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Author Topic: Karatbars are an overpriced way to buy gold  (Read 26791 times)
Cholo4Life
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« Reply #25 on: June 18, 2013, 10:27:55 AM »

I have done the math, in many other threads. And the math proves that Karatbars are a bad investment purely because of the storage volume required compared to traditional gold form factors. Let's review:

Assuming a gold bar is roughly the size of a credit card, it's dimensions are 85.60mm * 53.98mm * 0.76mm, giving us a volume of approximately 3.51cm3 per gram of gold. You need approximately 31 such card for one troy ounce of gold, occupying a volume of 108.8cm3.

Compare that to a single 1oz Canadian golden maple leaf coin, which has a diameter of 33mm and a height of 2.79mm, giving us a total volume of 1.972cm3.

In other words, purely as a function of the amount of storage required, you can fit 50 times more gold in the same space by buying 1oz Canadian maple leafs.

Now I've also done some more math which shows that Karatbars (and, this holds for any scheme that involves buying super-small quantities of anything with an end goal of accumulation, not just this particular scheme) is simply stupid. Let's go over that math together:

Right now the karatbars website says that a 1 gram can be purchased for €51.12. If we assume that one troy ounce of gold is exactly 31 grams (it's more, but what's a small amount of gold between friends?) then right now, I can buy an ounce of gold by getting 31 Karatbars. It will cost me 31 * 51.12 = €1584.72.

Let's look how much it would cost me to buy a 1 oz.  Canadian Maple from my friends at APMEX: €1050.28.

Well shit... that's €534.44 less expensive. I other words buying a 1oz Maple is 66% cheaper than buying 31 1 gram Karatbars and taping them together to make a 1 oz Super-gold bar. Or, to put it another way, I can buy 3 1 oz Canadian Maple Leafs (for a total of three ounces of gold) for less money than it would cost me to buy 2 ounces of gold in 1 gram Karatbars.

Now, I'm not mathematician (no... wait... I am!) but the numbers speak very loudly and very clearly.

Now consider the simple fact that the Maple Leaf is a whole lot more liquid than a gold bar, a fact that I verified by calling 8 local places (I am in Las Vegas) all of which were familiar with Maple Leaf coins and were willing to pay me cash, on the spot, for them but none of which were familiar with karatbars and none were willing to pay me cash, on the spot, for Karatbars. Only one was willing to buy the Karatbars but said he would have to do research and would only pay after the gold content was verified.

So with all that said and done I'm curious about one thing...

Why would anyone buy 2 ounces of gold in a proprietary, hard to convert into cash form-factor that requires a boatload of space, when, for the same amount, they could buy three ounces in a much smaller package that they could convert into cash just about anywhere and at anytime?

Quality post.
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Archer77
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« Reply #26 on: June 18, 2013, 10:56:08 AM »

Why would anybody buy gold?  As an outsider the whole gold market looks like a self inflated circular pool of buyers and sellers.  If the world fell into chaos gold would be worthless to the average person as I imagine a barter system would be the first kind of market to emerge in a crisis
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« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2013, 06:19:57 AM »

Quality post.

Actually Cholo, it is quite misleading. You cannot compare gold sized in gram weights with gold in ounce weights and expect a comparable price. Gold simply isn't priced that way. There will ALWAYS be a slightly higher premium on smaller weights because they are more labour intensive, and therefore more expensive to make.

In addition, he is comparing 2 different asset classes.

One truly needs to compare 999.9 pure 24KT LBMA GDL gram weight gold with others in the SAME asset class.

Canadian Maples are not in the same asset class as Karatbars, ...and are neither as flexible, nor considered as valuable.
They also do not come with as many benefits of ownership as Karatbars.

Now that the Fed has dumped even more paper on the market to shake out the weak hands, scare the ignorant, facilitate central bank acquisitions of physical, and push the price slightly below that of production... it's gonna get real interesting to witness the shortages that will abound, ...and the premiums other suppliers will start attaching. De-coupling of paper & physical is just around the corner... I think  Cheesy

Bottom line, ...if one doesn't see the value in Karatbars, ...there's no law that says you have to acquire them.

It's like any other vehicle... I could have gotten 2 or possibly 3 vehicles for the price I paid for my BMW, but none would have been as durable, dependable or as valuable... There's no law that says one has to have filet mignon with every meal if your budget will only allow for hamburger meat twice a month.  Fortunately for myself and many others, we are able to leverage the system to magnify and accelerate our acquisition of Karatbars with no out-of-pocket costs. For me, getting my gold through the system, at no cost to myself is far more preferable to running around trying to find the best "just over spot" dealer to buy a lesser quality asset class out of my own pocket, ...but to each his/her own.
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« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2013, 06:59:49 AM »

Why would anybody buy gold?  As an outsider the whole gold market looks like a self inflated circular pool of buyers and sellers.  If the world fell into chaos gold would be worthless to the average person as I imagine a barter system would be the first kind of market to emerge in a crisis

Why  would anybody buy gold?  ...I suppose for the same reason why men buy shirts over a dry cleaners claim ticket. Gold is the real thing while FRN's were just a claim ticket to gold. A claim ticket that since 1971 has lost it's redeemability.

Gold will never be worthless. ...and can be easily exchanged into whatever currency one prefers worldwide.

People buy gold as a form of financial insurance, and as a store of generational wealth.

IMO, physical gold is a form of money best used for long term savings.

It's not about the world falling into chaos, it is about preserving and defending the value and purchasing power of our labour from the all out attack by the Fed and their policies. The derivatives bubble will come crashing down, and with it, everything else held in paper.

Barter is only used when people have no money to exchange for goods or services,

Gold is the money of Kings & Queens
Silver is the money of Aristocracy
Barter is the money of peasants
Debt is the money of slaves

"He who has gold, will always have money" ~ Alan Greenspan - Fmr. Fed Chair

"In the absence of gold, there is no way to protect yourself from confiscation via inflation" - Alan Greenspan
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« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2013, 08:31:48 AM »

Gold is the money of Kings & Queens
Silver is the money of Aristocracy
Barter is the money of peasants
Debt is the money of slaves

hahahahahahaha oh, brother  Roll Eyes

I guess that is partly true.  The Queen of Spam and her tired cash for gold scheme cluttering up cyberspace yet again.

"Miss Black Ontario"  hahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahaha
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« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2013, 02:36:49 PM »

I didn't start this thread, ...but you're right about one thing, ...I am a Queen!
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« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2013, 05:55:22 PM »

Actually Cholo, it is quite misleading. You cannot compare gold sized in gram weights with gold in ounce weights and expect a comparable price. Gold simply isn't priced that way. There will ALWAYS be a slightly higher premium on smaller weights because they are more labour intensive, and therefore more expensive to make.

Right, so why buy anything in smaller weights? If you really value gold (as you claim you do) as a store of value then you should want to get the most gold for your fiat-buck. Right? Except you don't - you peddle this "buy gold by the gram" nonsense and you admit that doing so will cause you to buy gold at a higher price. How does that make ANY sense?


Canadian Maples are not in the same asset class as Karatbars, ...and are neither as flexible, nor considered as valuable.

What does "considered as valuable" means? The gold content of a maple is fixed - a on troy ounce coin contains exactly one troy ounce of gold, and the metal is refined to 999.9 millesimal fineness. Exactly like a "gold bar".

As for "flexible" I call bullshit. I can walk into over half a dozen stores within 10 minutes driving distance and exchange them for fiat money (which I can actually use to buy stuff) on the spot. I already told you that I cannot do this with Karatbars. I have to follow some ridiculous process and rely on your promises that any day now, I'll be able to carry my Karatbars and pay for the stuff that I want by trading them to someone else (I probably won't be able to get change back in Karatbars though).


They also do not come with as many benefits of ownership as Karatbars.

Name one tangible, actual, practical benefit.


Now that the Fed has dumped even more paper on the market to shake out the weak hands, scare the ignorant, facilitate central bank acquisitions of physical, and push the price slightly below that of production... it's gonna get real interesting to witness the shortages that will abound, ...and the premiums other suppliers will start attaching. De-coupling of paper & physical is just around the corner... I think  Cheesy

Huh? Huh

But let's assume all that nonsense is true, and it magically means that gold will become super-duper valuable. If that's the case, why shouldn't I want to get as many ounces of gold today so what when whatever you "described" (I use the term loosely) above happens, I have the most gold I could possibly want?


It's like any other vehicle... I could have gotten 2 or possibly 3 vehicles for the price I paid for my BMW, but none would have been as durable, dependable or as valuable...

The thing is, though, you bought a BMW. You didn't buy tiny parts of a BMW encased in plastic, did you?


Fortunately for myself and many others, we are able to leverage the system to magnify and accelerate our acquisition of Karatbars with no out-of-pocket costs. For me, getting my gold through the system, at no cost to myself is far more preferable to running around trying to find the best "just over spot" dealer to buy a lesser quality asset class out of my own pocket, ...but to each his/her own.

Enough with this lie of yours. You aren't getting gold for free from Karatbars or anywhere else. If you were, that would suggest that the actual value of the asset you claim is so valuable is exactly zero. So either you're doing one of three things:

  • participating in a pyramid scheme and when you drag others in, you get a small cut; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that you are getting gold for free; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that gold has intrinsic value.

So which is it?
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Chadwick The Beta
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« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2013, 06:02:26 PM »

So either you're doing one of three things:

  • participating in a pyramid scheme and when you drag others in, you get a small cut; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that you are getting gold for free; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that gold has intrinsic value.

So which is it?

All three. 

She is the biggest joke on getbig with the exception of Will Grant.
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« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2013, 06:05:17 PM »

Gold will never be worthless. ...and can be easily exchanged into whatever currency one prefers worldwide.

And yet, somehow, you claim to get this commodity that you assert is not and will never be worthless for free.
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pedro01
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« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2013, 08:03:26 PM »

Actually Cholo, it is quite misleading. You cannot compare gold sized in gram weights with gold in ounce weights and expect a comparable price. Gold simply isn't priced that way. There will ALWAYS be a slightly higher premium on smaller weights because they are more labour intensive, and therefore more expensive to make.

In addition, he is comparing 2 different asset classes.

One truly needs to compare 999.9 pure 24KT LBMA GDL gram weight gold with others in the SAME asset class.

Canadian Maples are not in the same asset class as Karatbars, ...and are neither as flexible, nor considered as valuable.
They also do not come with as many benefits of ownership as Karatbars.

Now that the Fed has dumped even more paper on the market to shake out the weak hands, scare the ignorant, facilitate central bank acquisitions of physical, and push the price slightly below that of production... it's gonna get real interesting to witness the shortages that will abound, ...and the premiums other suppliers will start attaching. De-coupling of paper & physical is just around the corner... I think  Cheesy

Bottom line, ...if one doesn't see the value in Karatbars, ...there's no law that says you have to acquire them.

It's like any other vehicle... I could have gotten 2 or possibly 3 vehicles for the price I paid for my BMW, but none would have been as durable, dependable or as valuable... There's no law that says one has to have filet mignon with every meal if your budget will only allow for hamburger meat twice a month.  Fortunately for myself and many others, we are able to leverage the system to magnify and accelerate our acquisition of Karatbars with no out-of-pocket costs. For me, getting my gold through the system, at no cost to myself is far more preferable to running around trying to find the best "just over spot" dealer to buy a lesser quality asset class out of my own pocket, ...but to each his/her own.

BMWs, Filet Mignon are well known names where the quality of the product determines the price. Gold is determined by purity. At any purity, Gold is Gold and has an agreed value by weight that is what makes it a potential currency. A Gold trader will have a bid and an offer price OR a buy and a sell price. They will also have a spread between the buy and sell price which is effectively his profit margin. This is the Gold market - whether it be futures or physical product. Every Gold shop in Thailand has 2 prices displayed prominently in the window which changes each day (and sometimes during the day). Those are the prices they buy physical Gold and the prices they sell it. This is fixed regardless of the amount brought or sold. There is no 30% uplift for small quantities.

Saying that embedding Gold in plastic increases the value of the Gold by 30% is ludicrous. If that were the case, we should all go out & buy plastic.

No-one gives Gold away for free. The only way an MLM scheme is able to give YOU gold for free is to sell SOMEONE ELSE gold and an inflated price. The fact you keep going on about "free Gold" simply proves the point beyond doubt that others are paying way over market price for which you should be fucking ashamed of yourself.

Were the shit to hit the fan, gold bar owners would not be able to use that Gold as currency without removing all the crap from around the Gold so that it could be weighed and verified. Remember - this would not be a world where everyone trusts each other. All that plastic crap around the Gold makes it less portable, hard to break up and more cumbersome. Karatbars are much LESS flexible than the metal itself.

All of the arguments you put forward here are given to you from MLM HQ. They exist to fool the gullible.

For example, the argument that Karatbars are 'spendable' - have you tried using them in WalMart? I live in a nation where Gold IS closer to being accepted as a currency as anywhere else ont he planet. Many people here have savings in both Gold and cash and it is quite normal to cash in some Gold to make a major purchase. You still cannot use Gold to buy a tank of Gas, there's too much chance of fraud/theft there - a gas pump attendant cannot really be expected to know fake from real. The same applies to a gold bar - could also be fake or real. Still - you come to Thailand and walk into a Gold shop with your gold bar and they will laugh you out of the shop. If they did entertain you, they would need to remove the Gold from the surrounding plastic in order to verify it.

In short, Gold is traded in a certain way and that way is not to cut it into tiny pieces, cover it in plastic, sell it at a 30% mark-up to the gullible and then share that money with your "upline".
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pedro01
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« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2013, 08:11:51 PM »

Anyone that wants to read 24KTs replies to my posts before he/she posts them can look here:

http://www.regularsaving.com/gold/karatbars-saving-gold-investments/

Because all 24KT does is regurgitate arguments sent down through the upline.

Look familiar?Huh

Quote
Comparing Apples to Apples NOT Apples to Pears
The first thing to look at when comparing prices of any commodity is the understanding that you must do an ‘apples to apples’ comparison.

For example, if you are going to buy a pint of milk you should do the price comparison against other suppliers of the exact same grade single pints of milk to find out which offers the very best value for money

What you don’t do is find the best price for a gallon of milk which, for the sake of discussion let’s say it is £4.00, and then divide it by 8 pints, which works out at 50p per pint, and then compare that price to buying a single pint of milk. We all understand what it means to buy in bulk and, the more you buy, the cheaper the price becomes. As with any product, there are what is commonly called volume discounts. The reason that ounce-for-ounce bulk prices of gold are less is very simple; there is more labour and other costs involved in producing several smaller units verses producing one single larger unit.

Following on with the milk analogy, let’s take a look at Tescos Fresh Milk Prices. To make a true price comparison, you would need to compare the exact same brand and type of milk and you will quickly see that buying in bulk offers a substantial saving as opposed to buying single pints.

It is exactly the same when buying gold. Karatbars really are the Crème de la Crème when it comes to buying gold bullion, and especially as they come in easily-manageable, transaction-friendly, small weight 0.5g, 1g and 5g denominations. In these uncertain economic times it makes far more sense to own a selection of half a gram, one gram and five gram cards as opposed to a single one ounce bar; imaging going into a shop and trying to change up £1,000 note to buy your groceries – that is exactly what it would be like if you tried to change up a one ounce bar of gold. Even though the ounce of gold may be effectively lower in price, it doesn’t give you the same convenience and flexibility that owning small weight denominations does.

There are roughly 31.1 grams per troy ounce of gold. So, to get an accurate ‘like for like’ price comparison for Karatbars gold bullion cards (not taking into consideration all of the other many great benefits that owning flexible transaction-friendly gold bar gold cards provides), you should Not take the spot price for an ounce of gold and then simply divide it by 31.1. Nor should you take the price of 1 gram of gold and multiply it by 31.1. You must price Karatbars gold bullion by the gram, against other gold of the exact same quality, by the gram.
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avxo
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« Reply #36 on: June 22, 2013, 10:49:23 PM »

Anyone that wants to read 24KTs replies to my posts before he/she posts them can look here:

http://www.regularsaving.com/gold/karatbars-saving-gold-investments/

Because all 24KT does is regurgitate arguments sent down through the upline.

Look familiar?Huh


Haha, awesome. Good job tracking that down. It doesn't prove anything we didn't already know. It was obvious she is clueless and copy-pasting the bullshit she peddles from somewhere else; the signs were always there and the whole "our gold is 999.9% pure!" bullshit she kept peddling on here along with the shit youtube "presentations" (in Comic Sans font and narrated by people with speech impediments talking into an old-timey microphone) were just the icing on the cake.

I'll repeat what I said in response to a comment by her that she's helping people with their investment needs: I feel sorry for anyone who chooses to hand a single cent to this snake-oil peddler and who relies on her advice about anything even remotely related to investing.
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syntaxmachine
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« Reply #37 on: June 23, 2013, 01:49:40 AM »

I'll repeat what I said in response to a comment by her that she's helping people with their investment needs: I feel sorry for anyone who chooses to hand a single cent to this snake-oil peddler and who relies on her advice about anything even remotely related to investing.

The good news is that there's no evidence anybody has done this, nor any reason to believe people will be stupid enough to fall for it in the future.
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Chadwick The Beta
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« Reply #38 on: June 23, 2013, 12:53:24 PM »

She'll be back to peddling the magic gas pills sooner or later.
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Cholo4Life
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« Reply #39 on: June 24, 2013, 07:22:20 PM »

She'll be back to peddling the magic gas pills sooner or later.


They are probably more useful than this crap.
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OzmO
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« Reply #40 on: July 03, 2013, 06:51:02 AM »

Epic

Lol
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Archer77
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« Reply #41 on: July 03, 2013, 07:05:19 AM »

So you were a beauty queen, 24.  A former beauty queen from Canada who believes in conspiracy theories and sells gold who also posts on a bodybuilding forum.  How did that happen?
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Chadwick The Beta
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« Reply #42 on: July 03, 2013, 07:14:00 AM »

So you were a beauty queen, 24.  A former beauty queen from Canada who believes in conspiracy theories and sells gold who also posts on a bodybuilding forum.  How did that happen?

She was "Miss Black Ontario"

Which is on par with being the finest Alpine skier in Panama.
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« Reply #43 on: July 03, 2013, 07:17:00 AM »

She was "Miss Black Ontario"

Which is on par with being the finest Alpine skier in Panama. 


hahahahahaha  Grin 
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Chadwick The Beta
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« Reply #44 on: July 03, 2013, 02:25:22 PM »

Contest didn't take into account eyes I guess?

Much in the way the Mr. Canada 1970 contest didn't take lack of muscles into account.
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« Reply #45 on: July 06, 2013, 12:36:40 AM »

Wow, ...I see a few of you people have been quite busy in my absence.Cheesy

I'll try to keep my responses brief.

Right, so why buy anything in smaller weights? If you really value gold (as you claim you do) as a store of value then you should want to get the most gold for your fiat-buck. Right? Except you don't - you peddle this "buy gold by the gram" nonsense and you admit that doing so will cause you to buy gold at a higher price. How does that make ANY sense?

All smaller weight pieces are priced higher. The same if you were to purchase a 500ml bottle of soda vs. a 2 Litre bottle. The unit cost is always higher on the smaller weights & sizes.That is simply the nature of the beast when acquiring anything. Check it out the next time you visit your local supermarket.

Quote
What does "considered as valuable" means? The gold content of a maple is fixed - a on troy ounce coin contains exactly one troy ounce of gold, and the metal is refined to 999.9 millesimal fineness. Exactly like a "gold bar".

Value is measured by more metrics than price alone.

Quote
As for "flexible" I call bullshit. I can walk into over half a dozen stores within 10 minutes driving distance and exchange them for fiat money (which I can actually use to buy stuff) on the spot.

For one, By owning Karatbars, one is not required to liquidate an entire ounce of gold if one needs only a few hundred dollars.

Karatbars can be exchanged at any merchant / retailer, or business that chooses to do so, ...as well as in a number of different ways.


Quote
I already told you that I cannot do this with Karatbars. I have to follow some ridiculous process and rely on your promises that any day now, I'll be able to carry my Karatbars and pay for the stuff that I want by trading them to someone else (I probably won't be able to get change back in Karatbars though).

YOU can't do it with Karatbars, simply because YOU don't own any Karatbars with which to do it.

Quote
Name one tangible, actual, practical benefit.


Huh? Huh

I've already pointed out many in previous conversations and threads about this. Please refer to those.

Quote
But let's assume all that nonsense is true, and it magically means that gold will become super-duper valuable. If that's the case, why shouldn't I want to get as many ounces of gold today so what when whatever you "described" (I use the term loosely) above happens, I have the most gold I could possibly want?

If you have unlimitedly deep pockets, ...lnock yourself out.
I prefer a to acquire MY gold, from the Karatbars system. By availing myself of what Karatbars has to offer, I am empowered to acquire far more gold, than I could ever purchase from my own pocket at some best just over spot gold seller.

Quote
The thing is, though, you bought a BMW. You didn't buy tiny parts of a BMW encased in plastic, did you?

What I am getting are smaller, transaction friendly weights of 999.9 pure 24KT LBMA GDL gold, not tiny parts of gold emcased in plastic.


Quote
Enough with this lie of yours. You aren't getting gold for free from Karatbars or anywhere else. If you were, that would suggest that the actual value of the asset you claim is so valuable is exactly zero. So either you're doing one of three things:

  • participating in a pyramid scheme and when you drag others in, you get a small cut; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that you are getting gold for free; or
  • you are lying to us when you say that gold has intrinsic value.

So which is it?

It is none of the above.

When you say "pyramid" are you refering to an ancient artifact in Egypt?
...or are you refering to the strongest, soundest, structure known to the architect? ...or perhaps you are refering to the US system of social security?

As for the shape of my business organization, ...most any business entity is structured in the same fashion. My friend, colleague, and fellow Canadian Karatbars affiliate was able to dispense with this myth when he testified before Congress back in 1972. The end result was Congress basically said to him "Thank You very much. We're sorry for wasting your time" How typical, ...it's always a Canadian having to clue in an American. Now if Congress could finally figure it out, (albeit with a little Canadian assistance) ...what does that say about those who have yet to discover this for themselves? It's one thing to take the 'Are you smarter than a 6th grader" challenge and come up short, ...but how does one live down the shame of coming up short when compared to Congress?  Embarrassed
    
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« Reply #46 on: July 06, 2013, 01:50:34 AM »

Anyone that wants to read 24KTs replies to my posts before he/she posts them can look here:

Because all 24KT does is regurgitate arguments sent down through the upline.

Look familiar?Huh


And what makes you think the individual who wrote that is in my "upline".

For the record, ...we don't have uplines. Karatbars is not an MLM.
It is an e-commerce affiliate business operating under International Bullion laws, as set forth by the World Trade Organization, under the harmonious tax code.

As for a great deal of the info posted on his site, quite a bit of it is outdated and/or inaccurate.

His blog has posts covering only 2 months. January & February 2012.

It is over a year and a half old, and has not been added to since. He also appears to be from the UK.
I suspect this individual could be one of a few who jumped in, then jumped out when they discovered they weren't going to make $1,000,000 in their first month with Karatbars. Granted, I will admit the company's launch into Western Europe and North America didn't go as smoothly as we could have hoped, due to issues with a payment processor, ...however thanks to the integrity of the company founder & CEO, this issue was rectified immediately. This individual clearly lacked the vision, or understanding of what s/he had their hands on.  It happens all the time. Believe it or not, we have people in Karatbars who have lost thousands of dollars simply because they weren't paying attention to their business, and didn't bother activating 2 of the 7 different income streams available to them within our system. They were already fully qualified to earn the income, ...all they had to do was activate the option. They didn't understand what they had in front of them. There are many who to this day still do not get it. At some point, the light bulb goes on, ...and when it does, ...I hope they respond better one of than the original founders of Microsoft. He had a vested interest in the company, but lacked the vision to see what he had his hands on. He walked away. Later, ...when he realized what he had given up, ...he committed suicide.

Helen Keller was once asked if she thought there was anything worse than lacking sight.
Her response was "There are worse things in life than lacking sight., ...such as having sight, but lacking vision"

Many are called, ...but few are chosen. Those of us in the Karatbars Nation have been chosen because of our vision. You show us an acorn, ...and we don't see a little brown nut, ...our vision is that of a mighty forest of oak trees, ...and that's why WE CELEBRATE KARATBARS!!!
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avxo
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You've given me multiple traumatic brain injuries!


« Reply #47 on: July 06, 2013, 02:11:32 AM »

All smaller weight pieces are priced higher. The same if you were to purchase a 500ml bottle of soda vs. a 2 Litre bottle. The unit cost is always higher on the smaller weights & sizes.That is simply the nature of the beast when acquiring anything. Check it out the next time you visit your local supermarket.

Right, so why buy 500ml when you get more "bang for the buck" with a larger bottle if your goal is to stockpile as much soda as you can?


Value is measured by more metrics than price alone.

No doubt. But if you can get the more gold from Joe than you can from Peter for the same price, then price has become a very important factor, if not the only one.


For one, By owning Karatbars, one is not required to liquidate an entire ounce of gold if one needs only a few hundred dollars.

If one needs a few hundred dollars, liquidating gold (which you claim will only go up in value) is dumb to begin with.


Karatbars can be exchanged at any merchant / retailer, or business that chooses to do so, ...as well as in a number of different ways.

You've said that before, but the problem is that "any" can also mean zero. Of the people I called, only one offered to consider exchanging Karatbars for money; the others just refused. Being able to quickly and efficiently liquidate Karatbars is something which you've touted as an advantage. You've been telling us for how long that "soon" and "anyday now" a massive list of establishments which will accept Karatbars directly in exchange for goods and services will be posted. Where's that list?

The facts are simple. Can I pay for a meal with Karatbars? No. Can I pay for a car with Karatbars? No. Can I pay my doctor with Karatars? No. And it doesn't look like I will be able to in the near future either. Face it - physical gold is not practical as an everyday medium of exchange. Couple that with basically no quick and efficient way to liquidate physical holdings, and Karatbars are, to put it bluntly, useless.


YOU can't do it with Karatbars, simply because YOU don't own any Karatbars with which to do it.

That's true - but the people I was speaking to didn't know that. In fact they didn't even know what Karatbars were, despite the fact that they bought gold and were perfectly willing to give me money, on the spot, for bullion coins and bars.


I've already pointed out many in previous conversations and threads about this. Please refer to those.

No. All you've done is post silly rhymes, easily debunkable bullshit that others wrote and crappy youtube videos.

I prefer a to acquire MY gold, from the Karatbars system. By availing myself of what Karatbars has to offer, I am empowered to acquire far more gold, than I could ever purchase from my own pocket at some best just over spot gold seller.

BULLSHIT. Let's say you can only afford to buy a one gram gold bar per month. With Karatbars, it would take you 32 months to get an ounce of gold. If you saved that money instead then in 32 months you'd have saved enough to buy almost twice the gold... So you aren't empowered to acquire far more gold. You're duped into buying far less.

And frankly, if you can't afford to buy an ounce of gold outright, perhaps gold isn't for you.


What I am getting are smaller, transaction friendly weights of 999.9 pure 24KT LBMA GDL gold, not tiny parts of gold emcased in plastic.

First of all is a one gram gold bar containing one gram of "999.9 pure 24Kt LBMA GLD" gold not a tiny bit of gold encased in plastic? I submit that one gram of any metal qualifies as a tiny bit, and considering that the plastic volume is many times than of the gold, and surrounds it (for "protection") the fact of the matter is that a gold bar is, indeed, a tiny bit of gold encased in plastic.

Also, it seems that you are confused. A gold bar isn't GDL. GDL gold comes in bars of specific dimensions that are 350 and 450 ounces each of 999.5 gold. Perhaps the refinery producing Karatbars has LBMA GDL certification, but don't delude yourself that a gold bar is GDL. It is, most assuredly, not. See more at Wikipedia if you want to educate yourself.


When you say "pyramid" are you refering to an ancient artifact in Egypt?

No.

...or are you refering to the strongest, soundest, structure known to the architect?

Sorry no. This is actually a bogus claim that you would be hard pressed to justify. The pyramid has a number of important structural properties but it's hardly the strongest or the soundest structure. Oh, and please don't bother copy-pasting bullshit you find on the Internet but don't understand. We'll know.


...or perhaps you are refering to the US system of social security?

Nope. I'd also point out that that term doesn't quite describe the abomination that is social security if for no other reason that a critical component of a Ponzi scheme is that the fact that money from new investors is used to pay old investors is obscured. That's not the case with social security. But let's not get sidetracked here, shall we?


As for the shape of my business organization, ...most any business entity is structured in the same fashion.

Is it now? You think that most businesses are structured using multi-level marketing techniques to recruit fools who will then recruit still more fools? That's interesting.


My friend, colleague, and fellow Karatbars affiliate was able to dispense with this myth when he testified before Congress back in 1972. The end result was Congress basically said to him "Thank You very much. We're sorry for wasting your time" Now if Congress could figure it out, ...what does that say about those who have yet to discover this for themselves? It's one thing to take the 'Are you smarter than a 6th grader" challenge and come up short, ...but how does one live down coming up short against Congress?  Embarrassed

Uhm... you seem to think that Congress is some mythical, inerrant institution. I've got news for you. But, let's not go there; there are other questions first.

Does this "friend, colleague and fellow Karatabars affiliate" have, you know, a name? Or is he like the mythical "guy a friend of mine heard about through her sister, who met him at her best friend's cousin's boyfriend's brother's wedding"?

Is his testimony on the record? Can we read the transcripts of said testimony?

And, perhaps most importantly, did he testify specifically in connection with Karatars back in 1972, or something else? Because you know... we're talking about Karatbars here.
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TightBody
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« Reply #48 on: July 06, 2013, 06:21:49 AM »

buying gold in grams is a stupid way to buy gold. You want to buy gold in ounces. Grams of gold dont qualify for IRA's or retirement. She just wants you to buy gold in grams so she gets a cut and makes money. Shame on you jag. You know nothing of gold except to line your pocket by overcharging people.
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Chadwick The Beta
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"Stop calling me by my name." - Karen M.


« Reply #49 on: July 06, 2013, 07:06:13 AM »

buying gold in grams is a stupid way to buy gold. You want to buy gold in ounces. Grams of gold dont qualify for IRA's or retirement. She just wants you to buy gold in grams so she gets a cut and makes money. Shame on you jag. You know nothing of gold except to line your pocket by overcharging people.

This would be true if anybody actually did business with her.

She is just like Goodrum...all this grand talk but anyone really achieving anything isn't going to spam a "bodybuilding" board to death.
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