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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Positive Bodybuilding Discussion & Talk => Natural Bodybuilding => Topic started by: Livewire on September 26, 2007, 10:35:20 AM
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:)
What are the top 5 differences for a bodybuilder?
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recovery times.
ability to cheat on diet.
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100 lbs of muscle mass
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100 lbs of muscle mass
there you go
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1 Bigger
2 Rounder
3 Leaner
4.Mentally stronger
5. More enjoyable training sessions/life in general, because you don't get sore for very long
ability to cheat on diet.
???
Any idea what steroids are? And what they do?
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ability to cheat on diet.
I think you're thinking of other drugs like T3 & such. When on test, ed, deca, winny, etc... you need to watch your diet. Because you can & will get fat if you don't.
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1 Bigger
2 Rounder
3 Leaner
4.Mentally stronger
5. More enjoyable training sessions/life in general, because you don't get sore for very long
???
Any idea what steroids are? And what they do?
Agree with one and two.Three is highly debatable and four is just laughable.
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From what I understand, you can be a lot more lacks on the diet and training--and the results won't suffers as much.
Obviously, recovery time is big. You can train the same body part more often because it has completely recovered.
This one kid on myspace was natural for a long time. He saays he feels like Superman--in the gym, walking around, and in the bedroom.
If you compete, you can get better results in a shorrter period of time---meaning no months on strict dieting. You can cheat more when you are on the diet too. Sounds like life is a lot more fun.
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From what I understand, you can be a lot more lacks on the diet and training--and the results won't suffers as much.
Obviously, recovery time is big. You can train the same body part more often because it has completely recovered.
This one kid on myspace was natural for a long time. He saays he feels like Superman--in the gym, walking around, and in the bedroom.
If you compete, you can get better results in a shorrter period of time---meaning no months on strict dieting. You can cheat more when you are on the diet too. Sounds like life is a lot more fun.
Actually you can get fat quite easy on a cycle. Dont ask me why im not a doctor, im sure someone here will pipe up. It might be because your appetite is larger when you're using gear. But from what i've seen, when im off a cycle i dont gain fat as easily, but when i'm on i gotta watch my diet and eat more clean because i'm more incline to put weight on in fat. Granted either way im still gainin muscle, and im sure even if i ate completely like shit i'd still gain a bit of muscle, im only talkin about fat.
Anyways thats enough from me, gnight y'all
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I get tired of all the "Natural purists" haters talking shit about what they never done...
So here's the real deal...
Response is somewhat individual and age related also..
They let me eat more like when I was younger and not put on fat as easy.
Increase muscle mass and recovery from ANY hard work.
Mentaly faster on the right dose of stuff like test or Dbol. But At the point of major aromatisation there is a loss of mental clarity.
THe "DIFFERENCE" IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT.
So many Natties overtrain at a rate that would fry a healthy juicer.
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I get tired of all the "Natural purists" haters talking shit about what they never done...
So here's the real deal...
Response is somewhat individual and age related also..
They let me eat more like when I was younger and not put on fat as easy.
Increase muscle mass and recovery from ANY hard work.
Mentaly faster on the right dose of stuff like test or Dbol. But At the point of major aromatisation there is a loss of mental clarity.
THe "DIFFERENCE" IS WHAT YOU MAKE IT.
So many Natties overtrain at a rate that would fry a healthy juicer.
you should post a picture , you must be a beast.
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Agree with one and two.Three is highly debatable and four is just laughable.
Try taking them before a critical exam fase in school/uni. etc. I tried it and can tell the difference.
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Try taking them before a critical exam fase in school/uni. etc. I tried it and can tell the difference.
Quicker, sharper your sayin' ?
I'd agree.
There is a point of too much though.
Get about as logical as a women w/ PMS.
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Quicker, sharper your sayin' ?
I'd agree.
There is a point of too much though.
Get about as logical as a women w/ PMS.
A lot sharper indeed. Easier to memorize a lot of data in a short time.
But like you said, don't overdo it. Coudn't agree more.
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A lot sharper indeed. Easier to memorize a lot of data in a short time.
But like you said, don't overdo it. Coudn't agree more.
I agree. And, you REALLY need go overboard to go the opposite way.
Anadrol, and big doses of Deca or combinations of are major culprit to PMS like thinking.
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arnold talked about cumming in the gym. is there a certain high that u can get from steroids while weight training?
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arnold talked about cumming in the gym. is there a certain high that u can get from steroids while weight training?
He was comparing a bicep pump to a hard-on. Its pretty funny, I dont know if its been edited out of Pumping Iron these days.
A pump on some Testo and/or Anadrol, Deca can get so engorged you cant continue a set or bend your arm anymore. Downright painfull. They also stay pumped LIKE THAT MUCH MUCH LONGER. Its pretty satisfying to a
BBer for sure. You may watch yourself grow more in first 2 weeks than previous year.
A nice highrange normal level of test makes me very allert and fast reflexes. Dbol esp fast reflexes.
Very noticible for me in my 40's.
I aint telling everyone to use, but the fears are way overblown. Its great stuff for hard physical jobs for a older guy.
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but do u actually feel a high like u would with a rec drug?
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Natural vs. Steroid
Striving to reach your genetic potential in skeletal muscle hypertrophy through consumption of high quality foods/supplements (excluding steroids) while breaking your butt in the gym vs. striving to reach your genetic potential in skeletal muscle hypertrophy through consumption of high quality foods/supplements (including steroids) while breaking your butt in the gym. But the two are mutually exclusive so why bother comparing them at all?
Nice post. Who really cares if some takes steroids or not? Does it matter in the long run? The thing I can't stand are those "cycle warriors" who only train while on cycle & that's it.
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but do u actually feel a high like u would with a rec drug?
NO. Absolutely not. Simply more energy and better recovery. Feel like I did in my 20's and early 30's.
The pumps and recovery are even better than that though.
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Dont matter if you take steroids or not. Just train and do your best. Ive seen excellent bodybuilders both steroid and natural. We are all focused on one thing.. thats to make your body stronger..bigger..better .
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it just depends - do u want to be the best in the world, or at least competing with the best, or not have the potential health risks yet compete with lesser bbers.
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it just depends - do u want to be the best in the world, or at least competing with the best, or not have the potential health risks yet compete with lesser bbers.
I use steroids, but I prefer many natural builds to many steroid competitors today. Lift for you.
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i think the steroid look is only good for some. arnie - perfect structure, muscle bellies, face, etc. same with lee priest, lou ferrigno, and some others. theyre the posterchildren for bbing for a reason. thesedays every man and his dog is vying for that pro spot, and u see alot of ugly physiques and structures simply not traditionally 'perfect' for bbing (ala jay cutlers wide waist and lack of vascularity/striations/detail) but as u say, lift for urself. u do what u can do with what U were given. in the same respect, if u have the option to compete and test urself against others, while gaining a little more notoriety, why not? aslong as the love for bbing is there, it's all good.
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i think the steroid look is only good for some. arnie - perfect structure, muscle bellies, face, etc. same with lee priest, lou ferrigno, and some others. theyre the posterchildren for bbing for a reason. thesedays every man and his dog is vying for that pro spot, and u see alot of ugly physiques and structures simply not traditionally 'perfect' for bbing (ala jay cutlers wide waist and lack of vascularity/striations/detail) but as u say, lift for urself. u do what u can do with what U were given. in the same respect, if u have the option to compete and test urself against others, while gaining a little more notoriety, why not? aslong as the love for bbing is there, it's all good.
Yeah, it got to be everyone and his dog using for no reason, and lots of problems.
I'll never be a competitor and thats not why I use the stuff.
HIghest doses Ive used to work and make money.
The sstuff weren't made to grow 20" arms in the first place. I dont like this Insulin look today on most.
Yates was 1st and one of few to make it look good at the top level of BBers IMO.
Just plain Ugly is all I can say for Cutler. Get them stretch marks on his ass Lazed would be a start.
They aint from Squats, they from insulin. Remind me of pregnant woman.
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arnold talked about cumming in the gym. is there a certain high that u can get from steroids while weight training?
That comment was made up off the cuff by Arnold and didn't even approach being a realistic comparison. Watch the Pumping Iron 20th Anniversary video and the extras interview they do with Arnold where is talks about the hype they put into the movie in order to make it sell.
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Thats a politician covering his ass. Dammage control.
What else have the edited out?
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Steroids - big pecs w/bitch tits
Natural - smaller pecs w/no bitch tits
GH - big, pregnant looking gut
Natural - small waist w/tight abs
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Steroids - big pecs w/bitch tits
Natural - smaller pecs w/no bitch tits
GH - big, pregnant looking gut
Natural - small waist w/tight abs
So all the 1970s BBers had a bitch tits? They all used steroids.
Ive used HGH and dont have a big gut. Ive got defined seratus, and intercostals and obliques at almost 50yrs old.
Basically your talking about what you have no experience with, and generalizing from extreme examples.
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Steroids - big pecs w/bitch tits
Natural - smaller pecs w/no bitch tits
GH - big, pregnant looking gut
Natural - small waist w/tight abs
So all the 1970s BBers had a bitch tits? They all used steroids.
Ive used HGH and dont have a big gut. Ive got defined seratus, and intercostals and obliques at almost 50yrs old.
Basically your talking about what you have no experience with, and generalizing from extreme examples.
Where do you read "all" into my message?
Damn! Someone's must be having a bout of 'roid rage. (Ooops! Sorry, didn't mean to generalize about something I have no experience with.)
Re: your "defined seratus, and intercostals and obliques", as Squadfather would say, "hahahahahahaha post your picture and prove it."
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That comment was made up off the cuff by Arnold and didn't even approach being a realistic comparison. Watch the Pumping Iron 20th Anniversary video and the extras interview they do with Arnold where is talks about the hype they put into the movie in order to make it sell.
i tend to agree with trab as far as lying to keep his political career intact. ive heard from another source that there is a certain high from training on steroids. maybe it differs person to person or drug to drug
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i tend to agree with trab as far as lying to keep his political career intact. ive heard from another source that there is a certain high from training on steroids. maybe it differs person to person or drug to drug
The pumps are awesome, very allert and high energy. Not "High" in the Rec Drug sense.
Dont expect a speed, coke or pot type high, you'll be very dissapointed.
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The pumps are awesome, very allert and high energy. Not "High" in the Rec Drug sense.
Dont expect a speed, coke or pot type high, you'll be very dissapointed.
post a picture.
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Lets see you abs Fat Ass. You talk shit but never put anything that amounts to a Pic up.
Your caryin way too much fat and water for your age. Dont kid your deluded brain its beef. Your bench #s
tell the story. ;)
I didnt realise I'd bumbled into another of your multipersonality disorder gimmicks.
54 posts a day on "SquadMommy" only... ::) Get a life.
so i guess that's a no on the picture, right? :D
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so i guess that's a no on the picture, right? :D
SAme as you, no picture. Thats not a picture you put up Fat ass.
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#1 Fuck you.
#2 your blanket comment is false and stupid. Intelligent GH use will cut fat and make abs more visible. Stupid.
#3 Friends get my pix. Your a asshole, I dont have assholes as friends.
I hope you Enjoy your warm relationship with denMother. ;)
Answers to:
#1 - No thanks I'll pass. Go find a another gayboy for your sexual antics.
#2 - You're taking GH to try to stop father time I assume. Too little testoterone left?
#3 - You have friends? You'd think your 'roid rage would have scared them off.
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Its also stupid when people take steroids/drugs and think they are tough and big when they have nothing. Just take the stuff and dont even look big.. dont even train hard or eat clean. when the natural guy is pushing weight, eating clean, no smoking.. and making good gains and in the end looks better then the juicer. Natural all the way.
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Its also stupid when people take steroids/drugs and think they are tough and big when they have nothing. Just take the stuff and dont even look big.. dont even train hard or eat clean. when the natural guy is pushing weight, eating clean, no smoking.. and making good gains and in the end looks better then the juicer. Natural all the way.
Natural bodybuilding is hell when you experienced steroids. Take my word for it, trained natural for 5 years and hated the soreness in each bodypart for the whole week.
Weird post btw, you claim naturals look better than juicers? Crappy gym you have.
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Natural bodybuilding is hell when you experienced steroids. Take my word for it, trained natural for 5 years and hated the soreness in each bodypart for the whole week.
Weird post btw, you claim naturals look better than juicers? Crappy gym you have.
;D
The "Natural" Mr Olympia? :'( <$
Yes, that would fill the seats!
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Its also stupid when people take steroids/drugs and think they are tough and big when they have nothing. Just take the stuff and dont even look big.. dont even train hard or eat clean. when the natural guy is pushing weight, eating clean, no smoking.. and making good gains and in the end looks better then the juicer. Natural all the way.
Your post makes no sense (IMO). I've seen juicers that look like shit & natty's that look like shit & vice versa. Again I'll ask this: Who gives a fuck who takes or doesn't take steroids? Does it matter in the long run. I think all that is important is we train - be it "assisted" or not. I've said this over & over I've got no problem training naturally & no problem training "assisted". In all honesty my training style doesn't change much on or off - with the exception of maybe using a little more weight or banging out a few more reps when taking AAS. The only thing I suggest is being honest about your useage or lack there of.
Can't we all just get along? ;D
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all that matters is how u look. plain and simple.
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all that matters is how u look. plain and simple.
It's not how good you are but how good you look. ;D
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It's not how good you are but how good you look. ;D
In this "sport" how good you look is how good you are
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It's not how good you are but how good you look. ;D
In this "sport" how good you look is how good you are
very true fellas.
as for my comment, i was simply referring to the 'natty vs unnatty' debate, not in life in general. ;)
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1) TEST
2) DBOL
3) ANADROL
4) TREN
5) MUSCLES
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I competed natually for 13 years in various organizations with the last being NPC Natural shows. I beat a lot of guys who were on while I was natty, only using what was sold in stores. So, yes, took pro-hormones. That is another debate on whether I was truely natural or not. Some claim if they take a Flintstone vitamin, you are not natty.
My experience has been, most nattys are like bible thumpers and very narrow minded. Slandering those that use AAS and such. It is a lifestyle choice and I am still friends with a lot of natural guys, where most natty guys would shun someone who uses, claiming they are the devil!
Here is the deal, I have been assisted now for about 1 1/2 years and the difference between natty vs. aas users is not as big as you would think.
Sure, I recover much quicker, can eat more and keep bodyfat lower, train longer and more frequently but using AAS is not a cure all. I still train just as hard as when I was natty, I just use now for the same reason most do, to keep progress going. I hit my genetic peak naturally and was not until then that I started using. Also, my system crashed after my last natural show in 06 and my test was at 100! Natural or not, no one can grow with that low of test.
We are all trying to accomplish the same thing, muscular progress. Natty or not, we all still need to eat, train and sleep also in order to grow.
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I competed natually for 13 years in various organizations with the last being NPC Natural shows. I beat a lot of guys who were on while I was natty, only using what was sold in stores. So, yes, took pro-hormones. That is another debate on whether I was truely natural or not. Some claim if they take a Flintstone vitamin, you are not natty.
My experience has been, most nattys are like bible thumpers and very narrow minded. Slandering those that use AAS and such. It is a lifestyle choice and I am still friends with a lot of natural guys, where most natty guys would shun someone who uses, claiming they are the devil!
Here is the deal, I have been assisted now for about 1 1/2 years and the difference between natty vs. aas users is not as big as you would think.
Sure, I recover much quicker, can eat more and keep bodyfat lower, train longer and more frequently but using AAS is not a cure all. I still train just as hard as when I was natty, I just use now for the same reason most do, to keep progress going. I hit my genetic peak naturally and was not until then that I started using. Also, my system crashed after my last natural show in 06 and my test was at 100! Natural or not, no one can grow with that low of test.
We are all trying to accomplish the same thing, muscular progress. Natty or not, we all still need to eat, train and sleep also in order to grow.
pro hormones = legal steroids.
natty = no steroids at all.
big difference there.
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pro hormones = legal steroids.
natty = no steroids at all.
big difference there.
pro hormones = worthless crap
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I competed natually for 13 years in various organizations with the last being NPC Natural shows. I beat a lot of guys who were on while I was natty, only using what was sold in stores. So, yes, took pro-hormones. That is another debate on whether I was truely natural or not. Some claim if they take a Flintstone vitamin, you are not natty.
My experience has been, most nattys are like bible thumpers and very narrow minded. Slandering those that use AAS and such. It is a lifestyle choice and I am still friends with a lot of natural guys, where most natty guys would shun someone who uses, claiming they are the devil!
Here is the deal, I have been assisted now for about 1 1/2 years and the difference between natty vs. aas users is not as big as you would think.
Sure, I recover much quicker, can eat more and keep bodyfat lower, train longer and more frequently but using AAS is not a cure all. I still train just as hard as when I was natty, I just use now for the same reason most do, to keep progress going. I hit my genetic peak naturally and was not until then that I started using. Also, my system crashed after my last natural show in 06 and my test was at 100! Natural or not, no one can grow with that low of test.
We are all trying to accomplish the same thing, muscular progress. Natty or not, we all still need to eat, train and sleep also in order to grow.
Maybe this could be the problem. From what I hear, if you're an older guy (30+) your progress will be slow even on AAS. If you had started when you were younger (20-24) you might have blown up with less effort and less juice.
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I competed natually for 13 years in various organizations with the last being NPC Natural shows. I beat a lot of guys who were on while I was natty, only using what was sold in stores. So, yes, took pro-hormones. That is another debate on whether I was truely natural or not. Some claim if they take a Flintstone vitamin, you are not natty.
My experience has been, most nattys are like bible thumpers and very narrow minded. Slandering those that use AAS and such. It is a lifestyle choice and I am still friends with a lot of natural guys, where most natty guys would shun someone who uses, claiming they are the devil!
Here is the deal, I have been assisted now for about 1 1/2 years and the difference between natty vs. aas users is not as big as you would think.
Sure, I recover much quicker, can eat more and keep bodyfat lower, train longer and more frequently but using AAS is not a cure all. I still train just as hard as when I was natty, I just use now for the same reason most do, to keep progress going. I hit my genetic peak naturally and was not until then that I started using. Also, my system crashed after my last natural show in 06 and my test was at 100! Natural or not, no one can grow with that low of test.
We are all trying to accomplish the same thing, muscular progress. Natty or not, we all still need to eat, train and sleep also in order to grow.
Quoted for truth imo of course
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If you take pro-hormones, M1T, superdrol, any of that crap you are not natural. Period.
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If you take pro-hormones, M1T, superdrol, any of that crap you are not natural. Period.
ppfffft.
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england_1 speaks the truth. u dont get those type of gains from any natural product.
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england_1 speaks the truth. u dont get those type of gains from any natural product.
PRO HORMONES are garbage.
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well ppl have used them and gained quite nicely.
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well ppl have used them and gained quite nicely.
PPL gain quite nice on bacon and eggs too.
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indeed, but prohormones are often taken off the market due to their discovered anabolic qualities.
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indeed, but prohormones are often taken off the market due to their discovered anabolic qualities.
Taken off market because they violate law, tahts all.
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Maybe this could be the problem. From what I hear, if you're an older guy (30+) your progress will be slow even on AAS. If you had started when you were younger (20-24) you might have blown up with less effort and less juice.
Not neccessarily. I made a concious decision not to juice at my younger age because I wanted to max out where I could go naturally. In hind sight, probably should have started a bit earlier rather than taking the pro-hormones. My progress has been tremendous since using and the doses I used are not outlandish either.
Was not trying to debate whether I was natural or not because of my pro-hormone use, I followed the rules of the "Natural Bodybuilding Organizations" I competed in. I was mearly saying, natty or not, we all are in the game for the same reasons.
Bottom line is, work hard, eat, rest and results will come no matter what you use because without that, you can juice till oil comes out your ears and not make gains. It is not a cure all!!! So, it is always about the effort you put in all areas of making muscular gains...
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well ppl have used them and gained quite nicely.
Maybe the gains people made ,they would have made anyway.
I don't know anyone who has made any dramatic gains from them.I don't know anbout what's out now..but back in the late 90's when they first came out I used about every one of em.
They do just about enough to supress your natural test levels and not much more.
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indeed, but prohormones are often taken off the market due to their discovered anabolic qualities.
::) wrong
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::) wrong
ok, so tell me why they are taken off.
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ok, so tell me why they are taken off.
BECAUSE THEY ARE DANGEROUS, UNTESTED USELESS SHIT.
WAHT BETTER ANSWER COULD YOU WANT.
GTBRO1 IS 100% ON TARGET.
FORGET THIS SHIT AND LIFT AND EAT. IT IS TRASH AND HARMFULL.
YES YOU CAN END UP PISSING BLOOD FROM THEM, GOOD LUCK.
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half the natural products claiming a possibility for growth are useless but they are still on shelf.
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half the natural products claiming a possibility for growth are useless but they are still on shelf.
More like 99% ;)
Creatin, WHey, Mulitvit, Glutamine, BCAA, Thats about all thats worth buying.
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exactly. and if ur gonna get steroids, get the real deal
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More like 99% ;)
Creatin, WHey, Mulitvit, Glutamine, BCAA, Thats about all thats worth buying.
I went to a seminar once, three products were claimed that actually were legal and would give a boost to performance (in different ways) were creatine, caffeine and baking soda.
Everything else was considered equal to sound nutrition, eg whey protein.
Or worthless unless there was a deficiency in the body (ZMA).
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ok, so tell me why they are taken off.
It all started with Mark Mcguire admitting he used Andro. Then the homerun record and the witch hunt in pro baseball and bla bla bla.
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It all started with Mark Mcguire admitting he used Andro. Then the homerun record and the witch hunt in pro baseball and bla bla bla.
I figured the andro was a convienent excuse for a bad T:E ratio if they ever asked.
It was OTC and not banned, so he could use some testo and have a perfect excuse for a blown test. ;)
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I figured the andro was a convienent excuse for a bad T:E ratio if they ever asked.
It was OTC and not banned, so he could use some testo and have a perfect excuse for a blown test. ;)
BINGO. :) That what I figured too. Also that could have something to do with them being pulled from the market. I don't mean HIM in particular...but there were some athletes that blamed testing possitive for decca on the 19-nor pro hormones...make em illegal and that ruins that excuse for everyone. just a thought.
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BINGO. :) That what I figured too. Also that could have something to do with them being pulled from the market. I don't mean HIM in particular...but there were some athletes that blamed testing possitive for decca on the 19-nor pro hormones...make em illegal and that ruins that excuse for everyone. just a thought.
I think the bottom line is - They are drugs.
Drugs that are untested. The pharma industry spends a fortune to bring drugs to market and the viciously protect that turf.
There's lots of politics & competition in Pharma and what is made available as it competes with other companys products.
Also, there is a major interest to replace older drugs with much more spendy new ones.
Drug pattents expire and then the 1000% profit margin goes out the window when any Pharma Corp can make it generic.
Most the Old guys on ED drugs (Viagra, Cialis,Levitra ) Have low testo. One or two cc of Sustanon would do more for them for 3 weeks at a fraction of the cost of ED drugs. There is little profit in common sense.
ANadrol was pulled from the US market and replaced by much more spendy (and dangerous) EPO.
The AIDS and Gay loby had a big part in making it widely available again.
Corruption and greed rule. Nothing new.
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BINGO. :) That what I figured too. Also that could have something to do with them being pulled from the market. I don't mean HIM in particular...but there were some athletes that blamed testing possitive for decca on the 19-nor pro hormones...make em illegal and that ruins that excuse for everyone. just a thought.
These athletes buy these pro-hormones looking for and edge but they all end up testing positive. All pro-hormones are tweaking the chemisty of real drugs and 19 nor will be a tweak of nandrolone. Then when the FDA bans that product, they tweak it again, making another hormone. The government has re-written the law so many times and are falling short of a "blanket" law that bans them all. I have heard horry stories of where some of this shit is made.
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Your post makes no sense (IMO). I've seen juicers that look like shit & natty's that look like shit & vice versa. Again I'll ask this: Who gives a fuck who takes or doesn't take steroids? Does it matter in the long run. I think all that is important is we train - be it "assisted" or not. I've said this over & over I've got no problem training naturally & no problem training "assisted". In all honesty my training style doesn't change much on or off - with the exception of maybe using a little more weight or banging out a few more reps when taking AAS. The only thing I suggest is being honest about your useage or lack there of.
Can't we all just get along? ;D
Amen. It's just that steroid users are tired of all the bullshit that is tossed around in the media/boards etc. All "science" of people who never even used a.s.
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Amen. It's just that steroid users are tired of all the bullshit that is tossed around in the media/boards etc. All "science" of people who never even used a.s.
Exactly. I've got respect for anyone who trains regularly - be it assisted or not. I haven't been on anything in seven months & I'm fine with that. My training remains the same.
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Exactly. I've got respect for anyone who trains regularly - be it assisted or not. I haven't been on anything in seven months & I'm fine with that. My training remains the same.
Have you kept the gains you made during your cycle?
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Probably roughly 75% of them (I'm about 40lbs heavier then I was four or five years ago). Right now I weigh the lowest I have in the last two years but that's on purpose.