Gasoline up 100% under Obama, MSM continues to make excuses

[Fury]

I'm not trying to justify triple digit oil, just explaining a possible side benefit of higher prices.  The overall effect will be crippling no one can deny that, but it's not all doom and gloom.  By the way, higher prices will come whether the US drills or not.  You have not proven me wrong in any way shape or form in fact i have proven your asinine belief that US drilling will reduce prices significantly is false.  

You have done nothing but speculate and post media articles, your most hated source of info from others.  Brutal double standard.  

I didn't say higher prices wouldn't come regardless. What I'm saying is that Obama's reckless monetary and fiscal policies that have contributed to the growing inflation rate in this country (something you continually ignore) are one of the major driving forces behind the rise in prices. The demand from China is not increasing anywhere near the rate that would be required to be the driving force behind the astronomical rise in oil prices over the last few months. You are incapable of acknowledging the role inflation is playing in this because it would mean that your Messiah, your King, your God, has fucked up. And we all know you're not actually capable of criticizing your deity.

I, 333 and other have posted articles from people who know a hell of a lot more than YOU about this. You ignore them like a twat and continue rambling on about whatever it is that strikes your fancy in this argument, all of which is unsubstantiated and based on your opinion, of course.

And where did I say I hate all media? Nice generalization, something you chastise me for. Brutal double standard.  

[Soul Crusher]

I have two on going threads on this issue alone! 

[GigantorX]

Pointed out what?  It's not a claim it's fact.  The rise in the bunker fuel index increases the cost of shipping, as i pointed out.  Chinese steel imported to the US becomes more expensive, ergo, US steel production becomes economically viable, ergo, the potential for a move to more production of US goods for the US market.  

QE2 no doubt has an effect on the rise in oil prices.  I have never not acknowledged that.  But it is one factor, not THE factor.  

Triple digit oil, especially at 130 and above would/has cripple economies. Airline industries, transportation, food, gasoline, diesel...the whole damn box of rocks gets smashed. Inflation rises as cost of inputs and cost of transport skyrocket. The consumer is at the end of the barrel of this shotgun and takes all the shot right in the face. All of this for the "potential" for jobs and manufacturing to move back to the U.S? I see what you are saying but it isn't good enough. $5 gas and 150 dollar per barrel oil has ZERO upside, that scenario would be all doom and gloom. Consumers would adjust as best they could by any money saved or pushed from adjusting household budgets would be destroyed by the ensuing inflation on EVERYTHING.

There is no upside.

[Soul Crusher]

Triple digit oil, especially at 130 and above would/has cripple economies. Airline industries, transportation, food, gasoline, diesel...the whole damn box of rocks gets smashed. Inflation rises as cost of inputs and cost of transport skyrocket. The consumer is at the end of the barrel of this shotgun and takes all the shot right in the face. All of this for the "potential" for jobs and manufacturing to move back to the U.S? I see what you are saying but it isn't good enough. $5 gas and 150 dollar per barrel oil has ZERO upside, that scenario would be all doom and gloom. Consumers would adjust as best they could by any money saved or pushed from adjusting household budgets would be destroyed by the ensuing inflation on EVERYTHING.

There is no upside.

Wrong! 

If you are in favor of cap n trade, NWO, people not going anywhere, cloward & piven, people living under candles, etc, there is a ton of upside on this.     

[GigantorX]

The moment Obama mentioned "increased biofuel production" in his energy campaign speech....I turned the channel.

[Soul Crusher]

The moment Obama mentioned "increased biofuel production" in his energy campaign speech....I turned the channel.

I.E. - burning food for fuel and then claiming ignorance as to food inflation.         


That is the obama doctrine to a tee. 

[kcballer]

I didn't say higher prices wouldn't come regardless. What I'm saying is that Obama's reckless monetary and fiscal policies that have contributed to the growing inflation rate in this country (something you continually ignore) are one of the major driving forces behind the rise in prices. The demand from China is not increasing anywhere near the rate that would be required to be the driving force behind the astronomical rise in oil prices over the last few months. You are incapable of acknowledging the role inflation is playing in this because it would mean that your Messiah, your King, your God, has fucked up. And we all know you're not actually capable of criticizing your deity.

I, 333 and other have posted articles from people who know a hell of a lot more than YOU about this. You ignore them like a twat and continue rambling on about whatever it is that strikes your fancy in this argument, all of which is unsubstantiated and based on your opinion, of course.

And where did I say I hate all media? Nice generalization, something you chastise me for. Brutal double standard.  

Why do you keep calling him my messiah?   Are you that dense that you think that?  When have i called him my messiah, king or other superlative?

Rising inflation does increase the price of oil, this is something that i have acknowledged a long time ago.  However, you are looking at ONE aspect.  ONE.  You are ignoring the demand from China, you are ignoring the OPEC increase in usage, you are ignoring that oil field discoveries peaked 25 odd years ago.  YOU are ignoring the work of M Hubbard who successfully predicted in 1956 that US oil production would peak between 1965 - 1970.  You are ignoring the work of economists like Jeff Rubin, who i have posted on here many times, discussing the reasons behind rising prices.  

YOU are ignoring the oil companies themselves who say that conventional oil is getting harder and harder to find, making oil sands the go to resource.  Oil sands being significantly more energy intensive and therefore more expensive than crude.  YOU ignore Exxon's latest yearly forecast where they predict to replace EVERY BARREL OF CRUDE WITH .95 OF A BARREL over the next 5+ years.  That means an ever dwindling decline in crude, a relatively cheap fuel we have run on for decades, and an increased reliance on higher priced, harder sourced oil.  

YOU ignore that 4,000,000 barrels of oil need to be found EVERY DAY just to replace what we are currently taking out.  Do the math BF, where does that put the price of future oil?  Lower or higher?  

But hey this is all Obama/Bush's fault right?  

[kcballer]

Triple digit oil, especially at 130 and above would/has cripple economies. Airline industries, transportation, food, gasoline, diesel...the whole damn box of rocks gets smashed. Inflation rises as cost of inputs and cost of transport skyrocket. The consumer is at the end of the barrel of this shotgun and takes all the shot right in the face. All of this for the "potential" for jobs and manufacturing to move back to the U.S? I see what you are saying but it isn't good enough. $5 gas and 150 dollar per barrel oil has ZERO upside, that scenario would be all doom and gloom. Consumers would adjust as best they could by any money saved or pushed from adjusting household budgets would be destroyed by the ensuing inflation on EVERYTHING.

There is no upside.

That is the type of response i like to see.  It was a question posed to illicit thought out responses.  I never agreed nor disagreed with it, just stated it.  I agree, the consequences of higher oil far outweigh a benefit of job creation but it's an interesting correlation i thought i would share.

[kcballer]

I.E. - burning food for fuel and then claiming ignorance as to food inflation.         


That is the obama doctrine to a tee. 

That's US Ethanol policy to a T.  Obama is wrong on that for sure, and so was Bush and any one else who thinks burning oil to make ethanol is smart.  It's a giveaway to the midwest farmers. 

[Soul Crusher]

Oil climbs to highest since 2008 on Libya conflict
Oil settles above $106 a barrel as pro-Gadhafi forces push back rebels

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Oil-climbs-to-highest-since-apf-1947152419.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=




A motorist leaves an Indian reservation where the price of gas is less expensive than surrounding areas at $3.53 per gallon at Western Door gas station on the Tonawanda Indian Reservation in New York, Thursday, March 31, 2011. The price of oil rose to a 30-month high on Thursday as fighters loyal to Moammar Gadhafi pushed back rebels from key areas in eastern Libya. (AP Photo/David Duprey)
On Thursday March 31, 2011, 3:35 pm



NEW YORK (AP) -- The price of oil rose to a 30-month high on Thursday as fighters loyal to Moammar Gadhafi pushed back rebels from key areas in eastern Libya.

Benchmark West Texas Intermediate crude rose $2.45, more than 2 percent, to settle at $106.72 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange. At one point it hit $106.83, the highest it's been since September, 2008. In London, Brent crude rose $2.25 to settle at $117.20 per barrel.

Battles between Gadhafi's troops and rebels have seesawed back and forth in Libyan ports and towns since mid-February, with the price of oil rising more than $20 a barrel since then. Energy consultants Cameron Hanover said traders are beginning to view the Libya uprising as a standoff for now. 'Without control of the air, Gadhafi's troops have been unable to hammer home their gains. And, without strong and well-trained ground forces, the rebels seem incapable of holding onto their gains. Optimism that Libyan oil might return to the market, seen earlier this week, was dashed."

Libya's oil exports, which went mainly to Europe, are shut down. The rebels have said they plan to start shipping oil again, although how soon that could happen is unclear. Libya exported only about 1.6 million barrels of oil a day, or 2 percent of global consumption, but energy traders worry that unrest will spread across the region to disrupt shipments from OPEC countries like Saudi Arabia and Iran. The Saudis are the biggest oil producers in the world, supplying about 8.4 million barrels a day. Iran produces more than 4 million barrels a day. Anti-government protests in those countries so far have been limited, although unrest continues in Syria, Bahrain and Yemen.

Meanwhile the Saudis are making good on a promise to make up for the deficit of Libyan oil. "Saudi Arabia is beginning to supply European oil companies with crude oil to help alleviate the shortfall from Libya," said Addison Armstrong, senior director of market research at Tradition Energy. "Saudi Arabian Oil Co. has sold three shipments of light, sweet crude for March and April delivery: two to Austrian oil company OMV AG and one to BP."

The Energy Department's Energy Information Administration released its weekly report on natural gas supplies on Thursday. It showed that the United States' abundant reserves grew by 12 billion cubic feet from the week before, to 1.624 trillion cubic feet. That is 4.4 percent above the five-year average.

"Shale plays have fundamentally altered the amount of domestic supply available, leading to large weekly injections," said energy analyst Stephen Schork, who writes the daily Schork Report newsletter.

The EIA estimates that the country has 827 trillion cubic feet of natural gas in shale formations. In all, EIA estimates the U.S. has 2,552 trillion cubic feet of potential natural gas resources, enough to satisfy the nation's annual demand for 110 years. The agency expects that to rise in coming years as more shale resources are discovered.

Natural gas contracts rose 3.4 cents to settle at $4.389 per 1,000 cubic feet. In other Nymex trading, heating oil added 5.91 cents to settle at $3.1125 per gallon, and gasoline futures gained 5.04 cents to settle at $3.1077 per gallon.

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[MM2K]

Now that the price of oil is high under Obama as it was under Bush, its funny how liberals are suddenly becoming economically literate. But you guys are neglecting to mention one crucial difference: Under Bush, the unemployment rate was 5% when gasoline hit $4.00 a gallon. Under Obama, the unemployment rate is still 10%.

[whork25]

Now that the price of oil is high under Obama as it was under Bush, its funny how liberals are suddenly becoming economically literate. But you guys are neglecting to mention one crucial difference: Under Bush, the unemployment rate was 5% when gasoline hit $4.00 a gallon. Under Obama, the unemployment rate is still 10%.

True but you gotta remember we had the burst of the housing bubble, the bailouts etc..

I thought the bailouts was to secure american jobs but the businesses is laying people off and the CEOs bonuses is getting bigger, go figure

[Soul Crusher]

Business will not begin to rapidly hire until obama is out office and the dems lose conytrol over the senate.   Too many insane policies creating massive uncertainty.   

[Option D]

I have two on going threads on this issue alone! 

you got 2 threads on EVERY "Issue"...

[Kazan]

It's kind of amusing watching all this debate about "big oil", I suggest you actually find out how much per gallon is tax. Doesn't anyone find it strange that the tax is just added into the price? Not to mention all the rules and regulation for refining and special gas blends, 10% ethanol BS ......

[Option D]

It's kind of amusing watching all this debate about "big oil", I suggest you actually find out how much per gallon is tax. Doesn't anyone find it strange that the tax is just added into the price? Not to mention all the rules and regulation for refining and special gas blends, 10% ethanol BS ......

now that be some straight bullshit.. when i look at the graph of the tax its like 14%...for this.. 10% for that.. I think we are taxed 3 times here in LA. Fed, State and City..

[Kazan]

now that be some straight bullshit.. when i look at the graph of the tax its like 14%...for this.. 10% for that.. I think we are taxed 3 times here in LA. Fed, State and City..

Yep, I bet you guys are getting hit for at least another 50 cents a gallon in California just in taxes

[Option D]

Yep, I bet you guys are getting hit for at least another 50 cents a gallon in California just in taxes

im gonna look it up.. if its more than .50c... im gonna buy a bike,...as in 1 human powered

[andreisdaman]

I didn't say higher prices wouldn't come regardless. What I'm saying is that Obama's reckless monetary and fiscal policies that have contributed to the growing inflation rate in this country (something you continually ignore) are one of the major driving forces behind the rise in prices. The demand from China is not increasing anywhere near the rate that would be required to be the driving force behind the astronomical rise in oil prices over the last few months. You are incapable of acknowledging the role inflation is playing in this because it would mean that your Messiah, your King, your God, has fucked up. And we all know you're not actually capable of criticizing your deity.

I, 333 and other have posted articles from people who know a hell of a lot more than YOU about this. You ignore them like a twat and continue rambling on about whatever it is that strikes your fancy in this argument, all of which is unsubstantiated and based on your opinion, of course.

And where did I say I hate all media? Nice generalization, something you chastise me for. Brutal double standard.  

you ignore everyone else's stuff and opinions as well.....so why bring this up?

[Option D]

What the fuck/.. when you add the Fed, State, County, and city,..we are taxed 64 mutha fuckin cents per gallon... this shit kind of infuriates me..

[GigantorX]

now that be some straight bullshit.. when i look at the graph of the tax its like 14%...for this.. 10% for that.. I think we are taxed 3 times here in LA. Fed, State and City..

And take a look at where those tax "revenues" go. I bet they all flow into a "general fund".

[Kazan]

What the fuck/.. when you add the Fed, State, County, and city,..we are taxed 64 mutha fuckin cents per gallon... this shit kind of infuriates me..

Well that is the reaction they are trying to avoid, people would freak out if the tax per gallon actually showed at the pump.

[Option D]

And take a look at where those tax "revenues" go. I bet they all flow into a "general fund".

funny you should say that

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/bottleneck/2008/06/understanding-g.html

A lot of the gas tax money is supposed to be spent on infrastructure. But here's a sentence to chew on from the traffic series The Times is running this week:

"Roughly $5.8 billion in highway and mass-transit funds that were diverted during the state's repeated budget crises this decade have not yet been repaid."

[GigantorX]

funny you should say that

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/bottleneck/2008/06/understanding-g.html

A lot of the gas tax money is supposed to be spent on infrastructure. But here's a sentence to chew on from the traffic series The Times is running this week:

"Roughly $5.8 billion in highway and mass-transit funds that were diverted during the state's repeated budget crises this decade have not yet been repaid."

Not surprising.

Social Security is also classified as a "General Fund".

[Kazan]

When all the layers of BS are peeled back, what we find is a ponzi scheme.