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Author Topic: PBW: BOB CHICK SOUNDS OFF (Listen Now)  (Read 7618 times)
Largerthanlife
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« Reply #25 on: June 06, 2011, 07:36:31 PM »

The state of professional BB isnt nearly what many of you believe it is...many more athletes have contracts and opportunities than ever before, the Expo style shows have many more people attending, prize money is up, especially at the Olympia as we are nearing the $1M purse...and despite the economy of the last few years, the supplement industry had thrived...

As for the physiques, any era of BB has its ups and downs in terms of depth...and people tend to remember the "good 'ol days" as just that...

your delusional, yeah the prize money went up, it's not like it got more people watching, it's just a freak show admit it!

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« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2011, 07:38:45 PM »

I just gotta know if the higher ups or head judges like a Jim Rockell believe these physques we see today are of a better quality than those of the past.  if they do they are delusional if they don't what aren't they doing something about it?
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« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2011, 07:41:51 PM »

The state of professional BB isnt nearly what many of you believe it is...many more athletes have contracts and opportunities than ever before, the Expo style shows have many more people attending, prize money is up, especially at the Olympia as we are nearing the $1M purse...and despite the economy of the last few years, the supplement industry had thrived...

As for the physiques, any era of BB has its ups and downs in terms of depth...and people tend to remember the "good 'ol days" as just that...

good ol' Comical Ali haha.
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« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2011, 07:42:19 PM »

I just gotta know if the higher ups or head judges like a Jim Rockell believe these physques we see today are of a better quality than those of the past.  if they do they are delusional if they don't what aren't they doing something about it?

dude competitive eating is more popular than bodybuilding.  it's sad, bodybuilding had it's time and it's time has gone.

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« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2011, 07:42:51 PM »

BTW Dan, Bob, Lee, Chad, I challenge any one of you on my ideas to a debate and I'd like to see a coherant reason as to why physiques shouldn't look like those from the 90s of a higher quality (quality defined as conditioning, tie-ins separation and taper to the waist) vs. IFBBs definition of progress being bigger with less tie-ins, separation and taper.

first, there is no official IFBB stance of progress...the judges judge on whats before them. There are many athletes with exactly what you described competing today...

Finally myself and many others would like to know the reason why a major part of the sport POSING has been forgotten other than the reason Bob gave.  They make the rules and it seems like it wouldn't be to difficult to enforce.  Presentation of the physique is very important...What we have onstage today in most cases is pathetic.

Thats your opinion...it hasnt been forgotten, and it counts in the scoring as much as it ever has....ZERO. Nothing has changed other than calling it the way it REALLY is.  Its a physique contest, first and foremost...


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« Reply #30 on: June 06, 2011, 07:44:43 PM »

dude competitive eating is more popular than bodybuilding.  it's sad, bodybuilding had it's time and it's time has gone.



I for one would like it to be better.  It could be so much better and in turn would bring more people if that's what they want.  Even if not for more people it could be better with changes to the way they judge would correct many problems like I stated.  A better quality physique would come about, longer careers, and better shows.
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« Reply #31 on: June 06, 2011, 07:57:16 PM »



Corrrect Bob there are and not many of those guys win top shows. No one ever wants to answer my question about the guys from the 90s vs. guys now.  The reason I bring these guys up is because I think most will agree the 90s was the gold standard for bodybuilding.  There is no reason we can't have physiques like that, it's all in how you judge them.  Judging today favors the larger bodybuilder who in most cases has severe abdominal distention, little to no taper, much less sepration, and tie-ins than his smaller and better looking counterpart.  The smaller guy will be penilized and be told "get bigger" and the larger guy will get better placings unless he's really off. 

It is and shouldn't presenting your physique important?  Shouldn't it count for something?  Why did was the scoring part of posing taken away vs. enforced?  Was it believed that it would never be enforced?

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« Reply #32 on: June 06, 2011, 07:58:08 PM »

Regarding the statements made my Dan, Bob and Lee.

1.  Bob is 100% correct.  There needs to be no more the 10 people to do the Mr. O.  I've stated this in the past.  This is supposed to be the best of the best and IMO only the winners of shows should be qualified for the O and in the case that the winner is qualified then the second place person should go in.

2.  In regards to what's going on with athletes today?  You want them to come in better shape, condition etc?  Have the judges to hold more credence in those categories.  Obviously it's bodybuilding so you want them to have size BUT far too many times I've seen the smaller more defined/conditioned bodybuilder get the shaft over the larger less conditioned guy....THIS NEEDS TO END.

3.  You want them to compete more often, bodybuilders must be smaller.  As you already know it's difficult for the larger guys to come in shape many times during the year.  When this happens you have shows with 2nd and 3rd tier bodybuilders headlining shows. And guess what, we don't go to shows to see 2nd and third tier guys...So you want them to compete more often, CHANGE THE JUDGING STANDARDS cause we know the prize money won't go up.

4.  Oh yeah the biggest mistake ever made and Flex, Shawn, Kevin and many others agree with me is not counting the posing anymore...You excuse was it wasn't being judged the right way it was dropped...Why weren't the rules ever enforced and the judges told, "hey guys, we're going to count the judging round now on actual posing."  So for the first couple of shows when guys are getting bad placings for shitty posing they'll get the message and practice posing the way it shoud be.


5.  The thing that sets todays bodybuilders apart from the guys of yesterday is everything you said but it's the size today.  People are able to get in great condition what they aren't able to do is get this size at a young age.  So as I said before, put more credence in coniditioning, separation, tie-ins and posing you'l lhave bodybuilder turning pro at a younger age, a better lineup, better physiques and people that are more interested in viewing and getting involved with the sport.  This is progress Bob not adding 30lbs of slin muscle and adding 3-4 inches on the waist and losing the previously sharp physique.  There really is no debating this, it's the truth.



6. Though a young at at 31 I've folowed the sport since 15  and its trends this is the answer. Not what is going on.
I agree with alot of these points... I have personally witnessed to many guys with better conditioning getting the shaft because the fat big guy wins all the time. It is a large part of the reason why many younger guys are discouraged from continuing to compete. I cannot tell you how many talented guys who could have gone far i have seen drop out because of this. It is exhausting to see and personally draining for myself.
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« Reply #33 on: June 06, 2011, 07:59:47 PM »

I agree with alot of these points... I have personally witnessed to many guys with better conditioning getting the shaft because the fat big guy wins all the time. It is a large part of the reason why many younger guys are discouraged from continuing to compete. I cannot tell you how many talented guys who could have gone far i have seen drop out because of this. It is exhausting to see and personally draining for myself.

Boom...
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« Reply #34 on: June 06, 2011, 08:08:51 PM »

Corrrect Bob there are and not many of those guys win top shows. No one ever wants to answer my question about the guys from the 90s vs. guys now. 

Theyre two different eras...there simply were MORE guys who had physiques you liked, right now, there are fewer...but they still exist...there were also guys like JP Fux, etc who had really bad distension, dorians waist wasnt exactly waspish either, Ernie Taylor and his tris, etc...


 The reason I bring these guys up is because I think most will agree the 90s was the gold standard for bodybuilding. 

You can make just as good a case for the 80's...


 There is no reason we can't have physiques like that, it's all in how you judge them.  Judging today favors the larger bodybuilder who in most cases has severe abdominal distention, little to no taper, much less sepration, and tie-ins than his smaller and better looking counterpart.  The smaller guy will be penilized and be told "get bigger" and the larger guy will get better placings unless he's really off. 

Pretty broad statement...Who do you believe in the top 10 of the Olympia have what you describe this year?


It is and shouldn't presenting your physique important?  Shouldn't it count for something?  Why did was the scoring part of posing taken away vs. enforced?  Was it believed that it would never be enforced?

It cant be enforced, as routines are as diametrically different than the physiques themselves...



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« Reply #35 on: June 06, 2011, 08:13:01 PM »

I agree with alot of these points... I have personally witnessed to many guys with better conditioning getting the shaft because the fat big guy wins all the time. It is a large part of the reason why many younger guys are discouraged from continuing to compete. I cannot tell you how many talented guys who could have gone far i have seen drop out because of this. It is exhausting to see and personally draining for myself.

Really?  Being that you mention this has been your personal experience...Id like to hear some names of these gentlemen who youve personally witnessed drop out.
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« Reply #36 on: June 06, 2011, 08:13:58 PM »

Boom...
That's not even the half of it. There is so much i'd like to complain about but i don't due to fear of looking like Shawn Ray. I think you a dead on in much of your assessment.  I'm not too big of a fan of the posing routines and im actually quite happy about that not being judged anymore but the end result of that is the entertainment factor for the night show is destroyed. I would say though that those who are good posers will be good posers regardless of the judging of the night show. It is a BODY building contest after all. I am sick of the "dance routines". I wish they could incorporate something a lot like prejudging at the night show.
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« Reply #37 on: June 06, 2011, 08:16:08 PM »

Really?  Being that you mention this has been your personal experience...Id like to hear some names of these gentlemen who youve personally witnessed drop out.
I'm speaking at the local level. I have seen plenty of people get frustrated and end it. I think some of the qualifications can be a bit unfair to. Here at my local show the top 2 in the entire show qualify for nationals. Over at East coast shows top 3 in every class qualify and to be honest the quality of competitors ain't much better. If anything many of them are far behind. I realize though that this is probably based on the actual size of the show.
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« Reply #38 on: June 06, 2011, 08:18:21 PM »

Really?  Being that you mention this has been your personal experience...Id like to hear some names of these gentlemen who youve personally witnessed drop out.
Lets think of a few guys... How about the Feldman brothers? Moe Elbasouni? Shane Geise? There are a lot more. I have joked in private with a couple of competitors and said maybe we should just come in our offseason condition since some of these softer guys seem to be placing higher. We all laugh and agree. Some of the guys i know are contemplating other shows in other areas for that reason. I can go on Rx muscle and pull up shows where people won that probably should have.
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« Reply #39 on: June 06, 2011, 08:24:05 PM »

Lets think of a few guys... How about the Feldman brothers? Moe Elbasouni? Shane Geise? There are a lot more. I have joked in private with a couple of competitors and said maybe we should just come in our offseason condition since some of these softer guys seem to be placing higher. We all laugh and agree. Some of the guys i know are contemplating other shows in other areas for that reason. I can go on Rx muscle and pull up shows where people won that probably should have.

And you believe these guys you mentioned were really going to go on to achieve anything at the pro level??
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« Reply #40 on: June 06, 2011, 08:29:04 PM »

And you believe these guys you mentioned were really going to go on to achieve anything at the pro level??
Are you kidding me? The Feldman brothers look awesome. Moe looked awesome. That is like saying do you think Kuclo will achieve anything at the pro level? or Jason Huh? or Brandon Curry? I got into bodybuilding following those guys careers wondering what they did to get as big as they were at such a young age. These guys are turning pro now as we speak. There is no way to know but im just saying i see a lot of good things that could have been great get discouraged and move on.
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« Reply #41 on: June 06, 2011, 09:33:12 PM »

I have to agree with Wiggs.

Bob, we've PM'd about this before and I appreciate you taking the time to respond but ultimately, I think what Wiggs is saying is right on the money.

Bodybuilding could be so much better than what it is now.
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« Reply #42 on: June 06, 2011, 09:56:28 PM »

yes it could be, but they guys are just on too many drugs, they look grotesque to the average person.  If you want to appeal to a wider audience the competitors need to lose about 50 - 70 pounds of muscle.

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« Reply #43 on: June 06, 2011, 10:01:04 PM »

Quote
Bob is 100% correct.  There needs to be no more the 10 people to do the Mr. O.  I've stated this in the past.  This is supposed to be the best of the best and IMO only the winners of shows should be qualified for the O and in the case that the winner is qualified then the second place person should go in.

With fewer athletes, you can work them much harder on stage and you can make the smallest things really count when separating them - things like details in poses, posing itself, presentation etc

Quote
In regards to what's going on with athletes today?  You want them to come in better shape, condition etc?  Have the judges to hold more credence in those categories.  Obviously it's bodybuilding so you want them to have size BUT far too many times I've seen the smaller more defined/conditioned bodybuilder get the shaft over the larger less conditioned guy....THIS NEEDS TO END.

Bodybuilders are responsible for what they present onstage for that moment BUT it is the judges who determine what is successful over the long haul. Leave the freaks for guest posing.

Quote
Oh yeah the biggest mistake ever made and Flex, Shawn, Kevin and many others agree with me is not counting the posing anymore...You excuse was it wasn't being judged the right way it was dropped...Why weren't the rules ever enforced and the judges told, "hey guys, we're going to count the judging round now on actual posing."  So for the first couple of shows when guys are getting bad placings for shitty posing they'll get the message and practice posing the way it shoud be.

Posing is an excellent way for separating physiques that are close. When two or three guys are so close, imagine how a posing routine can increase the pressure and interest in deciding the winner. A dead pan, useless most-muscular based routine would quickly be the death of a bodybuilder.

Imagine if Grimek, Arnold, Zane, Labrada etc posed, with all due respect, like Dillet, Coleman, Branch etc... If posing wasn't being judged correctly, why not just judge it correctly?
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« Reply #44 on: June 06, 2011, 10:18:19 PM »

It was the right move to eliminate scoring in the posing round.  Posing is already scored in a sense during mandatories, because it is a necessary element to displaying a physique.  The next logical move is to eliminate the night show.  Why bring everyone back a second time to see pre-judging all over again?  It's done for money, but apart from the Arnold or Olympia, there is no financial benefit from splitting the show into two parts.  The individual mandatories could include music and two minutes of free posing, so each competitor could show their unique style.  I think getting it done all in one shot really heightens the excitement. 
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« Reply #45 on: June 06, 2011, 10:50:25 PM »

Quote
The individual mandatories could include music and two minutes of free posing, so each competitor could show their unique style. I think getting it done all in one shot really heightens the excitement.

I think that this is a good idea as long as the free posing is judged and can influence the results and placings of the competitor.
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« Reply #46 on: June 06, 2011, 11:17:54 PM »

Roelly did it just to make me look bad on getbig.  Sad

Don't sweat it. I had to rub it in a little. Wink
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« Reply #47 on: June 07, 2011, 03:01:01 AM »

Is this an R rated show about what Bob saw in Room 7 by the ice machine Huh
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« Reply #48 on: June 07, 2011, 04:58:08 AM »

Bob did not disappoint !!

He was very informative, and gave us some great inside information, on how the IFBB / NpC machine actually works.
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« Reply #49 on: June 07, 2011, 07:55:09 AM »

Don't sweat it. I had to rub it in a little. Wink

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