question for the jesus freaks

[FREAKgeek]

Let's say some degenerate piece of shit brutally rapes a woman and the woman gives birth to the kid.

Is it:

A) an abominable, sinful act
B) another beautiful soul brought into the world by the miracle of god

[Dos Equis]

Both?

Rape is sin.

Childbirth is a miracle. 

[alexxx]

Both?

Rape is sin.

Childbirth is a miracle. 

Good Answer!

[AVBG]

Both?

Rape is sin.

Childbirth is a miracle. 

I agree..

[FREAKgeek]

it can't be both, that's cheating damn it

[OzmO]

it can't be both, that's cheating damn it

lol

[haider]

2 seperate incidents.. though related are independent of each other here. Simple explanations as posted above are good enough.

BUT

The better question is..Since she's been raped, and gets pregnant with a child that she doesn't want, then is it permissible for her to get an abortion? Would that be a sin then?  

(Im not a "jesus freak", I'm a muslim..and I think Islams view on similar matters is pretty much on parallel with christian teachings.)

[blinky]

2 seperate incidents.. though related are independent of each other here. Simple explanations as posted above are good enough.

BUT

The better question is..Since she's been raped, and gets pregnant with a child that she doesn't want, then is it permissible for her to get an abortion? Would that be a sin then? 
(Im not a "jesus freak", I'm a muslim..and I think Islams view on similar matters is pretty much on parallel with christian teachings.)

really good question. i argue this with my mom quite often. i was raised and consider myself to be christian BUT i belive this is 1 circumstance where abortion should be allowed if the mother chooses. my mother who is VERY religious says its still wrong because its an innocent life.

[Colossus_500]

Great answer by Beach. 

Blinky, I used to think that way too.  But when you think about it, even though a child is brought into this world by violence, it doesn't dictate the rest of his/her life.  Who's to say that God doesn't have a plan for the child who was brought into this world for a greater purpose?  That's like saying God made a mistake, and we know that He doesn't. 

[Lord Humungous]

Great answer by Beach. 

Blinky, I used to think that way too.  But when you think about it, even though a child is brought into this world by violence, it doesn't dictate the rest of his/her life.  Who's to say that God doesn't have a plan for the child who was brought into this world for a greater purpose?  That's like saying God made a mistake, and we know that He doesn't. 

understandable Colossus but I still think  an embryo is not a human life and I dont have a problem with a woman wanting an abortion for reasons such as rape, massive birthdefects, or danger to the mother. It shouldnt be allowed to be used as birth control.

[Colossus_500]

understandable Colossus but I still think  an embryo is not a human life and I dont have a problem with a woman wanting an abortion for reasons such as rape, massive birthdefects, or danger to the mother. It shouldnt be allowed to be used as birth control.

When I saw my first child at 8 weeks on an ultrasound, she was but a speck and a heartbeat.  I totally connected with my child at that point, bro.  No way anyone will EVER convince me that an embryo is not a human life at that point.  Too many things have happened in my lifetime to convince me that even those with massive birth defects can still teach the rest of us a lesson or two about life, more specifically about perceverence.  And at the point of making a decision between mother and child during the birthing process, it's a tragedy one way or the other.     My wife and I discussed this with each of her pregnancies.  Should I have had to make that decision, she wanted me to save the baby.  And my heart would literally ache at just the thought.  I told her that I don't know that I would have been able to make that decision.  Thank God I haven't had to make that decision, and I pray for any man who has to do so. 

[blinky]

Great answer by Beach. 

Blinky, I used to think that way too.  But when you think about it, even though a child is brought into this world by violence, it doesn't dictate the rest of his/her life.  Who's to say that God doesn't have a plan for the child who was brought into this world for a greater purpose?  That's like saying God made a mistake, and we know that He doesn't. 

i agree with everything you said. this child is no less special because he/she is a product of rape. i'm only saying that in this instance the mother should have the choice.

[Lord Humungous]

When I saw my first child at 8 weeks on an ultrasound, she was but a speck and a heartbeat.  I totally connected with my child at that point, bro.  No way anyone will EVER convince me that an embryo is not a human life at that point.  Too many things have happened in my lifetime to convince me that even those with massive birth defects can still teach the rest of us a lesson or two about life, more specifically about perceverence.  And at the point of making a decision between mother and child during the birthing process, it's a tragedy one way or the other.     My wife and I discussed this with each of her pregnancies.  Should I have had to make that decision, she wanted me to save the baby.  And my heart would literally ache at just the thought.  I told her that I don't know that I would have been able to make that decision.  Thank God I haven't had to make that decision, and I pray for any man who has to do so. 

Totally understandable, I guess since my wife and I have no children -I have no bone to pick with you Colossus to each his own

[Cavalier22]

it is never the babies fault

[FREAKgeek]

So I can essentially rape as many women as I want and in one regard it's a blessing in disguise.

[Colossus_500]

So I can essentially rape as many women as I want and in one regard it's a blessing in disguise.

Of course we all know you say that as a howard-sternish attempt at shock factor, but you know full well this is something you wouldn't dream of doing, therefore you know how ridiculous a thought this is. 

[FREAKgeek]

Of course we all know you say that as a howard-sternish attempt at shock factor, but you know full well this is something you wouldn't dream of doing, therefore you know how ridiculous a thought this is. 

Why is this so ridiculous? Isn't that what you are essentially saying?

[Butterbean]

So I can essentially rape as many women as I want and in one regard it's a blessing in disguise.

The baby itself would be considered a blessing.  The act of rape will always be an abominable sin.....

[Bast175]

what if a guy rapes 200 women then is honestly sorry for doing it later on.. (repenting)  Can he go to heaven?

[FREAKgeek]

what if a guy rapes 200 women then is honestly sorry for doing it later on.. (repenting)  Can he go to heaven?

He sure can.
This is a religion that judges you on what you do in a brief course of life (based on environmental and roll of the dice factors) and then suffer eternal consequences from.

[Dos Equis]

Not a realistic hypothetical.  Repentance takes place when you listen to your conscience (i.e., the Holy Spirit) telling you your conduct is wrong.  It would likely take years for a man to rape 200 women.  Each time, his conscience tells him it's wrong.  Each time he ignores it.  He then ignores it so much that he can no longer hear it.  By the time he has raped woman number 200, he probably actually believes his conduct is okay.  So, he's likely not going to repent.

[body88]

What is the deal with Christains anyway? You guys want free rain to practise your beliefs. Yet try to tell women they cannot have the right to choose '

Hard core Christains imo are very hypocritical.