Author Topic: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?  (Read 10850 times)

Dos Equis

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #50 on: October 20, 2010, 11:56:20 AM »
So according to you the courts can take away life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness with 'due process'  where is the due process for 'enemy combatants'?  Aren't they from the same creator who gave us these rights according to you?  Or are you agreeing with me that these rights were bestowed by man upon man and have nothing to do with a creator bestowing them upon us?

Enemy combatants are not American citizens. 

kcballer

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #51 on: October 20, 2010, 12:41:17 PM »
Enemy combatants are not American citizens. 

So you're agreeing with me then?  Because if those inalienable rights were from a creator wouldn't all men regardless of country or creed get to enjoy those?  Like i said the rights of this countries citizens are bestowed on them by man.  Proof is in what you just said.  Unless you believe being born here makes you somehow closer or more divine in the creators eyes. 
Abandon every hope...

Arnold jr

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #52 on: October 20, 2010, 01:33:09 PM »
All men are created with the same set of rights granted to each man, regardless of the country you were born in, race, sex or position in life. It is up to the United States to protect those rights for its citizens, it is not up to the United States to protect those rights of citizens of foreign lands. The protection of those rights is empowered by the government at hand and the people under it...for example, the rights of Germans are the same as those in the U.S. but it is up to the Germans to protect those rights for their people, it is not up to the U.S.

Look at it like this; you are responsible for what happens in your house, you are not responsible for what happens in your neighbors house. Yes, you're neighbor should do the right thing but that is your neighbors call. If what your neighbor does infringes on you and your household, then yes, you are responsible to protect your household from that infringement by your neighbor. You are responsible for protecting your household, you are protecting the life, liberty and pursuit of happiness of your household, if your neighbor breaks into your house and threatens that, he has forfeited his rights and is now subject to your discretion. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #53 on: October 20, 2010, 05:12:33 PM »
So you're agreeing with me then?  Because if those inalienable rights were from a creator wouldn't all men regardless of country or creed get to enjoy those?  Like i said the rights of this countries citizens are bestowed on them by man.  Proof is in what you just said.  Unless you believe being born here makes you somehow closer or more divine in the creators eyes. 

Nope.  See Arnold's response. 

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #54 on: October 20, 2010, 08:39:50 PM »
What Creator established these rights?  The part of all men are created equal is ironic for those bleating about the Creator in a biblical sense.  Because we all know that book of fairy tales didn't establish women, black men and slaves with the same set of rights as other men.

Arnold jr

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #55 on: October 21, 2010, 12:50:30 AM »
What Creator established these rights?  The part of all men are created equal is ironic for those bleating about the Creator in a biblical sense.  Because we all know that book of fairy tales didn't establish women, black men and slaves with the same set of rights as other men.

You know what's so funny and frustrating about this topic is that it is perhaps one of the most basic concepts in the world but for some reason some people can't see it or they simply refuse too...I'm not sure which. I honestly believe you could explain all of this to a four year old child and they would get it and understand it a lot better than a lot of adults...of course "A Lot of Adults" is a very relative phrase because the truth of the matter is most people recognize these very, very simple truths...the "A Lot" that actually make up a very small portion of the population, yet they seem to strut around as if they are in a majority surrounded by a minority of Homer Simpson's...pretty strange.

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #56 on: October 21, 2010, 05:47:43 AM »
You know what's so funny and frustrating about this topic is that it is perhaps one of the most basic concepts in the world but for some reason some people can't see it or they simply refuse too...I'm not sure which. I honestly believe you could explain all of this to a four year old child and they would get it and understand it a lot better than a lot of adults...of course "A Lot of Adults" is a very relative phrase because the truth of the matter is most people recognize these very, very simple truths...the "A Lot" that actually make up a very small portion of the population, yet they seem to strut around as if they are in a majority surrounded by a minority of Homer Simpson's...pretty strange.

All that typing and still didn't answer my question.  Maybe you should recruit some of those 4 year olds to help you out.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #57 on: October 21, 2010, 05:56:55 AM »
All that typing and still didn't answer my question.  Maybe you should recruit some of those 4 year olds to help you out.


The "inalianable rights" come from the God of Creation and God of Nature, as it is believed by 98% of people, not the Govt. 

If you don't believe in God, fine, I understand that the concept seems wacky, but to 98% who do, it makes perfect sense, especially considering the history of totalitarian govts ruling over the life, liberty, and freedom of people. 

 

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #58 on: October 21, 2010, 06:54:23 AM »

The "inalianable rights" come from the God of Creation and God of Nature,

 

Then explain why the Bible - the source book for this God of Creation - denies many rights to women, slaves, and people of other religions. 
Once you explain that little paradox you just created with your statement you can move along a bit further.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #59 on: October 21, 2010, 07:06:09 AM »
Then explain why the Bible - the source book for this God of Creation - denies many rights to women, slaves, and people of other religions. 
Once you explain that little paradox you just created with your statement you can move along a bit further.

I have no idea - the Bible was written by men who were writing for their times.    Maybe some others can explain that better than myself, but the premise is that the God who Created the universe is thew ultimate grantor of our rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, not govt hacks on their fleeting whims and wishes. 

 

Straw Man

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #60 on: October 21, 2010, 07:31:42 AM »
as usual, the clowns in our society are the ones who tell the truth.

George Carlins take on rights is that if they really came from God then he/it would have given you the right to a bit of food every day and a roof over your head and wouldn't have been so concerned whether had a gun or not.

his take on "rights" starts @ 4:30


Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #61 on: October 21, 2010, 07:33:30 AM »
as usual, the clowns in our society are the ones who tell the truth.

George Carlins take on rights is that if they really came from God then he/it would have given you the right to a bit of food every day and a roof over your head and wouldn't have been so concerned whether had a gun or not.

his take on "rights" starts @ 4:30



 ::)  ::)

I guess the concept of negative liberties has no meaning to you?   


Straw Man

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #62 on: October 21, 2010, 07:41:52 AM »
YES!   

If you are born in some other country that does not have our Dec. of indep., consti, etc, your rights are subject to mans laws, not the creator.  Wake up. 

so "god" recognizes borders and citizenship?

 ::)

MindSpin

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #63 on: October 21, 2010, 07:45:53 AM »
HEY MORON - HAVE YOU EVER READ THE DECLARATION OF iNDEPENDENCE? 


"WE ARE ENDOWED BY OUR CREATOR" 

Not obama, not bush, the trees and rocks, not gays, not the sun, but the creator. 

there is no creator.  hope that helps.
w

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #64 on: October 21, 2010, 07:48:10 AM »
there is no creator.  hope that helps.

Good, when obama/Bush/Palin or some other hack politician comes to rob your liberties from you, where are you going to say your "inalienable rights" derive from?  The moon? 

Mr. Magoo

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #65 on: October 21, 2010, 07:49:21 AM »
is this thread referring to deism or theism?

the founder fathers were deists

MindSpin

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #66 on: October 21, 2010, 07:50:58 AM »
Good, when obama/Bush/Palin or some other hack politician comes to rob your liberties from you, where are you going to say your "inalienable rights" derive from?  The moon? 

Why do they need to be derived from anywhere ::)
w

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #67 on: October 21, 2010, 07:54:06 AM »
Why do they need to be derived from anywhere ::)

Are you serious? 

Mr. Magoo

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #68 on: October 21, 2010, 08:37:29 AM »
is this thread referring to deism or theism?

the founder fathers were deists

bump for 333386's reply

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #69 on: October 21, 2010, 08:42:59 AM »
bump for 333386's reply

This issue has been discussed in so many other threads already.  Many of these guys were committed christians and look up the quotes from Adams for Gods' sake. 

Straw Man

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #70 on: October 21, 2010, 08:51:43 AM »
This issue has been discussed in so many other threads already.  Many of these guys were committed christians and look up the quotes from Adams for Gods' sake. 

and many were Diest and some were no doubt agnostic or atheists

oddly, none of these alleged chrisitans managed to the word "jesus" or even "god" into our founding documents and even went out of there way to proclaim in official documents  that our nation was in no way founded on the christian religion

they even went so far to establish a country that allowed for the freedom to practice any chosen religion or even none at all

pretty radical don't ya think?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #71 on: October 21, 2010, 08:54:30 AM »
and many were Diest and some were no doubt agnostic or atheists

oddly, none of these alleged chrisitans managed to the word "jesus" or even "god" into our founding documents and even went out of there way to proclaim in official documents  that our nation was in no way founded on the christian religion

they even went so far to establish a country that allowed for the freedom to practice any chosen religion or even none at all

pretty radical don't ya think?

They did that because there were many divisions among many different sects and religions and many were distrustful of each other in that regard.  The founders created the greatest documents in the world between the Declaration, Const. etc by setting up Govt how they did. 

I agree with you on their views and am thrilled they were smart enough to frame the nation how they did. 

Straw Man

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #72 on: October 21, 2010, 09:00:57 AM »
They did that because there were many divisions among many different sects and religions and many were distrustful of each other in that regard.  The founders created the greatest documents in the world between the Declaration, Const. etc by setting up Govt how they did. 

I agree with you on their views and am thrilled they were smart enough to frame the nation how they did. 

they did it because they saw how fucked up things get when you mix religion with government

this is basic shit man

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #73 on: October 21, 2010, 09:01:56 AM »
they did it because they saw how fucked up things get when you mix religion with government

this is basic shit man

I agree - have I ever been a holy roller on this site? 

MindSpin

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Re: Does President Obama Think Our Rights Come from Our Creator?
« Reply #74 on: October 21, 2010, 09:14:24 AM »
Are you serious? 

uh yeah.  you mean to tell me that unless some "higher power" give me rights, I don't have any?  lol
w