Black lives matter!

[SF1900]

By race?  Certainly.

You did not specify by race making me raise this question.  Do you really think people are equally born with the same brain capacities?   Really?  

Yeah, well, who has the time to look through hundreds of thousands of studies. The only study that I found relevant was this one:

Brain size, IQ, and racial-group differences: Evidence from musculoskeletal traits

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016028960200137X

And this doesn't list the ages of people studied. If people are born with different brain capacities, then we would have to understand the brain capacities of infants, from pretty much day one, in order to determine if people are BORN with different brain capacities. I don't know how that would be possible. If the results of the above study are true, and it was done on adult populations, how do we know a smaller brain present was at birth or due to environmental circumstances? What was this literature they reviewed in terms of age? Also, you do realize that ALL peer-reviewed studies are REQUIRED to post at the end of the study something called, "Limitations of the Study." This helps the reader better understand how limitations of the study may have confounded results. I'd also need to read that.

[SF1900]

Clearly, environmental factors affect intra-uterine development:

http://www.popline.org/node/304362

The brain is the organ at greatest risk during intrauterine life, since it is the first organ to complete hyperplastic growth. Placental metabolic functions are critical in early pregnancy to providing nutrition and energy to the developing conceptus and the placenta itself, while placental endocrine activities are important to maintaining pregnancy and inducing metabolic adaptations in the mother and fetus. Premature infants face both possible nutritional deficits and lack of placental nourishment, placing them at increased risk of neuro-developmental disorders, especially if they are also low birth weight.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3837231/

The fetal brain is highly plastic and is not only receptive to but requires cues from its environment to develop properly. Based on an understanding of evolutionary biology, developmental plasticity, and life history theory, one can predict that stressors are an important environmental condition that may influence brain development. In fact, the available empirical evidence appears to support the notion that exposure to excess stress in intrauterine life has the potential to adversely affect short- and long-term neurodevelopmental outcomes with implications for altered susceptibility for mental health disorders in childhood and adult life. In this presentation, we provide a rationale for proposing that endocrine and inflammatory stress mediators are key candidate pathways for programming brain development.

[The True Adonis]

So, go ahead and provide the studies.

1) I never said that babies are born a Blank State. In fact, most social scientists do not agree with the Blank State.  The majority agree that babies are born with distinct temperament styles, which is highly ingrained. See the work of Thomas and Chess and other Temperament theorists.

2) My hypothesis, which has overwhelming evidence, is that cultural affects brain functioning and structure. It's true, even if you do not want to accept this fact. How that interacts with naturally occurring abilities, well, Id have to do the research.

3) We would also need to know how intra-uterine exposure to a variety of circumstances, which affects the mother, also affect the babies development inside the womb. There is overwhelming evidence that parental factors affects the brain development of the baby in the womb. I am one who rarely ever puts 100% stock in genetics or environment.

1. Why would you concede that blacks have different genetic traits every where else, but stop short at the brain?  Does not make sense.

2. Both have an impact.  Environment and genetics.  Why is that so difficult to understand?  Why would you think genetics do not play any role?  

3.  Again genetics.  Whatever happens or does not happen intra-uterine is a result of a genetic response.  Just like anything else.

4. Genetics determine everything. We can certainly try and act against our genetics and change behaviors to subvert our genetics or take medication or use devices that circumvent genetics, but at the end of the day, it always comes down to genetics and the battle against them.

[The True Adonis]

Clearly, environmental factors affect intra-uterine development:

http://www.popline.org/node/304362

The brain is the organ at greatest risk during intrauterine life, since it is the first organ to complete hyperplastic growth. Placental metabolic functions are critical in early pregnancy to providing nutrition and energy to the developing conceptus and the placenta itself, while placental endocrine activities are important to maintaining pregnancy and inducing metabolic adaptations in the mother and fetus. Premature infants face both possible nutritional deficits and lack of placental nourishment, placing them at increased risk of neuro-developmental disorders, especially if they are also low birth weight.

I think they oughta look at the intelligence of Jews being born right before World War II and right after World War II which would basically shit all over that hypothesis.  (nobody had anything to eat still, yet Jews and their intelligence remained).

I am not saying there is no water in your theory, I just don't think it accounts for as much as you think it does.  Jews laugh at your attempt. 

[The True Adonis]

Yeah, well, who has the time to look through hundreds of thousands of studies. The only study that I found relevant was this one:

Brain size, IQ, and racial-group differences: Evidence from musculoskeletal traits

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016028960200137X

And this doesn't list the ages of people studied. If people are born with different brain capacities, then we would have to understand the brain capacities of infants, from pretty much day one, in order to determine if people are BORN with different brain capacities. I don't know how that would be possible. If the results of the above study are true, and it was done on adult populations, how do we know a smaller brain present was at birth or due to environmental circumstances? What was this literature they reviewed in terms of age? Also, you do realize that ALL peer-reviewed studies are REQUIRED to post at the end of the study something called, "Limitations of the Study." This helps the reader better understand how limitations of the study may have confounded results. I'd also need to read that.

Maybe your brain is not capable of sifting through so much information.  

How about a 30 year Meta-analysis.
https://www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf
THIRTY YEARS OF RESEARCH ON RACE
DIFFERENCES IN COGNITIVE ABILITY

Psychology, Public Policy, and Law
2005, Vol. 11, No. 2, 235–294
Copyright 2005 by the American Psychological Association
1076-8971/05/$12.00    DOI:  10.1037/1076-8971.11.2.235

The  new  evidence  reviewed  here  points  to  some  genetic  component  in
Black–White differences in mean IQ.

Denial  of  any  genetic  component  in  human  variation,
including between groups, is not only poor science, it is likely to be injurious both
to unique individuals and to the complex structure of societies.

[SF1900]

Maybe your brain is not capable of sifting through so much information. 

How about a 30 year Meta-analysis.
https://www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf
THIRTY YEARS OF RESEARCH ON RACE
DIFFERENCES IN COGNITIVE ABILITY

Psychology, Public Policy, and Law
2005, Vol. 11, No. 2, 235–294
Copyright 2005 by the American Psychological Association
1076-8971/05/$12.00    DOI:  10.1037/1076-8971.11.2.235

Denial  of  any  genetic  component  in  human  variation,
including between groups, is not only poor science, it is likely to be injurious both
to unique individuals and to the complex structure of societies.

Nope, I am also working on grant writing. Some of us have to work for a living, Adam.  I don't have time to sift through 350K journal articles.

[The True Adonis]

Nope, I am also working on grant writing. Some of us have to work for a living, Adam.  I don't have time to sift through 350K journal articles.

Maybe you oughta improve your reading speed instead. 

[SF1900]

Maybe you oughta improve your reading speed instead. 

I actually do not have the best reading speed. I am not in a speed reading competition. I read at my desk, quietly and alone. There is no sense in speed reading through a book. Those days are over when I was cramming for college tests and needed to read X amount of pages for a test.

[SF1900]

1. Why would you concede that blacks have different genetic traits every where else, but stop short at the brain?  Does not make sense.

2. Both have an impact.  Environment and genetics.  Why is that so difficult to understand?  Why would you think genetics do not play any role?  

3.  Again genetics.  Whatever happens or does not happen intra-uterine is a result of a genetic response.  Just like anything else.

4. Genetics determine everything. We can certainly try and act against our genetics and change behaviors to subvert our genetics or take medication or use devices that circumvent genetics, but at the end of the day, it always comes down to genetics and the battle against them.

1) I never said it stopped at the brain. Temperament is often determined by biological and genetic components. I didn't know I had to spell it out for you.

2) Nice trolling. I just said I never put 100% stock on genetics or environment. Read above, more closely. Failed attempt at trolling. I never said genetics was not a factor. I was offering a counter-opinion, that is all. Again, trolling attempt = fail. I specifically said, "I am one who rarely ever puts 100% stock in genetics or environment." Meaning, I don't think its 100% genetics or 100% environment. In fact, throughout my time on getbig, I have often said life is a mixture of genetics and environment.

3) I'd have to do more research on this, so I cannot comment on it. I am not the typical getbigger. I like to actually read and learn before forming an opinion.

4. You just said that everything is a mixture of genetics and environment, now you're saying that genetics determine everything. Make up your mind. Since most of life is a mixture of genetics vs. environment, I would hardly agree that its a fight purely against genetics, unless you can provide evidence of this. Ive seen first hand how the changing of environments can alter a persons behavior (as well as evidence).

[The True Adonis]

1) I never said it stopped at the brain. Temperament is often determined by biological and genetic components. I didn't know I had to spell it out for you.  

2) Nice trolling. I just said I never put 100% stock on brain or environment. Read above, more closely. Failed attempt at trolling. I never said genetics was not a factor. I was offering a counter-opinion, that is all. Again, trolling attempt = fail. I specifically said, " I am one who rarely ever puts 100% stock in genetics or environment." Meaning, I don't think its 100% genetics or 100% environment.

3) I'd have to do more research on this, so I cannot comment on it. I am not the typical getbigger. I like to actually read and learn before forming an opinion.

4. You just said that everything is a mixture of genetics and environment, now you're saying that genetics determine everything. Make up your mind. Since most of life is a mixture of genetics vs. environment, I would hardly agree that its a fight purely against genetics, unless you can provide evidence of this.

4. Everything.  Without DNA, you do not exist.  We are DNA first and foremost.  All of our biology is rooted in it.  Our bodies are just hosts essentially for these selfish genes.  We can mitigate or enhance genetic expression as I noted earlier, but at the end of the day, all we are doing is wrestling with our own DNA, adjusting it as necessary to fit whatever environment we find ourselves in-biologically as well as socially/environmentally.

[SF1900]

4. Everything.  Without DNA, you do not exist.  We are DNA first and foremost.  All of our biology is rooted in it.  Our bodies are just hosts essentially for these selfish genes.  We can mitigate or enhance genetic expression as I noted earlier, but at the end of the day, all we are doing is wrestling with our own DNA, adjusting it as necessary to fit whatever environment we find ourselves in-biologically as well as socially/environmentally.

4. Well, exactly, the environment can mitigate genetic expression. This is why a baby may be born with an anxious predisposition, but may not become anxious person later in life, if they grew up in a home that provided appropriate soothing and comfort. The environment can mitigate the babies genetics. On the other hand, a baby may not have a genetic predisposition for anxiety, but experiencing enough trauma in the home, will alter the babies biological system, thus creating an anxious person later in life. Children that experience trauma often have higher heart rate and pulse than children who do not experience trauma. Whether or not these children would have these physical ailments, despite trauma, well, its hard to say. However, RCTs have been done, which has included children with trauma and children without trauma (control group).

I do not necessarily agree that we always fight against our genetics. The environment has a powerful impact on the individual. Sometimes changing the context will have drastic implications for behavior. Criminology research shows that when a person is released from prison, and move 20+ miles away from their home, recidivism rates drastically drop. These ex-convicts have the same genetics, but its the same genetics within a different environment. Now, how much are they struggling against the genetic predisposition in these new environments, well, I do not know. But clear, a different social context is modifying their behavior to a certain degree ( to the point of not going back to prison). I guess the real question is: how will they respond in this new environment if they are faced with a situation that would trigger their criminal behavior?

[The True Adonis]

4. Well, exactly, the environment can mitigate genetic expression. This is why a baby may be born with an anxious predisposition, but may not become anxious person later in life, if they grew up in a home that provided appropriate soothing and comfort. The environment can mitigate the babies genetics. On the other hand, a baby may not have a genetic predisposition for anxiety, but experiencing enough trauma in the home, will alter the babies biological system, thus creating an anxious person later in life. Children that experience trauma often have higher heart rate and pulse than children who do not experience trauma. Whether or not these children would have these physical ailments, despite trauma, well, its hard to say. However, RCTs have been done, which has included children with trauma and children without trauma (control group).

I do not necessarily agree that we always fight against our genetics. The environment has a powerful impact on the individual. Sometimes changing the context will have drastic implications for behavior. Criminology research shows that when a person is released from prison, and move 20+ miles away from their home, recidivism rates drastically drop. These ex-convicts have the same genetics, but its the same genetics within a different environment. Now, how much are they struggling against the genetic predisposition in these new environments, well, I do not know. But clear, a different social context is modifying their behavior to a certain degree ( to the point of not going back to prison). I guess the real question is: how will they respond in this new environment if they are faced with a situation that would trigger their criminal behavior?

All that aside for a moment.  Can you find me one city run entirely by minorities that is actually worth a shit to live in?  Just curious.  Some of this cities have been minority controlled for decades and have been shitholes for decades.

Another fun example is Soul City, NC.  It was supposed to be a paradise for minorities and had the full backing of the Federal and State Government.  They had everything they needed to make this a reality.  What do you think happened?  So much for trying to let them create their own "ideal environment".     Look it up sometime.  I think you will find it interesting.

Utopian black ghost town.

[SF1900]

All that aside for a moment.  Can you find me one city run entirely by minorities that is actually worth a shit to live in?  Just curious.  Some of this cities have been minority controlled for decades and have been shitholes for decades.

Another fun example is Soul City, NC.  It was supposed to be a paradise for minorities and had the full backing of the Federal and State Government.  They had everything they needed to make this a reality.  What do you think happened?  So much for trying to let them create their own "ideal environment".    Look it up sometime.  I think you will find it interesting.

Utopian black ghost town.

1) As I stated, temperament has a genetic-brain basis. I was only questioning Fortress's over-emphasis on genetics. So, yes, I 100% believe in genetics-brain and that life is a mixture of genetics-brain and environment. I just wanted to make that clear before we moved on to something else (if we do).

"The discoveries suggesting genetic components to temperament started with that workhorse of the human behavioral lab—twin studies, monozygotes versus dizygotes versus siblings versus strangers. Clear findings emerged. Using infant temperamental inventories, the degree of resemblance (correlation) for identical twins was shown to be about 0.4. For fraternal twins and non-twin siblings, the resemblance score was between 0.15 and 0.18. In these studies, about 60% of kids who seemed very inhibited as youngsters grew up to be inhibited as adults. They were prone to the same strong fears and phobias shown previously and were the most anxious in the group. Ninety percent of the uninhibited group stayed uninhibited as a group when adults."

How brain arousal systems determine different temperament types and the major dimensions of personality

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0191886900002117

2) And I agree that many minority communities are struggling. Black people on this board, such as Parker and Dr Kaje will 100% agree with you. You will not hear an argument from them. I've never heard of Soul City, NC, but I will look it up.

[The True Adonis]

1) As I stated, temperament has a genetic basis. I was only questioning Fortress's over-emphasis on genetics. So, yes, I 100% I believe in genetics and that life is a mixture of genetics and environment. I just wanted to make that clear before we moved on to something else (if we do).

"The discoveries suggesting genetic components to temperament started with that workhorse of the human behavioral lab—twin studies, monozygotes versus dizygotes versus siblings versus strangers. Clear findings emerged. Using infant temperamental inventories, the degree of resemblance (correlation) for identical twins was shown to be about 0.4. For fraternal twins and non-twin siblings, the resemblance score was between 0.15 and 0.18. In these studies, about 60% of kids who seemed very inhibited as youngsters grew up to be inhibited as adults. They were prone to the same strong fears and phobias shown previously and were the most anxious in the group. Ninety percent of the uninhibited group stayed uninhibited as a group when adults."

2) And I agree that many minority communities are struggling. Black people on this board, such as Parker and Dr Kaje will 100% agree with you. You will not hear an argument from them. I've never heard of Soul City, NC, but I will look it up.

It just seems that we have exhausted all of our avenues in order to "civilize" and "placate" and "advance".  What more can be done?  Even when given carte blanche with no obstruction, they fail.  

Also, what you may think or identify as "stress", "stressors" or a "bad living situation", they do not see it that way at all.  Its what they like and are comfortable with.  How they act is also a universal constant pretty much, no matter what area of the country you find them.

There is a lot of components to all of it, but I think we all are out of ideas on how to improve the situation, especially when they are not interested in doing so themselves.  No interest whatsoever.

[hardgainerj]

I think they oughta look at the intelligence of Jews being born right before World War II and right after World War II which would basically shit all over that hypothesis.  (nobody had anything to eat still, yet Jews and their intelligence remained).

not according to thomas sowell research

[SF1900]

It just seems that we have exhausted all of our avenues in order to "civilize" and "placate" and "advance".  What more can be done?  Even when given carte blanche with no obstruction, they fail.  

Also, what you may think or identify as "stress", "stressors" or a "bad living situation", they do not see it that way at all.  Its what they like and are comfortable with.  How they act is also a universal constant pretty much, no matter what area of the country you find them.

There is a lot of components to all of it, but I think we all are out of ideas on how to improve the situation, especially when they are not interested in doing so themselves.  No interest whatsoever.

By the way, I read the "Blank Slate" when it first came out. Perhaps I shall have to read it again.

To be honest, I grew up middle-to-upper middle class (my parents made good livings--obviously not rich or anything. But we grew up nicely), so I cannot provide you with a more personalized answer. As I said, I do not make up answers like the majority of getbiggers. I do work with many different poor communities, and they are beset with many problems. The issue is often Multigenerational. Murray Bowen, a founding father of family therapy, discussed something called, "Multigenerational Transmission Process, which is: The concept of the multigenerational transmission process describes how small differences in the levels of differentiation between parents and their offspring lead over many generations to marked differences in differentiation among the members of a multigenerational family. The information creating these differences is transmitted across generations through relationships. The transmission occurs on several interconnected levels ranging from the conscious teaching and learning of information to the automatic and unconscious programming of emotional reactions and behaviors. Relationally and genetically transmitted information interact to shape an individual’s “self."

https://www.thebowencenter.org/theory/eight-concepts/multigenerational-transmission-process/

This is huge in many families, especially low-income families. You will often see the transmission of trauma through generations, i.e., domestic violence or sexual abuse has occurred for generations. The only way to break the cycle is to break the way its passed on to the children. But as long as parents keep passing on genetic and psychological transmitted information to their children, it will be hard to break the cycle. Thus, the cycle of emotions and behaviors continue.

But, to complicate the matter even more, read Urie Bronfenbrenner (developmental psychologist), who extended family issues to varying levels of the environment. You may have heard of Bronfenbrenner. Here is his bioecological systems theory:

[SF1900]

1. Why would you concede that blacks have different genetic traits every where else, but stop short at the brain?  Does not make sense.

2. Both have an impact.  Environment and genetics.  Why is that so difficult to understand?  Why would you think genetics do not play any role?  

3.  Again genetics.  Whatever happens or does not happen intra-uterine is a result of a genetic response.  Just like anything else.

4. Genetics determine everything. We can certainly try and act against our genetics and change behaviors to subvert our genetics or take medication or use devices that circumvent genetics, but at the end of the day, it always comes down to genetics and the battle against them.

Point 3) Yes, you are correct. Two babies can have the same intra-uterine exposure. And one baby can be perfectly fine, and another baby can have a wide range of developmental delays. So, yes, something is definitely going on in the womb that is making babies respond differently (genetic response). But, clearly, babies are still affected in the womb--look at Fetal Alcohol Syndrome  But, again, some babies are born perfectly fine.

[Ropo]

I bet violent crime by blacks would drop by at least half if these thugs actually grew up with a father figure present.  But as long as you have babies making babies, with no father present, it's going to be more of the same.

So, let's think that logic little further? Why the father figure isn't present? a) he has paid the mother to fuck her b) he is in prison c) he is a gangbanger, and could not care less d) he is killed by another black american e) he is crack addict piece of crap.. So if you pick your father figure from that bunch, the kid will be just where he is right now 

[obsidian]

This is not the first time a dindu nuffin torched an older white man. Why are the large mainstream media companies silent on these despicable acts? Why don't they label these acts as hate crimes - which is what they are??? I am starting to think the owners of the media companies need to be impaled ASAP. No, that's the wrong choice of words. I am not starting to think this. I knew this a long time ago. Let's torch these large mainstream media companies. Fuck them ALL!!!!

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2015/11/report_teen_suspected_of_killi.html

[obsidian]

For instance, Ashkanazi Jews are by far, the most intelligent and have the most developed brain from birth.

BS. Whites are by far the most intelligent. Most major inventions were made by white men. When white men ran Western societies the results were fantastic.

Now that Ashkenazi Jews control the banking in Western Nations completely they have corrupted all politicians and governments. The West is becoming a cesspool because of fake jews and their greedy corruption. These are not the actions of smart individuals. They are creating a major fuck up. It is time to remove their influence in banking, media, immigration etc. The sooner their influence over politicians stop the better off the West will be.

You can't even spell Ashkenazi you moron. Ashkenazi Jews are great at being greasy, slimy, sneaky activists (feminism, homosexuality, immigration, black civil rights, abortion, false narratives etc.)

As far as emotional intelligence goes "ashkenazi fake jews" have none.

[PJim]

Anybody with half a brain understands that 'equality' is a myth. It's forcefed to children from an early age to dumb them down in the hopes of creating subservient adults who won't question the grossly liberal direction the world has gone in.

People won't call a spade a spade nowadays for fear of being branded a bigot etc.

Think about it, what's the default reaction to terrorism or mass mobs looting and rioting? A Facebook status calling  for 'prayers' and/or a twee little meme. There's a lot of good in the world, but there's also a lot of shit...but when you've got people who truly believe that there is no such thing as an offender and that they are merely a victim of circumstance, what hope have you got?

[MAXX]

Can you provide studies that show that infants are born with different brain capacities? I mean, you are a man of science, right, True Adonis? As such, when you make a claim, you should provide evidence, correct? Ill await the journal articles.

Research and studies on race is taboo and basically forbidden since WW2...

Dog races and other biological species all have differences in intelligence and behaviour between races. Are you telling me this is cultural difference between animals?   Humans differ in no way from other biological creatures, I mean why would we.

David Duke explains it well

[SF1900]

Research and studies on race is taboo and basically forbidden since WW2...

Dog races and other biological species all have differences in intelligence and behaviour between races. Are you telling me this is cultural difference between animals?   Humans differ in no way from other biological creatures, I mean why would we.

David Duke explains it well

  That is all I can muster regarding that statement lol. There is just no other way to address such a statement lol

[MAXX]

That is all I can muster regarding that statement lol. There is just no other way to address such a statement lol

You can laugh it away. Or educate yourself.

[SF1900]

You can laugh it away. Or educate yourself.

Okay, you better email all those neuroscientists and tell them they have it all wrong and pick up your Nobel Prize lol