Author Topic: Heavy Duty Training explained  (Read 2547 times)

pkaz

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #25 on: December 30, 2023, 02:54:21 PM »
you think he took other compounds?

larry pollack trained with him in the 80's and he said mentzer's stack at that time was 300 mgs of npp eod only that's a ton of npp

According to my discussions with Ray, and he was pretty open about everything with me, they did many different compounds and plenty of. Along with recreational drugs as well (especially Mike).

IroNat

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #26 on: December 30, 2023, 03:58:03 PM »
I believe the Mentzers only ate lots of eggs.

dj181

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #27 on: December 30, 2023, 04:00:11 PM »
According to my discussions with Ray, and he was pretty open about everything with me, they did many different compounds and plenty of. Along with recreational drugs as well (especially Mike).

can i ask which other compounds and how much? this shit is fascinating 8)

meth isnt a muscle builder fat burner yeah ok

Rmj11

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #28 on: December 31, 2023, 12:01:04 AM »


HIT overtrains you faster than conventional "volume" training. HIT is a logical argument based on a false premise. That premise is that full intensity (100%) is the PRIMARY cause of muscular growth. That is not true. It has never been shown that full intensity is optimal for maximal growth. Full intensity IS the most stressful on the nervous system. The nervous system is what causes overtraining, not muscular fatigue. That's why runners can train everyday and not overtrain, yet performing single max attempts for even 1 exercise will quickly overtrain even if done 1x per week.

Where ARE the "HIT" trainers? methzer, before he died, used to take long layoffs, as did his brother Ray. Dorian Yates was a victim of burnout. Boyer Coe tried it for awhile and lost all kinds of size.

HIT HAS been around since the 70's. Where is ONE bodybuilding, powerlifting, olympic lifting champion that has used it since day 1 to develop their physique or talent?

The cream always rises to the top. Low carb diets, even though they were ridiculed by Doctors, the media, the food industry, nutritionists OVERCAME the nay sayers to become mainstream and accepted. Why? BECAUSE THEY WORK. Why hasn't HIT done the same?

HIT was given a fair shake by the "powers that be", like Bob Kennedy, Peary Rader etc. Ironman still promotes it or at least talks about it. HIT has had more of a fair shake than other "failed" systems. Yet, no HIT made champs. Not one.

Jones and Darden didn't get big doing HIT. They lifted conventionally before, then did HIT. That's why Jones came up with it in the first place, because he couldn't train as much anymore. He got lazy.

Why did Viator go back to conventional training? The Colorado experiment is just an example of: Muscle memory in an ARTIFICIALLY underweight NATURALLY big person who STARTED using drugs again AND training again. What a crock.

I always get a laugh out of people who say how "hard" HIT is. HIT is easy compared to some of the systems out there. Tom Platz did Mentzer intensity but for up to 30 sets per bodypart.

It is MUCH easier psychologically to get up for your 1 "Big set" than for a workout of TWENTY SETS per bodypart, then doing TWO MORE bodyparts for 20 sets. THEN coming back the next day and doing it again 6 days per week. Not even close in comparison. THAT'S hard.

It's the difference between sprinting an "all-out" 100 yard dash, and the pain of a mile run. NO COMPARISON.

AGAIN, why did Viator, Coe, Grymkowski go back to REGULAR HIGH VOLUME TRAINING. I guess they were sick of the results and gains, and wanted to be in the gym for 2 hours a day instead of 30 min 2x per week. LOL.

Hit sucks. 



Royalty

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #29 on: December 31, 2023, 02:30:25 AM »
▫️

Rmj11

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #30 on: December 31, 2023, 04:32:58 AM »
▫️

RMJ11 has really gotten to me.

😉

IroNat

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #31 on: December 31, 2023, 05:44:22 AM »
I...am your father.

The Scott

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #32 on: December 31, 2023, 07:44:47 AM »
I...am your father.

Yes but the real quextion be,  do you be your father?  ;D

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #33 on: December 31, 2023, 08:37:38 AM »
HIT overtrains you faster than conventional "volume" training. HIT is a logical argument based on a false premise. That premise is that full intensity (100%) is the PRIMARY cause of muscular growth. That is not true. It has never been shown that full intensity is optimal for maximal growth. Full intensity IS the most stressful on the nervous system. The nervous system is what causes overtraining, not muscular fatigue. That's why runners can train everyday and not overtrain, yet performing single max attempts for even 1 exercise will quickly overtrain even if done 1x per week.

Where ARE the "HIT" trainers? methzer, before he died, used to take long layoffs, as did his brother Ray. Dorian Yates was a victim of burnout. Boyer Coe tried it for awhile and lost all kinds of size.

HIT HAS been around since the 70's. Where is ONE bodybuilding, powerlifting, olympic lifting champion that has used it since day 1 to develop their physique or talent?

The cream always rises to the top. Low carb diets, even though they were ridiculed by Doctors, the media, the food industry, nutritionists OVERCAME the nay sayers to become mainstream and accepted. Why? BECAUSE THEY WORK. Why hasn't HIT done the same?

HIT was given a fair shake by the "powers that be", like Bob Kennedy, Peary Rader etc. Ironman still promotes it or at least talks about it. HIT has had more of a fair shake than other "failed" systems. Yet, no HIT made champs. Not one.

Jones and Darden didn't get big doing HIT. They lifted conventionally before, then did HIT. That's why Jones came up with it in the first place, because he couldn't train as much anymore. He got lazy.

Why did Viator go back to conventional training? The Colorado experiment is just an example of: Muscle memory in an ARTIFICIALLY underweight NATURALLY big person who STARTED using drugs again AND training again. What a crock.

I always get a laugh out of people who say how "hard" HIT is. HIT is easy compared to some of the systems out there. Tom Platz did Mentzer intensity but for up to 30 sets per bodypart.

It is MUCH easier psychologically to get up for your 1 "Big set" than for a workout of TWENTY SETS per bodypart, then doing TWO MORE bodyparts for 20 sets. THEN coming back the next day and doing it again 6 days per week. Not even close in comparison. THAT'S hard.

It's the difference between sprinting an "all-out" 100 yard dash, and the pain of a mile run. NO COMPARISON.

AGAIN, why did Viator, Coe, Grymkowski go back to REGULAR HIGH VOLUME TRAINING. I guess they were sick of the results and gains, and wanted to be in the gym for 2 hours a day instead of 30 min 2x per week. LOL.

Hit sucks.

This is true.

The Scott

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #34 on: December 31, 2023, 11:40:44 AM »
Per Mike himself, this was his most productive Heavy Duty/H.I.T. routine:

Workout 1 (Monday)

Legs
Superset
Leg extensions 1 x 6-8
Leg presses 1 x 6-8
Squats 1 x 6-8
Leg curls 2 x 6-8
Calf raises 2 x 6-8
Toe presses 1 x 6-8

Chest
Superset
Dumbbell flyes or pec deck 1-2 x 6-8
Incline presses 1-2 x 6-8
Dips 2 x 6-8

Triceps
Superset
Pushdowns 1 x 6-8
Dips 1 x 6-8
Lying triceps extensions 2 x 6-8

Workout 2 (Wednesday)

Back
Superset
Nautilus pullovers 2 x 6-8
Close-grip pulldowns 2 x 6-8
Bent-over barbell rows 2 x 6-8

Traps
Superset
Universal machine shrugs 2 x 6-8
Upright rows 2 x 6-8

Shoulders
Superset
Nautilus laterals 2 x 6-8
Nautilus presses 2 x 6-8
Rear-delt rows 2 x 6-8

Biceps
Standing barbell curls 1 x 6-8
Concentration curls 2 x 6-8

‘Was there anything else you did differently with this routine?’ I asked eagerly.

‘Yes, I used this type of routine throughout my professional bodybuilding career, but the greatest gains I got from it was when, rather than following it on the usual four-out-of-seven-day schedule, I began spacing it so I trained every other day on a split routine.

‘For instance, rather than train Monday and Tuesday on a split routine, working half the body on Monday and the other half on Tuesday’I would do the first half of the body on Monday, skip Tuesday to recuperate and then train on Wednesday, rest on Thursday and repeat the cycle again, starting on Friday. That was the most result-producing routine that I ever used.’

Taffin

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #35 on: December 31, 2023, 12:01:11 PM »
I believe the Mentzers only ate lots of eggs.

Duck or chicken?  ;D


I...am your father.

Daddy!?

T

IroNat

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #36 on: December 31, 2023, 12:09:57 PM »
Taffy funny!

beakdoctor

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #37 on: December 31, 2023, 12:23:24 PM »
Duck or chicken? 


For a man like Mike "a calorie is a calorie " Mentzer  it would mot matter. He once claimed he got into contest shape eating candy bars.

The Scott

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #38 on: December 31, 2023, 12:41:50 PM »

For a man like Mike "a calorie is a calorie " Mentzer  it would mot matter. He once claimed he got into contest shape eating candy bars.

Would it not be true that as far as caloric value goes a calorie is indeed a calorie?  Feb 25, To a scientist, a calorie is the quantity of heat (or energy) needed to boost the temperature of 1 ml of water by 1°C or 33.8°F.


It is the nutritional value that makes the difference, does it not?  If one never trained and was sedentary but still consumed 7,000 "clean" calories a day wouldn't that person still get fat?

This seems correct to me and so in essence I too think that a calorie  is a calorie but I could be wrong.  Again. ;D

wes

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #39 on: December 31, 2023, 12:48:03 PM »

For a man like Mike "a calorie is a calorie " Mentzer  it would mot matter. He once claimed he got into contest shape eating candy bars.
......and the occasional apple.

wes

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #40 on: December 31, 2023, 12:48:57 PM »
Would it not be true that as far as caloric value goes a calorie is indeed a calorie?  Feb 25, To a scientist, a calorie is the quantity of heat (or energy) needed to boost the temperature of 1 ml of water by 1°C or 33.8°F.


It is the nutritional value that makes the difference, does it not?  If one never trained and was sedentary but still consumed 7,000 "clean" calories a day wouldn't that person still get fat?

This seems correct to me and so in essence I too think that a calorie  is a calorie but I could be wrong.  Again. ;D
It`s about macros not calories.

Rmj11

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #41 on: December 31, 2023, 01:07:29 PM »
Per Mike himself, this was his most productive Heavy Duty/H.I.T. routine:

Workout 1 (Monday)

Legs
Superset
Leg extensions 1 x 6-8
Leg presses 1 x 6-8
Squats 1 x 6-8
Leg curls 2 x 6-8
Calf raises 2 x 6-8
Toe presses 1 x 6-8

Chest
Superset
Dumbbell flyes or pec deck 1-2 x 6-8
Incline presses 1-2 x 6-8
Dips 2 x 6-8

Triceps
Superset
Pushdowns 1 x 6-8
Dips 1 x 6-8
Lying triceps extensions 2 x 6-8

Workout 2 (Wednesday)

Back
Superset
Nautilus pullovers 2 x 6-8
Close-grip pulldowns 2 x 6-8
Bent-over barbell rows 2 x 6-8

Traps
Superset
Universal machine shrugs 2 x 6-8
Upright rows 2 x 6-8

Shoulders
Superset
Nautilus laterals 2 x 6-8
Nautilus presses 2 x 6-8
Rear-delt rows 2 x 6-8

Biceps
Standing barbell curls 1 x 6-8
Concentration curls 2 x 6-8

‘Was there anything else you did differently with this routine?’ I asked eagerly.

‘Yes, I used this type of routine throughout my professional bodybuilding career, but the greatest gains I got from it was when, rather than following it on the usual four-out-of-seven-day schedule, I began spacing it so I trained every other day on a split routine.

‘For instance, rather than train Monday and Tuesday on a split routine, working half the body on Monday and the other half on Tuesday’I would do the first half of the body on Monday, skip Tuesday to recuperate and then train on Wednesday, rest on Thursday and repeat the cycle again, starting on Friday. That was the most result-producing routine that I ever used.’


No wonder he couldn't win the Olympia with a crappy routine like that.

beakdoctor

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #42 on: December 31, 2023, 01:25:13 PM »
Would it not be true that as far as caloric value goes a calorie is indeed a calorie?  Feb 25, To a scientist, a calorie is the quantity of heat (or energy) needed to boost the temperature of 1 ml of water by 1°C or 33.8°F.


It is the nutritional value that makes the difference, does it not?  If one never trained and was sedentary but still consumed 7,000 "clean" calories a day wouldn't that person still get fat?

This seems correct to me and so in essence I too think that a calorie  is a calorie but I could be wrong.  Again. ;D

Strictly speaking....yes , you make a great point. I think the issue, like you said, is the "nutritional content."   Anything producing an  insulin response or resistance, I would have to guess, would make it difficult to get ripped for a contest?

I mean rice, quinoa, duck eggs or quail eggs is one thing but getting ripped on Toblerones is hard to believe.


Humble Narcissist

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #43 on: January 01, 2024, 12:31:09 AM »

For a man like Mike "a calorie is a calorie " Mentzer  it would mot matter. He once claimed he got into contest shape eating candy bars.
If he was on his 800 calorie a day diet that would just be 3 candy bars all day long. No wonder he was so uptight.

wes

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #44 on: January 01, 2024, 02:22:52 AM »
I believe the Mentzers only ate lots of eggs.
.......as did the Munsters!   ;)

Royalty

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #45 on: January 01, 2024, 05:12:01 AM »
If he was on his 800 calorie a day diet that would just be 3 candy bars all day long. No wonder he was so uptight.

Why are you responding to your own gimmick AGAIN? 

IroNat

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #46 on: January 01, 2024, 06:34:39 AM »
Why are you responding to your own gimmick AGAIN? 

Stop harrassing me and my gimmicks.

The Weight Trained Male

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #47 on: January 01, 2024, 11:05:35 AM »
Stop harrassing me and my gimmicks.
You can try to laugh it off but it's not working. You are also soon to be exposed on Anabolicminds and UG Bodybuilding forums, among others. Even the prostitution forum you post on. Moron.

The Scott

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #48 on: January 01, 2024, 11:25:31 AM »
You can try to laugh it off but it's not working. You are also soon to be exposed on Anabolicminds and UG Bodybuilding forums, among others. Even the prostitution forum you post on. Moron.


 ;D

Humble Narcissist

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Re: Heavy Duty Training explained
« Reply #49 on: January 03, 2024, 01:12:09 AM »
Stop harrassing me and my gimmicks.
There are only 2 people who post on Getbig, Royalty and me (us). Just 1000 gimmicks that I (we) run from laptop to tablet to phone to pc all day long posting.