New Jersey man admits to beating friend to death with 25-pound dumbbell

[The Ugly]

Can't disagree with Dorian that Blair's a POS and the Bush administration was a disgrace, though.

But I completely believe Harley's story, too.  Dude is strong as F and I don't think he'd have reason to fear DY.

Probably not a good idea to call soldiers "cowards" in NYC so soon after 9/11. Wish he'd dropped that f'n Limey.

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Shawn,
  You asked me about my opinion as to Dorian and his impact on the sport.
  I think you have seen my personal opinion as to Dorian the person and I didn't even go into his unapologetic
attitude to keeping the tattoo or having relations with his own friend's girl.
  As to his "impact on the sport," that is without reproach. 
 Lee Haney, at the time considered massive, was soon followed by an ever growing Dorian who began to rewrite the book on size.
 It's always a bit unfair to compare athletes from different eras and generations, but we must and we love to do so, myself included.
 Dorian, in my opinion, was the first modern bodybuilder to bring massive size along with being grainy to the Mr. O.  That is a very important
distinction as it set a new standard upon which all subsequent competitors, much to their chagrin, were forced to live up to.  Most never did.
 I wish to make 2 points as to the Dorian physique:
   1)  How much did those black and white photos of a pre-contest, virtually 300 pound, black sock wearing Dorian do to give him legendary
status?  I say, quite a bit.  Those are some of the most impressive and startling photos of any bodybuilder ever taken.  When those hit the cover of what
I believe was a yellow covered Flex Magazine, the bodybuilding world was seeing something for the first time.  No one had ever captured that size and
"graininess" before.  It was a first and still a standard upon which to be measured.  As far as I was concerned, Dorian had won that year's Mr. O the day
that magazine arrived in my mailbox.
  2)  I don't think any Mr. O title can be given to a competitor whose bicep is so torn and deformed as was Dorian's.  It was more than unsightly.  Given what
one could argue is a bit less than aesthetic or pleasing physique, I don't think Dorian could afford such an obvious injury (defect, if you will) and win the Mr. O in
good conscience.  That is a judging issue, not a Dorian issue.  When Dorian began further exhibiting the ravages of his brutal training (pre-Ronnie), it reaffirmed for
me that his time had come and gone.
  In the end, Dorian Yates was the first monstrosity to exhibit almost razor sharpness and a gritty-like skin condition that would make an orange peel jealous.
  For that alone, he makes the record book.
Harley

[njflex]

Dear Shawn,
  You asked me about my opinion as to Dorian and his impact on the sport.
  I think you have seen my personal opinion as to Dorian the person and I didn't even go into his unapologetic
attitude to keeping the tattoo or having relations with his own friend's girl.
  As to his "impact on the sport," that is without reproach. 
 Lee Haney, at the time considered massive, was soon followed by an ever growing Dorian who began to rewrite the book on size.
 It's always a bit unfair to compare athletes from different eras and generations, but we must and we love to do so, myself included.
 Dorian, in my opinion, was the first modern bodybuilder to bring massive size along with being grainy to the Mr. O.  That is a very important
distinction as it set a new standard upon which all subsequent competitors, much to their chagrin, were forced to live up to.  Most never did.
 I wish to make 2 points as to the Dorian physique:
   1)  How much did those black and white photos of a pre-contest, virtually 300 pound, black sock wearing Dorian do to give him legendary
status?  I say, quite a bit.  Those are some of the most impressive and startling photos of any bodybuilder ever taken.  When those hit the cover of what
I believe was a yellow covered Flex Magazine, the bodybuilding world was seeing something for the first time.  No one had ever captured that size and
"graininess" before.  It was a first and still a standard upon which to be measured.  As far as I was concerned, Dorian had won that year's Mr. O the day
that magazine arrived in my mailbox.
  2)  I don't think any Mr. O title can be given to a competitor whose bicep is so torn and deformed as was Dorian's.  It was more than unsightly.  Given what
one could argue is a bit less than aesthetic or pleasing physique, I don't think Dorian could afford such an obvious injury (defect, if you will) and win the Mr. O in
good conscience.  That is a judging issue, not a Dorian issue.  When Dorian began further exhibiting the ravages of his brutal training (pre-Ronnie), it reaffirmed for
me that his time had come and gone.
  In the end, Dorian Yates was the first monstrosity to exhibit almost razor sharpness and a gritty-like skin condition that would make an orange peel jealous.
  For that alone, he makes the record book.
Harley

POST,,,YEAH THOSE PICS WERE INCREDIBLE,,,AS STATED HERE AD NAUSEUM ONLY 1996 GRAND PRIX WAS A TRUE PRE OLYMPIA CLOSE TO STAGE CONDITION OF ALL CONSIDERED SIZE/CONDITION/FREAKINESS HE HAD IT,,HE WOULD COME IN MRO A TAD LESS FULL TO BE CONDITIONED TO WIN..PRE AND POST MR O PIC HE LOOKED CRAZY

[Al Doggity]

Someone's jealous.

Not at all. Just amused by how often the sheeple on here fall into this pattern.

[Waller]

Not at all. Just amused by how often the sheeple on here fall into this pattern.

Sheeple?  For having an interest in somebody who's life is greatly different from our own? Someone who can articulate it?

Not quite sure where you're coming from, it's just a bunch of individual guys who's interest has been peaked by the same person. It's all no Homo. 

[HarleyBreite]

Hey Waller,
  I appreciate the kind words but my life isn't really "greatly different" from anyone else's here on GetBig.
  Perhaps the only major difference is that I fall victim to having too many different passions and wishing to become accomplished
in them all and thus, failing to some degree in most endeavors.
  I had written that I am passionate about collecting cars, fighting the government, learning languages, painting, playing piano, training MMA, training BJJ and training with Craig.
  No one really asked about those things, which in a way, I am sort of glad as my failure to achieve what I want is something that plagues me quite a bit.
  I was lucky in life in that I was able to continue with my education long after I finished college.  However, I didn't start making any money until I was about 33 years old.
  I was very lucky in that I, unlike almost all my friends, wasn't married with kids or a mortgage when I first started making money.  I was single.
  It was a crazy time as my close friends owned go go bars and I had already developed a penchant for strippers with implants and then began to afford some toys.
  At about the same time, 2 of my closest friends ran the hottest clubs in Las Vegas, Pure and then Prive.  What most guys don't understand about living like a rock star is
that it isn't all about the money, it's about the ACCESS.  I wasn't rich, but I had access.  Access to everything and I indulged (but not in recreational drugs). 
  I am not saying that anyone else should emulate what I did, but for me, it was the right thing to do and I did it for many many years and sometimes, still do.
  I am just a guy struggling with age, fighting the psyche that if I don't have abs then I am worthless, trying to understand the needless stupidity and interference of others
on my quiet life and last but not least, trying to figure out the female mindset.
Harley

[King Shizzo]

Harley making up for lost time in this thread.

[Waller]

Hey Waller,
  I appreciate the kind words but my life isn't really "greatly different" from anyone else's here on GetBig.
  Perhaps the only major difference is that I fall victim to having too many different passions and wishing to become accomplished
in them all and thus, failing to some degree in most endeavors.
  I had written that I am passionate about collecting cars, fighting the government, learning languages, painting, playing piano, training MMA, training BJJ and training with Craig.
  No one really asked about those things, which in a way, I am sort of glad as my failure to achieve what I want is something that plagues me quite a bit.
  I was lucky in life in that I was able to continue with my education long after I finished college.  However, I didn't start making any money until I was about 33 years old.
  I was very lucky in that I, unlike almost all my friends, wasn't married with kids or a mortgage when I first started making money.  I was single.
  It was a crazy time as my close friends owned go go bars and I had already developed a penchant for strippers with implants and then began to afford some toys.
  At about the same time, 2 of my closest friends ran the hottest clubs in Las Vegas, Pure and then Prive.  What most guys don't understand about living like a rock star is
that it isn't all about the money, it's about the ACCESS.  I wasn't rich, but I had access.  Access to everything and I indulged (but not in recreational drugs). 
  I am not saying that anyone else should emulate what I did, but for me, it was the right thing to do and I did it for many many years and sometimes, still do.
  I am just a guy struggling with age, fighting the psyche that if I don't have abs then I am worthless, trying to understand the needless stupidity and interference of others
on my quiet life and last but not least, trying to figure out the female mindset.
Harley

Ok, I can't speak for anyone else but it's certainly greatly different from mine. Bodybuilding is the common interest here, you're mingling with the pros. Not many here have that chance. You're in an interesting career, I can appreciate the intellectual aspect of the work you do. It's much more interesting for me to talk about than my unfulfilling job. Plus you manage to pursue other personal goals.

And on that last goal? Save your time  

[Al Doggity]

Sheeple?  For having an interest in somebody who's life is greatly different from our own? Someone who can articulate it?

Not quite sure where you're coming from, it's just a bunch of individual guys who's interest has been peaked by the same person. It's all no Homo. 

Having an interest in someone else's life is fine. Complimenting someone is fine. I'm sure he has plenty more great storyies, but getbig tends to take stuff like this to a bizarre, eyeroll worthy extreme. He's friends with a pro-bodybuilder and has met some pros, but why are so many members suddenly clamoring  for his opinion on what certain pros mean in the history of bodybuilding? Why did Shnauzer need Harley's approval to be a fan of Dorian's? Why did Rascal think he had some special insight into how long Phil will be Mr. O?   I actually think  Craig Richardson has a great physique, but if he started an AMA thread here a week ago, no one would have cared. Yet his training partner got his picture in the paper and people are lining up to ask his opinion and acting like his posts are bodybuilding gospel.  That's not meant as a slam against Harley, just the sheep mentality this place frequently exhibits.

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Lurker,
  You has asked me previously, "Have you ever defended someone and got them acquitted even though you knew yourself that they were guilty?  How did you feel about this?  When (or if) they then went on to do another awful crime like murder, rape, aggravated assault, did it weigh on your conscience that they were allowed to commit this crime due to the fact they were walking around free because of your efforts?"

  I promised I would answer honestly so here goes:
  When clients come in for the consult (or I go to the jail to do it), they almost never admit to the crime nor do I ask them.  I actually don't care if they committed the crime.  My intent is to test
the State's evidence and their methods in gathering their evidence so as to make sure they don't cheat.  It is the State's burden to prove someone's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt and that is
a far cry from the Probable Cause required to just levy the charge, at least it is when I take on a case.  I previously wrote about why it's important to have someone stand up on the Defendant's
behalf and ensure that the Accussor has not violated the rules or laws and is not guided by a mob mentality or some presently politically correct and popular movement or worse, some racist theme.
  The truth however is, that an overwhelming percentage of those charged with serious crimes are in fact, guilty as charged.  Few lawyers like to publicly say that but it is true.  But again, for me, it's
how the government goes about their job that matters to me.  I don't spend any time thinking about the heinous details of what my clients did.
  I have handled around 35 homicide defendants and what they do if they are acquitted is not my fault.  It's the fault of the State.  It is the State that was so sure my client murdered someone, not me.
  If they are so sure and they have endless resources, then they should be able to convince 12 jurors beyond a reasonable doubt.  
  I would love to think that each time I won a trial (and no lawyer wins every trial - - that is all Hollywood) it was because of my "efforts" as you write, but that is simply untrue.
  The State is responsible in a very major part of how a trial goes down and many times, I am forced to react to the wave they send in motion.  The better the Prosecutor, the better the investigation,
the better is the testimony of the State's witness, then the more difficult it is for me to win, regardless of all my "efforts."
  However, for me, trials consist of literally 20 hour days (usually 3-4 days per week) and some can last as long as 4 months.  I had a client wait in jail for 4 years for his trial to begin and then
we spent 4 months trying the case before a jury.  The jury was hung at 11-1 Not Guilty and a Mistrial was declared which is a victory for the defense (State v. Paul Stafford- Passaic County Superior
Court- for those auditing me).  During that trial, I had casually asked Paul, in private at counsel table, why it was that he did his whole 6 year sentence just 3 months before being released and allegedly
slitting the throat and killing his hooker girlfriend.  Most guys get paroled early but not Paul.  Paul was sentenced to 6 years due to a very bad Aggravated Assault.  Paul, in response to my question,
calmly leaned over and told me "same thing as here."   I asked what happened to the inmate he stabbed and Paul just shook his head, meaning the other guy had died too.
  Why does the State even let someone like that out?  I don't have the answer for that.  Perhaps the previous Prosecutor should not have offered Paul a sweet deal, worked his ass off and tried the case
before a jury.
  In the end, we all exercise some free will and the fact that these guys, some of them, repeat their hideous crimes doesn't fall on my conscience.   It isn't my job to put them away.  It's my job
to test the State's evidence.
  I have no guilt about what I do and how well I do it.  People pay a premium to have the best and if they pay for it, they should not only expect the best but also, receive it.
Harley

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Al Doggity,
  You wrote: Having an interest in someone else's life is fine. Complimenting someone is fine. I'm sure he has plenty more great storyies, but getbig tends to take stuff like this to a bizarre, eyeroll worthy extreme. He's friends with a pro-bodybuilder and has met some pros, but why are so many members suddenly clamoring  for his opinion on what certain pros mean in the history of bodybuilding? Why did Shnauzer need Harley's approval to be a fan of Dorian's? Why did Rascal think he had some special insight into how long Phil will be Mr. O?  Roll Eyes I actually think  Craig Richardson has a great physique, but if he started an AMA thread here a week ago, no one would have cared. Yet his training partner got his picture in the paper and people are lining up to ask his opinion and acting like his posts are bodybuilding gospel.  That's not meant as a slam against Harley, just the sheep mentality this place frequently exhibits.

  I don't think anyone here takes my opinion on the history of bodybuilding any more seriously than they take anyone else's opinion on any other topic.  I think it was a call to go on a new and different topic.
  Seems to me that Schnauzer was going to like Dorian no matter how much I dislike Dorian and I still dislike Dorian.  I have no special insights except for many years of experience and being on the "other
side of the rope" for many conversations between the powers to be and the competitors.  That doesn't make me special, but it gives me a bit of insight not always found.
  As far as no one caring about Craig posting something, I initially came to this site to learn more about bodybuilding in all its aspects, good and bad.  Why wouldn't we want pros coming on here and giving us
tips and advice, as long as they were honest?  Wouldn't that save some of us a great deal of time, energy and money?  From whom should we get advice?  The guy who owns a supplement company who is actually selling us more sugar than he claims? 
  My posts are nothing close to gospel and I didn't even know my picture was on GetBig until Craig told me.  He loves you guys. 
  Perhaps any interest in what I have to say is solely because I'm a new voice and by next week, no one will care as to what I pontificate or what knowledge I have about losing body fat or
anything else.  That is kool too.  I just came back on because I thought it was a funny coincidence that my legal career makes this site and not my relationship with Craig.
  I appreciate your comments but I think people are just having a good time with a new voice on some dog days of August.
Harley

[Al Doggity]

'Fraid not, Harley. The pattern repeats itself way too often. I never said that your posts were gospel, just that certain posters were acting like they were. New voices pop up all the time, but there is a very clear tendency for a lot of guys around here to want to become followers of certain posters. I actually had a discussion about this with another member just last week, but the thread was deleted. The same type of hero worship mentality that led to GH15 gaining so many fans and eventually starting his own board was transferring itself onto you. In case you are unaware, GH15 was an anonymous poster who may or may not have been a pro bodybuilder and at some points was almost certainly a shared gimmick account between certain regular posters. It's one of several times many members on the boards creamed themselves into a fan frenzy.

And I wasn't criticizing Craig. I thought I made that clear. But if he had posted here, most would have criticized his competitive history, called him all drugs, bashed him if he gave training advice without giving his drug protocol, etc. In theory, it would be great to have pros as part of the regular community, but the fact that you don't know why that isn't the case highlights just how little time you've spent on this board. 

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Al Goggity,
  I do confess to not having spent great time here nor do I know of the history of GH15.
  I appreciate you telling me this.
  I can assure you that I have no agenda.  I am so bad with computers that I need to hire my "Computer Guy" to teach me how to post photos here.
  I can also assure you that I am not running from GetBig with a fan base to start my own site.
  I am NOT saying you said I would do any of this, I am merely pointing out that my motives here are different.
  As far as not giving "drug protocol", I never said I would not discuss drugs.  They are an integral part of the competitive sport.
  As an attorney, however, I would put any personal experience in the "hypothetical" for obvious reasons but I think you could forgive that.
  As far as drugs, most guys completely miss the boat on what is true.  But again, where would you get honest information about that?  From the
"chemist" making it in his basement?  One of my degrees is in Bio-Chemistry and I can tell you that anyone making gear in his own house has some
real issues regarding impurities and cleanliness.  Real labs are very sterile and clean, not like the meth labs you see on fictional television programs.
  As a side note, my Ph.D. dissertation was an ethnography of at that time, the East Coast largest steroid dealer.  Fascinating stuff, in my opinion.
  Quite unlike the psycho babble Alan Klein wrote in his "Little Big Men: Bodybuilding Subculture and Gender Construction."  If you believe Klein, we are all
gay, hate our dads and can't have loving relationships and also, can only talk to one another while facing a mirror.  I thought he was a real pompous ass.
Harley

[Al Doggity]

Harley, man, you don't have to explain anything to me. I have nothing against you personally,and even if I did, who gives a shit?  I'm not one of the more well-known members and people argue around here all the time. My point wasn't really about your behavior, but about others.

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Al Doggity,
  The fact that you are, as you put it, "not one of the more well-known members.." is irrelevant to me.
  Everyone's voice is equal and should be heard.  I wanted to respond so that you knew that I not only ready your post but
didn't dismiss it.  Popularity contests ended when I was "released" from high school.
  I like your views.
Harley

[King Shizzo]

Harley for mod of the training board.

[SF1900]

Harley,

What made you decide to start posting again on getbig?

[Army of One]

Harley for official pro bono Getbig exclusive lawyer, Groink already has him on speed dial

[Schnauzer]

Having an interest in someone else's life is fine. Complimenting someone is fine. I'm sure he has plenty more great storyies, but getbig tends to take stuff like this to a bizarre, eyeroll worthy extreme. He's friends with a pro-bodybuilder and has met some pros, but why are so many members suddenly clamoring  for his opinion on what certain pros mean in the history of bodybuilding? Why did Shnauzer need Harley's approval to be a fan of Dorian's? Why did Rascal think he had some special insight into how long Phil will be Mr. O?   I actually think  Craig Richardson has a great physique, but if he started an AMA thread here a week ago, no one would have cared. Yet his training partner got his picture in the paper and people are lining up to ask his opinion and acting like his posts are bodybuilding gospel.  That's not meant as a slam against Harley, just the sheep mentality this place frequently exhibits.

Fuck you. I asked Harley for his opinion on Dorian because of his past beef with him. That's not "asking for approval to be a fan", dipshit. Go fuck yourself, Al Doggityshit.

[Al Doggity]

Fuck you. I asked Harley for his opinion on Dorian because of his past beef with him. That's not "asking for approval to be a fan", dipshit. Go fuck yourself, Al Doggityshit.

 What did you want to hear from him?   You said you were a fan of Dorian's and he was a huge inspiration to you... why did Harley's opinion matter to you?  It would be one thing if you had asked for more details about the disagreement, but you asked about what he thought of Dorian and his impact on the sport. It just seemed strange. You already knew what his impact on the sport was.

[HarleyBreite]

Dear SF 1900,
   You asked why I started posting again and the answer is that Craig called me and said there was a picture of me on GetBig.
   I immediately panicked figuring it was one of me quite over-weight but I went ahead and looked.
   I began laughing at the comments about my hair but felt I needed to 1)  Let you guys know that the attorney was actually a "GetBigger" at least in spirit and
2)  I'm no Public Defender.
   I must say that the positive response is something that completely surprised me and would've bet my house against (actually, I live with my Mom- - I've always lived with
my parents but my Dad passed last year).
   Warmed by the positive response and wishing to corroborate the fact that it was really me and not some imposter (which I still couldn't figure out why anyone would impersonate
me) I wrote back a few times.  Once I was asked a question, I felt I should respond so I did.
   Now that you guys know I live with my Mom, I am sure the crushing will begin.  I will say, in my defense, I live here by choice.  I could afford my own place.
   Oh, I also just remembered one reason I left GetBig and didn't want to come back.  Some guy named TBombz kept attacking every single thing I said and then insisted I was gay.
I have no problem with gay people and wish them all the best but the fact is, I am not gay.  As I mentioned, I have a terrible addiction for strippers with implants which is well known
by all those around me.  I guess I should expect TBombz to come at me again.  Oh well.
Harley

[King Shizzo]

I sense many breite days ahead for Getbig.

[Schnauzer]

What did you want to hear from him?   You said you were a fan of Dorian's and he was a huge inspiration to you... why did Harley's opinion matter to you?  It would be one thing if you had asked for more details about the disagreement, but you asked about what he thought of Dorian and his impact on the sport. It just seemed strange. You already knew what his impact on the sport was.

What's so strange about two gym rats discussing Dorian? I know what his impact is, I asked Harley for his opinion about it. Not hard to understand. I talk about the same shit in the gym with my friends. Does that seem "strange" to you, also?

[King Shizzo]

Harley for official pro bono Getbig exclusive lawyer, Groink already has him on speed dial

I get a bono just looking at his pics.

[Al Doggity]

What's so strange about two gym rats discussing Dorian? I know what his impact is, I asked Harley for his opinion about it. Not hard to understand. I talk about the same shit in the gym with my friends. Does that seem "strange" to you, also?

LOL In the context of what was going on in the thread, yes, it did seem strange. It was not just a shoot-the-shit type of thing. It had already turned into an AMA and even the way the question was phrased and your follow-up were so OTT reverential. Maybe you talk that way to your friends?