Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
April 19, 2014, 01:56:35 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
 
   Home   Help Calendar Login Register  
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Best jobs for the future based on current conditions?  (Read 10047 times)
Soul Crusher
Competitors
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 5194


Doesnt lie about lifting.


View Profile
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2009, 11:51:26 AM »

The Mirage of Multilevel Marketing
Stephen Barrett, M.D.

Don't be surprised if a friend or acquaintance tries to sell you vitamins, herbs, homeopathic remedies, weight-loss powders, or other health-related products. Millions of Americans have signed up as distributors for multilevel companies that market such products from person to person. Often they have tried the products, concluded that they work, and become suppliers to support their habit.

Multilevel marketing (also called network marketing) is a form of direct sales in which independent distributors sell products, usually in their customers' home or by telephone. In theory, distributors can make money not only from their own sales but also from those of the people they recruit.

Becoming an MLM distributor is simple and requires no real knowledge of health or nutrition. Many people do so initially in order to buy their own products at a discount. For a small sum of money—usually between $35 and $100—these companies sell a distributor kit that includes product literature, sales aids (such as a videotape or audiotape), price lists, order forms, and a detailed instructional manual. Most MLM companies publish a magazine or newsletter containing company news, philosophical essays, product information, success stories, and photographs of top salespeople. The application form is usually a single page that asks only for identifying information. Millions of Americans have signed up, including many physicians attracted by the idea that selling MLM products can offset losses attributable to managed care.

Distributors can buy products "wholesale," sell them "retail," and recruit other distributors who can do the same. When enough distributors have been enrolled, the recruiter is eligible to collect a percentage of their sales. Companies suggest that this process provides a great money-making opportunity. However, it is unlikely that people who don't join during the first few months of operation or become one of the early distributors in their community can build enough of a sales pyramid to do well. In July 1999, the National Association of Attorneys General announced that complaints about multilevel marketing and pyramid schemes were tenth on their list of consumer complaints.

A recent analysis of Quixtar's reported income figures indicates how poorly most MLM distributors do. In a declaration filed in a suit by two former Quixtar distributors, he concluded:

A statistical sample of distributors revealed that 99.4% of the IBOs [independent business owners] earned on average just $13.41 per week—before product purchases, all business expenses, and taxes. This average income is far less than the costs of the business, resulting in 99% of victims of Quixtar making no net profit. Fewer than 1 person in 10,000 are at the "Diamond and above" levels, the upper ranks of the Quixtar chain that every new recruit is urged to aspire to. . . .

The massive loss rates among Quixtar victims that are revealed in Quixtar's own data are the inevitable mathematical result of the endless chain business model. In this model, the success of the IBO is based on continuous recruiting of additional distributors (IBOs), who are induced to make monthly purchases for their own consumption, rather than on making retail sales in the open marketplace. In the recruitment model, only those participants at the top levels of the pyramid can earn true profits, since the source of a participant's real income is the expenditures of individuals below them on the pyramid, and only a small percentage can be in those top positions. The untenable model result in approximately 70% of IBOs quitting Quixtar within the first year. The mission of this deceptive business model is to continuously enroll losing investors (IBOs) and replace them as they suffer losses and quit the program.

Many distributors who stock up on products to meet sales goals or increase their hoped-for commissions get stuck with unsold products that cost thousands of dollars. Some companies permit direct ordering of their products, which avoids this problem, but the risk of failure is still high.

Dubious Claims

More than a hundred multilevel companies are marketing health-related products. Most claim that their products are effective for preventing or treating disease. A few companies merely suggest that people will feel better, look better, or have more energy if they supplement their diet with extra nutrients. When clear-cut therapeutic claims are made in product literature, the company is an easy target for government enforcement action. Some companies run this risk, hoping that the government won't take action until their customer base is well established. Other companies make no claims in their literature but rely on testimonials, encouraging people to try their products and credit them for any improvement that occurs.

Every company I have looked at has done at least one of the following.

Made misleading statements that could frighten people into taking dietary supplements they do not need.

Made misleading statements of product superiority that could induce people to buy products that retail stores sell more cheaply.

Made unsubstantiated claims that their products would prevent or remedy health problems

Uses research findings to promote products without noting that the findings are not sufficient to substantiate using the products.

Uses deception by omission by making statements about the biochemical properties of various substances without placing them in proper perspective. An example would be stating that a certain nutrient is important because it does this or that in the body but omitting that people who eat sensibly have no valid reason to take a supplement.

Exaggerated the probability of making significant income.

Most multilevel companies tell distributors not to make claims for the products except for those found in company literature. (That way the company can deny responsibility for what distributors do.) However, many companies hold sales meetings at which people are encouraged to tell their story to the others in attendance.

Some companies sponsor telephone conference calls during which leading distributors describe their financial success, give sales tips, and describe their personal experiences with the products. Testimonials also may be published in company magazines, audiotapes or videotapes. Testimonial claims can trigger enforcement action, but since it is time-consuming to collect evidence of their use, government agencies seldom bother to do so.

Government enforcement action against multilevel companies has not been vigorous. These companies are usually left alone unless their promotions become so conspicuous and their sales volume so great that an agency feels compelled to intervene. Even then, few interventions have substantial impact once a company is well established.

Motivation: Powerful but Misguided

The "success" of network marketing lies in the enthusiasm of its participants. Most people who think they have been helped by an unorthodox method enjoy sharing their success stories with their friends. People who give such testimonials are usually motivated by a sincere wish to help their fellow humans. Since people tend to believe what others tell them about personal experiences, testimonials can be powerful persuaders.

Perhaps the trickiest misconception about quackery is that personal experience is the best way to tell whether something works. When someone feels better after having used a product or procedure, it is natural to give credit to whatever was done. However, this is unwise. Most ailments are self-limiting, and even incurable conditions can have sufficient day-to-day variation to enable bogus methods to gain large followings. In addition, taking action often produces temporary relief of symptoms (a placebo effect). For these reasons, scientific experimentation is almost always necessary to establish whether health methods are really effective. Instead of testing their products, multilevel companies urge customers to try them and credit them if they feel better. Some products are popular because they contain caffeine, ephedrine (a stimulant), valerian (a tranquilizer), or other substances that produce mood-altering effects.

Another factor in gaining devotees is the emotional impact of group activities. Imagine, for example, that you have been feeling lonely, bored, depressed or tired. One day a friend tells you that "improving your nutrition" can help you feel better. After selling you some products, the friend inquires regularly to find out how you are doing. You seem to feel somewhat better. From time to time you are invited to interesting lectures where you meet people like yourself. Then you are asked to become a distributor. This keep you busy, raises your income, and provides an easy way to approach old friends and make new ones—all in an atmosphere of enthusiasm. Some of your customers express gratitude, giving you a feeling of accomplishment. People who increase their income, their social horizons, or their self-esteem can get a psychological boost that not only can improve their mood but also may alleviate emotionally-based symptoms.

Multilevel companies refer to this process as "sharing" and suggest that everyone involved is a "winner." That simply isn't true. The entire process is built on a foundation of deception. The main winners are the company's owners and the small percentage of distributors who become sales leaders. The losers are millions of Americans who waste money and absorb the misinformation.

Do you think multilevel participants are qualified to judge whether prospective customers need supplements—or medical care? Even though curative claims are forbidden by the written policies of each company, the sales process encourages customers to experiment with self-treatment. It may also promote distrust of legitimate health professionals and their treatment methods.

Some people would argue that the apparent benefits of "believing" in the products outweigh the risks involved. Do you think that people need false beliefs in order to feel healthy or succeed in life? Would you like to believe that something can help you when in fact it is worthless? Should our society support an industry that is trying to mislead us? Can't Americans do something better with the billion or more dollars being wasted each year on multilevel "health" products?

Physician Involvement
Many any physicians are selling health-related multilevel products to patients in their offices. The companies most involved have included Amway (now doing business as Quixtar), Body Wise, Nu Skin (Interior Design), Rexall, and Juice Plus+. Doctors are typically recruited with promises that the extra income will replace income lost to managed care. In December 1997, the American Medical Association Council on Ethical and Judicial Affairs (CEJA) advised against against profiting from the sale of "non-health-related products" to their patients. Although CEJA's policy statement does not mention products sold through multilevel marketing, CEJA's chairman said the statement was triggered by the growing number of physicians who had added an Amway distributorship to their practice.

Recommendations

Consumers would be wise to avoid health-related multilevel products altogether. Those that have nutritional value (such as vitamins and low-cholesterol foods) are invariably overpriced and may be unnecessary as well. Those promoted as remedies are either unproven, bogus, or intended for conditions that are unsuitable for self-medication.

Government agencies should police the multilevel marketplace aggressively, using undercover investigators and filing criminal charges when wrongdoing is detected. People who feel they have been defrauded by MLM companies should file complaints with their state attorney general and with local FDA and FTC offices. A letter detailing the events may be sufficient to trigger an investigation; and the more complaints received, the more likely that corrective action will be taken. If you possess a distributor kit that you no longer need, I would be pleased to add it to my collection. If you would like to help Quackwatch gather information on MLM companies on the Internet, click here.

This article was revised on January 21, 2008.

________________________ ________________________ ________________________ ___

Jag - this confirms everything I have said. 

Report to moderator   Logged
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2009, 06:10:24 PM »

LOL, I can't believe this conversation is still going on.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ8EGQtrUFs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ8EGQtrUFs</a>

Whose out of popcorn yet?
Report to moderator   Logged

w
Deicide
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 22937


Reapers...


View Profile
« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2009, 06:12:57 PM »

LOL, I can't believe this conversation is still going on.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ8EGQtrUFs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ8EGQtrUFs</a>

Whose out of popcorn yet?

You must be tired; 'whose' is a possessive.
Report to moderator   Logged

I hate the State.
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2009, 06:35:14 PM »

You must be tired; 'whose' is a possessive.

{blush} I am waaaaay tired. lol. I didn't get any sleep at all last night, drank caffeine near my bedtime, and I've been wired ever since. Instead of a catnap I was up early because I had to connect with my leaders in Australia, the UK, Spain and France, and there's  5 - 14 hrs time difference. We just launched 2 new products on Sunday for our North American market, and my phones haven't stopped as I've been updating and answering downline questions non-stop for the past two days, getting my leaders up to speed. The caffeine crash is starting to occur. Now I'm hosting a trucker's call in about 30 mins, so I'm a little tired. I will be comatose and counting sheep in about 90 mins.
Report to moderator   Logged

w
headhuntersix
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 15230



View Profile
« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2009, 07:31:21 PM »

Sorry about the job....military..PMC..Co p..gov contractor..anything gov as Barry is hiring.
Report to moderator   Logged

L
Soul Crusher
Competitors
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 5194


Doesnt lie about lifting.


View Profile
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2009, 04:27:09 AM »

Its going on because you are promoting a pyramid scheme. 
Report to moderator   Logged
ToxicAvenger
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 26529


I thawt I taw a twat!


View Profile
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2009, 09:26:01 AM »

So I got laid off about 3 weeks ago.  I worked as an internal wholesaler for variable annuities primarily.  It seems like financial sales are no longer going be as lucrative or as widespread as they once were.  I am fortunate enough that I can take a little time to make my next move, I might even go back to school.

Now I am certainly not asking people online to decide my life path.  Just looking to get a conversation going about what you think maybe are the best jobs/careers for the future.  I have done financial services for the last 5 years, so it is a bit concerning with the way everything is.  Maybe I should just stay home and grow a garden and get animals, who knows.  Still need an income though.  Thoughts?
IT..wide area networking...
regardless of what else happens..the internet is only gonna get bigger...its only a matter of time before your toaster oven and fridge have an IP address so you can log in remotely and start cooking your meal at homebefore u leave work
http://tcpmag.com/salarysurveys/article.asp?EditorialsID=257   
here in the DC area avg salary with a clerance is over 100k
you can take a ccie anywhere on the planet and companies will basically kiss your ass to sign you on board
Report to moderator   Logged

carpe` vaginum!
MuscleMcMannus
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 6242


View Profile WWW
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2009, 09:33:31 AM »

Anything related in health care.

I am seeing a lot of people take a quick entry prep job in the health care field until their former occupation regains an economic growth to create more jobs.  Lots of people taking quick courses in things like respiration therapists just to get employed quickly. 
If you have a bit more time you can look into things that require a bit more time to get certified like surgical tech.  If you have 2 years to put forth, then radiology tech (xray), ultrasound, etc.. is easy to obtain with a two year program that leads to certification.


Umm there is no such thing as quick prep or quick entry anything in healthcare.  That is unless you want to be a nurses aide or caregiver and they don't make hardly anything.  It takes just as much education as any other field to be in healthcare.  Nursing takes 4 years and is very time consuming.  Respiratory therapy, speech therapy, PT/OT all require lots of years of education.  Surgical tech is also not "quick" entry.  And a guy like the OPer who probably has no anatomy, physiology, micro, or psych in his background is not going to get through school "quickly".  Compound that with the fact that healthcare jobs are just as hard to find as anything else right now.  They were hot a year ago but hardly anyone is hiring right now.  My hospital isn't hiring any new nurses.  And nursing jobs are more plentiful than any respiratory therapist or x-ray tech jobs. 
Report to moderator   Logged
LurkerNoMore
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 11630

Tossing sand in your Va-Jay-Jay


View Profile
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2009, 10:49:08 AM »


Umm there is no such thing as quick prep or quick entry anything in healthcare.  That is unless you want to be a nurses aide or caregiver and they don't make hardly anything.  It takes just as much education as any other field to be in healthcare.  Nursing takes 4 years and is very time consuming.  Respiratory therapy, speech therapy, PT/OT all require lots of years of education.  Surgical tech is also not "quick" entry.  And a guy like the OPer who probably has no anatomy, physiology, micro, or psych in his background is not going to get through school "quickly".  Compound that with the fact that healthcare jobs are just as hard to find as anything else right now.  They were hot a year ago but hardly anyone is hiring right now.  My hospital isn't hiring any new nurses.  And nursing jobs are more plentiful than any respiratory therapist or x-ray tech jobs. 

When I said quick prep and quick entry I am referring to the time it takes to enter, complete and get the required certification or registration necessary for lower rung jobs like surgical tech or insturment tech as opposed to something that takes longer as nursing.

The point of my post, as stated, was in regards to the OP being unemployed at the moment was not to find a new career field but to find something where there are at least SOME jobs so he can earn SOME money while waiting for his last profession to regain it's foothold.
Report to moderator   Logged
Deicide
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 22937


Reapers...


View Profile
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2009, 10:51:53 AM »

When I said quick prep and quick entry I am referring to the time it takes to enter, complete and get the required certification or registration necessary for lower rung jobs like surgical tech or insturment tech as opposed to something that takes longer as nursing.

The point of my post, as stated, was in regards to the OP being unemployed at the moment was not to find a new career field but to find something where there are at least SOME jobs so he can earn SOME money while waiting for his last profession to regain it's foothold.


* indexCAKOIFPR.jpg (110.96 KB, 750x600 - viewed 183 times.)
Report to moderator   Logged

I hate the State.
MuscleMcMannus
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 6242


View Profile WWW
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2009, 01:59:55 PM »

When I said quick prep and quick entry I am referring to the time it takes to enter, complete and get the required certification or registration necessary for lower rung jobs like surgical tech or insturment tech as opposed to something that takes longer as nursing.

The point of my post, as stated, was in regards to the OP being unemployed at the moment was not to find a new career field but to find something where there are at least SOME jobs so he can earn SOME money while waiting for his last profession to regain it's foothold.

Well what's your definition of quick?  It takes 9-24 months according to the BLS.  That's depending on what other science coursework you have.  If the OPer has a bachelor's degree he can get a BSN in a year.  All I'm saying is in this market people need to understand that healthcare is not the holy grail those that don't work in the field make it out to be.  There will always be a need for nurses and healthcare is in fact growing.  But in the next year it's not going to be the holy grail of jobs it was a year ago.  Surgitechs are a very niche market too.  Like I said the most widely available job in healthcare is nursing....most places aren't even hiring nurses right now because of the economy.  If I were the OPer I'd collect unemployment for as long as possible, go work under the table and enjoy life a little.   
Report to moderator   Logged
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2009, 11:49:01 PM »

Its going on because you are promoting a pyramid scheme. 

No, ...I'm building a legitimate network marketing business.
There's a vast world of difference between the two.
Report to moderator   Logged

w
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #37 on: May 20, 2009, 11:58:44 PM »

CANADA'S 1st ENVIRONMENTAL COMPENSATION REPORT IS NOW AVAILABLE

On May 11th, 2009, ECO Canada has compiled Canada's first Compensation Report specifically for 16 key occupations in the environmental sector. The study offers detailed information on all forms of compensation, including: salaries, bonuses, RRSP and pension contributions and all other benefits.
Occupations include: Environmental Engineer, Environmental Technician/Technologist, Biologist, Lab Technician/Technologist, Chemist, Agrologist, Project Manager and more.

Learn what other companies are using to lure the best talent to their operations

For more information and a list of all the occupations, download the brochure.

Order your copy today using one of three easy methods:
1) CALL ECO Canada at (403)233-0748 and request a "publications order".
2) EMAIL orders@eco.ca and include:
  • (a) a daytime telephone number;
  • (b) full mailing address;
  • (c) name of your organization.
3) SURF to ECO's Employer Site and click the Publication button on the top-left corner of the page.
Visit www.eco.ca now.
Report to moderator   Logged

w
pillowtalk
Getbig IV
****
Gender: Male
Posts: 3724


Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone


View Profile
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2009, 12:17:18 AM »

No, ...I'm building a legitimate network marketing business.
There's a vast world of difference between the two.

Did I just hear some-one reffer to 'MLM' - pyramid schemes, as a legitimate business.
OH-MY !!

OH-MY indeed  Shocked Shocked Roll Eyes

That is why they have been out-lawed in most European countries - (Tony the 'frosties Tiger' voice)  THEIR GRRREEEEAT - for every-one involved.
The classic one 'Herba-life' has been kicked out of India (other Asian countries) & most of Europe.

Do you all still have 'HL' over there in the land of the free ??
Report to moderator   Logged

Growth/noob loves me
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2009, 03:17:19 AM »

The Mirage of Multilevel Marketing
Stephen Barrett, M.D.

Don't be surprised if a friend or acquaintance tries to sell you vitamins, herbs, homeopathic remedies, weight-loss powders, or other health-related products. Millions of Americans have signed up as distributors for multilevel companies that market such products from person to person. Often they have tried the products, concluded that they work, and become suppliers to support their habit.

Multilevel marketing (also called network marketing) is a form of direct sales in which independent distributors sell products, usually in their customers' home or by telephone. In theory, distributors can make money not only from their own sales but also from those of the people they recruit.

Becoming an MLM distributor is simple and requires no real knowledge of health or nutrition. Many people do so initially in order to buy their own products at a discount. For a small sum of money—usually between $35 and $100—these companies sell a distributor kit that includes product literature, sales aids (such as a videotape or audiotape), price lists, order forms, and a detailed instructional manual. Most MLM companies publish a magazine or newsletter containing company news, philosophical essays, product information, success stories, and photographs of top salespeople. The application form is usually a single page that asks only for identifying information. Millions of Americans have signed up, including many physicians attracted by the idea that selling MLM products can offset losses attributable to managed care.

Distributors can buy products "wholesale," sell them "retail," and recruit other distributors who can do the same. When enough distributors have been enrolled, the recruiter is eligible to collect a percentage of their sales. Companies suggest that this process provides a great money-making opportunity.

Although Mr. Barrett paints with too wide, too broad, and too sweeping a brush; reducing an entire industry into a tiny niche, ...what he has said thus far is somewhat accurate. Although it is the equivalent of saying beware the garment industry because XYZ brand brassieres have been found to provide less than adequate support. It reduces the entire garment industry to that of an individual brassiere manufacturer. It disregards the fact that within the garment industy we find all sorts of apparel, coats, blouses, pants, dresses, shirts, slacks etc., etc.,

Quote
However, it is unlikely that people who don't join during the first few months of operation or become one of the early distributors in their community can build enough of a sales pyramid to do well.

A completely inaccurate statement for many reasons; the first two:
  • people are not building a sales "pyramid"
  • in a legitimate network mktg company, it can and should be possible for one to be able to simply retail the product without building a sales organization

Quote
In July 1999, the National Association of Attorneys General announced that complaints about multilevel marketing and pyramid schemes were tenth on their list of consumer complaints.

Tenth on the list of consumer complaints. I guess there were 9 other areas that topped that. What were those?

Quote
A recent analysis of Quixtar's reported income figures indicates how poorly most MLM distributors do. In a declaration filed in a suit by two former Quixtar distributors, he concluded:

A statistical sample of distributors revealed that 99.4% of the IBOs [independent business owners] earned on average just $13.41 per week—before product purchases, all business expenses, and taxes. This average income is far less than the costs of the business, resulting in 99% of victims of Quixtar making no net profit. Fewer than 1 person in 10,000 are at the "Diamond and above" levels, the upper ranks of the Quixtar chain that every new recruit is urged to aspire to. . . .

The massive loss rates among Quixtar victims that are revealed in Quixtar's own data are the inevitable mathematical result of the endless chain business model. In this model, the success of the IBO is based on continuous recruiting of additional distributors (IBOs), who are induced to make monthly purchases for their own consumption, rather than on making retail sales in the open marketplace. In the recruitment model, only those participants at the top levels of the pyramid can earn true profits, since the source of a participant's real income is the expenditures of individuals below them on the pyramid, and only a small percentage can be in those top positions. The untenable model result in approximately 70% of IBOs quitting Quixtar within the first year. The mission of this deceptive business model is to continuously enroll losing investors (IBOs) and replace them as they suffer losses and quit the program.

Many distributors who stock up on products to meet sales goals or increase their hoped-for commissions get stuck with unsold products that cost thousands of dollars. Some companies permit direct ordering of their products, which avoids this problem, but the risk of failure is still high.


This is a poor example for many reasons.

1. Quixtar is not the industry. It is an individual company within an industry. It is the equivalent of saying The Banking industry is a bad industry to be involved in because XYZ bank made poor decisions that caused it to fail.

2. Quixtar's business model is an old outdated model no longer used for quite some time by MOST companies in the industry. Unfortunately for Quixtar, it has grown too big, and too large to change course without risking irreversible damage to itself. The vast majority of it's "distributors" are not pursuing wealth, but rather the convenience that association with such a large company provides. Despite that, by law, their incomes MUST be averaged in to the final tally of IBO incomes for their income disclosures. If we have 100 "distributors" of whom only 10 are pursuing the business as a business. Each making 1,000 a month, while the other 90 do not pursue a cheque, the average monthly income of IBO's would be $100 / month. Furthermore, a distributor is often considered active if they've paid the distributor fee.  A company like Amway / Quixtar, has such a huge distributor base, that companies the world over, fall all over themselves to get access to their consumer base, offering discounts that are beyond belief. Would you pay a $70 fee in order to have the ability to purchase a brand new automobile at 0.0025% over manufacturer's cost?

Quote
Dubious Claims

More than a hundred multilevel companies are marketing health-related products. Most claim that their products are effective for preventing or treating disease.

This is a flat out untruth.  No legitimate network marketing company would make such a claim. If one does, you had better run as fast as you can because it is evident that the company lack adequate enough legal counsel to keep them compliant. If that product does in fact do what the unlawful claims state, ...it will be reclassified as a drug, and the will lose access to that product in a heartbeat.

Quote
A few companies merely suggest that people will feel better, look better, or have more energy if they supplement their diet with extra nutrients.

Do you believe additional nutrients will NOT effect the way a person feels, looks, or have an impact on their energy level? Perhaps you might want to starve yourself for a month and see how much better you look, how much better you feel, and how much energy you have?  Tongue
 
Quote
When clear-cut therapeutic claims are made in product literature, the company is an easy target for government enforcement action.

This is true

Quote
Some companies run this risk, hoping that the government won't take action until their customer base is well established. Other companies make no claims in their literature but rely on testimonials, encouraging people to try their products and credit them for any improvement that occurs.

What's wrong with encouraging someone to try something? If they do not like it, they can get a refund.
If they do like it, they can continue to purchase it. I think that's far more ethical than what we see in the market today. If I buy a bottle of energy drink at the grocery store, and do not like it, I'm out the money. If I buy an energy drink from a network marketing company and do not like it, I will get my money back.

Quote
Every company I have looked at has done at least one of the following.

Made misleading statements that could frighten people into taking dietary supplements they do not need.

Made misleading statements of product superiority that could induce people to buy products that retail stores sell more cheaply.

Made unsubstantiated claims that their products would prevent or remedy health problems

Uses research findings to promote products without noting that the findings are not sufficient to substantiate using the products.

Uses deception by omission by making statements about the biochemical properties of various substances without placing them in proper perspective. An example would be stating that a certain nutrient is important because it does this or that in the body but omitting that people who eat sensibly have no valid reason to take a supplement.

This is a very potentially misleading statement, because it he does not state which companies he has looked at.

it does not differentiate between legitimate network marketing companies, and pyramid schemes. I think this is rather significant, because it is clear Mr. Barrett cannot discern between the two.

It is the equivalent of someone stating "Stay away from bodybuilders because every bodybuilder I have evaluated was a murderer" It may be an accurate statement, but he does not reveal that the only bodybuilders he looked at were Sally McNeil, Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dalhmer, Richard Ramirez, and Craig Titus

Quote
Exaggerated the probability of making significant income.

Potential and probability are not the same thing. the potential is there, however individual performance is a variable that no one can predict. Some have better work ethics than others.

Quote
Most multilevel companies tell distributors not to make claims for the products except for those found in company literature. (That way the company can deny responsibility for what distributors do.) However, many companies hold sales meetings at which people are encouraged to tell their story to the others in attendance.

And this is so wrong how? When you contemplate a purchase, do you not want to know other peoples experience with it? Would you not find it helpful? 

Quote
Some companies sponsor telephone conference calls during which leading distributors describe their financial success, give sales tips, and describe their personal experiences with the products. Testimonials also may be published in company magazines, audiotapes or videotapes.

He states this as if this were a bad thing. It's not. How would you go about training and educating an army of people located in various places throughout the country / continent/ planet? Do you hop on a plane and meet each person in their living room personally? A conference call is a highly efficient means of communication across distances. If it were so wrong their use would not be so prevalent, either in metwork marketing or throughout corporate boardrooms across the planet. The availability of tele/video conferences has dramatically increased the flexibility & efficiency of the workplace environment. Only a fool would not take advantage of the opportunities afforded through technological advances

Quote
Testimonial claims can trigger enforcement action, but since it is time-consuming to collect evidence of their use, government agencies seldom bother to do so.

Another misleading statement IMO. There's absolutely nothing wrong with testimonial claims. Testimonial claims in and of themselves will not trigger enforcement action. It is unlawful testimonial claims that will trigger enforcement actions.

To give you an idea of what may or may not be said, take a look at the recent challenge the FDA made against Cheerios.

Quote
Government enforcement action against multilevel companies has not been vigorous. These companies are usually left alone unless their promotions become so conspicuous and their sales volume so great that an agency feels compelled to intervene. Even then, few interventions have substantial impact once a company is well established.

Untrue IMO. Enforcement action against multilevel companies have been vigorous. The companies do act quickly with multilevel enforcement. These regulatory agencies understand that these are legitimate businesses that are providing products of great value to the end consumer, much needed additional incomes into many homes, employment for many, an asset to the economy, and much appreciated tax revenues to the government. They do not want to see MLM companies running into trouble and jeopardizing their status. They act quickly in the case of legitimate MLMs.

What needs to be more vigorous are enforcement actions against pyramids, ponzis and flat out fraudulent operations. Unfortunately, resources are limited and often by the time an AG or other regulatory authority gathers the evidence against the entity, the entity collapses. Too many regulators choose to look at them as self-weeding gardens. This is unfortunate for both the unsuspecting public, as well as the legitimate MLM industry.  It's the equivalent of Extremist Islamic Fundamentalists wrapping themselves in the Star Spangled Banner while commiting suicide bombings. Very soon, the international community would be under the mistaken impression that Americans were suicide bombers.

I believe in this current economic climate, regulators will be more vigilant about policing the pyramids, ponzis and frauds that will inevitably emerge.

Quote
Motivation: Powerful but Misguided

The "success" of network marketing lies in the enthusiasm of its participants. Most people who think they have been helped by an unorthodox method enjoy sharing their success stories with their friends. People who give such testimonials are usually motivated by a sincere wish to help their fellow humans. Since people tend to believe what others tell them about personal experiences, testimonials can be powerful persuaders.

Perhaps the trickiest misconception about quackery is that personal experience is the best way to tell whether something works. When someone feels better after having used a product or procedure, it is natural to give credit to whatever was done. However, this is unwise.

I somewhat agree with his position here, because I've seen this double-edged sword in action. By the same token, one can try something, and simultaneously experience something unpleasant, and will flasely attribute it to the only new variable they immediately identify; the trying of the product, ...when in actuality, the unpleasant experience was caused by something else entirely.

Quote
Most ailments are self-limiting, and even incurable conditions can have sufficient day-to-day variation to enable bogus methods to gain large followings. In addition, taking action often produces temporary relief of symptoms (a placebo effect). For these reasons, scientific experimentation is almost always necessary to establish whether health methods are really effective. Instead of testing their products, multilevel companies urge customers to try them and credit them if they feel better.

Of course companies urge people to try something and give it credit if it works. What better way of evaluation is there, than through your own personal experience? As for the lack of scientific testing and experimentation... that too is a blatant untruth. Perhaps this was a factor in the past, but these days, no legitimate network marketing company is going to market a nutritional product without adequate scientific test results to back it up. That's simply ridiculous

Quote
Some products are popular because they contain caffeine, ephedrine (a stimulant), valerian (a tranquilizer), or other substances that produce mood-altering effects.

Kind of like Coca~Cola, RedBull, Coffee etc. So let's shut down Starbucks.  Cheesy

response split due to character count restrictions... continued below
Report to moderator   Logged

w
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #40 on: May 21, 2009, 03:18:43 AM »

...continued from above due to character count restrions...

Another factor in gaining devotees is the emotional impact of group activities. Imagine, for example, that you have been feeling lonely, bored, depressed or tired. One day a friend tells you that "improving your nutrition" can help you feel better. After selling you some products, the friend inquires regularly to find out how you are doing. You seem to feel somewhat better. From time to time you are invited to interesting lectures where you meet people like yourself. Then you are asked to become a distributor. This keep you busy, raises your income, and provides an easy way to approach old friends and make new ones—all in an atmosphere of enthusiasm. Some of your customers express gratitude, giving you a feeling of accomplishment. People who increase their income, their social horizons, or their self-esteem can get a psychological boost that not only can improve their mood but also may alleviate emotionally-based symptoms.

Please, I urge you to re-read the above highlight, ...and tell me why this is such a bad thing.  Roll Eyes

Quote
Multilevel companies refer to this process as "sharing" and suggest that everyone involved is a "winner." That simply isn't true. The entire process is built on a foundation of deception. The main winners are the company's owners and the small percentage of distributors who become sales leaders. The losers are millions of Americans who waste money and absorb the misinformation.

Flat out untruth.

Quote
Do you think multilevel participants are qualified to judge whether prospective customers need supplements—or medical care?

First of all, that is NOT what multilevel participants do. Physicians do that, ...not MLM'ers.
Even the JAMA, the Journal of American Medical Association has flat out stated that all Americans should be taking dietary supplements


Quote
Even though curative claims are forbidden by the written policies of each company, the sales process encourages customers to experiment with self-treatment. It may also promote distrust of legitimate health professionals and their treatment methods.

People who seek out nutrional ways of promoting and maintaing a state of health and wellness are already distrustful of pharmacopia. As are those who've suffered the toxic effects of pharmacopia. It's called taking a proactive approach to creating and maintain a state of heath & wellness. In my opinion, that is a far more intelligent approach than neglecting one's health, then going bankrupt in an attempt to regain what was lost due to neglect.
 
Quote
Some people would argue that the apparent benefits of "believing" in the products outweigh the risks involved. Do you think that people need false beliefs in order to feel healthy or succeed in life? Would you like to believe that something can help you when in fact it is worthless? Should our society support an industry that is trying to mislead us? Can't Americans do something better with the billion or more dollars being wasted each year on multilevel "health" products?

IMO... a very specious argument. It assumes the position these products are worthless. In a legitimate network mktg company, no makes any money until and unless a product is sold. There is no advertising. People would NOT continue to purchase products that are worthless. A product must have value, or that company is out of business. NO EXCEPTIONS. Companies can go out of business for other reasons despite a fabulous product, ...however, without one, a company's demise is inevitable.

Quote
Physician Involvement
Many any physicians are selling health-related multilevel products to patients in their offices. The companies most involved have included Amway (now doing business as Quixtar), Body Wise, Nu Skin (Interior Design), Rexall, and Juice Plus+. Doctors are typically recruited with promises that the extra income will replace income lost to managed care. In December 1997, the American Medical Association Council on Ethical and Judicial Affairs (CEJA) advised against against profiting from the sale of "non-health-related products" to their patients. Although CEJA's policy statement does not mention products sold through multilevel marketing, CEJA's chairman said the statement was triggered by the growing number of physicians who had added an Amway distributorship to their practice.

Of course physicians have joined the ranks of network marketing. Physicians are often quite knowledgeable, well informed, and have the ability to verify the scientific testing so prevalent within the industry. They are also frequently disheartened with their lot in life... being required to treat disease, as opposed to being actively engaged in helping their patients achieve optimal states of heath & wellness.

Quote
Recommendations

Consumers would be wise to avoid health-related multilevel products altogether. Those that have nutritional value (such as vitamins and low-cholesterol foods) are invariably overpriced and may be unnecessary as well. Those promoted as remedies are either unproven, bogus, or intended for conditions that are unsuitable for self-medication.

I couldn't disagree more strongly. For him to take the position that a product that has nutritional value is automatically overpriced & unecessary reveals the amount of credibility or lack thereof within his article. One shouldn't rely on mere price to determine value. Mass market vitamins are often produced using inferior ingredients in order to keep the price minimal. Yes, you may be able to get a cheaper product, but you may not be getting the same quality. There's a huge difference between the price of cyanocobalamin, methylcobalamin, or hydroxocobalamin. Take a look at any B vitamin complex sold in the drug store, health food store, or grocery store. I'll bet you 99.9% of the time you'll find it contains cyanocobalamin. Had the manufacturer used either methylcobalamin, ...a far superior B-12 imo, the price on the bottle certainly would be much higher, and much higher still were it hydroxocobalamin.

When you examine price before value, you're looking in the wrong sequence.

I could manufacture two rings, one made of gold color plated metal, another made of 18K gold.
Obviously the 2nd ring costs more, but is ring 1 a better value? I don't think so.
Especially not when the gold colored ring will lose it's color, cause a nasty rash, turn your finger green, potentially allow lead absorbtion through your pores. While the 18K ring will not only keep it's value, ...it may even appreciate with the inevitable rise in the price of gold.


Quote
Government agencies should police the multilevel marketplace aggressively, using undercover investigators and filing criminal charges when wrongdoing is detected. People who feel they have been defrauded by MLM companies should file complaints with their state attorney general and with local FDA and FTC offices. A letter detailing the events may be sufficient to trigger an investigation; and the more complaints received, the more likely that corrective action will be taken.
 

This part I do agree with.

Quote

Jag - this confirms everything I have said.  


Just because it confirms what you said, ...doesn't make it accurate or correct. And does not address the broad over generalizations inherent in both your arguments.

You could say the moon was made of green cheese and could probably find someone to validate your statement.
Just because he's a Doctor, ...don't give him more credit than he is due. I think the 'integrity' of his article (for want of a sufficiently sarcastic euphemism) speaks volumes to a knowledgeable individual about the amount of credit he is due.  Wink Scream the world is made from green eggs and ham, and I'll betcha Dr. Seuss would agree. See, you can find a Doctor to approve or disapprove of pretty much any statement made.  Wink

Barrett maintains lists of sources, individuals, and groups it considers questionable and non-recommendable. His lists includes two-time Nobel Prize winner Linus Pauling (for his claims about mega-doses of Vitamin C), and the National Institutes of Health (NIH)

Barrett is flat out critical of alternative. He depends heavily on negative research and case studies in which alternative therapies do not work, and says most positive case studies are unreliable. Well which is it. Either scientific research is reliable or it isn't, but Barrett appears to want it both ways. It's reliable when scientific testing and research shows something to be invalid, ...but when that same scientific testing and research determines something to be valid, it's unreliable. Barrett says, he does not criticize conventional medicine because "that's way outside my scope." What kind of a doctor is unqualified or unable to be critical of conventional medicine? A psychiatrist perhaps? He says alternative therapies simply should be disregarded without further research. A wise man investigates what a fool takes for granted. Could that really be the reason he is not critical of conventional medicine? His organization is a non-profit that relies on donations. Have you researched exactly where he gets his donations from? Does his donor list include Big Pharma and those with a vested interest in removing all competition in the marketplace?

There have been a interesting lawsuits in the past involving the chiropractic industry and other wellness practices of which Barrett has been extremely critical. unable to pull details off the top of my head, and am unwilling to risk making a misstatement from memory. to do that would be unfair both to Barrett as well as those reading this, a consideration, both you & Barrett have failed to show to readers imo. However, when I find time, if the moment catches me, i might look them up. If memory serves me correctly, they do not portray Barrett and his co-horts in a very positive light.

333386, before you go quoting people and introducing them as validation for your theories,
...it would behoove you to know exactly who you're relying on, what his biases are, as well as who his donors are.  Cool

Hope That Clarifies
Report to moderator   Logged

w
Deicide
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 22937


Reapers...


View Profile
« Reply #41 on: May 21, 2009, 04:29:34 AM »

...continued from above due to character count restrions...

Please, I urge you to re-read the above highlight, ...and tell me why this is such a bad thing.  Roll Eyes

Flat out untruth.

First of all, that is NOT what multilevel participants do. Physicians do that, ...not MLM'ers.
Even the JAMA, the Journal of American Medical Association has flat out stated that all Americans should be taking dietary supplements


People who seek out nutrional ways of promoting and maintaing a state of health and wellness are already distrustful of pharmacopia. As are those who've suffered the toxic effects of pharmacopia. It's called taking a proactive approach to creating and maintain a state of heath & wellness. In my opinion, that is a far more intelligent approach than neglecting one's health, then going bankrupt in an attempt to regain what was lost due to neglect.
 
IMO... a very specious argument. It assumes the position these products are worthless. In a legitimate network mktg company, no makes any money until and unless a product is sold. There is no advertising. People would NOT continue to purchase products that are worthless. A product must have value, or that company is out of business. NO EXCEPTIONS. Companies can go out of business for other reasons despite a fabulous product, ...however, without one, a company's demise is inevitable.

Of course physicians have joined the ranks of network marketing. Physicians are often quite knowledgeable, well informed, and have the ability to verify the scientific testing so prevalent within the industry. They are also frequently disheartened with their lot in life... being required to treat disease, as opposed to being actively engaged in helping their patients achieve optimal states of heath & wellness.

I couldn't disagree more strongly. For him to take the position that a product that has nutritional value is automatically overpriced & unecessary reveals the amount of credibility or lack thereof within his article. One shouldn't rely on mere price to determine value. Mass market vitamins are often produced using inferior ingredients in order to keep the price minimal. Yes, you may be able to get a cheaper product, but you may not be getting the same quality. There's a huge difference between the price of cyanocobalamin, methylcobalamin, or hydroxocobalamin. Take a look at any B vitamin complex sold in the drug store, health food store, or grocery store. I'll bet you 99.9% of the time you'll find it contains cyanocobalamin. Had the manufacturer used either methylcobalamin, ...a far superior B-12 imo, the price on the bottle certainly would be much higher, and much higher still were it hydroxocobalamin.

When you examine price before value, you're looking in the wrong sequence.

I could manufacture two rings, one made of gold color plated metal, another made of 18K gold.
Obviously the 2nd ring costs more, but is ring 1 a better value? I don't think so.
Especially not when the gold colored ring will lose it's color, cause a nasty rash, turn your finger green, potentially allow lead absorbtion through your pores. While the 18K ring will not only keep it's value, ...it may even appreciate with the inevitable rise in the price of gold.

  

This part I do agree with.

Just because it confirms what you said, ...doesn't make it accurate or correct. And does not address the broad over generalizations inherent in both your arguments.

You could say the moon was made of green cheese and could probably find someone to validate your statement.
Just because he's a Doctor, ...don't give him more credit than he is due. I think the 'integrity' of his article (for want of a sufficiently sarcastic euphemism) speaks volumes to a knowledgeable individual amount the amount of credit he is due.  Wink Scream the world is made from green eggs and ham, and I'll betcha Dr. Seuss would agree. See, you can find a Doctor to approve or disapprove of pretty much any statement made.  Wink

Barrett maintains lists of sources, individuals, and groups it considers questionable and non-recommendable. His lists includes two-time Nobel Prize winner Linus Pauling (for his claims about mega-doses of Vitamin C), and the National Institutes of Health (NIH)

Barrett is flat out critical of alternative. He depends heavily on negative research and case studies in which alternative therapies do not work, and says most positive case studies are unreliable. Well which is it. Either scientific research is reliable or it isn't, but Barrett appears to want it both ways. It's reliable when scientific testing and research shows something to be invalid, ...but when that same scientific testing and research determines something to be valid, it's unreliable. Barrett says, he does not criticize conventional medicine because "that's way outside my scope." What kind of a doctor is unqualified or unable to be critical of conventional medicine? A psychiatrist perhaps? He says alternative therapies simply should be disregarded without further research. A wise man investigates what a fool takes for granted. Could that really be the reason he is not critical of conventional medicine? His organization is a non-profit that relies on donations. Have you researched exactly where he gets his donations from? Does his donor list include Big Pharma and those with a vested interest in removing all competition in the marketplace?

There have been a interesting lawsuits in the past involving the chiropractic industry and other wellness practices of which Barrett has been extremely critical. unable to pull details off the top of my head, and am unwilling to risk making a misstatement from memory. to do that would be unfair both to Barrett as well as those reading this, a consideration, both you & Barrett have failed to show to readers imo. However, when I find time, if the moment catches me, i might look them up. If memory serves me correctly, they do not portray Barrett and his co-horts in a very positive light.

333386, before you go quoting people and introducing them as validation for your theories,
...it would behoove you to know exactly who you're relying on, what his biases are, as well as who his donors are.  Cool

Hope That Clarifies



* tupac4.jpg (19.79 KB, 362x480 - viewed 148 times.)
Report to moderator   Logged

I hate the State.
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2009, 05:33:50 AM »

Did I just hear some-one reffer to 'MLM' - pyramid schemes, as a legitimate business.
OH-MY !!

OH-MY indeed  Shocked Shocked Roll Eyes

No, what you heard was someone refer to MLM as a legitimate business.
I refer to pyramid schemes as very illegitimate, and something to be stamped out.


Quote
That is why they have been out-lawed in most European countries - (Tony the 'frosties Tiger' voice)  THEIR GRRREEEEAT - for every-one involved.
The classic one 'Herba-life' has been kicked out of India (other Asian countries) & most of Europe.

The problem in Europe is all those crazy pyramids! It's CRAAAAAZY! Over there. The same with Asia.

Part of the problem is that in those regions, there are no clear laws or regulations that differentiate between pyramids and MLM's. They are lumped together in the minds of the unsuspecting public. The pyramid schemes have been very effective in confusing people and muddying the waters by applying MLM compensation plans to their shady practices. If I opened a fitness consulting business, and paid my personal trainers using a banks compensation plan, it wouldn't make my business a bank. It would still be a fitness consulting business. Even countries like China that has flat out criminalized Network Marketing recognize it's proper structure and form, to be a very valid and viable form of doing business, ...however without clear legislative delineation, guidelines, regulations, and operational procedures, con artists and crooks are able to muddy the waters and dupe many. As a result, Network Marketing is illegal in China.

They will however allow e-commerce. Fancy that? They outlaw MLM and Network Marketing, but allow e-commerce.
Infact, the Central Government of China recently provided my company with the distinctive honour naming us
"The Top Potential New E-Commerce Brand in all of China"

That goes to show, you can call something whatever you want. It doesn't make it so. Just as a rose by any other name would smell just as sweet, a pyramid called an MLM is still a pyramid. You cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. What matters is not what you call it, but rather how it operates. Our company operates the same way in North America as it does in China, and despite MLM being illegal in China, they not only do not have a problem with us, ...they have granted us one of their country's most prestigious honours.

Quote
Do you all still have 'HL' over there in the land of the free ??

Yes, Herbal Life exists in the USA, however, there are rules & regulations that must be complied with in order to operate in North America. Those same rules & regulations are not applicable in other markets.

For instance, it is against acceptable policies & procedures to reveal income in North America, and most MLM companies now put strict rules in place in their distributor agreements barring distributors from revealing their pay cheques. Those same regulations do not exist in other markets where distributors freely photocopy their cheques and include them in the information packages and brochures they leave with prospects.

It's really too bad, because I know many extremely successful network marketers, myself included, who would not be in the industry today, were it not for the ability to at one time verify someone's cheque. LOL. Back in the early 90's, that was what many of us did.... we photocopied our cheques every month. It allowed us to show prospects what we were accomplishing, and they could see the progressive results of our steady, disciplined, commitment over time. Ahhh the good ol days. Unfortunately, you have those who expected to buy a distributor kit, and make $10,000 / month right out of the gate. They weren't even making that in their professions that they spent thousands in University to learn. They spent thousands on an education, ...books, tuition etc, worked in their professions for maybe 5+ years, still weren't earning a 6 figure income FULL TIME, ...yet expected to achieve that in a brand new industry within which they had no training, or experience, ...and accomplish this inside of 90 days on a PART TIME basis.  Undecided How realistic is this?  Huh And when they don't achieve this in 90 days, they quit in frustration and disgust, ...claiming they were ripped off or scammed. It is because of people like this that network marketers are now restricted from revealing their incomes. It is the equivalent of the "Do Not Use Internally" warnings and disclaimers to be found on cans of Drano drain cleaners.  Grin

I can tell you myself and many others were haunted by some of those cheques. And in the beginning when we first started out, and were easily discouraged, the upside potential was enough to keep us in it. The type of freedom, lifestyle, and financial independence success in this industry brings was enough to motivate many of us to learn the business and how to succeed with it. I remember the first time I saw a cheque for $100,000 back in 1986. I didn't understand the principle of leverage, and calculated that I had to sell the product at the rate of 1 sale every 19 minutes in order to earn a $100,000 annual income. I immediately dismissed it as unachieveable. lol. At the time, my limited mentality thought that was an annual income, ...my frame of reference at the time couldn't even perceive of that as being a monthly income which it had been. I think if I had been told it was a monthly income, I probably wouldn't have even taken the time to calculate how many retail sales I would have needed.

My trigger or big AHA moment occured when my sister re-introduced me to the industry in 1990. Her and her boyfriend at the time invited me to a meeting, where I ran into two people I knew personally. The first was a man who I personally knew had within a matter of 2 years, pulled himself out of one of the worst financial shapes a grown man could be in, and achieved tremendous financial success. I just didn't know until 2 days before that night, this industry had been the vehicle he had used to achieve that success. It wasn't until my sister popped a videotape into my VCR that I recognized the company logo from his business card. The 2nd man I knew personally was a wealthy Japanese family physician who owned the most luxurious double-box at the Skydome. He admitted to me, that it was his network marketing income that afforded his home in Forest Hill, his vacation property in the Caymans, and his son's tuition at Upper Canada College. Neither one of those men had any vested interest in me joining, infact, it was quite the opposite. If I did join, it was going to be through my sister, and both of them, along with my sister were in 3 separate lines of sponsorship. My joining would mean a whole whack of mutual acquaintances that they could potentially lose as prospects if I got to them first.  Cheesy

Then I saw the cheques!  Shocked   Shocked   Shocked  Shocked  I realized this industry provided too much in the way of freedom, flexibility, lifestyle, self determination, personal development, and financial rewards for me to dismiss, or turn my back on. I determined then and there that I was going to learn how to do it and do it successfully.

Since entering the industry, I've had my share of bumps, bruises, and learning experiences along the way, but that is par for the course in any endeavor or pursuit, be it recreational or professional. Michael Jordan missed alot of baskets when he first picked up a basketball, ...but he stuck with it, and look at him now. My sister was only able to sponsor 1 person (me) and grew frustrated and impatient with her lack of "success" despite the fact that she was leveraged by me, the people I sponsored, those that they sponsored etc., and her little group had spread to 5 cities. Rather than be encouraged that this little leg that she started was growing deep and fast, she quit in frustration within 90 days and went back to her "Golden Handcuffs" at IBM. I on the other hand stuck with it. There are people who we introduced to the company, who to this very day are still using the products made by that company.

Here we are 19 years later, she's no longer with IBM. After leaving IBM, she went back to school, and acquired a Masters Degree, found employment elsewhere, and in her new employment, she was locked out of her job for 5 - 6 months due to a strike. Her contract ends at the end of this month when she will fall off yet another cliff. Her husband is a Real Estate broker... need I say more... And here  I am... also having endured a 6 month long strike within my previous profession. Our strike experiences were vastly different however. During her strike, ...her income went down. During my strike my income went up. Cheesy
Report to moderator   Logged

w
loco
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 8703

Getbig!


View Profile
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2009, 05:43:33 AM »

One thing Jag is definitely great at: Spamming the boards...classic illegitimate business tactic.
Report to moderator   Logged
Deicide
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 22937


Reapers...


View Profile
« Reply #44 on: May 21, 2009, 05:50:26 AM »

One thing Jag is definitely great at: Spamming the boards...classic illegitimate business tactic.

I did mention that whilst not the best, with the right qualifications you will always find decent (not great) work in the TEFL industry.

I agree with you about Judy.
Report to moderator   Logged

I hate the State.
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #45 on: May 21, 2009, 05:53:02 AM »

One thing Jag is definitely great at: Spamming the boards...classic illegitimate business practice.

{giggle} You chose your username well Loco  Wink

I prefer to categorize my contribution to this thread as addressing the inaccurate and misleading information put forth by others. It is an attempt to clarify things for the reader, from the position of one with a more accurate perspective on things. I hope it has been helpful for those who may be considering the industry.

Report to moderator   Logged

w
Deicide
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 22937


Reapers...


View Profile
« Reply #46 on: May 21, 2009, 05:59:40 AM »

{giggle} You chose your username well Loco  Wink

I prefer to categorize my contribution to this thread as addressing the inaccurate and misleading information put forth by others. It is an attempt to clarify things for the reader, from the position of one with a more accurate perspective on things. I hope it has been helpful for those who may be considering the industry.



You do realise you are a megalomaniac, right?
Report to moderator   Logged

I hate the State.
LurkerNoMore
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 11630

Tossing sand in your Va-Jay-Jay


View Profile
« Reply #47 on: May 21, 2009, 06:37:15 AM »

Well what's your definition of quick?    

1-2 years is quicker than 4 years correct?
Report to moderator   Logged
24KT
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 23884


Karatbars Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244


View Profile WWW
« Reply #48 on: May 21, 2009, 06:39:05 AM »

You do realise you are a megalomaniac, right?

{giggle} Megalomania is a luxury I cannot afford.
I'm about to awarded a Nobel prize in medicine, ...and I have an acceptance speech to write.  Wink
Report to moderator   Logged

w
loco
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 8703

Getbig!


View Profile
« Reply #49 on: May 21, 2009, 07:31:44 AM »

{giggle} You chose your username well Loco  Wink

I prefer to categorize my contribution to this thread as addressing the inaccurate and misleading information put forth by others. It is an attempt to clarify things for the reader, from the position of one with a more accurate perspective on things. I hope it has been helpful for those who may be considering the industry.

I know four people who got ripped off by your industry, a while after they had tried to get me involved using your exact same tactics.  I'd say they have a very accurate perspective on things.
Report to moderator   Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Theme created by Egad Community. Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.16 | SMF © 2011, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!