Author Topic: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...  (Read 6523 times)

Cleanest Natural

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Maybe it's just me , but i noticed that pros hit their peak early during the span of their competitive life and for some reason never manage to duplicate...i'll give some examples : flex 93 arnold, dorian 93 olympia, nasser 95 arnold( i think)...one eception ..ronnie 98 olympia and 2003 olympia. Please discuss. I'm afraid of the same with heath...that we may never see what he brought to the colorado show again...add artwood on his first pro outing, cziurlok on his first olympia...

njflex

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2007, 08:07:16 AM »
darem charles seem's to hit it almost each time,and has gradually added size.so it has not hindered his condition,most the guy's mentioned played the size game,and no longer worried much about lost conditioning.they tried to cruise in on the added mass and sacrificed the sharpness they had achieved.

Cleanest Natural

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2007, 08:11:06 AM »
i personally think it's slin and nolotil but i'd like to hear gh15 on this one.

jaejonna

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2007, 08:28:12 AM »
examples

Cormier 99
Lee when he won the SF pro
Levrone in 97
Ruhl when he won the NOC (the real on not the pdi costume party)
Kamali in 01
L

kiwiol

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2007, 08:34:07 AM »
Maybe it's just me , but i noticed that pros hit their peak early during the span of their competitive life and for some reason never manage to duplicate...i'll give some examples : flex 93 arnold, dorian 93 olympia, nasser 95 arnold( i think)...one eception ..ronnie 98 olympia and 2003 olympia. Please discuss. I'm afraid of the same with heath...that we may never see what he brought to the colorado show again...add artwood on his first pro outing, cziurlok on his first olympia...

If it's just conditioning we're talking about, then you're wrong cause Dorian only slipped up a tad in 1994 (and that too, during pre-judging). He was better in 1995 than he was in 93 (conditioning wise) and was just as dry in 1996 (albeit a bit depleted and not as full as the previous year) and dry as hell in 1997 (although he had a problem holding his stomach in due to food poisoning). Likewise, Paul Dillett was better in the 1997 Olympia than he was in the previous years. I think even for a seasoned pro, conditioning is hit or miss, with the risk factor being lowered a lot if they put in sufficient prep prior to the contest. Look at Dennis James - he peaked well for the 2003 Mr O, but was never able to duplicate that condition for any of the Olympias before or after that one.

Cleanest Natural

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2007, 09:31:51 AM »
dorian never came close to duplicating the package from 93 period....

kiwiol

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2007, 09:33:36 AM »
dorian never came close to duplicating the package from 93 period....

He did mate. If you want, ask ND or Suckmymuscle to post pics of him from the 95, 96 and 97 Mr Olympia. Even in 1994, Doz's conditioning in the English Grand prix was amazing. Of course, I'm just talking level of conditioning, not shape or fullness or any other attribute.

Cleanest Natural

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2007, 09:36:32 AM »
He did mate. If you want, ask ND or Suckmymuscle to post pics of him from the 95, 96 and 97 Mr Olympia. Even in 1994, Doz's conditioning in the English Grand prix was amazing. Of course, I'm just talking level of conditioning, not shape or fullness or any other attribute.
bodybuilding is the whole package...EVERYTHING included....so...dorian. ..93...flex ...93.....GH15...don't remember what show...but it was early when he had hair ....;)

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2007, 09:57:40 AM »
Maybe it's just me , but i noticed that pros hit their peak early during the span of their competitive life and for some reason never manage to duplicate...i'll give some examples : flex 93 arnold, dorian 93 olympia, nasser 95 arnold( i think)...one eception ..ronnie 98 olympia and 2003 olympia. Please discuss. I'm afraid of the same with heath...that we may never see what he brought to the colorado show again...add artwood on his first pro outing, cziurlok on his first olympia...

If you look at the progressive years you have you can pretty much see the pattern of how the drug use increased over the years, the about and different cominations used makes it difficult to hold their peak conditioning and actually makes it more difficult to peak from year to year, if you look at the bodybuilders from the late 70's and 80's alot of these guys were still winning and coming in absolutly shredded each time out well into their late 30's 40's and in Beckles case 50's.......why? IMO, they new the right amount to take which wasn't a whole lot compared to todays standards and most of all, they new their bodys and new what works for them.

If in fact gh15 is DJ...that proves my point, he looks good 2-4 weeks out and in some cases good enough to win on that particular day, but where does he place the DAY of the show......out of the money...why? My guess is that his hormones are so out of balance that even the slightest miscalculation of food intake, especially when they start carb loading 3-4 days out is disasterous, bottomline........to many different compounds to get it right!

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2007, 10:02:24 AM »
mr intense...i agree with u....too many variables...but i think the oil and the esiclene is the key

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2007, 10:06:52 AM »
mr intense...i agree with u....too many variables...but i think the oil and the esiclene is the key

As far as I know, esiclese hasn't been on the market for years and synthol use is less than what people really think.....same with the drug use amoung the pros....alot less than what people want to believe!

Cleanest Natural

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2007, 10:08:16 AM »
As far as I know, esiclese hasn't been on the market for years and synthol use is less than what people really think.....same with the drug use amoung the pros....alot less than what people want to believe!
not synthol...nolotil...plus slin,gh+OIL INJECTED INTO THE MUSCLE

rccs

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2007, 10:09:47 AM »
Arnold had peak conditions several years in a row
S

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2007, 10:13:46 AM »
not synthol...nolotil...plus slin,gh+OIL INJECTED INTO THE MUSCLE

True  Nolotil=Esiclese

kiwiol

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2007, 10:14:59 AM »
bodybuilding is the whole package...EVERYTHING included....so...dorian. ..93...flex ...93.....GH15...don't remember what show...but it was early when he had hair ....;)

Of course it's the whole package. But your title and your first post talk about CONDITIONING and it was this attribute alone that I was talking about when I said Doz was just as good, if not better in 95, 96 and 97

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2007, 10:17:50 AM »
Of course it's the whole package. But your title and your first post talk about CONDITIONING and it was this attribute alone that I was talking about when I said Doz was just as good, if not better in 95, 96 and 97

There is one major factor that the judges miss in having the whole package...........symmet ry!

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2007, 11:02:40 AM »
He did mate. If you want, ask ND or Suckmymuscle to post pics of him from the 95, 96 and 97 Mr Olympia. Even in 1994, Doz's conditioning in the English Grand prix was amazing. Of course, I'm just talking level of conditioning, not shape or fullness or any other attribute.

  On a bodybuilding contest, three things are evaluated:

 - Muscularity.

 - Symmetry.

 - Conditioning.

  Muscularity refers especifically to muscular development, or the size of a competitor's muscles. Symmetry refers to the size of each muscle in relation to each other, and in relation to a symmetrical frame.

  What is conditioning? Conditioning is, essentially, what the muscles appear to be like. When a bodybuilder diets and prepares for a contest, he loses subcutaneous adipose tissue, and when he restricts Sodium before a contest, he loses subcutaneous water. What is the purpose of this? To increase conditioning. Things like separations, striations, vascularity and density only appear when you drop your fat and water significantly. For instance, there are powerlifters and strongmen who weight in excess of 350 lbs; they are more muscular than any pro bodybuilder, but their muscles just plain don't look as good.

  Dorian Yates never displayed deep separations - except for his back -, striations and vascularity, no matter how low his bodyfat and water were - exactly the reason why I conceaded that Ronnie was as conditioned as Dorian at the truce thread -, but his muscles had a "waxed marble" look to them which is unique in bodybuilding history. Even though he lacked things that conditioned bodybuilders like Shawn and Ronnie had, like deep separations and striations, Dorian had a second-to-none ability to lose the water under his skin, making him as conditioned if not more than the aforementioned bodybuuilders, because it gave him a look that made Shawn and others look soft next to him. Dorian's conditioning was ridiculous. Just ridiculous.

  As for what year Dorian was at his best in terms of conditioning, that's an easy one: 1996. However, this was far from his best, because you can lose water not only beaneath your skin, but also the one that's inside the muscles. In 1996, Dorian didn't have even a single drop of water under his skin, making his hardness outrageous, but he had so little water inside his muscles that they looked shrinked like plumes. In 1994 and 1997, Dorian was immensely full, but he was obviously carrying a slight film of water under his skin. This is picking at straws, though, because even when he was off, Dorian's conditioning was still the suff of dreams: his "off" conditioning would be regarded as a carrier best by any other pro. In my opinion, Dorian was at his absolute best in 1995. That year, he was as dry as 1993 - although not as much as 1996 -, and had enough water inside his muscles to make them look engorged. 1993 he was as dry as 1995, but a little depleted - although not as much as 1996. I wouldn't go as far as saying that Dorian's 1995 Olympia package is the best ever, but it is easily in the top three. Dorian never had the swollen, round muscles of a Ronnie Coleman, but in 1995 he came close, while combining it with his trademarked preter-human dryness. Out of this World. Absolutely mind-blowing. I must confess that I'm somewhat biased towards Dorian - just like Hulkster is biased towards the narrow hipped and round muscles look of Coleman -, because I personally love his combination of incredible thickness with super-human hardness; no one ever did it better than him. The only bodybuilder who came close to being as thick from the sides as Dorian was Ronnie in 2003, but he was very, very soft when compared to Diesel.

  Here are pics from 1996, his best conditioning ever - the best in bodybuilding history. I must reiterate, though, that this was far from his best overall - only in conditioning. ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2007, 11:04:46 AM »
  1994... ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2007, 11:06:52 AM »
  1993... ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2007, 11:09:14 AM »
  1995... ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2007, 11:11:39 AM »
  1997. Still rock-hard at over 270 lbs. He was holding a slight film of water, but his dryness would still be regarded as a career-best by most pros. ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Jr. Yates

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2007, 11:14:09 AM »
There is one major factor that the judges miss in having the whole package...........symmet ry!
no doubt on that! this year if they judge according to the way they said they would, Dex or Vic would have won.  Vic will have it soon, just needs to come ripped.
bodybuildersreality.com

suckmymuscle

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2007, 11:16:34 AM »
  More 1993... ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Mr. Intenseone

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2007, 11:19:43 AM »
  On a bodybuilding contest, three things are evaluated:

 - Muscularity.

 - Symmetry.

 - Conditioning.

  Muscularity refers especifically to muscular development, or the size of a competitor's muscles. Symmetry refers to the size of each muscle in relation to each other, and in relation to a symmetrical frame.

  What is conditioning? Conditioning is, essentially, what the muscles appear to be like. When a bodybuilder diets and prepares for a contest, he loses subcutaneous adipose tissue, and when he restricts Sodium before a contest, he loses subcutaneous water. What is the purpose of this? To increase conditioning. Things like separations, striations, vascularity and density only appear when you drop your fat and water significantly. For instance, there are powerlifters and strongmen who weight in excess of 350 lbs; they are more musculari than any pro bodybuilder, but their muscles just plain don't look as good.

  Dorian Yates never displayed deep separations - except for his back -, striations and vascularity, no matter how low his bodyfat and water were - exactly the reason why I conceaxded that Ronnie was as conditioned as Dorian at the truce thread -, but his muscles had a "waxed marble" look to them which is unique in bodybuilding history. Even though he lacked things that conditioned bodybuilders like Shawn and Ronnie had, like deep separations and striations, Dorian had a second-to-none ability to lose the water under his skin, making him as conditioned if not more than the aforementioned bodybuuilders, because it gave him a look that made Shawn and others look soft next to him. Dorian's conditioning was ridiculous. Just ridiculous.

  As for what year Dorian was at his best in terms of conditioning, that's an easy one: 1996. However, this was far from hbis best, because you can lose water not only beaneath your skin, but also the one that's inside the muscles. In 1996, Dorian didn't have even a single drop of wate3r under his skin, making his hardness outrageous, but he had so little water under his skin that his muscles looked shrinked like plumes. In 1994 and 1997, Dorian was immensely full, but he was obviously carrying a slight film of water under his skin. This is picking at straws, though, because even when he was off, Dorian's conditioning was still the suff of dreams: his "off" conditioning would be regarded as a carrier best by any other pro. In my opinion, Dorian was at his absolute best in 1995, That year, he was as dry as 1993 - although not as much as 1996 -, and had enough water inside his muscles to mae them look engorged. 1993 he was as dry as 1995, but a little depleted - although not as much as 1996. I wouldn't go as far as saying that Dorian's 1995 Olympia package is the best ever, but it is easily in the top three. Dorian never had the swollen, round muscles of a Ronnie Coleman, but in 1995 he came close, while combining it with his trademarked preter-human dryness. Out of this World. Absolutely mind-blowing. I must confess that I'm somewhat biased towards Dorian - just like Hulkster is bioased towards the narrow hipped and round muscles look of Coleman -, because I personally love his combination of incredible thickness with super-human hardness; not one ever did it better than him. The only bodybuilder who came close to being as thick from the sides as Dorian was Ronnie in 2003, but he was very, very soft when compared to Diesel.

  Here are pics from 1996, his best conditioning ever - the best in bodybuilding history. I was reiterate, though, that this was far from his best overall - only in conditioning. ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Yates = Second worst symmetry ever, only Coleman comes in First!


njflex

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Re: hitting the all time high in terms of conditioning during a career...
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2007, 12:26:24 PM »
I was no big fan of yate's but he was way ahead of the pack interms of sheer size/hardness,not pretty to look at but when he posed it looked like it hurt.he looked like every pound he weighed.