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Author Topic: 2013/14 NBA Thread  (Read 23948 times)
catracho
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« Reply #50 on: July 27, 2014, 02:08:31 AM »

Agreed, but you would still say "Kobe has 6 rings" right?  jaja.  I want championships for my team any way they can get them!  Better that then be a second round exit every year trying to do it the right way.
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« Reply #51 on: July 28, 2014, 11:56:49 AM »

Agreed, but you would still say "Kobe has 6 rings" right?  jaja.  I want championships for my team any way they can get them!  Better that then be a second round exit every year trying to do it the right way.

I agree. 

Also, there is nothing wrong with teaming up with other stars.  I don't fault LeCramp for doing that.  If you look at the glory years (the 80s), those championship teams were full of Hall of Fame players. 
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« Reply #52 on: July 28, 2014, 11:58:45 AM »

I like the B. Scott hiring.  He's a good coach and has the championship pedigree.  And he wants to focus on defense.  Not much else out there other than old-time retreads.

I don't see a championship team, but if Kobe is healthy, at least they'll be back in the playoffs. 

Now they just need to let Jeannie take over for Jim Buss. 
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« Reply #53 on: August 02, 2014, 03:15:24 PM »

Additional facts:  Kobe has five rings.  LeCramp has two. 

Kobe has been to the Finals seven times, which makes him five for seven.

LeCramp has been to the Finals six times, which makes him two for six. 

And yes, Kobe is extremely grateful LA traded for him:

Kobe Bryant Thanks Hornets on Twitter for Trading Him After 1996 Draft
By Kyle Newport , Featured Columnist Jul 1, 2014

Eighteen years ago today, the Charlotte Hornets made a trade that they'd like to have back.

Kobe Bryant hasn't forgotten that trade.

Charlotte took Bryant out of high school with the 13th pick in the 1996 NBA draft. Less than a week later, the Hornets traded the Black Mamba to the Los Angeles Lakers:

Juan Ocampo/Getty Images
The reasoning behind the trade, according to Bryant, is pretty shocking:

Kobe Bryant        ✔ @kobebryant
Follow
On this day 18yrs ago the hornets told me right after they drafted me that they had no use for me and were going to trade me #thanku #lakers
8:13 AM - 1 Jul 2014


"No use" for Bryant? That doesn't look good now.

All he has done since the trade is put together a Hall of Fame resume. Bryant has won an NBA Most Valuable Player award and five NBA championships, which includes two NBA Finals MVP awards. He has also been named to the All-Star team 16 times. Oh, he's also fourth on the NBA's all-time scoring list.

Bryant has accomplished all of that while wearing a Lakers uniform.

Who knows how Bryant's career would have played out had Charlotte not traded him, but the Black Mamba and the Lakers are pretty pleased with how the last 18 years have played out.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2116201-kobe-bryant-thanks-hornets-on-twitter-for-trading-him-after-1996-draft

more additional facts

kobe has been in the league 7 years longer, hence more finals appearances

lebron is 2 out of 5 in the finals, taking a cavs team to the finals that kobe wouldn't have even reached the playoffs with

lebron 4 mvp's with much shorter career, should've been at least 5

kobe 1 mvp

it is also ridiculous to say lebron had more help with the heat, that 2004 lakers team was an all star roster and they lost in 5 to the pistons, lebron also never had a decent big man, let alone shaq or pau

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« Reply #54 on: August 02, 2014, 03:24:15 PM »

I don't see how you can say Kobe won nothing without help and then point to Lebron as being better.  Without 2 to 3 other stars Lebron also won nothing.  Also, when Lebron won his 2 rings he had more help than Kobe had for any of his 5. 

I give Lebron credit for getting a 50 win 06-07 Cleveland team with limited talent to the Finals, but they got smoked 4 games to zero.  You can't really count 2006-07 as "winning something".  That same year Kobe's team won 42 games and almost knocked off Phoenix, a vastly better team than anyone Lebron faced in the eastern conference playoffs that year.

Every star player that wins a ring has other stars on the roster.  No one wins titles by themselves in the NBA, not even Jordan.  you don't need to tear down Kobe in order to build up Lebron.  They are both among the best that ever played in the NBA.

i'll take prime shaq over bosh and over the hill wade not to mention phil as coach, notice how wade won a title with shaq?  shaq was a beast and in his prime was as dominating as any player in history

the cavs lost 4 games to zero in the finals yes, what is your point?  would you really respect lebron more if they lost in the first round as kobe did a few times?  that same spurs team probably smoked the lakers that year too, it had duncan and ginobli in their prime and parker became a star that year

i don't tear down kobe, beach bum tears down lebron

all i do is point out the fact that lebron is better than kobe ever was, the only thing kobe has on lebron is titles and that's because he played far longer and had prime shaq, lebron did far more without another star than kobe

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« Reply #55 on: August 02, 2014, 03:25:53 PM »

I never said Lebron was better.  Show me where I said that.  Kobe has been the best player of his generation and is right behin MJ interms of achievements.  What I said was that they both needed help to win, but Kobe got the help because he played for the Lakers, Lebron didn't cause he played for the Cavs, which at the time was a hole no star wanted to even visit.  But you bash Lebron for going somewhere else to get that help. That is what I meant. 

duncan, shaq, and lebron have all been better in kobe's generation

all have more league mvp's and finals mvp's

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« Reply #56 on: August 02, 2014, 03:27:35 PM »

What's up Earl? You doing good? Cheesy you old fuck you...

aren't we the same age?

ray rice deserved more than 2 games if ben got 4 with no proof or charges, not that i have a problem with him keeping his maniac wife in line

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« Reply #57 on: August 02, 2014, 03:28:38 PM »

Would you feel the same way if Kobe convinced Love and carmelo to go to the Lakers and they won Championships?  Would you have said those rings were cheapened?

they had no problem in 2004 when malone and payton showed up

oh wait, that team failed miserably thanks to kobe and his drama

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« Reply #58 on: August 02, 2014, 03:58:05 PM »

 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked   training for the olympic team, this makes no sense guy gets paid big bucks to play in the nba, gets hurt for nothing. never understood this. olympics should be for AMATEURS.
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« Reply #59 on: August 02, 2014, 09:32:18 PM »

they had no problem in 2004 when malone and payton showed up

oh wait, that team failed miserably thanks to kobe and his drama

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You talk so much bullshit that I can't respond to it all.  Let me just educate you on the 2003-04 Lakers.

Karl Malone was 40 fucking years old.  40.  He played pretty good for his age but he got hurt multiple times during the year including in the San Antonio series right before the NBA finals.  He played a little in the Finals essentially on one leg.  Eventually he couldn't go at all and didn't even dress.

Phil Jackson said by the time Gary Payton signed with us he hadn't lost a step on defense, he'd actually lost 2 steps.  He was 35 and like Malone, at the ass end of his career.  He never figured out the triangle and Phil was forced to start playing Fisher more at the end of the year and especially in crunch time.

We were down 3 power forwards by the time we got to the finals.  Rick Fox, Horace Grant and Karl Malone were all out injured.  Slava Medvedenko and Brian Cook were getting the minutes at PF in the Finals along with Devean George and rookie Luke Walton at Small Forward.  We were left with Shaq, Kobe and Derek Fisher.  Nobody else could hit a shot, even wide open 12 footers.

In my opinion that's why we lost.  Because our role players couldn't make wide open shots Detroit was able to aggressively double team Kobe at the top of the key and put our entire offense out of whack.  Shaq wasn't in great shape.  He was solid in the first quarter of games but then he would fade as the game wore on.

Some fucking dream team.  All this and they almost won the whole damn thing.  You didn't follow the 2003-04 Lakers and your ignorance is obvious to people that did.  You are just dragging out the same old, tired BS arguments that all Kobe haters use.  You don't know what you are talking about, shut up.
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« Reply #60 on: August 02, 2014, 09:40:50 PM »



it is also ridiculous to say lebron had more help with the heat, that 2004 lakers team was an all star roster and they lost in 5 to the pistons, lebron also never had a decent big man, let alone shaq or pau



Actually dumb ass, Lebron did have Shaq in Cleveland.  To which you will probably say, "but Shaq was old and not in his prime by then".  Yeah, kinda like Karl Malone and Gary Payton in 2004.  Actually Shaq was 3 years younger with Lebron then Karl Malone was in LA.  Interesting isn't it?

Oh, and Lebron did have more help.

Dwayne Wade...32 year old All-Star
Chris Bosh...29 year old All-Star
Ray Allen...in his late 30's but the best 3 point shooter OF ALL TIME.
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« Reply #61 on: August 03, 2014, 09:24:22 AM »

aren't we the same age?

ray rice deserved more than 2 games if ben got 4 with no proof or charges, not that i have a problem with him keeping his maniac wife in line

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No...you're two years older
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« Reply #62 on: August 03, 2014, 02:20:25 PM »

You talk so much bullshit that I can't respond to it all.  Let me just educate you on the 2003-04 Lakers.

Karl Malone was 40 fucking years old.  40.  He played pretty good for his age but he got hurt multiple times during the year including in the San Antonio series right before the NBA finals.  He played a little in the Finals essentially on one leg.  Eventually he couldn't go at all and didn't even dress.

Phil Jackson said by the time Gary Payton signed with us he hadn't lost a step on defense, he'd actually lost 2 steps.  He was 35 and like Malone, at the ass end of his career.  He never figured out the triangle and Phil was forced to start playing Fisher more at the end of the year and especially in crunch time.

We were down 3 power forwards by the time we got to the finals.  Rick Fox, Horace Grant and Karl Malone were all out injured.  Slava Medvedenko and Brian Cook were getting the minutes at PF in the Finals along with Devean George and rookie Luke Walton at Small Forward.  We were left with Shaq, Kobe and Derek Fisher.  Nobody else could hit a shot, even wide open 12 footers.

In my opinion that's why we lost.  Because our role players couldn't make wide open shots Detroit was able to aggressively double team Kobe at the top of the key and put our entire offense out of whack.  Shaq wasn't in great shape.  He was solid in the first quarter of games but then he would fade as the game wore on.

Some fucking dream team.  All this and they almost won the whole damn thing.  You didn't follow the 2003-04 Lakers and your ignorance is obvious to people that did.  You are just dragging out the same old, tired BS arguments that all Kobe haters use.  You don't know what you are talking about, shut up.

i'm well aware of all of that

the point is lebron gets shit for not winning with the cavs, who still had far less than any team kobe had yet people conveniently forget that

that team was built to be a dream team, just like the heat so don't knock lebron and then pretend that kobe didn't have the same thing, the difference is lebron succeeded and kobe failed

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« Reply #63 on: August 03, 2014, 02:29:19 PM »

Actually dumb ass, Lebron did have Shaq in Cleveland.  To which you will probably say, "but Shaq was old and not in his prime by then".  Yeah, kinda like Karl Malone and Gary Payton in 2004.  Actually Shaq was 3 years younger with Lebron then Karl Malone was in LA.  Interesting isn't it?

Oh, and Lebron did have more help.

Dwayne Wade...32 year old All-Star
Chris Bosh...29 year old All-Star
Ray Allen...in his late 30's but the best 3 point shooter OF ALL TIME.


malone was far better at old age than shaq was, hence the excitement and dream team comments from analysts, comparing shaq in 2010 to payton and malone makes you the dumbass, signing shaq didn't make the cavs clear cut favorites

being younger than malone doesn't mean anything, some guys hit the wall at 40 others hit it as young as 30, big men especially break down faster

funny how it doesn't matter to you that wade was hurt this year, but you excuse malone for being hurt

malone at 40 is better than ray allen today

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« Reply #64 on: August 03, 2014, 05:19:13 PM »


malone was far better at old age than shaq was, hence the excitement and dream team comments from analysts, comparing shaq in 2010 to payton and malone makes you the dumbass, signing shaq didn't make the cavs clear cut favorites

being younger than malone doesn't mean anything, some guys hit the wall at 40 others hit it as young as 30, big men especially break down faster

funny how it doesn't matter to you that wade was hurt this year, but you excuse malone for being hurt

malone at 40 is better than ray allen today



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Wade wasn't hurt this year.  He was missing games (especially on back to backs) as scheduled rest to save him for the playoffs.

Regardless, I do agree with you that Lebron didn't have much help in Cleveland.  He had a ton of help in Miami but still only won 2 out of 4.  Without Ray Allen's miracle shot in 2013 it would have been 1 out of 4.  That's just real talk.

The Laker's ancient fab 4 in 2003-04 was nothing like what Miami did when 3 20 something year old superstars in the prime of their careers conspired to join up, take less money to circumvent the salary cap and win cheap rings.  More reality being dropped here.

Lebron is a great talent.  He just likes to stack the odds in his favor.  He has no problem bouncing around to wherever the grass looks greener and he has a great chance to win rings.  You can't blame him, it's a free country and in some respects he's being smart.  I just happen to respect other guys (MJ, Kobe) a little more who didn't do that and won their rings in a more traditional and organic way.

That's the last time I'll say it because at this point I'm just repeating myself talking to different people.  The truth is, most people don't need me to tell them this, they already know, even if they don't want to admit it.  I'm looking forward to seeing how Lebron does back in Cleveland and how much Kobe has left in the tank.
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« Reply #65 on: August 04, 2014, 02:43:37 PM »

LeCramp is about to get Love.  Should definitely be a contender in the East if they get him. 
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« Reply #66 on: August 04, 2014, 04:37:23 PM »

so MJ or kobe wouldn't have left cleveland?  when did cleveland have the opportunity to sign a dennis rodman or any big free agent back in 2010?  would prime shaq feel perfectly fine with a trade to cleveland over LA?

for whatever reason nba players moreso than athletes in other sports only want to play in the big and glamourous cities, it's not lebron's fault bosh didn't want to play in cleveland

why is it that no nfl player has a problem with going to green bay but no nba player wants to play in milwaukee?

as with everything else in life your location has a major affect on your success, if the players weren't willing to play in cleveland lebron had to leave just like if you can't find a job in your hometown or you can't advance you leave home

none of you would respect him more today if he stayed and won zero titles

it shows lebron's character to go back, he could've stayed in miami and continued their streak especially considering dan gilbert left that ridiculous letter on the team website days before lebron signed with them, what a little turd gilbert is

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« Reply #67 on: August 04, 2014, 05:00:07 PM »

I give LeCramp props for going back to Cleveland, but let's not pretend he would have gone there regardless of the state of the franchise.  I'm sure Irving and all the other high draft picks played a role.  In fact, it would not surprise me if he talked to Love before committing. 

If the cupboard was bare, he would have kept his butt right in Miami. 
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« Reply #68 on: August 04, 2014, 05:16:46 PM »



none of you would respect him more today if he stayed and won zero titles

it shows lebron's character to go back, he could've stayed in miami and continued their streak especially considering dan gilbert left that ridiculous letter on the team website days before lebron signed with them, what a little turd gilbert is

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Actually, I would respect Lebron more if he had stayed in Cleveland.

It doesn't show character that he went back.  Miami was on the down slide because Dwyane Wade isn't the player he was a few years ago and they didn't have the cap room to improve their team.  You are acting like going back to Cleveland was some heroic gesture of self sacrifice.  The reality is that Cleveland won the draft lottery 3 out of the last 4 years and is stocked with young talent and cap room.  He left again for greener pastures only this time Cleveland's pasture was the one that was greener.
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« Reply #69 on: August 05, 2014, 11:54:01 AM »

Actually, I would respect Lebron more if he had stayed in Cleveland.

It doesn't show character that he went back.  Miami was on the down slide because Dwyane Wade isn't the player he was a few years ago and they didn't have the cap room to improve their team.  You are acting like going back to Cleveland was some heroic gesture of self sacrifice.  The reality is that Cleveland won the draft lottery 3 out of the last 4 years and is stocked with young talent and cap room.  He left again for greener pastures only this time Cleveland's pasture was the one that was greener.

right you would respect him more with zero titles

like i said the nba is all about big and glamorous cities, lets not pretend the best player in the world would play in cleveland if it wasn't his home

cleveland won the draft lottery and wants to get rid of two of their first overall picks, oh yeah "loaded with young talent" Roll Eyes

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« Reply #70 on: August 05, 2014, 12:53:48 PM »

right you would respect him more with zero titles

like i said the nba is all about big and glamorous cities, lets not pretend the best player in the world would play in cleveland if it wasn't his home

cleveland won the draft lottery and wants to get rid of two of their first overall picks, oh yeah "loaded with young talent" Roll Eyes

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Irving and Waiter are young talents.  That is going to be a pretty solid core. 

And if you think about it, how perfect did this play out for him?  Leaves them in a lurch.  They wind up with multiple lottery picks.  He wins two rings with other superstars.  He returns with great young talent, plus will get one the best players in the NBA. 
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« Reply #71 on: August 05, 2014, 01:05:23 PM »

right you would respect him more with zero titles


Yes I would

like i said the nba is all about big and glamorous cities, lets not pretend the best player in the world would play in cleveland if it wasn't his home

cleveland won the draft lottery and wants to get rid of two of their first overall picks, oh yeah "loaded with young talent" Roll Eyes

E


Cleveland didn't "win the draft lottery", they won the draft lottery 3 out of the last 4 years.  Irving, Wiggins, Dion Waiters, Anthony Bennett, Tristan Thompson.  Yeah I think most people would consider that loaded with young talent.
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« Reply #72 on: August 06, 2014, 12:38:35 PM »

 Smiley

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnB9bvud6IU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnB9bvud6IU</a>
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« Reply #73 on: August 07, 2014, 01:23:28 PM »

Boo hiss. 

Wolves, Cavs agree to Love trade
Updated: August 7, 2014
ESPN.com news services

The Minnesota Timberwolves have reached an agreement in principle to trade Kevin Love to the Cleveland Cavaliers for No. 1 overall pick Andrew Wiggins, 2013 No. 1 overall pick Anthony Bennett and a protected 2015 first-round draft pick, multiple media outlets reported Thursday.

The trade cannot be finalized until Aug. 23 because draft picks cannot be traded until 30 days after signing a new contract. Wiggins signed a rookie contract on July 24.

According to Yahoo! Sports, which reported an agreement in principle between the teams earlier Thursday, Love clinched the trade agreement by committing to re-sign with Cleveland next summer for five years and $120 million-plus after opting out of his contract. But such an arrangement would be a violation of NBA rules.

Sources confirmed to ESPN.com's Marc Stein on Thursday that the Cavs and Love can make no such arrangements about the future, even verbally, without violating salary cap circumvention rules in the league's collective bargaining agreement. Love has made it widely known that he intends to opt out of his contract at season's end, wherever he is, to become a free agent in July 2015, but the circumvention rules state that any discussions between the Cavs and Love regarding any future contract cannot take place until Love becomes a free agent next summer.

ESPN.com has reported numerous times over the last month, since James committed to re-sign with his home-state Cavs, that Love has let it be known he wants to play alongside James and would be willing to make a long-term commitment to Cleveland as long as James is there. But Cleveland would be making this trade with no such guarantees, because James is under contract for only the next two seasons -- with the right to opt out and return to free agency next season -- and because Love is likely to take his cues on the length of his next deal with Cleveland based on what James does.

Sources have told ESPN.com that Love has been highly intrigued by the idea of playing alongside Olympic teammate LeBron James on a full-time basis and is not put off by the fact that James' contract with the Cavs spans only two seasons and includes a player option to return to free agency next summer.

The deal also will unite Love, James and Kyrie Irving as a new-look Big 3 in Cleveland and give the long-suffering sports town a realistic chance for its first title in 50 years.

NBA Hall of Famer Isiah Thomas reacted to news of the trade agreement on Twitter by crediting James for his influence in getting Love to Cleveland.

James is the best player in the NBA, Irving is an All-Star and the 25-year-old Love is coming off his best season, one in which he averaged 26.1 points, 12.5 rebounds and 4.4 assists. He is the top "stretch 4" -- a power forward who can rebound and shoot 3-pointers -- in the game, but all of his offensive gifts haven't been enough to get the Timberwolves into the playoffs in the rugged Western Conference.

Love can opt out of his contract next summer, and the three-time All-Star made it clear to the Timberwolves that he was looking to join a contender after missing the postseason for six seasons in Minnesota.

The Cavaliers talked with the Timberwolves before the draft about bringing Love in, but his camp made it clear to owner Dan Gilbert and the Cavs front office that he wasn't interested in signing a long-term contract with a young and unproven team that had not made the playoffs since 2010.

Then James left Miami for home, changing everything for Love, who teamed up with the four-time MVP to win the gold medal at the London Olympics.

Wiggins has been working out at a non-Cavaliers location and his representatives have already begun researching possible endorsement opportunities for him in Minnesota,  a person with knowledge of those pursuits told The Associated Press. That person spoke to The AP on condition of anonymity because the deals have not been completed.

Love withdrew from his planned participation with Team USA at the FIBA World Cup of Basketball to avoid an injury that could derail the deal.

Wiggins, when asked Sunday about the uncertainty over his future, told ESPN that he wants to play where he's wanted. The Cavs signed Wiggins to his rookie contract, which averages about $5.5 million annually.

"I just want to play for a team that wants me. So whichever team wants me I'll play for," he told ESPN's "SportsCenter" from Tarrytown, New York, where he was taking part in a photo shoot for Panini trading cards.

Although the Cavs would prefer to keep Wiggins, their interest in Love is understandable given how well the big man's combination of elite rebounding, passing and long-range shooting ability could complement James' game. With Love in addition to James and point guard Kyrie Irving, Cleveland would rank as an undeniable favorite to win the Eastern Conference, something the Cavs managed only once in James' initial seven-season stint with his home-state franchise.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11320537/kevin-love-trade-cleveland-cavaliers-minnesota-timberwolves-agreement-place
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« Reply #74 on: August 07, 2014, 04:45:52 PM »

Yes I would

Cleveland didn't "win the draft lottery", they won the draft lottery 3 out of the last 4 years.  Irving, Wiggins, Dion Waiters, Anthony Bennett, Tristan Thompson.  Yeah I think most people would consider that loaded with young talent.

but then you would say kobe has 5 titles and lebron has zero, right?  do you guys forget that kobe asked the lakers to trade him?  he's not so loyal

wiggins and bennet are now gone, plus bennet looked like a poor man's michael olowakandi

that "young talent" couldn't even get them to the playoffs in a weak conference so give it a rest

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