Author Topic: Why is college so expensive?  (Read 9126 times)

Soul Crusher

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Why is college so expensive?
« on: May 03, 2009, 07:07:32 PM »



I am writing in Schiff for President in 2012.

This man is brilliant and truly gets it.

SAMSON123

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2009, 07:18:25 PM »
Because college is a BUSINESS...it is NOT about education. Tuitions have been on a furious rise for years, because the mindset in america is if you don't have a college education you will not get a job. Colleges looked at that mindset and said....We can raise our tuition to the sky, becasue the FEAR is without us their will be no career. So up the tuitions went without regard to student or parents income and with no option but to pay in order to go, students and parent were left with no option but to take out loans against their homes, student loans, work longer hours and hopefully get scholarships....

EDUCATION SHOULD NOT BE A BUSINESS
C

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2009, 07:22:08 PM »
Because college is a BUSINESS...it is NOT about education. Tuitions have been on a furious rise for years, because the mindset in america is if you don't have a college education you will not get a job. Colleges looked at that mindset and said....We can raise our tuition to the sky, becasue the FEAR is without us their will be no career. So up the tuitions went without regard to student or parents income and with no option but to pay in order to go, students and parent were left with no option but to take out loans against their homes, student loans, work longer hours and hopefully get scholarships....

EDUCATION SHOULD NOT BE A BUSINESS

Thats the point of the video.  The govt is actively promoting college being a buisness by giving the loans out to everyone regardless of the cost.

Hereford

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2009, 11:41:16 PM »
Colleges can charge whatever they want to. A) people will pay any amount to be there and B) most people are on loans anyway. When I was in college 86% of the undergraduate base was on government loans of some sort.

A government loan to an 18 year old is like free money. I got a friend who owes 65K+, and just pays $50 every month.

Agree with Samson, college is a business. For a lot of kids though, it's not about the education, they go for the lifestyle.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2009, 05:34:31 AM »
Colleges can charge whatever they want to. A) people will pay any amount to be there and B) most people are on loans anyway. When I was in college 86% of the undergraduate base was on government loans of some sort.

A government loan to an 18 year old is like free money. I got a friend who owes 65K+, and just pays $50 every month.

Agree with Samson, college is a business. For a lot of kids though, it's not about the education, they go for the lifestyle.

The the free money was no so available, colleges would have to lower costs to compete. 

Hereford

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2009, 07:16:41 AM »
The sheer volume of cash colleges waste is mind-boggling. Not like Obama's doings, but still...

The uni I went to raised tuition about 10% when I was there because they were not making it financially... Yet spent 85K on various 'art' projects, including a stack of logs ('art') for 30K that I could have made in 30 minutes with a decent loader.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2009, 07:21:56 AM »
The sheer volume of cash colleges waste is mind-boggling. Not like Obama's doings, but still...

The uni I went to raised tuition about 10% when I was there because they were not making it financially... Yet spent 85K on various 'art' projects, including a stack of logs ('art') for 30K that I could have made in 30 minutes with a decent loader.

College in its present form is antiquated and extremely wasteful. 

The government has completely screwed this up like everything else. 

If they simply did not give out as much loans to these kids, the colleges would have to innovate, compete, and become more competitive.

As it stands now, college is a ripoff unless you got to some of the very good state schools. 

There is no college worth 200k for four a B.A.   

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2009, 07:31:22 AM »
College should be free for all citizens.  Facts and Knowledge should not be only for those that can afford it.  George Washington`s sole goal which he placed more importance on than any other, was to establish a Free National University system for all Citizens.  Sadly, his dream was never realized.

College is a For-Profit, Capitalistic system which is totally wrong.  The idea is to make money, not educate.

The idea of college and its perception in the United States is also a gross failure.  No longer are they places of learning, but instead have become just a place to get a certificate so that a business can see if you are saddled with debt, thus ensuring that you will not go anywhere and be nothing but an obedient worker.

They LOVE students with debt. “Choice depends on the freedom to choose. And if you’re shackled with debt, you don’t have the freedom to choose.
“People in debt become hopeless, and hopeless people don’t vote…. See, I think there are two ways in which people are controlled. First of all, frighten people, and, secondly, demoralize them. An educated, healthy and confident nation is harder to govern….
“We don’t want people to be educated, healthy and confident because they will get out of control. The top 1 percent of the world’s population owns 80 percent of the world’s wealth.
“It’s incredible that people put up with it. But they’re poor, they’re demoralized, they’re frightened, and therefore they think perhaps the safest thing to do is take orders and hope for the best.”


Tony Benn puts it VERY well here:

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2009, 07:33:41 AM »
There is simply not enough money to fulfill all your socialistic fantasies.  You economic wet dreams are just that, dreams.

Free college, free health care, free housing, and on and on.

Tell, at what point do you think the govt has done enough?   

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2009, 07:35:12 AM »
The the free money was no so available, colleges would have to lower costs to compete. 
This is the same way Housing Prices and Auto Prices have gotten out of hand inflation wise.   In the 50s, one used to be able to pay for a house or a car pretty much free and clear.  Now, the idea is to be saddled with debt and keep working towards "The American Dream".


What would you do Chris though, if this rampant debt did not exist since your business depends entirely on people who cannot pay their debts?

Do you find yourself part of the problem in any way?

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2009, 07:37:19 AM »
There is simply not enough money to fulfill all your socialistic fantasies.  You economic wet dreams are just that, dreams.

Free college, free health care, free housing, and on and on.

Tell, at what point do you think the govt has done enough?   
We already spend more per capita on Healthcare and Education than any other country when compared to ANY of those who provide Free Healthcare and Education so the MONEY IS THERE!

We had no problem finding the money to fight two wars and Bush had no problem with raising 700 Billion plus for the first round of bailouts in a year.

The money is there, the will to use the money for things that actually help and work is not.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2009, 07:39:43 AM »
This is the same way Housing Prices and Auto Prices have gotten out of hand inflation wise.   In the 50s, one used to be able to pay for a house or a car pretty much free and clear.  Now, the idea is to be saddled with debt and keep working towards "The American Dream".


What would you do Chris though, if this rampant debt did not exist since your business depends entirely on people who cannot pay their debts?

Do you find yourself part of the problem in any way?

Not at all, I do construction industry work mainly and it is a different animal altogether. 

You are right about the homes and cars.

However, take that one step further, and college is no different. 

The costs are solely a result of a ease of credit.

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2009, 07:42:58 AM »
Not at all, I do construction industry work mainly and it is a different animal altogether. 

You are right about the homes and cars.

However, take that one step further, and college is no different. 

The costs are solely a result of a ease of credit.
Which are the evils of Capitalism and the free market unchecked.  College is a For Profit system and finding a hundred different ways to generate revenue, from parking tickets to tuition increases to student loans is what they do best.

Stormspirit

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2009, 07:43:16 AM »
he has a great tan

Hereford

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2009, 07:43:35 AM »
It is very easy to PR for a uni however. Everytime they get a little funding cut, they cry "But the children.....", or "our future ..."]

Refer to Arnold Swartzeneggers budget of a couple months ago.


Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2009, 07:50:15 AM »
Which are the evils of Capitalism and the free market unchecked.  College is a For Profit system and finding a hundred different ways to generate revenue, from parking tickets to tuition increases to student loans is what they do best.

Its not the free market when the govt promotes this nonsense by underwriting the school loans and setting the accreditation requirements.

Additionally, do you realize that school loans and taxes are the only types of loans you cant discharge in Bkrpty proceedings????   

Hereford

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2009, 07:53:37 AM »
Its not the free market when the govt promotes this nonsense by underwriting the school loans and setting the accreditation requirements.

Additionally, do you realize that school loans and taxes are the only types of loans you cant discharge in Bkrpty proceedings????   

What is taxes are the reason you went bankrupt?

What is it's an estate tax issue where the death tax ran you out of business?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2009, 07:55:19 AM »
What is taxes are the reason you went bankrupt?

What is it's an estate tax issue where the death tax ran you out of business?

Huh????


The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #18 on: May 04, 2009, 07:56:10 AM »
Its not the free market when the govt promotes this nonsense by underwriting the school loans and setting the accreditation requirements.

Additionally, do you realize that school loans and taxes are the only types of loans you cant discharge in Bkrpty proceedings????   
The whole system needs to be scrapped for a National University System similar to Norway.  Sweden and Finland also have entirely free University systems even for Non-Citizens.  Keep in mind we spend more Per Capita per student than they do.


In the late 1700s, Thomas Paine was amongst the earliest proponents of universal, free public education, which was considered to be a radical idea at the time.

Hereford

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2009, 07:58:28 AM »
Huh????



What if you are forced into bankruptcy because you couldn't pay the taxes. Do you still have to pay them regardless?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #20 on: May 04, 2009, 07:58:38 AM »
"We had no problem finding the money to fight two wars and Bush had no problem with raising 700 Billion plus for the first round of bailouts in a year."


Wrong, we charged it on our credit cards and will paying for it for generations.  It was no ok then and is not ok now.  

Bush was a fiscal disaster.


Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #21 on: May 04, 2009, 07:59:28 AM »
What if you are forced into bankruptcy because you couldn't pay the taxes. Do you still have to pay them regardless?

Yes.  It will stick with you for life. 

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #22 on: May 04, 2009, 08:06:03 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_education_in_Norway

Higher education in Norway is offered by a range of seven universities, eight specialised universities, 25 university colleges as well as a range of private university colleges. The national higher education system is in accordance with the Bologna process, with bachelor's degrees (first cycle, three years), master's degrees (second cycle, two years) and doctoral degrees (third cycle, four years). Acceptance is offered after finishing upper secondary school with general university admissions certification.

Public education is free, with an academic year with two semesters, from August to December and from January to June. The ultimate responsibility for the education lies with the Norwegian Ministry of Education and Research.

Student welfare and economics

There are no tuition fees for attending public higher education in Norway, as all the costs are covered by the Ministry of Education and Research.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #23 on: May 04, 2009, 08:13:23 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_education_in_Norway

Higher education in Norway is offered by a range of seven universities, eight specialised universities, 25 university colleges as well as a range of private university colleges. The national higher education system is in accordance with the Bologna process, with bachelor's degrees (first cycle, three years), master's degrees (second cycle, two years) and doctoral degrees (third cycle, four years). Acceptance is offered after finishing upper secondary school with general university admissions certification.

Public education is free, with an academic year with two semesters, from August to December and from January to June. The ultimate responsibility for the education lies with the Norwegian Ministry of Education and Research.

Student welfare and economics

There are no tuition fees for attending public higher education in Norway, as all the costs are covered by the Ministry of Education and Research.


Norway is a small homogeneous population that has not a fraction of the issues we deal with here.

Additionally, college here serves mostly as a place holder for many people who go into debt and come out and get HS level employment anyway. 

It would be far better to encourage community college and trade schools than private colleges that charge huge sums of money.

Of course the better students will go to college, but many would, and should pursue other endeavors.   

The True Adonis

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Re: Why is college so expensive?
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2009, 08:24:49 AM »
Don`t forget the myraid of PRIVATE LOANS that have ravaged the University system.  Private Loans have become HUGELY PREDATORY in nature and are by far worse than the Government backed loans.