Author Topic: Tennessee atheists win right to distribute literature after schools give Bibles  (Read 90369 times)

Agnostic007

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What would you accept as "any evidence"?  And what do you mean by "hows that even done"? 

Ok, how does one push out a religion? Is it simply by being outnumbered by non religious people? Did the Christians all move out of Europe? Again, how did Europe push out Christianity. And as far as evidence to your claim Atheists are sorry Christianity is somehow gone from Europe, just a link to a news article indicating Atheists regret pushing Christianity out of Europe because Muslims are taking over would do. I would think, an Atheist would just rather both groups be gone.

loco

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Ok, how does one push out a religion? Is it simply by being outnumbered by non religious people? Did the Christians all move out of Europe? Again, how did Europe push out Christianity. And as far as evidence to your claim Atheists are sorry Christianity is somehow gone from Europe, just a link to a news article indicating Atheists regret pushing Christianity out of Europe because Muslims are taking over would do. I would think, an Atheist would just rather both groups be gone.

It's a figure of speech.  You do understand what that means, don't you?  Western Europe has become secularized and hostile toward Christianity since WWII.  That's a well known fact.

As for me posting an article, and I will dig up more as time allows, did you not see the one that I just posted?

avxo

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Don't argue with me.

I will if I want to.


Ask your fellow atheists and agnostics.

Why would I? Do I need their permission? Are we all supposed to have the same opinion and I’m deviating?


According to them, you are being neither practical nor realistic.

And why would I give a s*** about what others think?


I thought this stuff was well known, but apparently you and our resident ex-cop had not heard of it:

Richard Dawkins: ‘Benign’ Christianity is about to be replaced by ‘something worse’ – Islam

Yeah, sorry. I don’t subscribe to the “Richard Dawkins Newsletter” nor do I pay attention to what he says.


I'll be posting more on this as I find time to dig it up.

No need to. I don’t doubt that Islam is a virulent religion that’s now spreading through Europe, at the expense of Christianity. Viruses infecting other viruses.

loco

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I will if I want to.


Why would I? Do I need their permission? Are we all supposed to have the same opinion and I’m deviating?


And why would I give a s*** about what others think?


Yeah, sorry. I don’t subscribe to the “Richard Dawkins Newsletter” nor do I pay attention to what he says.


No need to. I don’t doubt that Islam is a virulent religion that’s now spreading through Europe, at the expense of Christianity. Viruses infecting other viruses.

So, if you want to, you will argue with me Western European atheists' point of view regarding Islam replacing Christianity in Western Europe, knowing that I'm neither Western European nor atheist?  Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

Well, at least unlike our resident ex-cop, you don't doubt many European atheists and agnostics are feeling this way and saying these things today, if I understood you correctly.

Assuming you are an American citizen living in the US, you really don't mind if the conservative, church going Christian majority in the US gets replaced with a Muslim majority instead?

I know you prefer neither.  You made that clear.  But I ask because you also seem to be saying that you see no difference between countries where the majority religious people are Christian and countries that are predominantly Muslim.

Dos Equis

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Atheist group sues over Bible display at VA hospital in New Hampshire
Caleb Parke By Caleb Parke | Fox News

A Bible donated by a World War II veteran on display in a Manchester VA Medical Center memorial is at the center of a lawsuit filed by the Military Religious Freedom Foundation on behalf of a New Hampshire veteran. (Courtesy of First Liberty Institute)

An atheist group filed a lawsuit against the Department of Veterans Affairs over a Bible displayed at a VA facility in New Hampshire.

The group called the Bible's presence in the missing veterans and POWs memorial unconstitutional and an “outrage,” but the VA says it won't be "bullied" into removing the Bible from the display.

The Bible was donated to Manchester VA Medical Center by former U.S. Army Air Corps Technical Sergeant (TSgt) Herman "Herk" Streitburger, of Bedford, who was held captive in a German Prisoner of War camp during World War II.

The Military Religious Freedom Foundation said it filed the lawsuit on behalf of a New Hampshire veteran.

“That is stamping it with the approval of raising one faith over all the others,” Mikey Weinstein, the founder of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, told USA Today. “From our perspective, it’s a repugnant example of fundamentalist Christian triumphalism, exceptionalism, superiority, and domination, and it cannot stand.”


A Bible donated by a World War II veteran on display in a Manchester VA Medical Center memorial is at the center of a lawsuit filed by the Military Religious Freedom Foundation on behalf of a New Hampshire veteran. (Office of Public Affairs, Manchester VA Medical Center via AP)

Department of Veteran Affair Press Secretary Curt Cashour told Fox News the Bible, although incorrectly moved earlier this year, stays.

"This lawsuit – backed by a group known for questionable practices and unsuccessful lawsuits – is nothing more than an attempt to force VA into censoring a show of respect for America’s POW/MIA community," Cashour said. "Make no mistake: VA will not be bullied on this issue."

The VA briefly removed the Bible from the display case when MRFF initially complained about it, but put it back following an outpouring of complaints from veterans groups and religious liberty groups, including the First Liberty Institute, the same law firm that argued on behalf of the Bladensburg "Peace Cross" memorial in front of the Supreme Court earlier this year.

The MRFF lawsuit described the New Hampshire veteran, James Chamberlain, as a “devout Christian” who wants the Bible removed from the display.

“As a Christian, he respects and loves all his military brothers and sisters and does not want to be exclusionary by placement of the Christian Bible,” the complaint says.

The lawsuit seeks an injunction requiring that the Bible be removed from the display.

Those in favor of keeping the Bible on display said the lawsuit is frivolous.

“POW/MIA Remembrance displays have a long, cherished history in our nation,” said Mike Berry, chief of staff at the First Liberty Institute. “Veterans organizations like the Northeast POW/MIA Network should be able to honor and remember those killed, captured or missing with a display that includes a Bible donated by a WWII veteran that represents the strength through faith necessary for American service members to survive.”

https://www.foxnews.com/faith-values/atheist-group-sues-over-bible-display-at-va-hospital-in-new-hampshire

Agnostic007

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I think they should add a copy of Playboy as well.

Dos Equis

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Supreme Court: Cross Can Stand On Public Land In Separation Of Church And State Case
June 20, 2019
Nina Totenberg
Domenico Montanaro


A World War I memorial cross sits in Bladensburg, Md., just outside Washington, D.C. The federal government asked the Supreme Court to rule in favor of the cross.
Becky Harlan/NPR

The U.S. Supreme Court ruled Thursday that a 40-foot World War I memorial cross can stay on public land at a Maryland intersection.

The cross "has become a prominent community landmark, and its removal or radical alteration at this date would be seen by many not as a neutral act but as the manifestation of a hostility toward religion that has no place in our Establishment Clause traditions," the court wrote. Justice Alito wrote the majority opinion for the court.

"And contrary to respondents' intimations, there is no evidence of discriminatory intent in the selection of the design of the memorial or the decision of a Maryland commission to maintain it. The Religion Clause of the Constitution aim to foster a society in which people of all beliefs can live together harmoniously, and the presence of the Bladensburg Cross on the land where it has stood for so many years is fully consistent with that aim."

The decision was 7-to-2, but had multiple parts and not all of the seven agreeing on every aspect. The decision reverses a lower-court ruling that said the memorial is unconstitutional because it is on public land and maintained at taxpayer expense. The high court's ruling is a major victory for religious groups and the American Legion, which warned that if this cross had to be moved, so too would other crosses that serve as war memorials.

Alito argued that the cross had essentially become secular. He invoked the history of World War I memorials noting the rows and rows of crosses and stars of David at cemeteries that memorialized those who died in that war and that established in people's minds, in his view, that that was a way to honor to dead.

Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, in dissent, disagreed with Alito's history. She noted that it's clear what the purpose and meaning of the cross was from the start — it was religious. She argued Americans knew what it meant then and know what it means now.

"Decades ago," Ginsburg wrote, "this Court recognized that the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to the Constitution demands governmental neutrality among religious faiths, and between religion and nonreligion. ... Numerous times since, the Court has reaffirmed the Constitution's commitment to neutrality. Today the Court erodes that neutrality commitment, diminishing precedent designed to preserve individual liberty and civic harmony in favor of a 'presumption of constitutionality for longstanding monuments, symbols, and practices.'"

She adds, "The Latin cross is the foremost symbol of the Christian faith, embodying the 'central theological claim of Christianity: that the son of God died on the cross, that he rose from the dead, and that his death and resurrection offer the possibility of eternal life.' ... Precisely because the cross symbolizes these sectarian beliefs, it is a common marker for the graves of Christian soldiers. For the same reason, using the cross as a war memorial does not transform it into a secular symbol, as the Courts of Appeals have uniformly recognized."

The decision could have sweeping implications in terms of symbols, like crosses and the 10 Commandments that are already constructed. Those that are already there, likely will be able to stay; it's a question of removal, not putting them up. It could still be contested, however, if someone wanted to construct something new, because the purpose would be better known than something historic.

The concrete cross at the center of the court's decision is located in the middle of a busy median strip and directly across the street from a large pawnshop in Bladensburg, Md.

It was erected nearly 100 years ago when bereaved mothers in Bladensburg decided to build a World War I memorial to honor their fallen sons. When they ran out of money, the American Legion took over the project. But by the 1930s, a local parks commission had taken over the memorial and the responsibility for its maintenance.

Today, the cross is more grungy than grand. The concrete is crumbling; a canvas tarp covers the top, and without the $100,000 that the parks commission has budgeted for repair, the monument looks like it may not be long for this world.

The American Humanist Association challenged the placement of the cross, contending that "there is no meaning to the Latin cross, other than Christianity." A federal appeals court agreed, declaring that its placement violated the Constitution's ban on establishment of religion. The appeals court ruled that the cross should be moved to a private location and funded without taxpayer money.

Now the Supreme Court has reversed that ruling.

https://www.npr.org/2019/06/20/731824045/supreme-court-cross-can-stand-on-public-land-in-separation-of-church-and-state-c

Dos Equis

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Justices reject challenge to 'In God We Trust' on U.S. money
By Alex Swoyer - The Washington Times - Monday, June 10, 2019

The Supreme Court rejected a case Monday brought by an atheist who wanted to scrub “In God We Trust,” the U.S. motto, from the nation’s currency, claiming it was an entanglement of state and religion.

Michael Newdow, an activist who previous challenged reciting the Pledge of Allegiance in schools, had set his sights on money, but lost at the district, circuit and now Supreme Court levels.

On behalf of a group of atheists, Mr. Newdow argued America’s money lacked an reference to God until 1864, when it was added in. He said that amounted to an endorsement of religion.

“By mandating the inscription of facially religious text … on every coin and currency bill, defendants have turned petitioners — among whom are nine children — into ‘political outsiders’ on the basis of their most fundamental religious tenet,” he argued in his petition to the Supreme Court.

The justices rejected his petition without comment.

The 8th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in its ruling last August against Mr. Newdow said the Establishment Clause of the Constitution doesn’t force the government to purge itself from all religious reflection.

“Precluding general references to God would do exactly that,” the federal appeals court ruled.

Mr. Newdow lost a similar challenge in 2014 when the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled against a previous effort to strip the motto from currency. Four other appeals courts, dealing with the issue before, also have upheld the motto’s place on American money.

The activist has also launched a series of other legal challenges, attempting to separate religion from the public sphere. Some of his well known battles include trying to halt the Pledge of Allegiance from being said in public school due to the phrase “under God,” and also trying to stop prayers and religious references at the inaugurations of Presidents George W. Bush and Barack Obama.

Becket Religious Liberty for All, a religious liberty focused law firm, said the high court made the right move by dismissing Mr. Newdow’s challenge Monday.

“The result is the right one, but the multiyear process is a grand waste of time and money,” said Eric Rassbach, an attorney for Becket.

He said it’s time for the Supreme Court to revisit the “Lemon test,” a framework the Supreme Court laid out in a 1971 case for reviewing when a government’s action crosses the line into unconstitutional religious entanglement. Under the Lemon test, an action must have a secular purpose, must not advance or inhibit a religion, and must avoid “excessive government entanglement with religion.”

Mr. Rassbach said the Lemon test invites cases like Mr. Newdow‘s.

The Supreme Court has a chance to retire the Lemon test in another case this term involving a nearly 100-year-old war memorial cross in Bladensburg, Maryland. The Peace Cross, which stands on public land, is dedicated to local soldiers who died in World War I.

Justice Neil M. Gorsuch, during oral argument in that case, suggested Lemon’s usefulness was at an end.

“It’s been a long time since this court has applied Lemon,” Justice Gorsuch said. “Is it time for this court to thank Lemon for its services and send it on its way?”

A decision in the Peace Cross case is expected by the end of the month.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/jun/10/supreme-court-rejects-challenge-god-we-trust-us-mo/

Agnostic007

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This is where progressive atheist groups lose me.
"In GOD we trust" on US bills is not threat to personal freedoms.

Thats really not the criteria though.

Dos Equis

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What irrational crybaby complained about the word Christmas?  Good grief.

West Virginia mayor restores city's 'Christmas Parade' after protests over name change
By Vandana Rambaran | Fox News

Charleston Christmas parade now called 'Winter parade'
The parade will still be Christmas themed.

The mayor of West Virginia's capital city has reversed her earlier decision to rename the annual "Charleston Christmas Parade" the "Charleston Winter Parade" after protests.

Mayor Amy Goodwin announced the original name change Monday, saying it would encourage inclusivity. However, the parade's theme was to remain "Twas The Night Before Christmas."

“The City of Charleston is an inclusive community. We want everyone to participate in this parade,” Goodwin said in a video posted to Facebook.

The decision prompted a backlash, with Republican State Senate President Mitch Carmichael urging constituents to plead with Goodwin to reverse the name change. Officials from several churches quickly criticized the decision and said they wouldn't attend.

On Thursday, Goodwin reversed her original decision "after much consideration and conversation with religious leaders from all faiths and community members."

"We understand the history and tradition of the parade and we want to continue that for years to come," she said in a statement posted to Facebook.

"I truly appreciate all the calls, emails and feedback we have received regarding the Charleston parade. However, the kind of vitriol that has come forth since announcing the change in the name of the parade has been truly disappointing and hurtful. But I do respect those individuals’ freedom to deliver that message to my doorstep," she said.

Goodwin still kept to her message of inclusivity, saying: "To be sure, this city needs everyone included. We need to be kind. We need to work together, and this administration will continue to work every day for a more inclusive community where everyone is welcome to celebrate and come together."

Carmichael praised Goodwin's change of heart, saying in a statement: "Christmas celebrates the birth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. It is a central holiday for thousands of Christians in our Capitol City and throughout West Virginia.

“I am thankful Mayor Goodwin listened to her constituents and decided to cancel her plans to rename the parade ... People of all faiths, Christian, Judaism, Islam and all other faiths, should never feel as though the government is prohibiting their ability to worship and celebrate their religion. That is what inclusion looks like and that is what West Virginia should look like."

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/charleston-west-virginia-christmas-parade-name-change

IroNat

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Th public schools shouldn't be giving out bibles or the Torah, or Book of Mormon, etc. in the first place (unless they are private schools).

Agnostic007

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Ya know Dos, I'm a lonely guy on the religion issue.
Basically,  I believe in "GOD" , but I don't belong to any religion or faith doctrine.
For me , it's pretty simple :
I look out at the night sky and accept that the universe was made by something a
lot bigger and better than humans.

Interesting position

Dos Equis

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Court rules high school football coach cannot pray on the field
By Todd Starnes
Published August 23, 2017
Fox News

A Washington state high school football coach who was punished for taking a knee at the 50-yard line for a post-game prayer violated the U.S. Constitution, according to the U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals.

A three-judge panel ruled the Bremerton School District was justified in suspending Coach Joe Kennedy after he took a knee and prayed silently at midfield after football games.

Click here for a free subscription to Todd’s newsletter: a must-read for Conservatives!

"When Kennedy kneeled and prayed on the fifty-yard line immediately after games while in view of students and parents, he spoke as a public employee, not as a private citizen, and his speech therefore was constitutionally unprotected," the 9th Circuit wrote.

Kennedy, who served as an assistant coach at Bremerton High School from 2008-2015, was ordered to refrain from bowing his head, taking a knee or doing anything that could be perceived as praying on public school property.

PODCAST: Listen to Todd interview Coach Joe Kennedy’s Attorney

To be fair – it’s not like Coach Kennedy was conducting a Billy Graham Crusade at midfield. He would simply take a knee, bow his head, thank God for a good game and 30 seconds later – he went about his business.

"An objective student observer would see an influential supervisor do something no ordinary citizen could do – perform a Christian religious act on secured school property while surrounded by players – simply because he is a coach," the judges wrote.

The evangelical Christian was suspended in 2015 when he defied school officials and continued his post-game religious ritual.

Kennedy was not rehired when his contract expired.

"This is deeply disappointing to us," First Liberty Institute attorney Jeremy Dys said on The Todd Starnes Show.

"The 9th Circuit believes they can ban all coaches from praying individually in public just because they can be seen," Dys said. "That is simply wrong. It is not American. And it is not the America contemplated by our Constitution."

First Liberty Institute said they have not yet decided whether to appeal the ruling.

"Now all coaches across the country stand under the prospect of being prevented from engaging in any outward displays of religion,” Dys told me. "That includes crossing yourself or even taking a knee to pray."

That’s right, folks – not even Catholic coaches will be allowed to cross themselves in public, the attorney said.

Welcome to the America that was fundamentally transformed by President Obama and his activist judges.

It’s a nation where football players can take a knee to disrespect the flag, but a coach can’t take a knee to pray to the Almighty.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/08/23/court-rules-high-school-football-coach-cannot-pray-on-field.html

Bremerton School Board approves settlement with coach over on-field prayer
March 17, 2023
By Seattle Times staff

The Bremerton School Board voted Thursday to accept a nearly $2 million settlement with Joseph Kennedy, a high school assistant football coach who was placed on leave in 2015 for praying on the field with players.

The unanimous approval by the five-member board comes after the Bremerton School District announced Kennedy would resume his old coaching role and return to the sidelines for the upcoming football season.

The district said last week it had reach an agreement to settle a claim for Kennedy’s attorney fees for $1,775,000.

The U.S. Supreme Court ruled last June that Kennedy’s prayer fell under his First Amendment rights to free speech and free exercise of religion. After the decision, Washington’s Office of Superintendent of Public Instruction said the ruling affirms that school employees can engage in individual prayer as long as there’s no expectation that others join and the prayer is not part of official duties.

Kennedy, who started coaching at Bremerton High School in 2008, initially prayed alone on the 50-yard line at the end of games. But students and players soon joined him, and he began giving talks with religious references.

The district asked him to stop. Kennedy and district officials disagreed about whether he complied. He was put on administrative leave at the end of the 2015 season, and a school official recommended against renewing his contract. Kennedy did not reapply for his job.

Kennedy has completed human resources paperwork, according to the district. The School Board will approve football coach contracts on Aug. 3, and Kennedy will be included in coaching staff communications and begin coaching in mid-August, the district said.

“We are thrilled that Bremerton and Coach Kennedy are back together and we hope they go undefeated,” Hiram Sasser, executive general counsel at First Liberty Institute, the legal organization that represented Kennedy, previously said in a statement.

Seattle Times staff reporter Amanda Zhou contributed to this report, which includes material from Seattle Times archives.

This story has been updated to show that Joe Kennedy was not fired as a football coach but placed on leave in 2015.

Seattle Times staff

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/bremerton-school-board-approves-settlement-with-coach-fired-for-praying/#:~:text=Bremerton%20School%20Board%20approves%20settlement%20with%20coach%20over%20on%2Dfield%20prayer,-March%2017%2C%202023&text=The%20Bremerton%20School%20Board%20voted,on%20the%20field%20with%20players.