, I hear they are great for getting you very lean

[tbombz]

wind sprints..high intensity cardio... they will get you ripped quickly, but your going to lose more muscle that way than you would if you only did low intensity cardio.


it depends on what kind of look you are going for. if you want a lean shredded body that women are going to find sexy, wind sprints will be a good addition to your workout and diet and wil speed progress.  however, if you want to be as heavily muscled as possible with low bodyfat, then stripping the fat off at a slower pace using low intensity cardio will be a better choice.

thats not to say that the muscle loss will be extreme with sprints, OR that the pace of fat loss will be turtle-paced without them, BUT there is a significant difference between the two.

[flexingtonsteele]

Thank you all for all your inputs
how about High Intensity Interval Training cardio?
is it superior to long steady cardio?
for example sprints, I hear they are great for getting you very lean

I would say that HIIT is good. It burns fat via a different pathway than low intensity cardio.

So my best advice.

DO BOTH!!!!

Just make sure u have proper post workout nutrition when u do HIIT, the same as u would after an intense training session. Because it is pretty demanding on glycogen stores

[vice1]

what I'm doing right now
200grams of protein from shake, chicken, tuna
2-3 servings of vegies, green beans
2 scoops of peanut butter (I might just drop this later on)
I'll let you guys know how it goes
thanks for all the help

[tbombz]

increase the protien , eat as much vggies as you want (dont limit yourself on green veggies. you can even gorge yourself if you want  ), make sure to have a cheat day or carb up day at leats once every two weeks or so (preferable once a week), and get some fish oil in that diet.

[vice1]

increase the protien , eat as much vggies as you want (dont limit yourself on green veggies. you can even gorge yourself if you want  ), make sure to have a cheat day or carb up day at leats once every two weeks or so (preferable once a week), and get some fish oil in that diet.

oh, cool, I know that the body doesn't absorb the calories from the fiber of the vegies, is that also true about the other forms of carbs in them?
like green peas has 5 grams of fiber and 120 cals per cup......those 120 cals would not be counted? 
I know that carb up days once a week are necessary but could you please tell me why? I would like to know
I get 3 fishoil pills a day, is that enough?

[OTHstrong]

oh, cool, I know that the body doesn't absorb the calories from the fiber of the vegies, is that also true about the other forms of carbs in them?
like green peas has 5 grams of fiber and 120 cals per cup......those 120 cals would not be counted? 
I know that carb up days once a week are necessary but could you please tell me why? I would like to know
I get 3 fishoil pills a day, is that enough?

So you can replenish glycogen stores in the muscle, so that your body doesn't think its OK to chew up your muscle.
So you can replenish glycogen in the liver so you can be functional
So your metabolism rises agaIN and doesn't come to a complete stop
So your muscle fill out temporary for a good psycological momentum
..............BUT the most important of all............
SO YOU DON'T GO CRAZY
The time you go without carbs is up to you, I've been as much as 10-11 days in arow without, but very tortures. I don't think it should be based on time but rather based on how much you've lost, every 2.5 pounds under your previous low bodyweght have a carb day.

[vice1]

So you can replenish glycogen stores in the muscle, so that your body doesn't think its OK to chew up your muscle.
So you can replenish glycogen in the liver so you can be functional
So your metabolism rises agaIN and doesn't come to a complete stop
So your muscle fill out temporary for a good psycological momentum
..............BUT the most important of all............
SO YOU DON'T GO CRAZY
The time you go without carbs is up to you, I've been as much as 10-11 days in arow without, but very tortures. I don't think it should be based on time but rather based on how much you've lost, every 2.5 pounds under your previous low bodyweght have a carb day.

how many grams of carbs do you suggest?
400-500?

[Bobby]

i think 2g per lb of bodyweight

[tbombz]

oh, cool, I know that the body doesn't absorb the calories from the fiber of the vegies, is that also true about the other forms of carbs in them?
like green peas has 5 grams of fiber and 120 cals per cup......those 120 cals would not be counted? 
I know that carb up days once a week are necessary but could you please tell me why? I would like to know
I get 3 fishoil pills a day, is that enough?

onetime did a fabulous job with the question on carb ups

green veggies do conatin some carbohydrates in them along with the dietary fiber. however the amount of energy it takes to digest the green vegetables exceeds the amount of energy (carbs) contained in them. so there is sort of a 'negative calorie' effect. so the more you eat the better.  and there are tons of other reasont oo, al just as important, but that alone should be enough to get you eating some veggies 

3 fish oil is ENOUGH, but you could get more benefits by taking more. fish oil is another thing that contains calories, but has a net negative effect. fish oil raises metablism fat metaboliism insulin sensitivity protien synthesis all to the point that the more=the beter (in regards to body composition)

[vice1]

onetime did a fabulous job with the question on carb ups

green veggies do conatin some carbohydrates in them along with the dietary fiber. however the amount of energy it takes to digest the green vegetables exceeds the amount of energy (carbs) contained in them. so there is sort of a 'negative calorie' effect. so the more you eat the better.  and there are tons of other reasont oo, al just as important, but that alone should be enough to get you eating some veggies 

3 fish oil is ENOUGH, but you could get more benefits by taking more. fish oil is another thing that contains calories, but has a net negative effect. fish oil raises metablism fat metaboliism insulin sensitivity protien synthesis all to the point that the more=the beter (in regards to body composition)

great info

in the past where I have dieted, I have binged alot because my body had this crazy cravings for food, so it left me with a worse body composition
now I can binge on green veggies 

[tbombz]

great info

in the past where I have dieted, I have binged alot because my body had this crazy cravings for food, so it left me with a worse body composition
now I can binge on green veggies 

yup !

[Go 4 It]

Have you ever tried Dave Palumbo's diet? I've been on it for almost 2 weeks and it really dried me out, helped to get that last bit of fat off me, and I feel pretty good on it, energy is good, doesn't really feel like your dieting.

[tbombz]

Have you ever tried Dave Palumbo's diet? I've been on it for almost 2 weeks and it really dried me out, helped to get that last bit of fat off me, and I feel pretty good on it, energy is good, doesn't really feel like your dieting.

not 'dave palumbo's' diet, but ive done keto diets several times before.

yeah i agree it does feel good and yeah it drys you out too.

dave diet can be improved upon though.. in my opinion he has guys eat too much dietary fat, not enough fish oi, and is dumb for setting fish oil intake to 3 caps per ay... i would lower fat intake, increase fish oil and also i wouldnt have guys worry about trace carbs from nuts, meats, eggs, and veggies.