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Author Topic: Ask A “Schmoe” Anything! (G4P / Gay For Pay)  (Read 22185 times)
YellaDawg
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« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2012, 11:56:24 AM »

Thanks Yella! Its still interesting to think about the bodybuilding lifestyle as a subculture when it seems so important to those of us within it. You've mentioned that in the 80's and 90's when bodybuilding was "big" there was more acceptance for the sport... do you think we could ever return to that way of thinking, or will it continue to shrink further into a mere niche?


I think extreme bodybuilding and the look that goes along with it is going to remain a niche for some time. Trends tend to go on a pendulum, so maybe a generation will have to go by before it goes back to be being mainstream. There are aspects of bodybuilding that are mainstreamed and that may not change much. However, the preferred, desired look for the unwashed masses is the lean. sinewy, athletic look.

Now that does not mean that there isn't good money or a career to be made in the sport of the look of extreme bodybuilding. I'd argue that a successful big bodybuilder can make more and be more visible in this niche market than the 10,000 to 100,000 of generic wannabe male models that all look the same.
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usmcdevildoc
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« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2012, 05:14:12 PM »

Guess what??  For the right price they are all G4P!!!  Sometimes these guys (the bodybuilders)  get a little desperate and will allow poor judgement to prevail. That is when they get a reputation for providing escort services.  This certainly can detract from goals set in competition, depending on  how judges feel.  For instance, with the current publicity, it is unlikely that the parents of little Johnny who views his wrestling or bodybuilding champ as a superhero, would want their son to even get involved with an athlete, or look up to an athlete, who is selling his body to make payment for his apartment and gear costs. Superhero status or not.


Now the question: Don't you think it would be more acceptable to have someone on the down low as a single sponsor dealing with an elite bodybuilder and truly helping the bber out financially. Whether they drop trou or not is their own business!! Grin
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2012, 07:20:18 PM »

Guess what??  For the right price they are all G4P!!!  Sometimes these guys (the bodybuilders)  get a little desperate and will allow poor judgement to prevail. That is when they get a reputation for providing escort services.  This certainly can detract from goals set in competition, depending on  how judges feel.  For instance, with the current publicity, it is unlikely that the parents of little Johnny who views his wrestling or bodybuilding champ as a superhero, would want their son to even get involved with an athlete, or look up to an athlete, who is selling his body to make payment for his apartment and gear costs. Superhero status or not.


Now the question: Don't you think it would be more acceptable to have someone on the down low as a single sponsor dealing with an elite bodybuilder and truly helping the bber out financially. Whether they drop trou or not is their own business!! Grin

The answer to your question is yes. The most acceptable and preferred route (for bodybuilders) is to have one discreet wealthy or connected sponsor who can meet all of that bodybuilder's needs. However, finding that is often The Holy Grail. There are far more bodybuilders who need or want sponsorship than there are legitimate sponsors and schmoes willing and able to sponsor. The laws of supply and demand come into play.

Regarding your other comment, I do not think all bodybuilders are G4P. However, a high percentage of them are, have been, or are willing to be under the right circumstances. One day, just for shits and giggles, I might go through the comprehensive list of comp BBers at MuscleMemory and count how many I know have done some form of G4P work.
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usmcdevildoc
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« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2012, 02:07:08 PM »

Hypothetical:
How many times have you been scammed by a bodybuilder 'opportunist'  preying  on your good will to promote their endeavors? What was the outcome?
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HTexan
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« Reply #29 on: July 24, 2012, 05:48:55 PM »

Hypothetical:
How many times have you been scammed by a bodybuilder 'opportunist'  preying  on your good will to promote their endeavors? What was the outcome?
You have that backwards. it is the schmoe opportunist that scam the poor bbers out of their ass virginity. That is why bber contests don't pay any real money. They never want the starving bbers to get out of the old crusty pervert hands.  Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #30 on: July 24, 2012, 07:15:47 PM »

Hypothetical:
How many times have you been scammed by a bodybuilder 'opportunist'  preying  on your good will to promote their endeavors? What was the outcome?

I've never really been scammed because I'm pretty good at what I do and as they say you can't play a player.

I've had a couple that thought they were getting over on me, but ultimately, it's not what they think, it's what I know.

One IFBB pro who never really made much of himself was constantly trying to get assistance from me without doing anything, even having the nerve to show up to my hotel with his trailer park fitness girlfriend, to use her as a buffer. Then, she (the girlfriend) had the nerve to call me when they had a show and her credit card was declined for their hotel room! I let him know that my credit wasn't free. He found a way to secure his debt with me, right away, right before his prejudging! BTW, a few years later, he was actively looking for schmoe sponsors for awhile.

Another guy who was a top NPC competitor gave me a private muscle worship show for a somewhat high-end price. It was so bad and so hands off that I never contacted him again. His career never went anywhere. Coincidence? You tell me.

Most of them, however, have been good to excellent experiences. If I think it'll turn out bad, I don't push it and I walk away. There are too many out there who will to worry about the ones who won't.
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #31 on: July 24, 2012, 07:17:34 PM »

You have that backwards. it is the schmoe opportunist that scam the poor bbers out of their ass virginity.

Why are you obsessed with men ass fucking?
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HTexan
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« Reply #32 on: July 25, 2012, 08:41:59 AM »

Why are you obsessed with men ass fucking?
Why do you paid money to rape bbers you filthy schmoe?
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #33 on: July 25, 2012, 09:00:04 AM »

Why do you paid money to rape bbers you filthy schmoe?

You can't rape the willing, Genius.
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HTexan
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« Reply #34 on: July 25, 2012, 09:15:55 AM »

You can't rape the willing, Genius.
Kept telling yourself that, you disgusting sick fuck.  Cheesy
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #35 on: July 25, 2012, 12:29:48 PM »

Kept telling yourself that, you disgusting sick fuck.  Cheesy

Without casting aspersions, and trying to answer intelligently for once, please articulate what you believe constitutes "rape" or is "disgusting, sick" about two consenting adults agreeing to a sexual act or a non-sexual act with each other?
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usmcdevildoc
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« Reply #36 on: July 25, 2012, 01:14:36 PM »

Kudos to the originator of the topic. This is important coverage of one of the sleeziest elements of the "darkside" of bodybuilding that despite folks regarding it in disbelief or a figment of someone's imagination, is alive and well and florishing. G4P is alive and well in bodybuilding.

Question: Is there much in terms of networking between bbers for sponsors? How often does the bber approach an individual for sponsorship (that is what happened to me)?
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #37 on: July 25, 2012, 01:35:44 PM »

Question: Is there much in terms of networking between bbers for sponsors? How often does the bber approach an individual for sponsorship (that is what happened to me)?

I don't know the answer to your first question, but my educated guess based on my personal experience is that most bbers aren't interesting in spreading the wealth much, and they do not want it known too much how they get their money, gear, etc. So if they find a good sponsor, they will keep him for themselves. If the sponsor asks the bber for referrals, then there could be introductions, of course for a price. I do know one BBer who would hook up this older rich schmoe with other BBers he knew, in exchange for some dough and some good gear. But I personally never experienced that.

Regarding question #2, in my personal experience, I have been approached by BBers who suspect I am helping another BBer a little too much. They just strike up a conversation and tell me how they are looking for what so-and-so has, and it looks like I have been real helpful to that BBer in his career or hi contests. Or they tell me how much they really want to get sponsored by a supplement company. One BBer asked me to review a performance contract he received from an equipment company, and it led from there. Another guy remembers me from travelling with another BBer at the Arnold Classic, saw me at another show, and started talking business, which we continued later at a restaurant after the show. It's not really rocket science.
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bboy121
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« Reply #38 on: July 26, 2012, 06:20:10 PM »

Have you ever approached a guy at your gym? And if so, what was the approach like?
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #39 on: July 26, 2012, 07:09:59 PM »

Have you ever approached a guy at your gym? And if so, what was the approach like?

I have never personally approached anyone at the gym that I did not previously know. I have, however, been introduced to bodybuilders at the gym from gym managers and gym owners. That has worked out well.
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #40 on: July 27, 2012, 06:19:31 AM »

I wanted to add some commentary about those who seem to have a real issue with men who enjoy muscle worship and have the disposable income to pay for it, if they so choose.

I travel on a regular basis and vacation in many places all over the world. I own or co-own a couple of properties that are often used as vacation places for many of my colleagues. These colleagues are both straight and gay, but most of them are straight men.

All of the straight men have shared with me that they enjoy going to exotic locales and using their money to wine and dine the hottest women and pay for dates in exchange for sexual favors from them. Many of them also have their own secret luxury apartments in US cities that they use for the same purpose. They fly in women they meet in other cities or other countries, have them stay for a while, pay the women well or give them lots of nice womanly gifts, have their way with them, and send them home.

Why do straight men with money do this? Because they can! Hell, even men with thin wallets and small budgets try to get away with it as much as they can. I recall when I was a kid, my grandmother discovering that my grandfather (who was not a wealthy man by any means) had been paying for another woman to get a Maytag washer and dryer. Somehow the bill accidentally was sent to my grandma.

Anyway, men are men -- gay or straight. Just as many straight men like to use their disposable income or influence to have fun with hot chicks, many men who like men like to do the same with hot men. This happens all over the planet and has been going on since the dawn of time. The notion of Western romantic love and marriage is a relatively new one.  
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #41 on: July 30, 2012, 08:16:31 AM »

The results for the 2012 NPC USA are in.

The competitors are posted at MD. http://pics.musculardevelopment.com/index.php?mode=contest&eventcode=1563

I counted 8 competitors in men's bodybuilding that I know have done some form of g4p.

And those are just the ones I am aware of!  Shocked
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usmcdevildoc
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« Reply #42 on: July 31, 2012, 04:36:28 AM »

The results for the 2012 NPC USA are in.

The competitors are posted at MD. http://pics.musculardevelopment.com/index.php?mode=contest&eventcode=1563

I counted 8 competitors in men's bodybuilding that I know have done some form of g4p.

And those are just the ones I am aware of!  Shocked
[/quote

Dude you are dead on!!! How do you think it feels standing there and knowing some schmoe is in the audience that blew you multiple times? How can u win a show like that if have no perception of self worth--just kick back at lib for some ass licking and blow job (maybe more) with multiple partners? Not saying it ain't an easy way to make money, but unless you got just one sponsor who becomes a friend and repository, the multiple partner escort thing would give me a really poor self image. That has to have some impact on one's winning! I think it better to have one sponsor if the guy can handle the financial obligation of support.
Once your obligation financially is completed, how many of
these guys end up on your doorstep again looking for a handout ??  It
is a rough world out there financially. After your support and a none win, how many recognize what a good thing they had and approach again and again.
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #43 on: July 31, 2012, 04:46:32 AM »


Dude you are dead on!!! How do you think it feels standing there and knowing some schmoe is in the audience that blew you multiple times? How can u win a show like that if have no perception of self worth--just kick back at lib for some ass licking and blow job (maybe more) with multiple partners? Not saying it ain't an easy way to make money, but unless you got just one sponsor who becomes a friend and repository, the multiple partner escort thing would give me a really poor self image. That has to have some impact on one's winning! I think it better to have one sponsor if the guy can handle the financial obligation of support.
Once your obligation financially is completed, how many of
these guys end up on your doorstep again looking for a handout ??  It
is a rough world out there financially. After your support and a none win, how many recognize what a good thing they had and approach again and again.

Well, at least one of the competitors who earned their pro card at the USA this past weekend has done g4p in the past. I suspect he moved very quickly into the "just one rich discreet sponsor" category.
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yngclassic98
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« Reply #44 on: July 31, 2012, 03:08:06 PM »

The results for the 2012 NPC USA are in.

The competitors are posted at MD. http://pics.musculardevelopment.com/index.php?mode=contest&eventcode=1563

I counted 8 competitors in men's bodybuilding that I know have done some form of g4p.

And those are just the ones I am aware of!  Shocked
[/quote

Dude you are dead on!!! How do you think it feels standing there and knowing some schmoe is in the audience that blew you multiple times? How can u win a show like that if have no perception of self worth--just kick back at lib for some ass licking and blow job (maybe more) with multiple partners? Not saying it ain't an easy way to make money, but unless you got just one sponsor who becomes a friend and repository, the multiple partner escort thing would give me a really poor self image. That has to have some impact on one's winning! I think it better to have one sponsor if the guy can handle the financial obligation of support.
Once your obligation financially is completed, how many of
these guys end up on your doorstep again looking for a handout ??  It
is a rough world out there financially. After your support and a none win, how many recognize what a good thing they had and approach again and again.

In all fairness, we don't know who is doing what (or who) behind closed doors. We ALL have to use our best judgement with the decisions that we make. Financially, we have be responsible for those decisions, and recognize that they just might come back to bite us in the butt. For some people, that bite comes in the form of guilt or shame, but for some, it doesn't matter one way or another. When we look at these guys on stage who pick up their pro cards or what have you, did they train any less or sacrifice any less for their status? Sponsors help to make the dream happen, but these guys still have to work hard to shape their bodies into the form that we are all so obsessed with. I would imagine that if you're posing on stage and your "schmoe" is in the audience watching, you can either smile and wink in acknowledgement for him helping you, or you can turn red with shame as if you saw your one-night stand in the grocery store. I can definitely see how you could get a poor self image, but as with any decision, own what you did and move on.

Meanwhile, I'm sure Yella could share that these sponsors have a good idea of what they are doing and that they know how to control a situation. 
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #45 on: July 31, 2012, 06:23:00 PM »

Shame and guilt are oppressive feelings with no meaningful, positive purpose.
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usmcdevildoc
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« Reply #46 on: August 01, 2012, 01:53:15 PM »

There is no question in my mind that KNOWN bodybuilders who have been known to participate in G4P or porn are jeapordizing their careers in terms of a glass ceiling on how well they place in competition. What is your feeling? An example would be several of the weight classes at USA.
And yes you were right about the number of G4P on stage!! Care to compare notes?  I think this again
stress the need for 1 wealthy supportive person who can keep his mouth shut.
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Beefjake
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« Reply #47 on: August 01, 2012, 02:50:09 PM »

Do you think that this kind of behavior is easier because in BB your body is your craft so to speak?

I mean in sports and in BB especially your back hurts. Not, you hurt in your back. Or your operated
knee doesn't co-operate with you or I'll manage with my poor metabolism and so forth.

You tend to separate your self from your body.

I mean I would wager that lot's of these sponsored BB's do not consider themselves gay
even though their actions say other. What would you say?

Could there even be female sponsors? Even a typical non physical dad fucks the hell out of
his neighbors wife when given a chance. And if you are on gear that would be 20xfold.

I don't even wan't to imagine how much this sponsoring happens in the female side
of fitness industry. Everything works the same but without public pressure, or very much less of it anyway..

Conversations sake I'll hope you find a question or two in there!
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #48 on: August 02, 2012, 04:06:23 AM »

There is no question in my mind that KNOWN bodybuilders who have been known to participate in G4P or porn are jeapordizing their careers in terms of a glass ceiling on how well they place in competition. What is your feeling? An example would be several of the weight classes at USA.
And yes you were right about the number of G4P on stage!! Care to compare notes?  I think this again
stress the need for 1 wealthy supportive person who can keep his mouth shut.

I think it really depends on the public level of G4P that the bodybuilder participates in, in inverse relation to the quality of the bodybuilder's condition, that determines the effect on his placings. In other words, if he is discreet (like most are and want to be), the publicly known G4P activity is not too "dirty" (for example, just nude solo photos versus out-and-out sexual intercourse on film or being a publicly advertised escort), and/or the publicity from the G4P activity is minimal, AND the BBer is at the top of his craft, then the effect on placings is minimal. It really only affects the ones who are at the margins and reasons can be found by judges to place them lower than others.

I'm looking at the current USA placings and not seeing much effect at all on the G4P activity. In fact, it could well be argued that the ones who I know did G4P actually placed HIGHER than the ones who didn't -- with one even turning pro. So, perhaps it's an advantage in the sport!

Regarding "comparing notes" on who does what, I'm really not into "outing" people without their permission. Unless they have done something to out themselves publicly, then it's fair game. Plus, as an active sponsor / "schmoe", discretion has always helped me succeed in my hobby and I would like to keep it that way. I would not have gotten as far as I have in this field in the last 20 years without being able to keep my mouth shut. Not to say I would NEVER discuss certain things with others, but my question is always, "what's in for me if I do?" But if you want to PM me and go for it, then feel free.

Re: bodybuilders finding one wealthy discreet sponsor, yes, that's the goal and the Holy Grail. Like I said before, there are FAR more BBers who want "sponsorship" (whether private or corporate) than there are rich benefactors who are ready and willing to sponsor them.
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YellaDawg
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« Reply #49 on: August 02, 2012, 04:29:32 AM »

Do you think that this kind of behavior is easier because in BB your body is your craft so to speak?

I mean in sports and in BB especially your back hurts. Not, you hurt in your back. Or your operated
knee doesn't co-operate with you or I'll manage with my poor metabolism and so forth.

You tend to separate your self from your body.

I mean I would wager that lot's of these sponsored BB's do not consider themselves gay
even though their actions say other. What would you say?

Could there even be female sponsors? Even a typical non physical dad fucks the hell out of
his neighbors wife when given a chance. And if you are on gear that would be 20xfold.

I don't even wan't to imagine how much this sponsoring happens in the female side
of fitness industry. Everything works the same but without public pressure, or very much less of it anyway..

Conversations sake I'll hope you find a question or two in there!


To answer your questions:

I think it is easier in BBing because it's an activity that is highly homoerotic, the physique is your only marketing tool, the sport has always had a large gay element and support to it, and although not expensive at the low-end (if one just wants to work out and lift weights), it is much more expensive at the middle to top range and very "bottle-necked" when it comes to competitions, fortune and fame.

Regarding who considers themselves gay and who doesn't, very few of them do. As I said before, activities like this occur between men all over the world and they are not defined as "gay". "Gay" is mostly a modern Western world cultural concept. For some bodybuilders who do some G4P activities, it's a quick, easy buck. For others, it's a big turn-on to have hot photos or to be worshipped by an admirer. For others, it's a marketing tool. For others, they just may like it. For others, it's no big deal whatsoever and means absolutely nothing. There are a number of reasons any bodybuilder might be interested.

Regarding female sponsors and schmoes, there may be a few, but it's going to be far, FAR less than the male sponsors. Maybe 1-2% at the most. Yes, the female BBing world (as well as the female fitness modeling world) is overrun with male schmoes who spend money, and they are much more open about it on that side of the field. I'm not into female bodybuilding or female fitness modeling at all, so I can't comment much about it more than that. So if you want to generate a discussion about that, you'll have to get your answers somewhere else. This is about G4P in men's bodybuilding.
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