Class-Action Suit against 24 Hour Fitness

[wes mantooth]

Paying people only $20 an hour for something as tough as teaching an aerobics class is simply abusive.

So what would you propose?

I think trying to tie in world economics and the running rate across America for an aerobics instructor is a stretch. Now without telling us that we have been victimized and brainwashed by corrupt monopolies...tell us what you would think is a fair price? Why is $20 per class for an aerobics instructor a bad thing?

Shouldnt school teachers be paid more?
shouldnt police officers be paid more?
shouldnt civil servants be paid more?
Shouldnt we all be paid more?

unfortunately, it doesnt work like that in every case. IN THIS CASE, every gym in America pays aerobics instructors AROUND $20 to $25 per class (about an hour) If an individual such as yourself finds that this set wage is not "fair", why not find another occupation? All industries need balance and set standards

[The Luke]

How is Walmart a monopoly? Are you saying that they have the power to prevent anyone from forming a rival company that could, for example, pay double the wages they do while only charging half the price for the same products they sell?

Monopoly is only possible if the government interferes and forbids individuals or corporations to start manufacturing and selling products or services that would compete with the company that's holding the monopoly. If there is no governmental interference, then anyone is free to run a company like Walmart out of business by providing a similar or better quality of goods & / or services at a lower price while perhaps even paying higher wages. In a free market, the best product has the biggest share of the market.

As for your talking about Walmart wiping out the little fellows, don't forget that they offer goods of the same or better quality for a much lower price than the little fellows could ever offer you, with a lot more convenience in terms of payments, hours of operation, range of products to choose from, multiple locations etc

If Walmart has cut costs so much that it is now paying slave wages... the only way anyone can now compete with them is to pay NO wages.

Remember, Free Market Fundamentalism such as you are espousing is a religion... it has no basis in reality.

I'm somewhat surprised by your lack of understanding in this matter Kiwiol.


The Luke

[kiwiol]

If Walmart has cut costs so much that it is now paying slave wages... the only way anyone can now compete with them is to pay NO wages.

So by your own admission, offering competitive prices wouldn't leave a hypothetical Walmart competitor with enough of a profit margin to afford to pay even the kind of wage that Walmart pays. Ask yourself what that means.

You keep referring to Walmart as a monopoly, which is wrong. A monopoly is established by a company only when there is no possible chance for another company to compete with them by providing the goods & / or services that are offered by the former. And the only body that has the power to prevent a rival from competing is the government.

So if 90% of the US (not an exact figure, but just as an example) choose to use Microsoft, then Microsoft is not a monopoly. They just have the biggest share of the market. But if the US government suddenly says that no one else is permitted to manufacture and supply operating systems and such other than Microsoft, THAT would make Microsoft a monopoly.

[ManBearPig...]

The Puke likes to gives us all lessons on corporate and economic structures when he himself has never had a job.  Obviously, Puke is an Obama gimmick posting here.  Go hunt for sasquatch and leave the wage bitching to those who have a job, you fucking midget.

[tonymctones]

...and how do you do that when almost every aspect of American industry has been monopolised by cartels of massive corporations?

We have this same shit happening here in Ireland, one massive milk distributor or one massive beet processor hammering farmers on price and forcing them to sell below cost. Except over here we don't have people attacking the little guy by spouting the corporate propaganda... we tend to side with the common bloke, you guys seem so convinced that someday you too will be one of the super rich that you want to keep things skewed in their favour.

Strange?

Paying people only $20 an hour for something as tough as teaching an aerobics class is simply abusive.


The Luke

WTF are you talking about ding bat? 24 doesnt have any damn monopoly you idiot

and 20 bucks an hour equates to around 38000 a year, not bad for minimal education

who told them to work at 24? why not go into work for themselves?

personal accountability isnt really preached in ireland i see 

[kiwiol]

The Puke likes to gives us all lessons on corporate and economic structures when he himself has never had a job.  Obviously, Puke is an Obama gimmick posting here.  Go hunt for sasquatch and leave the wage bitching to those who have a job, you fucking midget.

LOL!

[gordiano]

If they had worded it '$20 per class' there would be no lawsuit.  I believe that is how they are paid around here, per class, not by the hour.

SHOW ME YOUR TITS!

[Topskin69]

I think the entire notion of the Employee vs. The evil Corporation is a bit of a False Dichotomy, or at least a bit of a one dimensional way of looking at it. It makes no sense for the Employer and Employee to have an adversial relationship, as one cannot function without the other. While I realize that many employers do wind up taking the easy road and screwing over their employees, this business plan does not usually pan out in the long run, and winds up being a great error of shortsightedness on the part of the company.

In other words "A kingdom divided against itself; cant stand."

[timfogarty]

and 20 bucks an hour equates to around 38000 a year, not bad for minimal education

no it doesn't because no one could do aerobics 40 hours a week 47 weeks a year, or 36 hours a week 52 weeks a year, or how ever you calculated that

[kiwiol]

I think the entire notion of the Employee vs. The evil Corporation is a bit of a False Dichotomy, or at least a bit of a one dimensional way of looking at it. It makes no sense for the Employer and Employee to have an adversial relationship, as one cannot function without the other. While I realize that many employers do wind up taking the easy road and screwing over their employees, this business plan does not usually pan out in the long run, and winds up being a great error of shortsightedness on the part of the company.

In other words "A kingdom divided against itself; cant stand."

Exactly. Sure there are some employers who try to take unfair advantage of some of their employees, but there are also tons of employees who rip off their employers in various ways. But over time, the market will put each in the place they deserve. No one can keep ripping someone off and still stay on top or even where they are, cause word will spread and a competitor who doesn't have the flaw(s) will wipe the bad one out.

[disco_stu]

omg the luke- a mans man and someone who i finally agree with at GB.

couldnt have said it better myself.

The US is extremely attractive to the well off or the talented, or educated, or skilled...but if you are out of luck, or not blessed with many talents, it is hell on earth. then dont even dare to get sick as well....

it happens in other countries, but not to the same extent, and not before the government steps in or the people say "hang on" . The US on the other hand see it as an opportunity to benefit, rather than help their fellow man..because one day you might need it (that help). instead, for some bizarre reason, they think, "screw them, thats their problem"   well, errrr, no. thats the reason why you have a problem. because its dog eat dog in the US and everyone thinks they are going to be rich or famous one day. when it doesnt work out, they lash out at the system. the very same system that may have allowed them to live well at some point.

to sum it up... the US = . Biggest dog eats little dog. The pack doesnt exist. Dogs roam and fight for territory. mangy dogs die due to stavation.
most other civilised countries = big dog is challenged by the pack regularly, mangy dog is assisted by the pack to survive and given a bone.

dont know how this became a dog analogy.

[The Luke]

Exactly. Sure there are some employers who try to take unfair advantage of some of their employees, but there are also tons of employees who rip off their employers in various ways. But over time, the market will put each in the place they deserve. No one can keep ripping someone off and still stay on top or even where they are, cause word will spread and a competitor who doesn't have the flaw(s) will wipe the bad one out.

Free Market Fundamentalism is a pernicious myth... like all religions.


The Luke

[kiwiol]

Free Market Fundamentalism is a pernicious myth... like all religions.


The Luke

Why not be honest and admit you can't refute what I said, instead of making a cliched blanket statement that you obviously can't prove because it simply isn't true?

[dr.chimps]

Clash of the Financial Titans going on. Forests will be felled, mountains laid low and valleys lifted.  

*hides under desk*  

[kiwiol]

Forests will be felled, mountains laid low and valleys lifted.

That would make Sasquatch spotting from the air a lot easier...

[tendonitis]

Sasquatch is trying to monopolize the elusive creature market.
The Loch Ness monster isn't happy.

[dr.chimps]

That would make Sasquatch spotting from the air a lot easier...

[Rome]

That's how corporations control and effectively enslave populations.

A local corner store can't find workers paying $9 an hour... but if Walmart abuses their employment monopoly by only paying $9 an hour; that sets an industry standard. Now the corner store can pay $8 an hour, no problem.

That's what I don't understand about the American mentality... I understand capitalist free market fundamentalism, it's a (somewhat) justifiable ideology...

But why don't the proponents of such thinking (ie: those parroting the propaganda) comprehend that monopolies; corporations; corporate personhood and cartels are ANTI-CAPITALIST?


The Luke

QFT!

[tonymctones]

no it doesn't because no one could do aerobics 40 hours a week 47 weeks a year, or 36 hours a week 52 weeks a year, or how ever you calculated that

I know this tim and no gym could have enough members to run 40 hours of classes in a 5 day week. This doesnt mean 24 should have to pay them more thats idiotic as someone else mentioned this isnt meant to be a full time job.

I think the problem is the fact they are meant to show up early and stay late without compensation not the 20 bucks an hour luke is making it into.

you want them to pay them 100 bucks a class? come the fuk on

again you want more pay, fine ask for commission on the number of members you have per class...LOL lets see how happy those instructors are then.

[noworries]

I know this tim and no gym could have enough members to run 40 hours of classes in a 5 day week. This doesnt mean 24 should have to pay them more thats idiotic as someone else mentioned this isnt meant to be a full time job.

I think the problem is the fact they are meant to show up early and stay late without compensation not the 20 bucks an hour luke is making it into.

you want them to pay them 100 bucks a class? come the fuk on

again you want more pay, fine ask for commission on the number of members you have per class...LOL lets see how happy those instructors are then.

Um alot of gyms offer 40 classes a week and more.  Gold's in West Hollywood have something like 100+ a week.  I actually posted this just because I can't believe the instructors are getting the exact and even less than my girlfriend was making back in the early 80's.  You guys think they are getting overpaid?  A plumber will charge you $100 to come and tighten a bolt on a toilet or garbarge men get over $20 an hour to drive a truck and pick up trash

[tonymctones]

Um alot of gyms offer 40 classes a week and more.  Gold's in West Hollywood have something like 100+ a week.  I actually posted this just because I can't believe the instructors are getting the exact and even less than my girlfriend was making back in the early 80's.  You guys think they are getting overpaid?  A plumber will charge you $100 to come and tighten a bolt on a toilet or garbarge men get over $20 an hour to drive a truck and pick up trash

over 7 days bro not 5 and over probably 13 hours a day

I never said they were overpaid I said a lot of ppl would like to get paid 20 bucks an hour. You ppl seem to think these are their full time jobs  this is a part time job and should be treated as such. Many aerobics instructors are personal trainers who teach classes on the side.

why dont they go become plumbers then or trashmen instead of bitching about a choice they decided to make?

[Noel Fuller]

24 hour will lose big, its up to the employer to prove it not the employee

[kiwiol]

Um alot of gyms offer 40 classes a week and more.  Gold's in West Hollywood have something like 100+ a week.  I actually posted this just because I can't believe the instructors are getting the exact and even less than my girlfriend was making back in the early 80's.  You guys think they are getting overpaid?  A plumber will charge you $100 to come and tighten a bolt on a toilet or garbarge men get over $20 an hour to drive a truck and pick up trash

It's a question of demand and supply, skill of labor involved and the size of the available work force. Aerobics instructors are a dime a dozen and the fitness industry by it's nature is one where people are constantly moving. So there's no need to pay more than $20 for the "average" instructor, cause if they leave, there's always plenty of others to fill the spot. Plumbing is a skilled trade and the ratio of number of plumbers available vs plumbing jobs is different.

Your girlfriend was making a lot more than the average wage because of her profile. It's the same as Personal Trainers with a full blown degree and having a lot of associated skills / certificates + a good profile charging more than the average PT who does a certificate course over 3 weekends and becomes accredited, even though they don't actually know shit about a lot of things.

[timfogarty]

Gold's in West Hollywood have something like 100+ a week. 

On Santa Monica Blvd, the city of West Hollywood ends just east of La Brea.  Gold's Hollywood is on Cole, a good 10 blocks farther east.

[tommywishbone]

Walmart sucks.