Are deads and squats necessary?

[Psychopath]

Was wondering what you guys do for your back?

I always loved deadlifting because i'm good at it, but i'm starting to think i can get the same results if not better with machine work that isolate the back, where you can squeeze and hold with lighter weights.

I also found that the classic lifts perpetuate muscle imbalance, since a straight bar is used.

Remember reading Bulsemo's posts on training, where he mainly goes for light weights and pump work and that gets him the best results.

I love training, but i'm starting to lose enthusiasm for lifts like squats and deads. Too much weight is being handled, making me feel like complete shit for days.

[trapz101]

squats yes,deads not really..

[deceiver]

I don't deadlift heavy usually. I focus on squats. If you squat 200kg then you won't deadlift less than 200kg. Heavy deadlifts wreck lower back (I mean muscles) and hence destroy your regeneration. If you have to do deadlifts then:

 - don't lower the bar, just fucking drop it on the floor, focus only on eccentric movement
 - do clean pulls, clean deadlifts, snatch pulls and so on instead of deadlifts
 - focus on heavy squats without belt

There's simply no amount of gear that would allow me to squat >3 times a week and keep my heavy deadlifts in. Fuck, even 1 squat session is hard when I add deads :/

[dr.chimps]

T-Bars. Hammer machines. 

[King Shizzo]

You could develop a fantastic physique using nothing but machines. Machines get a bad rap for some reason.

[Necrosis]

You could develop a fantastic physique using nothing but machines. Machines get a bad rap for some reason.

yes, there really is no difference and in some cases machines incite better muscle recruitement due to reduction in cheating and leverage, momentum.

Certain machines like a pullover machine just feel better then the freeweight counter part.

[trapz101]

You could develop a fantastic physique using nothing but machines. Machines get a bad rap for some reason.

x2..your muscle doesnt know whether you're using machine or free weighs,its all about loads and contraction/stretch of your muscle

[anabolichalo]

most ifbb pros agree deadlifts are pointless

rack pulls useful

[dj181]

real men bench

fuck legs

[jon cole]

I don't deadlift heavy usually. I focus on squats. If you squat 200kg then you won't deadlift less than 200kg. Heavy deadlifts wreck lower back (I mean muscles) and hence destroy your regeneration. If you have to do deadlifts then:

 - don't lower the bar, just fucking drop it on the floor, focus only on eccentric movement
 - do clean pulls, clean deadlifts, snatch pulls and so on instead of deadlifts
 - focus on heavy squats without belt

There's simply no amount of gear that would allow me to squat >3 times a week and keep my heavy deadlifts in. Fuck, even 1 squat session is hard when I add deads :/

amen.

squat and dead heavy was ok for me when i was young, after 28/30 y.o my lower just couldn't support the stress.

deadlift heavy till failure screw the recovery for the squat.

i'm doing askold surovetsky programm, so i'm doing 2 squat- 1 dead and the following week/ 2 dead - 1 squat,  even with a honest amount of "supp" it's hell.

[chaos]

Yes. Everyone's always looking for an easy shortcut.
Man the fuck up.

[freespirit]

Flip some heavy tires on a regular base, that's about it.

[Shockwave]

Yes. Everyone's always looking for an easy shortcut.
Man the fuck up.

x2

[anabolichalo]

squats and deadlifts are beneficial for bottoms


bench press and curls to get the women

[Necrosis]

I mean lower back and traps, posterior chain activation is important but for a big back chins and rows add way more mass to the lats, teres minor/major, rear delts.

Stretching results in more fiber recruitment, so any exercise that contains potentially extreme rom will be the best bet.

Deads are more for strength and functional strength imo, they are just so taxing with squats on the CNS that it makes recovery so hard.

[tommywishbone]

Q: Are squats and deadlifts necessary?

A: No. You can always go through life small and weak.

[G_Thang]

Was wondering what you guys do for your back?

I always loved deadlifting because i'm good at it, but i'm starting to think i can get the same results if not better with machine work that isolate the back, where you can squeeze and hold with lighter weights.

I also found that the classic lifts perpetuate muscle imbalance, since a straight bar is used.

Remember reading Bulsemo's posts on training, where he mainly goes for light weights and pump work and that gets him the best results.

I love training, but i'm starting to lose enthusiasm for lifts like squats and deads. Too much weight is being handled, making me feel like complete shit for days.

with leverage equipment, you can hit the quads and gluts, just as good as squats.  are you a sponsored bber or professional athlete?  as far as deads, again, what's the point, if you are just staying in shape?  save your lower back and knees.  add bench to the list also.  another exercise good for a nice muscle tear.

[deceiver]

I mean lower back and traps, posterior chain activation is important but for a big back chins and rows add way more mass to the lats, teres minor/major, rear delts.

Stretching results in more fiber recruitment, so any exercise that contains potentially extreme rom will be the best bet.

Deads are more for strength and functional strength imo, they are just so taxing with squats on the CNS that it makes recovery so hard.

"CNS taxing" is BS. CNS is NEVER a bottleneck in recovery, it's always muscles. For whatever reason my body recovers very slowly after heavy deads. It's of course somewhat better with 1-3 reps with 5 reps it's almost unbearable.

CNS will adapt to almost anything, that's why olympic lifters or other athletes that train explosive movements train every day, several times per day.

[deceiver]

nah man, cns will take huge and severe hits on very low calorie diet with high voume training.
if one does that for 2 weeks with no day off,the cns will be entirely shot.

too many factors.

no it won't, cns has nothing to do with it.

[Henda]

Id consider squats essential. Deadlifts important but not as much so.

I prefer a lighter weight on deads with a really slow negative. Squats the same really slow all the way down with a pause to emphasize quads.
Very different to how a powerlifter would lift

[affeman]

[Igor90]

squats importance: 90%
deadlift importance: 30%

i've trained with a couple of top amateur bodybuilders for a while, and only saw them doing deads like twice a month, some weren't doing them at all..

[chaos]

squats importance: 90%
deadlift importance: 30%

i've trained with a couple of top amateur bodybuilders for a while, and only saw them doing deads like twice a month, some weren't doing them at all..

That's why they're amateurs.

[King Shizzo]

That's why they're amateurs.

Power cleans are probably better than deadlifts.

[Big Chiro Flex]

I share the very unpopular belief here that ATG squats and controlled deadlifts should be 50% of my weeks training. They have been crucial to my bodybuilding.

Squats, for obvious reasons.

Deads, because I've added so much thickness to my entire posterior chain that I was missing by not doing them.