The left won't say gun confiscation

[Pray_4_War]

That's convenient.

"All the murders by non-whites don't count, I'm not talking about those".

[Straw Man]

That's convenient.

"All the murders by non-whites don't count, I'm not talking about those".

again, dispshit, try to pay attention

I never said all murders by non-whites don't count

I said I'm talking SPECIFICALLY about these mass shooting events

Mass shooting events will continue to  happen so we might as well accept it and get used to it

They are a regular and common events in a country with 300 million guns floating around

I mentioned this twice now and you've completely ignored

Do you agree or not

If you disagree then say why you disagree

[calfzilla]

I agree with you straw man.

[Straw Man]

I agree with you straw man.

thanks

I think others on this board agree but they're not as brave as you to admit it

[Pray_4_War]

thanks

I think others on this board agree but they're not as brave as you to admit it

Straw, when it comes to the 2nd Amendment and accepting the high cost of liberty, I'm so far ahead of you that your post was actually agreeing with me. 

I've been purposely ignoring your point because I knew it would piss you off.

[Straw Man]

Straw, when it comes to the 2nd Amendment and accepting the high cost of liberty, I'm so far ahead of you that your post was actually agreeing with me. 

I've been purposely ignoring your point because I knew it would piss you off.

translation - you were too embarrassed to admit you agree with me

[Pray_4_War]

translation - you were too embarrassed to admit you agree with me

Yep, you're right on this one Straw, but even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[Las Vegas]

I see no right wingers on this board have the balls to say (or agree with what I've said) that gun control is pointless.
We have the right to bear arms in this country and the right comes with the consequence that every once and awhile someone (mostly like a white male) is going to decide he wants to shoot a  but of innocent people.  That's just the way it is.  That is the price you pay for freedom

You make a good case, Straw, except the part to include a callout on white males (since, if nothing else, the everday ho-hum violence in our neighborhoods is a million times the threat).

But the fact is that the positives with guns simply cannot be assesed or used, in any way, on a graph or chart or in any study at all.  The subject may be the easiest out there to take and run with a purely negative side showing.

That's exactly what MSM is doing.

So, upon realizing that, the question should no longer be about guns.  It should be about the agenda.

[Straw Man]

You make a good case, Straw, except the part to include a callout on white males (since, if nothing else, the everday ho-hum violence in our neighborhoods is a million times the threat).

But the fact is that the positives with guns simply cannot be assesed or used, in any way, on a graph or chart or in any study at all.  The subject may be the easiest out there to take and run with a purely negative side showing.

That's exactly what MSM is doing.

So, upon realizing that, the question should no longer be about guns.  It should be about the agenda.

Once again, I'm referring to the mass shooting events such as the ones I listed and the ones in my link.  This are the events that are more likely to effect you and me and people like us.  I doubt anyone killed or injured in Vegas would have ever been a victim of gun violence in urban Chicago or some other similar city.

We're more likely to be effected by the nut job that wants to shoot up a church or a movie theater or spray a crowd with bullets from a hotel window and history tells us that type of shooter is more likely to be a white male.  Thats just a fact. Not sure why you can't deal with it. 

[Fuzzy Nuts]

Isn't that what Obama's government tried to do for eight years? He's a socialist/Marxist.

Ok, then. I guess you're a socialist marxist.

[Las Vegas]

Once again, I'm referring to the mass shooting events such as the ones I listed and the ones in my link.  This are the events that are more likely to effect you and me and people like us.  I doubt anyone killed or injured in Vegas would have ever been a victim of gun violence in urban Chicago or some other similar city.

We're more likely to be effected by the nut job that wants to shoot up a church or a movie theater or spray a crowd with bullets from a hotel window and history tells us that type of shooter is more likely to be a white male.  Thats just a fact. Not sure why you can't deal with it.  

No.  I don't doubt many of those individuals live, work, visit, or have some interest in one or more violent locales.

Matter of fact, anyone who cares about fellow Americans has a very strong interest, right there, even if that person uses extraordinary caution to avoid everywhere unfamiliar and at all times (a nut, in other words).

I believe you'll find gun "arguments" are nothing short of emotional outbursts, without a shred or trace of reason to them.  It should tell you something about that line of thought.

[Straw Man]

No.  I don't doubt many of those individuals live, work, visit, or have some interest in one or more violent locales.

Matter of fact, anyone who cares about fellow Americans has a very strong interest, right there, even if that person uses extraordinary caution to avoid everywhere unfamiliar and at all times (a nut, in other words).

I believe you'll find gun "arguments" are nothing short of emotional outbursts, without a shred or trace of reason to them.  It should tell you something about that line of thought.

I'm not convinced the people attending a country music festival in Vegas are going to be exposed to gun violence in Chicago (even if they happened to live in Chicago)

Again, my entire premise is this

We have 300 million guns floating around this country

If someone decided they want to shoot up a church, movie theater, school or concert they are going to find a way to do it

Just a part of life in this country so better just to accept it

If you've got some solution on how to prevent this from happening again then I'm certainly willing to listen

[Las Vegas]

I'm not convinced the people attending a country music festival in Vegas are going to be exposed to gun violence in Chicago (even if they happened to live in Chicago)

Again, my entire premise is this

We have 300 million guns floating around this country

If someone decided they want to shoot up a church, movie theater, school or concert they are going to find a way to do it

Just a part of life in this country so better just to accept it

If you've got some solution on how to prevent this from happening again then I'm certainly willing to listen

Reality has dictated very clearly that we can't rid ourselves of nature in its biggest picture.  The human condition won't allow for it in any reasonable way.

[Las Vegas]

I do believe you're a good guy, Straw.  Seeing how you've handled this issue over time tells me you're capable of taking a reasonable approach even if a (seemingly) popular message runs counter to it.

But I must say, a guy like Obama (or any one of his lying sound-alikes in the msm) really ticks me off.  They're so busy trying to convince us that the problem of reckless violence will be nearer to "fixed" if we just shut up and trust them, despite lacking even the slightest hint of logic, and all the while they're taking a dump on this society and making it worse.  Trying to create situations which rob us of all meaningful opportunity, which everyone should know is the first step in causing unwanted behavior.

[Agnostic007]

I do believe you're a good guy, Straw.  Seeing how you've handled this issue over time tells me you're capable of taking a reasonable approach even if a (seemingly) popular message runs counter to it.

But I must say, a guy like Obama (or any one of his lying sound-alikes in the msm) really ticks me off.  They're so busy trying to convince us that the problem of reckless violence will be nearer to "fixed" if we just shut up and trust them, despite lacking even the slightest hint of logic, and all the while they're taking a dump on this society and making it worse.  Trying to create situations which rob us of all meaningful opportunity, which everyone should know is the first step in causing unwanted behavior.

I'm interested in your opinion on Australia and the result they got from their 1996 ban

[Dos Equis]

I'm interested in your opinion on Australia and the result they got from their 1996 ban

Someone brought that up on the board several years ago.  Turns out to be a pretty bad talking point.  https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/10/21/australia-admits-gun-buyback-failure-amnesty/

[Agnostic007]

Someone brought that up on the board several years ago.  Turns out to be a pretty bad talking point.  https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/10/21/australia-admits-gun-buyback-failure-amnesty/

"Regardless of how much of a cause-and-effect relationship there might be between the NFA and gun deaths in Australia, it’s undeniable that the firearms homicide rate in that country has decreased substantially since the implementation of the NFA. It’s not the case, however, as suggested by the misleading and long out-of-date online piece quoted in the Example block above (which was written way back in 2001) that the overall crime rate in Australia has shot up since the NFA was introduced. The rates of various types of violent crimes (sexual assault, kidnapping, homicides of all types) have scarcely changed at all, and while the robbery rate rose substantially in the 1998-2001 timeframe, it dropped below its pre-NFA level by 2004 and has continually declined since then:"

[Las Vegas]

I'm interested in your opinion on Australia and the result they got from their 1996 ban

Australia is not America, to begin with.  And as far as what they did, they saw a chance and took it, the citizens let them do it, and I'd leave it to the Australians to comment on it.

[Las Vegas]

And btw, I have no way of knowing who has a "banned" gun or multiple guns there at this very moment.  Because it wouldn't make sense to believe no one possesses any gun or guns to meet the description.

[Straw Man]

I do believe you're a good guy, Straw.  Seeing how you've handled this issue over time tells me you're capable of taking a reasonable approach even if a (seemingly) popular message runs counter to it.

But I must say, a guy like Obama (or any one of his lying sound-alikes in the msm) really ticks me off.  They're so busy trying to convince us that the problem of reckless violence will be nearer to "fixed" if we just shut up and trust them, despite lacking even the slightest hint of logic, and all the while they're taking a dump on this society and making it worse.  Trying to create situations which rob us of all meaningful opportunity, which everyone should know is the first step in causing unwanted behavior.

I'm all for honesty in public policy

Same reason I'd like to see Repubs stop lying about tax cuts paying for themselves (it's total horsehit and has never happened).   Say you want to cut taxes because you want lower taxes and then find an actual way to pay for it and if you're going to make the middle class pay to give tax cuts to the rich then just say so.   

I'd respect any politician who said that.

They all say what they really believe behind closed doors and they lie like MF'ers in front of the camera

In another example I applaud Bob Corker for saying what probably 98% of the Senate also says when they are among themselves behind closed doors (remember that tape of Congressional Repubs joking that they though Trump was paid by Russia and then Paul Ryan reminding the group that this was only for "the family" to say behind closed doors).  Total bullshit...all of it

[Soul Crusher]

Wising up in your older years i see. 

 

I'm all for honesty in public policy

Same reason I'd like to see Repubs stop lying about tax cuts paying for themselves (it's total horsehit and has never happened).   Say you want to cut taxes because you want lower taxes and then find an actual way to pay for it and if you're going to make the middle class pay to give tax cuts to the rich then just say so.   

I'd respect any politician who said that.

They all say what they really believe behind closed doors and they lie like MF'ers in front of the camera

In another example I applaud Bob Corker for saying what probably 98% of the Senate also says when they are among themselves behind closed doors (remember that tape of Congressional Repubs joking that they though Trump was paid by Russia and then Paul Ryan reminding the group that this was only for "the family" to say behind closed doors).  Total bullshit...all of it

[Las Vegas]

I'm all for honesty in public policy

Same reason I'd like to see Repubs stop lying about tax cuts paying for themselves (it's total horsehit and has never happened).   Say you want to cut taxes because you want lower taxes and then find an actual way to pay for it and if you're going to make the middle class pay to give tax cuts to the rich then just say so.   

I'd respect any politician who said that.

They all say what they really believe behind closed doors and they lie like MF'ers in front of the camera

In another example I applaud Bob Corker for saying what probably 98% of the Senate also says when they are among themselves behind closed doors (remember that tape of Congressional Repubs joking that they though Trump was paid by Russia and then Paul Ryan reminding the group that this was only for "the family" to say behind closed doors).  Total bullshit...all of it

Yeah, man.  Yes.  Totally understood.

One thing I'll admit that sort of freaks me out a little, is that everything about "governing" is now built on necessary-to-their-purpose deception.  Everything.  It has reached a point that it is an actual insult, a daily one at that, to common decency.  It makes me ill to be even within earshot of a TV these days, knowing how badly they've set out to deceive and how some give them all benefit of (an overwhelming) doubt about what they say.  Believing it's an "authoritative" source since, well, that source says so.

It is like a jab in the heart to think where this will lead us.

[Straw Man]

Wising up in your older years i see. 

 

I've said the same thing for year

My only change is the view on guns and that pure cynicism

Nothing is going to change and mass shootings are going to continue to be a common event in this country until we invent Pre-Crime technology ala Minority Report

Now, it would be nice to see Republican apply the exact same argument they use for opposing all gun control legislation to abortion legislation

No amount of restrictions or laws are going to prevent someone who wants an abortion from getting one so why even bother

Don't give me this shit about "if only we can stop a few or some or reduce them" etc..

Same arguments can be made about gun laws

Mind your own fucking business.  If a woman wants an abortion and she can pay for it that's her business and if you think God is going to be pissed at her that's her problem not yours (not you personally 333 - just using that as an example)

[Dos Equis]

"Regardless of how much of a cause-and-effect relationship there might be between the NFA and gun deaths in Australia, it’s undeniable that the firearms homicide rate in that country has decreased substantially since the implementation of the NFA. It’s not the case, however, as suggested by the misleading and long out-of-date online piece quoted in the Example block above (which was written way back in 2001) that the overall crime rate in Australia has shot up since the NFA was introduced. The rates of various types of violent crimes (sexual assault, kidnapping, homicides of all types) have scarcely changed at all, and while the robbery rate rose substantially in the 1998-2001 timeframe, it dropped below its pre-NFA level by 2004 and has continually declined since then:"

The Australian Law Banned and Confiscated Guns

The crucial fact they omit is that the buyback program was mandatory. Australia’s vaunted gun buyback program was in fact a sweeping program of gun confiscation. Only the articles from USA Today and the Washington Post cited above contain the crucial information that the buyback was compulsory. The article by Smith-Spark, the latest entry in the genre, assuredly does not. It’s the most important detail about the main provision of Australia’s gun laws, and pundits ignore it. That’s like writing an article about how Obamacare works without once mentioning the individual mandate.

Yet when American gun control advocates and politicians praise Australia’s gun laws, that’s just what they’re doing. Charles Cooke of the National Review shredded the rhetorical conceit of bellowing “Australia!” last year after President Obama expressed his admiration for gun control à la Oz:

You simply cannot praise Australia’s gun-laws without praising the country’s mass confiscation program. That is Australia’s law. When the Left says that we should respond to shootings as Australia did, they don’t mean that we should institute background checks on private sales; they mean that they we should ban and confiscate guns. No amount of wooly words can change this. Again, one doesn’t bring up countries that have confiscated firearms as a shining example unless one wishes to push the conversation toward confiscation.

Cooke, of course, is right. When gun control advocates say they want Australian gun control laws in the United States, what they are really saying is that they want gun confiscation in the United States.

http://thefederalist.com/2015/06/25/the-australia-gun-control-fallacy/