Author Topic: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents  (Read 8031 times)

knny187

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I say "no"

LOS ANGELES (Sept. 15) - New Orleans Saints running back Reggie Bush and his family appear to have accepted gifts, money and other benefits worth more than $100,000 from two marketing agents while the Heisman Trophy winner was still playing at Southern California, according to a report posted Thursday on Yahoo.com.

 
Julie Jacobson, AP
Reggie Bush left USC with a national championship and the Heisman Trophy. Did he also leave with his pockets lined?



The report says Michael Michaels, a marketing agency investor who wanted to represent the football star, and current Bush marketing agent Mike Ornstein lavished Bush and his family with gifts while he was still at USC, each hoping to entice him to sign with them once he left school.

Bush eventually chose Ornstein, which caused a falling out between Michaels and Bush's family.

Speculation over whether Bush and his family received money arose earlier this year in reports that his mother and stepfather didn't pay $54,000 in rent during the year they lived in a house owned by Michaels, who later said the family promised to repay him once Bush went pro.

The NCAA prohibits student-athletes and their families from receiving extra benefits from agents or their representatives. Any improper benefits could lead to NCAA sanctions against USC and retroactively cost Bush his college eligibility and Heisman Trophy.

The report was based on an eight-month investigation by Yahoo Sports, citing documents and interviews with on-the-record sources close to the situation. It lists several instances in which Bush and his family appear to have received financial benefits, including:

Suits for Bush's stepfather and brother to wear during the Dec. 10, 2005 Heisman ceremony in New York, a makeover for his mother for the event and limousine transportation - all paid for by Ornstein.

Two hotel stays by Bush, one in Las Vegas and another in San Diego, during March 2005. In both instances, the rooms were paid for by Michaels.

$13,000 from Michaels' fledgling firm, New Era Sports & Entertainment, to purchase and modify a car for Bush.

$595.20 in round-trip airfare from San Diego to Oakland in November 2005 for Bush's stepfather, LaMar Griffin, his mother, Denise Griffin and younger brother to attend the USC-California game at Berkeley. The charges were put on a credit card belonging to Jamie Fritz, one of Ornstein's employees.

Ornstein said he believes that when Fritz paid for airfare and a limousine for the Bush family's trip to the Cal game, the money was eventually paid back. Asked whether he was aware that such loans could constitute an NCAA violation, Ornstein told Yahoo: "I have no idea."

A phone message left by The Associated Press for Bush's attorney, David Cornwell, and Ornstein were not immediately returned late Thursday.

Ornstein denied to Yahoo any wrongdoing on his and Bush's behalf.

"Reggie Bush never received an extra benefit from Mike Ornstein other than what he was allowed to get from the NCAA when he worked with us," Ornstein told Yahoo. He added Bush was an intern at his marketing company in the summer of 2005. "I feel pretty damn good about that."

The NCAA and Pac-10 are investigating whether any rules were broken when Bush's family lived in the home owned by Michaels. Cornwell also said earlier this summer that FBI agents interviewed him about "potential federal crimes" by phone in June. The FBI would neither confirm nor deny whether a federal investigation was under way.

The NFL players union also is investigating the rent payments.


 In a statement released by USC counsel Kelly Bendell, the school said it is cooperating with the probe but "cannot comment on any matter that is the subject of an ongoing NCAA and Pac-10 investigation."

Saints spokesman Greg Bensel told the AP the team would not comment on matters involving Bush when he was in college.

"It doesn't involve the Saints," he said.

The allegations would have no effect on Bush's professional football career, a person within the NFL with knowledge of Bush's standing in the league told the AP. The source asked not to be named because of the sensitivity of the situation.

Bush was expected to be the No. 1 overall pick in the NFL draft, but the Houston Texans bypassed him and took North Carolina State defensive end Mario Williams. Bush went to New Orleans with the second pick.

AP Sports writers Brett Martel in New Orleans and John Nadel in Los Angeles contributed to this report.

Dos Equis

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2006, 11:15:55 AM »
Bush didn't get over $100,000.  Most of the benefits allegedly went to his family. 

I think he should keep his trophy. 

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2006, 11:16:16 AM »
IMO, it doesn't really matter now, he's making his mark in the NFL, making millions and was the rookie MVP last week. I'm pretty sure the NCAA rules are clear reguarding gifts and he and his handelers I'm sure knew, I say strip the Heisman!

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2006, 11:17:43 AM »
Bush didn't get over $100,000.  Most of the benefits allegedly went to his family. 

I think he should keep his trophy. 

You don't some of that money went to him...it's a fine line, if it wasn't for him, his family wouldn't have got nothing!

Dos Equis

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2006, 11:28:31 AM »
You don't some of that money went to him...it's a fine line, if it wasn't for him, his family wouldn't have got nothing!

Perhaps he got something, but the lion's share involves the rented house lived in by his parents.

Colossus_500

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2006, 11:29:33 AM »
I don't think the Heisman goes back. 

Al-Gebra

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2006, 11:40:23 AM »
I think he should be stripped, and so should USC . . . like Michigan's bb team were . . . everyone will still know what caliber player he was, but the NCAA should also uphold their own standards before they become irrelevant.

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2006, 12:20:30 PM »
Wouldn't that then make him responsible for the actions of others?

If your brother committed murder, ...should YOU be punished?
w

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2006, 12:25:39 PM »
Wouldn't that then make him responsible for the actions of others?

If your brother committed murder, ...should YOU be punished?

Depends on wether he was aiding and abedding!

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2006, 12:26:46 PM »
Wouldn't that then make him responsible for the actions of others?

If your brother committed murder, ...should YOU be punished?

[Gasp]  I agree with Jag.   :o

I don't think most kids know what their parents' financial situation is.  He can't be expected to know that his parents are living in a rent-free house.  

a_joker10

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2006, 12:32:01 PM »
Its ridiculous that these schools make millions on their sports franchises, but their athletes aren't paid.
Not only should he keep the heisman he should make bank from it too.
Z

Al-Gebra

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2006, 12:33:37 PM »
jag is a dumbass . . . i expected better from you, bb.

1. I'm sure your kids wouldn't raise an eyebrow if they came home tomorrow and found a note saying "come on over to our new home on Diamond Head." It's not like he was in college and warned about this stuff either.

2. He received direct benefits.

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2006, 12:34:21 PM »
Actually, the heisman is just a trphy.  USC couild lose their nat'l titles, as he was an ineligible player.  Just like if he had failed all his courses and played anyway.  If you have one ineligible player, whether it be a star or a scrub, you sometimes have to forfeit the games.

Al-Gebra

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2006, 12:35:50 PM »
Its ridiculous that these schools make millions on their sports franchises, but their athletes aren't paid.
Not only should he keep the heisman he should make bank from it too.

well, then who needs the ncAa? besides, the NFL likes using college football as a kind of "minor league," so they're investigating this too . . . it's a character issue . . . get some college under your belt before you handle a man's responsibilities. he just acted like a spoiled child and now it's biting the spoilers in the ass. he's not going to lose anything . . . so what if they take his Heisman?natl championship away?

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2006, 12:39:07 PM »
Depends on wether he was aiding and abedding!

If he was 'abedding', it would be the Anita Bryant and the homo-police coming after him, not the NCAA.
I believe the word you're searching for is 'abetting', however, 'aiding & abetting' is a 'criminal' term.

Accepting gifts is not a crime, ...and one should not be held accountable for the malfeasance of others. I say let Michaels take the family to court for any back rent he believes he is due, if he can prove he had a rental agreement for them to pay the money to begin with. If not, he should be the one answering to why he allowed such a thing, and if the conclusion was to have the family pressure him to sign with Michaels, then I doubt any rental agreement could be enforceable. If anything, Michaels could find himself up on charges like 'conspiring to corrupt a minor' or something similar since it would clearly be an attempt to get him to break rules. Who'd have ever thunk I'd stick up for someone named Bush?  :D
w

Al-Gebra

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2006, 12:41:00 PM »
If he was 'abedding', it would be the Anita Bryant and the homo-police coming after him, not the NCAA.
I believe the word you're searching for is 'abetting', however, 'aiding & abetting' is a 'criminal' term.

Accepting gifts is not a crime, ...and one should not be held accountable for the malfeasance of others. I say let Michaels take the family to court for any back rent he believes he is due, if he can prove he had a rental agreement for them to pay the money to begin with. If not, he should be the one answering to why he allowed such a thing, and if the conclusion was to have the family pressure him to sign with Michaels, then I doubt any rental agreement could be enforceable. If anything, Michaels could find himself up on charges like 'conspiring to corrupt a minor' or something similar since it would clearly be an attempt to get him to break rules. Who'd have ever thunk I'd stick up for someone named Bush?  :D

silly broad . . . start criticizing other people's spelling when you learn to spell yourself. For starters, it's a "conscience," not a "conscious."

and he wasn't a minor so that's bs too.

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2006, 01:04:17 PM »
silly broad . . . start criticizing other people's spelling when you learn to spell yourself. For starters, it's a "conscience," not a "conscious."

I don't believe I used either word in the above quote you reference.

Quote
and he wasn't a minor so that's bs too.

I suspected that since he was in college, ...however, I do believe I said 'something similar'.
w

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2006, 01:06:21 PM »
jag is a dumbass . . . i expected better from you, bb.

1. I'm sure your kids wouldn't raise an eyebrow if they came home tomorrow and found a note saying "come on over to our new home on Diamond Head." It's not like he was in college and warned about this stuff either.

2. He received direct benefits.

1.  They might raise an eyebrow, but they still wouldn't know my finances.  They wouldn't know if the house was rented, whether I saved and invested for the last ten years to buy, whether a rich relative died and left me money, etc.  And I'd never live anywhere near Diamond Head.   :)  He wasn't living with his parents at the time.

2.  He allegedly received direct benefits.  The primary benefit allegedly went to his parents.    

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #18 on: September 15, 2006, 01:08:46 PM »

Accepting gifts is not a crime, ...and one should not be held accountable for the malfeasance of others.

It's not a "crime," but it is a violation of NCAA rules (depending on the gift and who it comes from).

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2006, 01:10:29 PM »
If he was 'abedding', it would be the Anita Bryant and the homo-police coming after him, not the NCAA.
I believe the word you're searching for is 'abetting', however, 'aiding & abetting' is a 'criminal' term.



Sorry, I suffer from what I call "Yogi Berra" syndrom!

Al-Gebra

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2006, 01:12:31 PM »
Sorry, I suffer from what I call "Yogi Berra" syndrom!

why are you apologizing to that harpie?

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2006, 01:13:17 PM »
Sorry, I suffer from what I call "Yogi Berra" syndrom!

You remind me more of a big 'BooBoo' ...except BooBoo was cute & lovable.  >:(
w

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #22 on: September 15, 2006, 01:14:22 PM »
You remind me more of a big 'BooBoo' ...except BooBoo was cute & lovable.  >:(

I said "Yogi Berra" not "Yogi Bear" ::)!

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2006, 01:15:04 PM »
It's not a "crime," but it is a violation of NCAA rules (depending on the gift and who it comes from).

That's why I said 'aiding & abetting' is such an inappropriate term. An infraction of a rule set by an athletic association is not a crime, ...it is an infraction of a rule.
w

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Re: Should Heisman be stripped? - Bush Reportedly Got Over $100K From Agents
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2006, 01:16:28 PM »
I said "Yogi Berra" not "Yogi Bear" ::)!

And I said BooBoo.
w