How much protein is really needed

[BBSSchlemiel]

Great books that address the protein love affair of the past century:
How Much Protein? by Brad Pilon
Proteinaholic by Dr. Garth Davis
The Mucusless Diet by Arnold Ehret (inspired Steve Jobs to take on a fruitarian diet, hence the name Apple)

[local hero]

If you are natural a gram per pound of lean mass is more than sufficient.

I don't agree.... I eat the same on and off... I cant imagine how much more you would shrink if you never, love to see some of the low protein monsters in action ( kinda homo )

[BBSSchlemiel]

... love to see some of the low protein monsters in action ( kinda homo )

You have: Nasser el Sonbaty, Mike Mentzer, Danny Padilla, Tom Platz. Take a look at some old timers' diets and you will see a lack of obsession with protein. Bill Pearl ate 0.5 g/lb.

[Grape Ape]

Why don't they count considering all the items you listed provide protein/amino acids, and even in the case of incomplete ones, the body is quite efficient at storing and recycling amino acids and even ones from our own muscle tissue?

There have always been men and still are those who have great mass and strength who do not go by the played-out, unscientific recommendation of one gram of bro-tein per pound or more.

I didn't say they didn't count.

I said I didn't count them.

For no reason, other than I didn't want to.

And, I only posted that I didn't do it to see who would respond to it like you did.  It's not like this hasn't been discussed 1000x times here.  Best legs in bodybuilding and how much protein......

[ritch]

Too bad the people you listed did not follow higher protein diets, they could have all done better as good as they were.

Still not pic from you though, huh pussy boy? Didn't think so... The "excuse" of being anonomous is bullshit. Just a mirror selfie, doN't need to see your ugly ass face anyway.

[Henda]

You cannot use the exception to prove the rule, Just because a few professional bodybuilders with way above average genetics MAY have ate low protein dosent mean we all can, they are the minority just amongst the pros never mind the population as a whole.

Simple trial and error will show anyone that a higher protein intake is very beneficial, despite what some wanker says in his book or crackhead Mike mentzer thought up as he ran about naked who we know is full of shit and didn't even train the way he preached.

[BBSSchlemiel]

Too bad the people you listed did not follow higher protein diets, they could have all done better as good as they were.

Still not pic from you though, huh pussy boy? Didn't think so... The "excuse" of being anonomous is bullshit. Just a mirror selfie, doN't need to see your ugly ass face anyway.

The excuse of being a flaming tough guy behind a computer screen without the risk of verbal and/or physical confrontation is the real bitch move, especially when not even confronted initially on this board. You just got into a huge crybaby hissy fit over a statement about, of all things, dietary habits, typical of the lost and confused gym bitch who believes people should watch their p's and q's around him because he goes to a fucking gym.

[BBSSchlemiel]

You cannot use the exception to prove the rule, Just because a few professional bodybuilders with way above average genetics MAY have ate low protein dosent mean we all can, they are the minority just amongst the pros never mind the population as a whole.

Simple trial and error will show anyone that a higher protein intake is very beneficial, despite what some wanker says in his book or crackhead Mike mentzer thought up as he ran about naked who we know is full of shit and didn't even train the way he preached.

And you happen to know the intakes of every individual who lifts. How did you get this ability and insight? I mean, they MAY have eaten higher amounts as well.

[Henda]

And you happen to know the intakes of every individual who lifts. How did you get this ability and insight? I mean, they MAY have eaten higher amounts as well.

Stupid childish response that I cannot be bothered to debate.
Fuck you

[oldtimer1]

The protein obsession started with the early Weider and Hoffman bodybuilding magazines. It gave them some snake oil to sell and promote.

When I finally started making real money at 24 so I could afford any supplement I desired. I used all of them. I had all the various containers that I would consume like a mad scientist. I was in amazing fitness shape if I can say so myself. I'm pretty sure now that all the supplements contributed nothing to that. It's just psychologically addicting in the fact that some where there is some insecurity that I could be wrong. Maybe all those tubs of protein and pills did make a difference? I am finally down to a really cheap multivitamin and tub of Orgain protein powder that I just use immediately after a weight workout. I just might get rid of everything.

Have you ever met someone who was sick because of a certified vitamin deficiency? I know it happens but I don't personally know of anyone.

[BBSSchlemiel]

The protein obsession started with the early Weider and Hoffman bodybuilding magazines. It gave them some snake oil to sell and promote.

When I finally started making real money at 24 so I could afford any supplement I desired. I used all of them. I had all the various containers that I would consume like a mad scientist. I was in amazing fitness shape if I can say so myself. I'm pretty sure now that all the supplements contributed nothing to that. It's just psychologically addicting in the fact that some where there is some insecurity that I could be wrong. Maybe all those tubs of protein and pills did make a difference? I am finally down to a really cheap multivitamin and tub of Orgain protein powder that I just use immediately after a weight workout. I just might get rid of everything.

Have you ever met someone who was sick because of a certified vitamin deficiency? I know it happens but I don't personally know of anyone.

Yes, several, considering my line of work. But amongst ordinary people outside of work, NONE, unless they had a disease  making vitamin metabolism impaired.

Speaking of protein, a protein deficiency is pretty much impossible so long as someone eats enough calories on a diet with good food. choices.

[kreator]

you only need enough protein

[ritch]

The excuse of being a flaming tough guy behind a computer screen without the risk of verbal and/or physical confrontation is the real bitch move, especially when not even confronted initially on this board. You just got into a huge crybaby hissy fit over a statement about, of all things, dietary habits, typical of the lost and confused gym bitch who believes people should watch their p's and q's around him because he goes to a fucking gym.

Just prove me wrong man, prove a pic of yourself, this is your chance. This has nothing to do with being tough, not my fault you feel intimidated here. Just calling you out for the fool you are and you feel threatened.

Yawn, goodbye now...

[Grape Ape]

Speaking of protein, a protein deficiency is pretty much impossible so long as someone eats enough calories on a diet with good food. choices.

This makes sense for normal eating.

[BBSSchlemiel]

Just prove me wrong man, prove a pic of yourself, this is your chance. This has nothing to do with being tough, not my fault you feel intimidated here. Just calling you out for the fool you are and you feel threatened.

Yawn, goodbye now...

Take care.

[Griffith]

Don't we just need to have a surplus of a few hundred calories over our maintenance level to build muscle...?

This is what Mike Mentzer argued in his Heavy Duty diet.

[OB1]

The protein obsession started with the early Weider and Hoffman bodybuilding magazines. It gave them some snake oil to sell and promote.

This.

[liberalismo]

People always talk about specific amounts of protein necessary but no one ever posts scientific studies showing how much protein a person needs per lb of body mass.

In truth, calculating 1 gram per KG of body mass makes no sense. Fat doesn't use protein. Muscle does. A better usage would be 1 gram per KG of LEAN bodymass. I.E. after your fat is gone what you weigh.

But people consuming 200+ grams of protein really aren't helping themselves. There's no scientific evidence supporting the claim you need that much protein. People just eat it because they don't know better and they think it works for them. In reality they're just wasting calories. Unused protein breaks down in the kidneys and causes damage.

http://www.livescience.com/8086-protein-supplement-myth-revealed-body-work.html

[ritch]

People always talk about specific amounts of protein necessary but no one ever posts scientific studies showing how much protein a person needs per lb of body mass.

In truth, calculating 1 gram per KG of body mass makes no sense. Fat doesn't use protein. Muscle does. A better usage would be 1 gram per KG of LEAN bodymass. I.E. after your fat is gone what you weigh.

But people consuming 200+ grams of protein really aren't helping themselves. There's no scientific evidence supporting the claim you need that much protein. People just eat it because they don't know better and they think it works for them. In reality they're just wasting calories. Unused protein breaks down in the kidneys and causes damage.

http://www.livescience.com/8086-protein-supplement-myth-revealed-body-work.html

Gonna take a fuck load of protein to damage kidneys in healthy people. You speak of bodybuilders not knowing exact amounts to take yet you can't even provide an exact number of protein it takes to harm a person.

Great post man!

[cephissus]

From 100 to 500 grams a day, I never 'noticed' a single difference.

'Noticed' feeling 'stronger' with more protein... Ffs, how can you isolate 'protein' out of the 500 billion other processes that your life consists of.

Do you live in a laboratory?

[Henda]

From 100 to 500 grams a day, I never 'noticed' a single difference.

'Noticed' feeling 'stronger' with more protein... Ffs, how can you isolate 'protein' out of the 500 billion other processes that your life consists of.

Do you live in a laboratory?

So you not noticing a difference could not have been due to 500 billion other processes either or does that only apply to us idiots who feel stronger on more protein?

Eating disorders is a woman's problem and you got one

[BBSSchlemiel]

People always talk about specific amounts of protein necessary but no one ever posts scientific studies showing how much protein a person needs per lb of body mass.

Largely because the science is all over the freaking place, with experiments being done with very low intakes, down to 20 to 30 grams, all the way up to 150 and 3 g/kg.

So no one knows exactly.

[MAXX]

depends on several different factors... you cant say everyone needs 1 g/ lbs. That's the simplification and reasoning of a complete moron...lean mass, training styles, metabolism, drugs, all these factors come in to play...

for the average chump 200 grams may be good enough for optimal gains

for a larger gymrat with some respectable mass 300+ grams is not unlikely.

and for the that ifbb massmonsters 500+ grams of protein is not unlikely either

[Tha Grim Lifter]

Eating huge amounts of protein is like Religion. It's been around so long everyone believes it.

What OldTimer said above is correct (for once  ). Weider and Hoffman started it because before that all they made money off was Barbell Sets and Magazines and a Barbell Set can last forever. They needed turnover and they got rich off the supplements. It's been bullshit for 70 years. Do you really think Weider knows what he's talking about? He was in anything to make a buck and said whatever he needed to in order to do that.

First two years I trained I gained the most muscle (as anyone would) and wasn't eating excess protein. After that I started and it made zero difference it was just paranoia from magazines. Ever since I've dropped it down I notice no loss in muscle, I feel better not eating all the fucking time.

[cephissus]

So you not noticing a difference could not have been due to 500 billion other processes either or does that only apply to us idiots who feel stronger on more protein?

That's exactly my point

Anything else