Dorian Yates kicks Ronnie's ass Hulkster is a punk Bitch and fuck any truce

[NeoSeminole]

Oliver, the majority of Dorian pics I used are from 93 and Ronnie's from 98 and 99. I believe Ronnie's 98, 99, and 2001 ASC form were all pretty close.

[suckmymuscle]

  For the Starcaf nerd, who thinks the 280+ Coleman is even worthy of standing on a bodybuilding stage, let alone compare to the 250+ Dorian, I present this comparison.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[pumpster]

Haney in 1990 at 235lbs and he was off !!

This is impressive? He has the same flapjacks/arm deficiencies as Yates-torso completely overwhelms.

[suckmymuscle]

DORIAN WAS UNDOUBTEDLY SUPERIOR TO RONNIE BECAUSE:

1. Dorian had far less defeats, as a pro, than Ronnie.
2. Dorian won ALL of his Olympias with straight firsts, from ALL judges, whereas Ronnie only can say the same about three of his O wins, and still not from all judges.
3. Dorian was never a second-tier pro, winning or taking top spots in all his professional contests, unlike Ronnie, who was a bottom-feeder for years.
4. Dorian is only one year older than Ronnie, yet defeated Ronnie ALL the times they met; Ronnie cannot brag about a single victory over Dorian, in either the amateur or pro levels.

  Game over. Yates is the third greatest Mr.Olympia ever, besides only Arnold and Oliva.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[MikeThaMachine]

Haney even with "bad" biceps owns the front double bi

[pumpster]

Haney even with "bad" biceps owns the front double bi

NO. Can't have a great double-bi with less than great arms. No exceptions. If he wasn't facing the camera on an angle you'd see an even bigger imbalance between torso and arms as well as torso and legs.

That these two won so many Olympias while others as good or better were denied is something i'm not willing to overlook like others readily do. Both were enormously flawed as well as great in some respects-not the cream of the crop.

Those two winning so much devalued the Olympia, IMO.

[MikeThaMachine]

And his back against the competetion

[NarcissisticDeity]

And his back against the competetion

That shot is from the 1984 Mr Olympia Lee's first win , that is one of my favorite shots of Lee that front double bicep shot to me is just what its all about !!

[nicorulez]

Sucky, you assclown.  Are you threatening me.  Maybe I will need to go to the FBI asshole.  Schucks like you don't even deserve to procreate and have offspring.  You are a troll to lowest denominator.  I could care less if the bodybuilder was white or black.  I call them like I see them.  I have given numerous props to Yates in his 1992/1993 form.  You are an ignorant asshole.  No shit I live in Florida; pretty big ass state.  Don't you realize you can go to jail for threatening people on internet chat boards; ever heard of the Patriot Act dipshit.  If you disagree with me fine; I have as much right to spout my opinion as a braindead jerkweed like yourself.  I could care less about Yates versus Ronnie; it is schmucks like you that I take pleasure in shooting down.  Peace jerk.

[nicorulez]

ND, we may have our differences, but I agree that you usually present cogent arguments.  We disagree about the gut thing; big deal.  I almost surmise that you appreciate the Yate's physique from 1991/1192 over his physique of later years.  I was at the 1991 and really liked Dorian's physique then.  He was awesome in 1993.  However, I regurgitate this for the dimwitted morons on the board (sucky) I did not like his physique in 1994-1997.  It was off and asymmetrical.  That is my opinion.  Yours may be different; big deal.  What is funny is that one of Sucky's idols was Oliva who ripped on Dorian's physique.  Oh well, guess Oliva is an idiot now.

[Praetor Fenix]

  For the Starcaf nerd, who thinks the 280+ Coleman is even worthy of standing on a bodybuilding stage, let alone compare to the 250+ Dorian, I present this comparison.

Do you think I consider the term "Starcraft nerd" perjorative? No sir!
Ultimately, it boils down to this:
- 2003 Ronnie had significantly larger muscules AND much better symmetry than Dorian.
I love how neither of you (ND or suckmymuscle) will address this point. This is empirical fact.
These two criteria account for 66% of the judging, so even if Dorian's conditioning was 100% better (which it was not), Dorian was nevertheless guaranteed to lose.

Conditioning / muscle maturity / muscle density. The remaining 33%.
This is the only point of contention remaining.

Dorian came in dry. Granted. Yet he had nothing to showcase. Exceedingly few striations, minimal vascularity, average separation. He simply did not have Ronnie's muscle maturity.

You know, the densely layered mounds of muscle ever-so-evident in Ronnie's peaked biceps (crags, peaks, fissures, it looks as though he has a bicep stacked on top of his bicep). Ronnie's multilayered chest with uniform striations, displaying thickly proportioned layers of pectoralis major. The steel cords present in his superior glutes and hamstrings.

Dorian cannot match Ronnie's glute/hamstring condition.
Dorian would exceed Ronnie's lower-back detail in 2003. Upper back is quite comparable.
Hell, I'll even give you Dorian's abdomen, despite Ron's comparable intercostal / serratus detail.

Still, Dorian has not come close to winning the show. Not by a long shot.

[Praetor Fenix]

ND, we may have our differences, but I agree that you usually present cogent arguments. 

Cogent arguments?? 

The requisites:

- Real Facts
(ND is clearly a liar: "2003 Ron's quadriceps weren't striated" "Dorian has a better V-taper")

- Coherence
(ND's paragraphs are long-winded, comma-filled rants written with poor grammar and structure)

- Persuasive
(ND has yet to win an argument throughout this entire thread, poor representation for camp Yates)

- Address the Counter-Argument(s)
(When threatened, ND simply resorts to posting pictures of Ronnie's distension backstage)

- Relevance
(Cites mindnumbing statistics with absolutely no bearing or meaning beyond 1997)

- Originality
(He simply copy/pastes his old material and makes a few minor, cosmetic changes in format)

- Evidence
(Has a minimum amount of visual documentation, relies HEAVILY on a select few samples)

- Personality
(My doormat has more personality. Very dry presentation. Baselessly/unjustifiably arrogant)

- Character
(Refuses to acknowledge when he is wrong)

- Maturity
(Endless pages of spam: "soft man soft" - Repeatedly refers to me as "Starcraft nerd" and claims I "have my head lodged in Ronnie's man-glutes)

Other than that nicorulez, I agree, he's awesome. 

[nicorulez]

Praetor, I was comparing him to Sucky...now ND certainly is more cogent than Sucky.  I disagree with him completely, but at least he is not an assclown.

[sculpture]

- Personality
(My doormat has more personality. Very dry presentation. Baselessly/unjustifiably arrogant)

Truest thing said on this behemoth thread so far. 

[Hulkster]

There goes ND posting the same ab and thigh shot, and he will probably post the lower back shot too.

The two pics are all he has, and apparently, the abs and lower back are all that matter. The rest of the entire physique is meaningless according to him.

He has ignored all the rest of the pics, ignores all the videos, and posts pics from 2004 or backstage gut shots when he doesn't know what to say.

It is so obvious that he has lost, and doesn't know what to do.

They ignored my challenge about making Ronnie look soft, ignored several other posts that I was expecting some half hearted response too, ignored everything...

[Hulkster]

ou couldn't be anymore wrong , Dorian's gut was never as big and distended as Coleman 03 !!

but Dorian was never as big as Ronnie in 2003 either. Ronnie was 287 in 03 and 297 in 04.

Yet, Dorian looked like this at a mere 263 pounds:



so there goes your argument...

[Hulkster]

I have been saying this for 2 years now, but some like ND just can't seem to grasp the concept..


ND says that Dorian was dryer than Ronnie was here at the same bodyweight of 257 pounds.

Lets say that is true.

My question is:


(Yates at 257 in 1993)
What difference would it make?? The detail, shape and vascularity just isn't there...

this post was ignored...

[Hulkster]

umm.. I know this has been gone over before, but I would like to post these shots (from Ronnie in great shape at the 98 O.) and then ask a question, becuase I am still not getting it:







Okay, the comment keeps being made by ND and suckmyasshole that Dorian would make ronnie "look soft".

Well, could someone please post a series of Dorian shots that make these "look soft", because as far as I can see, other than the lower back, these shots by virtue of their supreme striated detail, make DORIAN look soft, not the other way around.

Thank you.

this post was ignored..

[pumpster]

ND survival strategy:


Yates ab, calf & forearm shots + Coleman gut shots + Yates "grainy" shots. Ignore, DO NOT discuss videos or getbig poll results. Disassociate from SUCKMYASSHOLE & ANUS. 

[natural al]

ND survival strategy:


Yates ab, calf & forearm shots + Coleman gut shots + Yates "grainy" shots. Ignore, DO NOT discuss videos or getbig poll results. Disassociate from SUCKMYASSHOLE & ANUS. 

what are pics of a guy training in the offseason, totally covered up supposed to show?  Really, I'm wondering what point you're trying to make,

[pumpster]

You're a perfect example of ND's filler strategy-the only thing memorable about you is your whining. No content whatsoever. You luv whining like a beeootch, i'll give you that!

Here's another shot:

[NarcissisticDeity]

Cogent arguments?? 

The requisites:

- Real Facts
(ND is clearly a liar: "2003 Ron's quadriceps weren't striated" "Dorian has a better V-taper")

- Coherence
(ND's paragraphs are long-winded, comma-filled rants written with poor grammar and structure)

- Persuasive
(ND has yet to win an argument throughout this entire thread, poor representation for camp Yates)

- Address the Counter-Argument(s)
(When threatened, ND simply resorts to posting pictures of Ronnie's distension backstage)

- Relevance
(Cites mindnumbing statistics with absolutely no bearing or meaning beyond 1997)

- Originality
(He simply copy/pastes his old material and makes a few minor, cosmetic changes in format)

- Evidence
(Has a minimum amount of visual documentation, relies HEAVILY on a select few samples)

- Personality
(My doormat has more personality. Very dry presentation. Baselessly/unjustifiably arrogant)

- Character
(Refuses to acknowledge when he is wrong)

- Maturity
(Endless pages of spam: "soft man soft" - Repeatedly refers to me as "Starcraft nerd" and claims I "have my head lodged in Ronnie's man-glutes)

Other than that nicorulez, I agree, he's awesome. 

1) A liar   please I've showed you a pic of Coleman with striations in 96 and compared it to the 2003 and its NOT the same period , Ronnie quad striations in 96 Ronnie 03 NONE

2) Coherence , you're grasping at straws with this one

3) Persuasive , there is a high probablity that you have NOT read all 160+ pages and even if I did ' win ' an argument you wouldn't admit it you're like a conservative Christian you think only your opinion is the gospel

4) Address the Counter-Argument(s) , Oh I've done this absolutely when you claimed the IFBB judges have to adhere to strict IFBB protocol I showed you the IFBB edict on having no abdominal distention and the top three at the 2005 Olympia all had guts , so the judges can do as they please !! another example is the 2001 Mr Olympia Cutler wins the musculairty & symmetry rounds and ' wins ' the posing rounds , he was also allowed to use a prop which is illegal ( American Flag ) and someone on here said he was allowed to pose for 10 minutes while the rest of the competitors just got 4

You've claimed Ronnie's gut in 2003 was completly flat , I've showed you proof which you don't have the balls to admit , you rational is ' well those are backstage and the contest takes place onstage ' and I countered with " have you seen the tape? ' I watched the 2003 Mr Olympia and his gut is clearly evident in every transition from pose to pose , this is where you were proven wrong and you again don't have the balls to admit it

5) Relevance , oh believe me Dorians domination of his peers is very relevant , especially on how he would fare against Coleman , his record is an indication of how great he was even if you don't think so and its relevant to Colemans tenure as Champ it shows Ronnie is very beatable

6) Originality , One I never CCP anything from a previous pose for you to say so is an out right lie , and it shows with this and your previous crietria you're just trying to fill up space

7) Evidence - Oh boy I've showed you at least 10 pictures of Ronnie Coleman on stage & back stage with a absurdly distended gut and you like Hulkster gloss right over that , I've provided pleanty of pictures showing Ronnie's unbalance & lack of proportion , you've reduced it to calves and forearms and laughed it off , I've posted pleanty of pics of Ronnie biceps/triceps making his delts look small , all of the evidence I provided as either blown off or not even commented on

 Personality , grasping again to assume my personality over an internet messageboard is lame , another attempt to fill space so it looks like you have content , and premature   and p.s. I like pissing-off fan-boys like you

9) Character , yawn , I've already said at their respective bests , Dorian may lose but one it wouldn't be a cake-walk for Coleman by any stretch of the imagination , and its my opinion by virtue of than I'm not wrong and neither are you ( although pumpster )

10) Maturity , trying to make more content on your part   and the pot calling the kettle black , and did I hurt your fragile ego?  

And a lot of the nonsense you're acusing me of , you in fact are guilty of , I don't mind debating anyone and more opinions are welcomed , I came to the conclusion that yours was useless when you typed Ronnie had a flat stomach in 2003 that was a clear indication you're delusion , you're able to articulate yourself better than Hulkster & pumpster but you're just as delusional and I've heard that The Uni Bomber was very elloquint so in closing you're just another super-fan with an opinion your only mistake is your thinks yours is the only right one  

[NarcissisticDeity]

Do you think I consider the term "Starcraft nerd" perjorative? No sir!
Ultimately, it boils down to this:
- 2003 Ronnie had significantly larger muscules AND much better symmetry than Dorian.
I love how neither of you (ND or suckmymuscle) will address this point. This is empirical fact.
These two criteria account for 66% of the judging, so even if Dorian's conditioning was 100% better (which it was not), Dorian was nevertheless guaranteed to lose.

Conditioning / muscle maturity / muscle density. The remaining 33%.
This is the only point of contention remaining.

Dorian came in dry. Granted. Yet he had nothing to showcase. Exceedingly few striations, minimal vascularity, average separation. He simply did not have Ronnie's muscle maturity.

You know, the densely layered mounds of muscle ever-so-evident in Ronnie's peaked biceps (crags, peaks, fissures, it looks as though he has a bicep stacked on top of his bicep). Ronnie's multilayered chest with uniform striations, displaying thickly proportioned layers of pectoralis major. The steel cords present in his superior glutes and hamstrings.

Dorian cannot match Ronnie's glute/hamstring condition.
Dorian would exceed Ronnie's lower-back detail in 2003. Upper back is quite comparable.
Hell, I'll even give you Dorian's abdomen, despite Ron's comparable intercostal / serratus detail.

Still, Dorian has not come close to winning the show. Not by a long shot.

Ronnie did have large muscles than Dorian and better symmetry thats utter gargbage , Ronnie's balance & proportion in 2003 was at its all time worse , this is one area that he cannout touch Dorian on no matter what you say !! so you and your each round 33% nonsense is just that nonsense

The judges wont just hand Ronnie the muscularity round by virtue of superior size , the size has to be well comditioning and Ronnie 2003 despite what you claim is NO WHERE near as conditioned as Yates if he stood next to Dorian 93/95 this would be clearly evident and all your extra size would be null & void like sucky pointed out this is exactly why Dorian beat Haney at the 1991 Mr Olympia in the muscularity round dispite being 239lbs to Haney's 250lbs !!

Now lets entertain Ronnie would win the musculairty round , he would still be down in the symmetry round and up comes the posing round and you guessed it Ronnie would go done and go down hard !! Dorian has always been an excellent poser , especially compared to Ronnie who looks akward while posing his tranasitions are sloppy and for some reason he does the raise the roof and showcases his gut    you don't have to have the grace of Russ Testo when posing but you do have to properly do the mandatories and thats something Ronnie hasn't mastered

And any assumed advantage you can come up is moot , Dorian doesn't need as many striations as Ronnie or he doesn't need to be as vasular , his ass doesn't need to be as big , he doesn't need to beat Ronnie has his game .

[natural al]

You're a perfect example of ND's filler strategy-the only thing memorable about you is your whining. No content whatsoever. You luv whining like a beeootch, i'll give you that!

Here's another shot:

well..whatever you say.  first, you couldn't answer a few simple questions I've been asking you for along time.  Now all you do is act like a dick.  I really haven't posted in this thread in awhile and I was just kinda looking around and didn't get what you were trying to say.  Which you must not know since you couldn't answer that either.  All you've done in this thread is talked about a pole, which I didn't participate in-mostly cause I could care less-and post moronic pics that show nothing..oh yeah you've been a complete asshole to anyone who isn't on your side.  The only thing this thread proves is your a moron and your moronic legacy continues to grow.

[pumpster]

Hillarious-you want me to answer your questions, while proving over and over again you have nothnig whatever to say other than being a dink. Excellent, dude!