I rest my case on Fedor. 0-3 & Losing to a Middleweight

[MindSpin]

  Why do you keep saying that he got KOd by a middleweight? What matters is lean body mass and there was no difference in lean body mass between the two of them. Going by your logic, then Akebono should have won all his MMA fights since he was close to 600 lbs which is over twice the bodyweight of the largest heavyweights. So Fedor was 18 lbs heavier than Hendo. Factor in Fedor's spare tires and love handles and Hendo's six pack, and they were roughly the same in lean body mass which is what matters. Hendo actually is leaner than Fedor at 230 lbs!!!!! Brock Lesnar was 40 lbs or so heavier than Velasquez and got TKOd by him, and yet you praised Lesnar as a great heavyweight. What do you have to say about that?

SUCKMYMUSCLE

What matters is lean body mass!?  Lol.  If that's the case, then why don't they do away with weighing and start measuring the BF%?  You've never trained in any martial arts have you?  Fedor's spare tire and love handles may actually be an advantage in his fights.  Looking like a bodybuilder i.e. lean and muscular, has NOTHING to do with how effectively you can fight   Fedor is most comfortable fighting at 220.  That's were he has the best combination of strength, speed & endurance.  Getting down to 205 could actually hinder him.  Hendo is most conformable at 205 for the same reasons. 

A good big fighter will always beat a good small fighter.  But, a more skilled small fighter can beat a less skilled bigger fighter.  Hendo is a more skilled fighter than Fedor.  What does that tell us?  That Fedor is not as skilled as everyone thought.  He got by by beating less skilled fighters (cans).  Once he was matched up with better skilled fighters (whether they are bigger or smaller than him), he was exposed...end of story.

[suckmymuscle]

What matters is lean body mass!?  Lol.  If that's the case, then why don't they do away with weighing and start measuring the BF%?  You've never trained in any martial arts have you?  Fedor's spare tire and love handles may actually be an advantage in his fights.  Looking like a bodybuilder i.e. lean and muscular, has NOTHING to do with how effectively you can fight  Fedor is most comfortable fighting at 220.  That's were he has the best combination of strength, speed & endurance.  Getting down to 205 could actually hinder him.  Hendo is most conformable at 205 for the same reasons.

 

  Listen to me, dummy. The reason why there are weight classes is because, on average, the larger a man is the more lean muscle mass he has and thus the strongest he is. Weight signifies muscle which signifies strength, and the strongest you are the harder you can punch, the easier you can throw your opponents and control them both standing and on the ground. This is why there are weight classes, since a shitty heavyweight can crush an outstanding welterweight with ease. Congo would demolish GSP without even breaking a sweat even though GSP is more skilled. Your argument that a fighter is best at the weight he is accustomed to fight is ridiculous, since going by it then BJ Penn wouldn't need to gain any weight to beat Cain Velasquez since he is at his best as a lightweight. Stupid argument

A good big fighter will always beat a good small fighter.  But, a more skilled small fighter can beat a less skilled bigger fighter.  Hendo is a more skilled fighter than Fedor.  What does that tell us?  That Fedor is not as skilled as everyone thought.  He got by by beating less skilled fighters (cans).  Once he was matched up with better skilled fighters (whether they are bigger or smaller than him), he was exposed...end of story.

  Easily countered by the fact that Fedor beat the best heavyweights in the World. The number of cans Fedor fought is irrelevant to establishing his skills since the skills of a fighter are determined by the best he's fought. Fedor could have fought nothing but cans in his career, but if he fought and beat one outstanding fighter, then this means that he is an outstanding fighter and all the cans he beats means nothing. Fedor demolished Big Nog who was good enough to destroy Couture and win the UFC heavyweight belt. Case closed. That is is his skill ceiling and not Hong Man Choi, Zuluzinho or Mikhail Apostolov.

  And if Hendo is so much better than Fedor, then why didn't he move up to heavyweight back in PRIDE and took Fedor's belt? The heavyweight class paid more money and has more prestige than middleweight, then why didn't Hendo move up, destroy Fedor and took his belt? Because he knew he would be beat.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[MindSpin]

You've obviously never trained or fought MMA. Weight does not relate to lean body mass...it's weight from everything...fat, water, muscle & bones. If it were just about lean body mass then Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler would be UFC heavyweight champs.

Large amounts of muscle are in fact a liability. The more muscle someone carries the more oxygen that they have to pump through their body.

Have you ever trained any MMA?

[asbrus]

You've obviously never trained or fought MMA. Weight does not relate to lean body mass...it's weight from everything...fat, water, muscle & bones. If it were just about lean body mass then Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler would be UFC heavyweight champs.

Large amounts of muscle are in fact a liability. The more muscle someone carries the more oxygen that they have to pump through their body.

Have you ever trained any MMA?

L0L R0NNIE AND JAY D0N'T TRAIN MMA. IF EVERYTHING IS EQUAL, THE GUY WITH M0RE LEAN MUSCLE MASS WILL ALWAYS HAVE THE ADVANTAGE.

[suckmymuscle]

You've obviously never trained or fought MMA.

  Yes I have, and I'm a heavyweight.

Weight does not relate to lean body mass...it's weight from everything...fat, water, muscle & bones.

  Actually, water and fat doesen't give you an advantage in punching power or the ability to control your opponents. Muscle does. Bigger bones means more muscle - the diameter of bones and the muscles that attach to them are related - which explains why, at the same height, a fighter with bigger bones is likely to belong to a higher weight class. So you're wrong.

If it were just about lean body mass then Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler would be UFC heavyweight champs.

  Apples and oranges. Everything else being equal skill-wise, the stronger fighter will always win except for lucky punches. Why do you think average men can beat up fit and athletic women? Because men are smaller and weaker than women? Lol.

Large amounts of muscle are in fact a liability. The more muscle someone carries the more oxygen that they have to pump through their body.

  Right. So lets get Cain to fight Franky Edgar to test your theory. The former has a lot more muscle so he should lose according to your logic...

Have you ever trained any MMA?

  What about you?

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[w8m8]

Mindspin > Sucky

in all ways

[MindSpin]

  Yes I have, and I'm a heavyweight.

  Actually, water and fat doesen't give you an advantage in punching power or the ability to control your opponents. Muscle does. Bigger bones means more muscle - the diameter of bones and the muscles that attach to them are related - which explains why, at the same height, a fighter with bigger bones is likely to belong to a higher weight class. So you're wrong.

  Apples and oranges. Everything else being equal skill-wise, the stronger fighter will always win except for lucky punches. Why do you think average men can beat up fit and athletic women? Because men are smaller and weaker than women? Lol.

  Right. So lets get Cain to fight Franky Edgar to test your theory. The former has a lot more muscle so he should lose according to your logic...

  What about you?

SUCKMYMUSCLE

You've been rambling for so long I don't even know what your ducking point is. What exactly are you arguing?

[suckmymuscle]

You've been rambling for so long I don't even know what your ducking point is. What exactly are you arguing?

  Ah, the classic MindSpin escaping through a tangent by making ad hominem invective everytime he gets owned.

SUCKMYUSCLE

[asbrus]

  Ah, the classic MindSpin escaping through a tangent by making ad hominem invective everytime he gets owned.

SUCKMYUSCLE

HENCE THE NAME MINDSPIN.

[coltrane]

HENCE THE NAME MINDSPIN.

OK Assbruise

 

[OptimusPrime1980]

L0L R0NNIE AND JAY D0N'T TRAIN MMA. IF EVERYTHING IS EQUAL, THE GUY WITH M0RE LEAN MUSCLE MASS WILL ALWAYS HAVE THE ADVANTAGE.

you are an idiot!
that is bullshit! more lean muscle mass, needs more what? all together now OXYGEN!!
all these muscular guys , gas quicker... a fact!
you need to find a balance.. and more muscle does not equal more strenght!
a fighter needs to be quick, strong and agile....
and some individuls just are chubbier then others.
when a guy looks like shit , does not mean he is not strong and does not have a gastank!

[OptimusPrime1980]

and about the age factor..
age is a number... just a number...

a fighter will have about 10 years.... some a bit more..
wear and tear... if you start at 20 you can keep going at the top of your game to about early 30's.
if you start at, 30 well you get the picture.....

after time and many fights alot of guys are just not that motivated anymore, combine that with injuries = retirement.
a healthy male reaches peak strenght at mid to late 30's and kan keep that well into his 40's.
powerlifters and strongmen are often their strongest at these ages.
what does go down a bit is speed and reflexes.
but hgh can fix that....
fedor is still a great fighter, but lost the spark! you can see it in his eyes when he comes up to fight.
in pride he had a death cold russian loonatic stare.....
now , well you all heard the f#$$cking music he used for his latest fight right? lol!

still fedor is one of the all time greats.....!

[asbrus]

you are an idiot!
that is bullshit! more lean muscle mass, needs more what? all together now OXYGEN!!
all these muscular guys , gas quicker... a fact!
you need to find a balance.. and more muscle does not equal more strenght!
a fighter needs to be quick, strong and agile....
and some individuls just are chubbier then others.
when a guy looks like shit , does not mean he is not strong and does not have a gastank!

Y0U'RE THE IDI0T N0T ME. FAT D0ES N0T EXERT ANY F0RCE. READ MY P0ST AGAIN DUMB FUCK.IF EVERYTHING ELSE BEING EQUAL.  IT'S IRRELEVANT H0W G00D S0ME0NES IS WHEN THEY'RE FAT BECAUSE THEY'LL ALWAYS BE BETTER IF THEY HAD M0RE MUSCLE MASS 0N THEM. SHIT Y0UR READING C0MPREHENSI0N IS THAT 0F A 2ND GRADER.

[coltrane]

Greater muscle mass equates to greater effort by the heart =  gassing quicker.

Fat doesn't breathe.

That's why these fat dudes out-cardio a muscular guy most of the time.   

however, it all boils down to one's cardiovascular shape.

[asbrus]

Greater muscle mass equates to greater effort by the heart =  gassing quicker.

Fat doesn't breathe.

That's why these fat dudes out-cardio a muscular guy most of the time.   

however, it all boils down to one's cardiovascular shape.

L0L

[OptimusPrime1980]

Y0U'RE THE IDI0T N0T ME. FAT D0ES N0T EXERT ANY F0RCE. READ MY P0ST AGAIN DUMB FUCK.IF EVERYTHING ELSE BEING EQUAL.  IT'S IRRELEVANT H0W G00D S0ME0NES IS WHEN THEY'RE FAT BECAUSE THEY'LL ALWAYS BE BETTER IF THEY HAD M0RE MUSCLE MASS 0N THEM. SHIT Y0UR READING C0MPREHENSI0N IS THAT 0F A 2ND GRADER.

my reading sucks??? lol you are the one who does not read properly.
how often do you train mma , have you competed as a martial artist???
my guess is no!
you are an idiot... seriously.
we have plenty of fat and chubby guys at our dojo, who do not gas and ar strong as hell!
muscle needs oxygene, fat doesnt....  when you need more oxygene = you gas faster!
and above all fighting is a lot of technique! when you're good you're good.. fat or muscular.
get it in your skull....
stick to having your boyfriend take pics of you in the bathroom.... you know shit about mma and shit about drugs.

[OptimusPrime1980]

Greater muscle mass equates to greater effort by the heart =  gassing quicker.

Fat doesn't breathe.

That's why these fat dudes out-cardio a muscular guy most of the time.   

however, it all boils down to one's cardiovascular shape.

this! x 100
look at roy nelson... dude is fat as they come.... great cardio....
mitrione also not real lean, great cardio
hell even cain is not really lean, also great cardio...
phil baroni, looks like a bb... gassen after 2 minutes.
even my fellow dutchman overeem has a tiny gas tank.

all comes down to genetics and exercise! a fat person can have great cardio!
assbruise is a moron! really dude does not know what he is talking about.

[suckmymuscle]

Greater muscle mass equates to greater effort by the heart =  gassing quicker.

  Greater muscle also means more powerful punches, more strength for throwing your opponents to the ground and greater ability to control them there. This is why a good big guy beats a good small guy 10 out of 10 times and why combat sports are separated into weight classes. Going by your logic, José Aldo should have no problem beating Shane Carwin or JDS since his heart has a lot less muscle to feed. See how stupid your argument is? Also, the bigger your muscle mass becomes, the bigger your heart also becomes, so it even outs in the end. I agree with you that, if the muscle mass proportional to the original heart size becomes too big, the heart won't grow proportionally as much and endurance will suffer, but the success of super-heavyweights over mere heavyweights, like Big Foot Siva overwheling Fedor, or Brock Lesnar demolishing the far more experienced Frank Mir, shows that the advantages of greater muscle far outweight any potential loss of endurance.

Fat doesn't breathe.

That's why these fat dudes out-cardio a muscular guy most of the time.   

however, it all boils down to one's cardiovascular shape.

  Actually, you are wrong. Fat does breathe. Human adipose tissue is enervated and must be fed just like muscle tissue. This is why extremely obese individuals experience necrosis: their hearts simply cannot feed their 1,000 lbs adipose bodies anymore, and their fat tissue thus starts to die(necrofile). But I agree with you that fat tissue does not require as much Oxygen and nutrients as muscle tissue, but the difference is that muscle tissue gives you great advantages in striking power and wrestling strength, being irrelevant only for grappling, whilst fat tissue gives you no advantage except making your bones better at absorbing shock.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[asbrus]

my reading sucks??? lol you are the one who does not read properly.
how often do you train mma , have you competed as a martial artist???
my guess is no!
you are an idiot... seriously.
we have plenty of fat and chubby guys at our dojo, who do not gas and ar strong as hell!
muscle needs oxygene, fat doesnt....  when you need more oxygene = you gas faster!
and above all fighting is a lot of technique! when you're good you're good.. fat or muscular.
get it in your skull....
stick to having your boyfriend take pics of you in the bathroom.... you know shit about mma and shit about drugs.

ACTUALLY I HAVE AND I STARTED AT 15. I WRESTLED IN HIGH SC00L AND C0LLEGE, STARTED BJJ AT 15 AN DID THAT F0R YEARS, ALS0 STRIKING. Y0U PR0VED MY P0INT THAT Y0U STILL HAVE N0 IDEA WHAT I MEANT 0R SAID. Y0U EITHER DID N0T READ 0R JUST A M0R0N. I TAKE THE LATTER.