Ok, Now Where Do They Go?

[OzmO]

Why is it inhumane to keep him in Gitmo? If he did in fact throw a grenade at a soldier and killed him, he deserves what he gets. If they caught that 12 year old kid who beheaded that guy, what would you want done with him? Tell him we love him and that we'll make that bad people go away? These two WILL grow up to be terrorists. Enlighten me, though. What would you do with him?

Again, but kind of different:  am i asking if the we should tell him we love him and that we will make the bad people go away  or is there something in your eye?

You don't put an 11 year in a prison camp full of adult terrorists.  PERIOD.  I shouldn't have to explain it to you.  You are not a muslim extremist, psycho-path, nazi concentration camp guard, sadist, etc...    

[The Luke]

I think the bigger issue here is that 90+% of the people being rounded up as terrorists are actually innocent bystanders. 90+% of those being tortured have no info to give.


If reading an English language newspaper is considered proof of a plot to travel to Britain to kill Tony Blair then perhaps we should consider whether these children are actually terrorists at all?

That 14 year old was sent to Gitmo because they claimed he headed up a sleeper cell network in Britain when he was 11 (in fact he was attending school in Saudi Arabia, living with his parents).

Wake up people... this is a witch hunt. The vast majority of these guys are completely innocent.


Your American press doesn't cover this, but half of the detainees have already been released and your State department is paying big bucks to countries taking them in, hoping to sweep this under the rug.


The Luke

[OzmO]

LOL so your answer is send him to jail in afghanistan? or let the local authority punish him? ya im sure that would be much better...lol

Again what would you have them do with him?

No, he needs some sort of rehabilitation.  He was obviously brainwashed to murder at a young age.  He might have to be institutionalized most of his life.  I donno the best course of action.

But I'm not ignorant or uncivilized enough to think putting an 11 year old child in gitmo is the best long term response or solution.

[tonymctones]

berserk & tony,

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to death?

I wasnt aware he had been sentenced to death?

Secondly you really need to get off this in america kick it didnt happen in america it happened in afghanistan so i would be more than willing to let local authorities deal with him if you would like?

what would you have us do?

[OzmO]

I think the bigger issue here is that 90+% of the people being rounded up as terrorists are actually innocent bystanders. 90+% of those being tortured have no info to give.


If reading an English language newspaper is considered proof of a plot to travel to Britain to kill Tony Blair then perhaps we should consider whether these children are actually terrorists at all?

That 14 year old was sent to Gitmo because they claimed he headed up a sleeper cell network in Britain when he was 11 (in fact he was attending school in Saudi Arabia, living with his parents).

Wake up people... this is a witch hunt. The vast majority of these guys are completely innocent.


Your American press doesn't cover this, but half of the detainees have already been released and your State department is paying big bucks to countries taking them in, hoping to sweep this under the rug.


The Luke

So he didn't kill anyone and they sent him to gitmo?

What a bunch of ignorant back wood shrimp dick inbred fear minded pecker woods.  

[OzmO]

what would you have us do?

Sticking an 11 year old kid in a prison camp with adults is something a MUSLIM TALIBAN LOVING extremist would do.

[tonymctones]

No, he needs some sort of rehabilitation.  He was obviously brainwashed to murder at a young age.  He might have to be institutionalized most of his life.  I donno the best course of action.

But I'm not ignorant or uncivilized enough to think putting an 11 year old child in gitmo is the best long term response or solution.

i can understand your viewpoint but again as you said this kid might have been brainwashed to kill american soldiers. Long term for me would mean that he wouldnt kill american soldiers and i personally dont really care how thats accomplished as long as its accomplished. Obviously america doesnt know how to rehibilitate their inmates very well so he wouldnt fair any better here in the states. You keep touting civilized, civilized, civilized...i tell you what id rather act uncivilized at times and accomplish our goals then try and carry ourselves with a certain ideal of moral superiority and not accomplish our goals.

[tonymctones]

So he didn't kill anyone and they sent him to gitmo?

What a bunch of ignorant back wood shrimp dick inbred fear minded pecker woods.  

U have no idea what the hell ur talking about......none at all. All u have access to is the net and cable news. U don't have a clearance, u don't get any intell briefs...ur a civilian. You're also a bleeding heart lib who's wacked world view is dangerous.  Here u go on ur innocent bombed teen...


Included in the study was Omar Khadr, the 21-year-old Canadian, who has admitted to being trained by al-Qaeda and killing a US solider in Afghanistan. Khadr was detained by US forces in 2002 as a 15-year-old. In 2007, Khadr was formally charged with supporting terrorism, conspiracy, and spying in "violation of the law of war." Khadr has filed an affidavit saying he was threatened and abused as an inmate.



Oh and the AQ playbook tells u that the West is weak so claim abuse and the bleeding heart ACLU and leftist dirtbags will feel sorry for u.....

[tonymctones]

Sticking an 11 year old kid in a prison camp with adults is something a MUSLIM TALIBAN LOVING extremist would do.

what happens when AQ starts recruiting young kids to do their work like they did with the mentally disabled and women?

Im sorry but there arent a lot of 11 yr olds running around shooting at US soldiers are there?

The idea that we need to fight a PC war is BULL SHIT, you dont go to war unless you are willing to accept the things that war includes.

[OzmO]

i can understand your viewpoint but again as you said this kid might have been brainwashed to kill american soldiers. Long term for me would mean that he wouldnt kill american soldiers and i personally dont really care how thats accomplished as long as its accomplished. Obviously america doesnt know how to rehibilitate their inmates very well so he wouldnt fair any better here in the states. You keep touting civilized, civilized, civilized...i tell you what id rather act uncivilized at times and accomplish our goals then try and carry ourselves with a certain ideal of moral superiority and not accomplish our goals.

Fair enough tony, but i reserved the "uncivilized acts of retribution" on ADULTS, not children.

Our rehabilitation system is a joke in the USA, agreed.  What do you think we created by putting him in Gitmo?    

[The Luke]

So he didn't kill anyone and they sent him to gitmo? 

...most of the guys in Gitmo are there because local people turned them in for the reward money.

The American press doesn't seem to cover it much, but seemingly anyone with a pretty wife; big house; car or job was handed over to the Americans by those who really wanted a chunk of cash; a pretty wife; big house; car or job.

It's probably the most blatant opportune use of the death list since Sulla's (Sylla) Proscriptions.


There is practically NO EVIDENCE against anyone at Gitmo. I've read that less than 4 of them will ever stand trial (ie: the prosecution can actually make a case).  


So how useful was all that abuse and torture? They were torturing innocent people. How usable is that "forcibly coerced" intel?

I could see Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld on trial for war crimes at the Hague in the near future.



The Luke

[240 is Back]

I wasnt aware he had been sentenced to death?

Secondly you really need to get off this in america kick it didnt happen in america it happened in afghanistan so i would be more than willing to let local authorities deal with him if you would like?

what would you have us do?

you answered my Q with 3 of your own.  let's try again.

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to death?

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to life in prison?

I await your response.

[OzmO]

what happens when AQ starts recruiting young kids to do their work like they did with the mentally disabled and women?

Im sorry but there arent a lot of 11 yr olds running around shooting at US soldiers are there?

The idea that we need to fight a PC war is BULL SHIT, you dont go to war unless you are willing to accept the things that war includes.

dude you are throwing a whole lot of extra stuff here that doesn't apply to my views.  I'm not johnny PC when is comes to war.  However, I am human and practical when comes to children.

[OzmO]

...most of the guys in Gitmo are there because local people turned them in for the reward money.

The American press doesn't seem to cover it much, but seemingly anyone with a pretty wife; big house; car or job was handed over to the Americans by those who really wanted a chunk of cash; a pretty wife; big house; car or job.

It's probably the most blatant opportune use of the death list since Sulla's (Sylla) Proscriptions.


There is practically NO EVIDENCE against anyone at Gitmo. I've read that less than 4 of them will ever stand trial (ie: the prosecution can actually make a case).  


So how useful was all that abuse and torture? They were torturing innocent people. How usable is that "forcibly coerced" intel?

I could see Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld on trial for war crimes at the Hague in the near future.



The Luke

I've read this before.  It's sad and tragic for the ones imprisoned who are innocent.

[tonymctones]

Fair enough tony, but i reserved the "uncivilized acts of retribution" on ADULTS, not children.

Our rehabilitation system is a joke in the USA, agreed.  What do you think we created by putting him in Gitmo?    

In all honesty nothing in terms of rehibilitation I agree with you on that, what it did accomplish though is keeping him from trying to kill any more soldiers(my main concern far over his well being)

I understand what your saying he is 11 or however old the person really is i think luke made that story up but whatever the case they are young kids. Its a shitty situation however something must be done with him and barring creating another prison for children which im sure would go over real well with the liberals in this country there isnt much else to do with the kid is there?

[OzmO]

you answered my Q with 3 of your own.  let's try again.

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to death?

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to life in prison?

I await your response.

I know you are not asking me, but i can't help it.  

NO on both but reserved the right to change mind based on individual cases.

[tonymctones]

you answered my Q with 3 of your own.  let's try again.

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to death?

Do you feel 11 year old children in America who commit actions that kill another person should be sentenced to life in prison?

I await your response.

my bad bro i thought your post was from OZ as we where the only ones talking at that point didnt even notice it was your post instead of his.

No i dont think they should be sentenced to death, is this child a US citizen and did this happen in the US also has this child been sentenced to death?

The second question is debatable on the situation, i would probably generally lean towards no but again dependent upon situation.

[OzmO]

In all honesty nothing in terms of rehibilitation I agree with you on that, what it did accomplish though is keeping him from trying to kill any more soldiers(my main concern far over his well being)

if he ever leaves gitmo do you think the chances of him committing an act of violence against americans is higher than if he was at least attempted to be rehabilitated and put on a lengthy supervised ankle bracelet probation?

I do.  Higher by miles.

I understand what your saying he is 11 or however old the person really is i think luke made that story up but whatever the case they are young kids. Its a shitty situation however something must be done with him and barring creating another prison for children which im sure would go over real well with the liberals in this country there isnt much else to do with the kid is there?

No mater what is done someone will bitch. so what?  Creating a lengthy prison/rehabilitation/probation program for 11 year olds who committed terrorist acts is the right thing to do.  

I know i come off as unrealistically idealistic at times.  But we are supposed to be the "good guys".    And that burden is worth bearing.

[240 is Back]

NO on both

what if an 11-year old american child fire a gun at an american soldier?

Execute him on teh spot?

[tonymctones]

if he ever leaves gitmo do you think the chances of him committing an act of violence against americans is higher than if he was at least attempted to be rehabilitated and put on a lengthy supervised ankle bracelet probation?

I do.  Higher by miles.

No mater what is done someone will bitch. so what?  Creating a lengthy prison/rehabilitation/probation program for 11 year olds who committed terrorist acts is the right thing to do.  

I know i come off as unrealistically idealistic at times.  But we are supposed to be the "good guys".    And that burden is worth bearing.

do you think it realistic to start a school of sorts and moniter their movements with ankle bracelets? be honest bro that would not work I agree if it was feasable then ya it would.

OZMO im gonna tell you this and i think you should really think about it..."Good" is nothing more than perspective bro and i respect that you hold yourself to a standard but if you where born in iran or afghanistan you could very likely be what you consider bad right now.

[OzmO]

do you think it realistic to start a school of sorts and moniter their movements with ankle bracelets? be honest bro that would not work I agree if it was feasable then ya it would.

OZMO im gonna tell you this and i think you should really think about it..."Good" is nothing more than perspective bro and i respect that you hold yourself to a standard but if you where born in iran or afghanistan you could very likely be what you consider bad right now.

what do we do with children who were brainwashed at an early age and committed murder?  Most of them are institutionalized.  I'm not suggesting school.  Some rehabilitate, most don't.

[OzmO]

what if an 11-year old american child fire a gun at an american soldier?

Execute him on teh spot?

no.

[tonymctones]

what do we do with children who were brainwashed at an early age and committed murder?  Most of them are institutionalized.  I'm not suggesting school.  Some rehabilitate, most don't.

Again we need to get away from treating these ppl like they are US citizens.

you are suggesting that we moniter them with ankle bracelets which means they will not be under direct supervision i.e. not in an encampment or prison.

[OzmO]

Again we need to get away from treating these ppl like they are US citizens.

you are suggesting that we moniter them with ankle bracelets which means they will not be under direct supervision i.e. not in an encampment or prison.

those people?

you mean those children.  Because that's what i mean.

And I am not suggesting "we moniter them with ankle bracelets which means they will not be under direct supervision i.e. not in an encampment or prison."

I am directly saying that putting an 11 year old child in gitmo is archaic, indecent, uncivilized, Taliban like, nazi like, stupid, ignorant, not right, un christian, etc... 

[tonymctones]

those people?

you mean those children.  Because that's what i mean.

And I am not suggesting "we moniter them with ankle bracelets which means they will not be under direct supervision i.e. not in an encampment or prison."

I am directly saying that putting an 11 year old child in gitmo is archaic, indecent, uncivilized, Taliban like, nazi like, stupid, ignorant, not right, un christian, etc... 

Enemy combatants is what i was referring to...

dont throw the christian thing at me killing in general is unchristian but your ok with that if they are older. THOU SHALL NOT KILL!!! doesnt get much clearer than that.