Fibromyalgia

[calfzilla]

and your point ?

It's all in their head.

[Necrosis]

Just a little odd I never see any healthy well adjusted people with fibro.

I have.

However, it has a component of mental illness such as anxiety or depression, insomnia is often linked as well.

It is simply an aggregate of symptoms that occurs in a reliable pattern like IBS.

[Parker]

It's definitely not made up. I see several people with fibromyalgia who are in real pain, have reproducible trigger points. 11 out of 18 of the points is needed, I see those with 18 at times. They also have a familial history of the disorder. I do think it is poorly classified as with all syndromes and even functional diseases like IBS, but it exists. The lack of any clear etiology really makes the pattern which may be several disease processes look suspect.

I know of several women with it, and all are "looped" in the head. I believe that it is real, but they always talked like this, "the air conditioning was on and it caused my Fibromyalgia to start acting up", and everybody goes "awww"
And it's odd, that everything that goes wrong in their lives, it's somebody else's fault, or out of their control...and they just "happened" to be diagnosed with this...

I wish that there was a male exclusive counterpart, like Blue Testicle Disease, and we could get instant sympathy and a quick "release".

[Donny]

It's all in their head.

thank you for sharing your illness and being so open

[Necrosis]

I know of several women with it, and all are "looped" in the head. I believe that it is real, but they always talked like this, "the air conditioning was on and it caused my Fibromyalgia to start acting up", and everybody goes "awww"
And it's odd, that everything that goes wrong in their lives, it's somebody else's fault, or out of their control...and they just "happened" to be diagnosed with this...

I wish that there was a male exclusive counterpart, like Blue Testicle Disease, and we could get instant sympathy and a quick "release".

Men do have it, woman in general are more susceptible to immune mediated illnesses (if it is even immune mediated) like MS, lupus etc.

[Parker]

Men do have it, woman in general are more susceptible to immune mediated illnesses (if it is even immune mediated) like MS, lupus etc.

yeah, I was just being facetious.

[abijahmaniaco]

thank you for sharing your illness and being so open

translation: my wife pretends to have it and i pretend with her.

[calfzilla]

I know of several women with it, and all are "looped" in the head. I believe that it is real, but they always talked like this, "the air conditioning was on and it caused my Fibromyalgia to start acting up", and everybody goes "awww"
And it's odd, that everything that goes wrong in their lives, it's somebody else's fault, or out of their control...and they just "happened" to be diagnosed with this...

I wish that there was a male exclusive counterpart, like Blue Testicle Disease, and we could get instant sympathy and a quick "release".

Spot on post Parker, well said. Not sure why "Donny" is being so sympathetic to these scumbags but to each their own.

[jude2]

Just a little odd I never see any healthy well adjusted people with fibro.

I have seen a few, but not common.

[dustin]

There's a lot that we don't know about inflammatory diseases. I think being riddled with this for years on end just makes it worse psychologically too. I've seen people with it who handle it gracefully and others who bitch and make it seem worse than it is, and that probably does make it worse in the end for them.

Don't let a few whiners make you think it's a fabrication. People try playing it like a victim and it's real easy to get sick of their shit. I have chronic migraines and if I'm a whiny bitch, they seem to last a lot longer and become more painful. But if I motor through them and keep a positive attitude, it makes a real big difference. Definitely not faking it either. You can see the veins pulsing and throbbing like crazy when I get a bad string of them. Best thing to do is sleep it off if that happens. Bitching about whining about it only makes it worse!

[oldtimer1]

Migraines are real. Who would deny that? I believe fibromyalgia is real and probably related to a nerve problem but so many who complain about this are full of it. Where were the the victims of this affliction 30 years ago? There weren't any. Now every other woman has it.

[abijahmaniaco]

Migraines are real. Who would deny that?

i would. i've never had one.

[dustin]

i would. i've never had one.

The pain can become so brutal that you nearly faint. Hypoglycemia and nausea can go with it, same with photo- and stereophobia, making one of the only options to curl up in a dark room and pray for sleep.

I finally discovered triptan medications and they can abort a migraine with no side effects. They cost like $25 per pill in some cases but my coverage takes care of it now. First prescription I filled was $1000, but now they make generics.

[NordicNerd]

It's definitely not made up. I see several people with fibromyalgia who are in real pain, have reproducible trigger points. 11 out of 18 of the points is needed, I see those with 18 at times. They also have a familial history of the disorder. I do think it is poorly classified as with all syndromes and even functional diseases like IBS, but it exists. The lack of any clear etiology really makes the pattern which may be several disease processes look suspect.

They have real pain, but it is a sensitization phenomenon. In other words- the pain is mostly in the mind- not directly related to peripheral neural pain signals.

Another point: In Norway, the disease got really big when the "Fibromyalgia organization" started handing out leaflets and such, describing the symptoms. People then knew what to tell their doctor to get the diagnosis.

NN

[MAXX]

white trash fake disease so they can live on health insurance.

[slate]

They have real pain, but it is a sensitization phenomenon. In other words- the pain is mostly in the mind- not directly related to peripheral neural pain signals.

Another point: In Norway, the disease got really big when the "Fibromyalgia organization" started handing out leaflets and such, describing the symptoms. People then knew what to tell their doctor to get the diagnosis.

NN

what a tool you are

so you think that there is a peripheral nervous system (PNS) and a central nervous system (CNS) and they are totally independent 

there is one nervous system fukwitt -and it works as a single system with all kinds of feedbacks that no one knows anything about

yes peripheral neurons are different from neurons that are wholly in the spine's dorsal horn, both are different from neurons who mediate (in both directions) between dorsal horn and the brain, which again are different from neurons wholly located in the brain

[abijahmaniaco]

The pain can become so brutal that you nearly faint. Hypoglycemia and nausea can go with it, same with photo- and stereophobia, making one of the only options to curl up in a dark room and pray for sleep.

I finally discovered triptan medications and they can abort a migraine with no side effects. They cost like $25 per pill in some cases but my coverage takes care of it now. First prescription I filled was $1000, but now they make generics.

cool story, but what's this have to do with fibromyalgia?

[dustin]

cool story, but what's this have to do with fibromyalgia?

It's another inflammation-related disease that involves neurological pain, something which is very misunderstood and vague. There are also a lot of people who claim to have these issues and don't, which leads a lot of people to write the diseases off completely.

[NordicNerd]

what a tool you are

so you think that there is a peripheral nervous system (PNS) and a central nervous system (CNS) and they are totally independent  

there is one nervous system fukwitt -and it works as a single system with all kinds of feedbacks that no one knows anything about

yes peripheral neurons are different from neurons that are wholly in the spine's dorsal horn, both are different from neurons who mediate (in both directions) between dorsal horn and the brain, which again are different from neurons wholly located in the brain

Cool it- you don't seem to know much about the nervous system at all.

We are gradually getting to know more about pain, and attentional mechanisms are very important in mediating pain sensation. Take a look at this paper for a review paper about pain sensitization, the phenomenon I was talking about:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0304395910005841


NN

[slate]

Cool it- you don't seem to know much about the nervous system at all.

We are gradually getting to know more about pain, and attentional mechanisms are very important in mediating pain sensation. Take a look at this paper for a review paper about pain sensitization, the phenomenon I was talking about:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0304395910005841

NN

I have read my share of Woolf review papers

He has been writing the same stuff for years siting on his fat harvard chair, doing no research.
 Look at the actual research papers, not the review papers and then think.

It is clear that no one really knows  how chronic pain develops and maintains itself. The system is so complex and so full of opportunities for feedback effects that almost certainly there will be different types of molecular mechanisms underlying different types of pathologies

Separating the nervous system into PNS and CNS is an anatomical simplification from the past which has outlived its usefulness beyond the introductory level, when you think at the molecular level and understand that the nervous system is fully bidirectional and acts as a loop (or several loops). It is not about a PNS nerve ending in say your skin, sending an electrical impulse up to brain neurons via the dorsal horn, as u know

Intra cellular signalling (both molecular and 'electrical') in neurons is bidirectional. What goes on in the dorsal horn end of a PNS neuron can change the activity of the other end of the PNS neuron that terminates in a muscle, organ etc, and what goes on in that dorsal horn end depends on what is coming down from the brain, which depends on what is coming up to the brain from the dorsal horn etc etc

the problem is that there is no way to currently understand the system as a whole. nobody even knows how long term potentiation between 2 neurons is maintained

anyway now that i wrote this shit i am wondering i did i bother

[NordicNerd]

...
Separating the nervous system into PNS and CNS is an anatomical simplification from the past which has outlived its usefulness beyond the introductory level, when you think at the molecular level and understand that the nervous system is fully bidirectional and acts as a loop (or several loops). It is not about a PNS nerve ending in say your skin, sending an electrical impulse up to brain neurons via the dorsal horn, as u know

Intra cellular signalling (both molecular and 'electrical') in neurons is bidirectional. What goes on in the dorsal horn end of a PNS neuron can change the activity of the other end of the PNS neuron that terminates in a muscle, organ etc, and what goes on in that dorsal horn end depends on what is coming down from the brain, which depends on what is coming up to the brain from the dorsal horn etc etc

the problem is that there is no way to currently understand the system as a whole. nobody even knows how long term potentiation between 2 neurons is maintained

anyway now that i wrote this shit i am wondering i did i bother

No, I get your point and I appreciate that you wrote this, hence I understand why you were critical. I intentionally tried to make a simple point with regard to Fibromyalgia, but of course it was an oversimplification. Nevertheless, I have worked with several manual therapists, such as chiropractors, who have been very naive about how the brain/mind can moderate and mediate pain perception. Some believe there is a 1-to-1 relationship between mechanical damage and pain.

NN

[Necrosis]

They have real pain, but it is a sensitization phenomenon. In other words- the pain is mostly in the mind- not directly related to peripheral neural pain signals.

Another point: In Norway, the disease got really big when the "Fibromyalgia organization" started handing out leaflets and such, describing the symptoms. People then knew what to tell their doctor to get the diagnosis.

NN

what you have just said is contradictory. Nerve pain is not in your head, it is not psychosomatic as the etiology is not mental. A similar mechanism occurs in migraines, tension headaches, would you suggest that is all in their heads?

It's not in their mind in any form or fashion. It's real pain caused by some CNS mediated disease.

[dustin]

Damn, Necro. What is your day job? You know your shit!

[Kolchak]

Yup, 'made up' disease which cannot be diagnosed objectively and relies on the veracity of the patient.  It's a favorite diagnosis of chiropractors.

[NordicNerd]

what you have just said is contradictory. Nerve pain is not in your head, it is not psychosomatic as the etiology is not mental. A similar mechanism occurs in migraines, tension headaches, would you suggest that is all in their heads?

It's not in their mind in any form or fashion. It's real pain caused by some CNS mediated disease.

The evidence indicates that there is a strong behavioral/mental component in Fibromyalgia. Of course "mental" is a poor term, as everything "mental" is mediated by the body/ nervous system.

But Fibromyalgia is not caused by muscular pathology in any direct fashion. As Slate said, my description originally is too simplistic, as there are two-way mechanisms at all levels in the nervous system, but Fibromyalgia happens mostly  to women in their 40s or older, doing low-paid, manual work and who are usually depressed/dysthymic.

This fact, combined with the lack of consistent, verifiable muscular causes, leads me and many others to believe that the "disease" to a some part is a construction. The pain is real, but it a very complex condition that is not easy to treat.

NN