What should a first time juicer take?

[millineum man]

This has been 100% my experience of it so far 8 weeks into my first cycle, spot on analysis from ESFitness as usual.

Only thing I would is yeah there are almost no physical sides at all but quite a few behavioral ones  and you shouldn't underestimate those cos most people think purely in terms of physical side effects like acne, hairloss etc.

For example test makes my appetite go through the roof and makes me feel so good all the time all I wanna do is party all the time and fuck bitches and that's good but not good as well if you get what I am saying. Harder to control impulses and urges like.

Also I get very short tempered quickly and you have to adjust a bit to that but nothing like people exaggerate roid users to have like "roid rage" and shit.

Like if some dude gets into a road race with me at a traffic light thinking he's being funny I am gonna win every single time where as before when I was natty I would just be like go ahead you go first I don't care etc.

How much are you using Junior, if you don't mind me asking?

[ProudVirgin69]

Why do you say that?

You might get the itch to bump it up but you can take a little test a long way. 

[Uncle Junior]

How much are you using Junior, if you don't mind me asking?

500mg test, sometimes I will go up to 750mg depending on feel.

8 weeks in absolutely no side in terms of physical sides, no hairloss, no acne, balls haven't shrunk etc (like I was so anally worried and obessed about this shit before I started I actually has test in my draw for like 6 months before I pinned)  

Only sides are:

Increased appetite (really need to control that shit)
Mild irritability (like I hate people procrastinating) and have less patience and want everything done quickly.
Insomnia (was always an insomniac anyway)
Massive increased libido (like this sounds good and it is great) but its getting bit annoying now too!  
Strength way up.
Obviously muscles and sick pumps.

[millineum man]

spot on!!!!!

MB, did you start at 250mgs or 500mgs/wk? What were the results?

[OTHstrong]

and it all ends where you end up like Phil Heath taking 2gms to cruise and looking like you are off.

Phil Heath never looks like he is off, ever. You are talking 250 at 5.9 single digits at his shittiest off-season ever, that is still fucken huge.

[millineum man]

500mg test, sometimes I will go up to 750mg depending on feel.

8 weeks in absolutely no side in terms of physical sides, no hairloss, no acne, balls haven't shrunk etc (like I was so anally worried and obessed about this shit before I started I actually has test in my draw for like 6 months before I pinned)  

Only sides are:

Increased appetite (really need to control that shit)
Mild irritability (like I hate people procrastinating) and have less patience and want everything done quickly.
Insomnia (was always an insomniac anyway)
Massive increased libido (like this sounds good and it is great) but its getting bit annoying now too!  
Strength way up.
Obviously muscles and sick pumps.

How much weight have you gained?

[millineum man]

Phil Heath never looks like he is off, ever. You are talking 250 at 5.9 single digits at his shittiest off-season ever, that is still fucken huge.

At that level, there can't be ANY off time. "Whatever it takes" mindset to be top dog, Mr Olympia...

[Uncle Junior]

How much weight have you gained?

23lb

[phil mcgroin]

Providing all products are properly dosed(which isnt likely)week1-8 40 mg dbol,500mg.deca. week9-20 500mg.test E,500mg.EQ  week21-29 250mg test prop.,350mg.tren.ace..,500mgEQ.,350mg.mast.prop

[phil mcgroin]

For the record, I couldnt give a flying fuck what esfitness takes himself to look as bad as he does, its the advice he dispenses to others, especially threads like this regarding a first ever course.
Do you realise that could cause some serious sides to a first time user?
I use 250mgs test a week, if I go to 500 I bloat and smooth over and any more than that generally feel unwell.

You also have advised in another post/thread, rather than drop your dose because of sides to take additional compounds to alleviate them?
Did it ever occur to you "sides" might be your bodies way of telling you its too much?

Just because you are a steroid "cum bucket" and they dont work on you dont presume everyone else is your genetic equal.

You must be very small. 250 mg. Just isnt enough to support much more than normal amount of muscle.Maybe for your first cycle for a few weeks it might get you adding some weight(mostly water)but not much muscle more than ordinary car salesman.With statements your making you cant be 175lbs.at 5'10 and 12%bf.prove me wrong.

[phil mcgroin]

actually, no bozo. im a 235 pound 6% male who dwarfs you. i look like a god compared to the fucking disaster you are. as of 4 weeks ago for the summer i am using 1ml of summit winstrol every other day, and a 350 mg shot of tren e/mast e/ and e every 5 days. lol 2-3 times. bitch please.

the REASON i tell other to not use the cycles you adivse isnt because im worried about anyone looking better than me, as theres always someone better than me somewhere, but because its not needed. at all. WHAT THE FUCK DOES A FIRST TIME USER NEED 2G OF GEAR FOR YOU FUCKING CLOWN? lol my god your DENSE. like DUMB. jesus.

no experience w higher doses eh? i dont know many guys who have run 2g of tren ace a week alone. i have. know why i dont 'recommend' stupidly high doses? because they are not necessary. dont talk about things you have no clue about. it only makes you look more stupid and ignorant that you already come across as being.

how you ever looked in the mirror and asked yourself why you look like shit? like have you ever wondered why the fuck dont you look good despite the shit you use?

ever think that maybe, just MAYBE your body cant utilise properly the shit your pumping yourself full of? ever think that maybe more isnt better, that being smart is better?-and no, im not going to tell you how you could be doing it better, cause your a know it all who id be wasting my words on- of course not, you wouldnt think that maybe theres something else different you could be doing. because your not smart. your a clown who thinks the be all end all is in the needle, and how many ml he can jam in his ass.

and thats why you look like shit, and so will anyone else whos unfortunate enough to listen to your stupidity

and ps dont call me a piece of shit. thats not very nice.

Allow me to take this time to honor the greatest BB to walk the planet  235@6%on about 1500mg./wk..about he size of flex wheeler when he turned pro.on 1500mg./wk WOW!  Speechless.,but not that gullable

[millineum man]

23lb

Not bad, bro. How long do you plan on staying on?

[millineum man]

Providing all products are properly dosed(which isnt likely)week1-8 40 mg dbol,500mg.deca. week9-20 500mg.test E,500mg.EQ  week21-29 250mg test prop.,350mg.tren.ace..,500mgEQ.,350mg.mast.prop

Interesting. What's your reasoning for a rookie starting with the classic Deca/Dbol stack and not Test like so many others recommend? Just trying to learn.

[Simple Simon]

You must be very small. 250 mg. Just isnt enough to support much more than normal amount of muscle.Maybe for your first cycle for a few weeks it might get you adding some weight(mostly water)but not much muscle more than ordinary car salesman.With statements your making you cant be 175lbs.at 5'10 and 12%bf.prove me wrong.

I can maintain 225 at 5'10 @10% BF.

I have posted more than enough pictures to verify it.
You might say I'm lying, who gives a fuck.

[phil mcgroin]

Interesting. What's your reasoning for a rookie starting with the classic Deca/Dbol stack and not Test like so many others recommend? Just trying to learn.

I just like the fast action of an oral to start to see positive results fast .I think primo,halo,winstrol,and most cases anavar,is a waste for a beginer.

[phil mcgroin]

I c.  maintain 225 at 5'10 @10% BF.

I have posted more than enough pictures to verify it.
You might say I'm lying, who gives a fuck.

Damn i am truely a priviledged person,yet another freak on this board 225@10% with 250mg.test. Thats pretty much natural.

[Kim Jong Bob]

I can maintain 225 at 5'10 @10% BF.

I have posted more than enough pictures to verify it.
You might say I'm lying, who gives a fuck.

ut you have trained a loooong timwe, its different with guys that balloon up in a shot timw

[BigRo]

lols at Phil Heath never looking like he's off and at 5.9 bodyfat year round

[OTHstrong]

lols at Phil Heath never looking like he's off and at 5.9 bodyfat year round

the reason people think that is because he is mr. Olympia and their brain is programmed to picture a 300lb monster but reality is if you see a gym rat weighing 250 single digits 5. 9, that is huge and Phil never goes under these number, ever, even at his worse.

[BigRo]

thought you meant 5.9 bodyfat year round not his height. Surely you see he looses muscle mass in off season though, its probably a healthier approach but gets him alot of flak.

[Simple Simon]

thought you meant 5.9 bodyfat year round not his height. Surely you see he looses muscle mass in off season though, its probably a healthier approach but gets him alot of flak.

Looks like he comes off altogether, if his latest look is cruising on 2gms then for that dosage he looks like shit.

[millineum man]

After 7 years of committed natural training the person should know their body, and how it reacts to calorie ranges, cardio, water retention, macro ratios, training frequency - high volume low volume etc.

This entire dynamic changes when you add in even 250mg test a week. For example: on 250mg test a week you would maintain way more muscle mass on a serious "cut" than you ever would naturally.

And this is why I advocate starting with low dose test only for(ever) the first year...Yes a year. At 25 if you run serious cycles until you are, let's say 30, you will never recover 100% production. Or at least you should just assume you won't because it is a side effect...You won't know until you get there. It could never recover after 1 8 week "prohormone" cycle..So why "cycle" in the first place..

If you are 15% bf or higher: 250mg test to cut down to 8%, should take 12 weeks conservatively. It will give you time to learn what test feels like, how your body reacts to it, mess around with calories etc., learn how to use syringes, sterile practices etc. The subtleties of using injectables.

Once at 8%: 500mg test 500mg EQ spend the next 20 weeks putting on 1lb of weight per week. Be patient and super consistent.

After this it is really up to the guy, do different stuff...

Some fun intermediate ones..
200 test 500 tren 75 anavar.  Get insanely strong...
200 test 2 grams of EQ. Put on actual muscle and not bloof...Lee Haney pounded EQ by the gram. Very mild stuff.
1 gram of test with 4 weeks superdrol, then dry out and cut on 250 test, and var, depleted as fuck...the week before your beach vacation, start the anadrol and carbs to fill up, pussy pulling stuff here...

The info in this post sounds pretty good.

[OTHstrong]

Looks like he comes off altogether, if his latest look is cruising on 2gms then for that dosage he looks like shit.

you are delusional if you think he comes off sustaining 20 inch arms, that is still bigger then you have ever been, think about it

[OTHstrong]

thought you meant 5.9 bodyfat year round not his height. Surely you see he looses muscle mass in off season though, its probably a healthier approach but gets him alot of flak.

oh haha, 

Ya he looses mass of course but he still is fucken huge though, we just think he is small because we are used to seeing him making the Olympia line up look weak but he still has 20 inch arms and 30 inch thigh at his all time worse off season ever, that is still big and he still smashes 4 plates on the bench at his worse off season so to say he looks like he does not take anything is outrageous.

[millineum man]

Not to get side tracked, I guess MOST will agree that a First Timer should start with 250-300mgs of Test E a week if you take the conservative route.

Others will say, 500-750mgs of Test E a week, 400-500mgs of NPP, EQ, or Tren a week and some Dbol for an aggressive approach.