Author Topic: >* The New Locker Room *<  (Read 826271 times)

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #425 on: September 01, 2007, 07:50:01 AM »
My girlfriend is into and understands the whole scene  but does not read the boards.

We go to shows together and she "gets it"...we went to the Europa in Dallas and going to the O in Vegas which are like vacations for us. We sprinkle in other activities (non bodybuilding related) when we go to these shows. She even will be pining my tris for me soon  :D

Regardless, if your girl loves who you are, should not matter how much muscle you have! She knows about my extended family here and is glad that I can learn about the darkside from people that know their shit! Lets just hope she does not cruise what I have written on the Sex Board  :o

That's funny because my wife can't stand the sport. Never played sports or really exercised until she met me. Now she'll trian about three times a week (usually only with me).

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #426 on: September 01, 2007, 07:52:29 AM »
On a positive note my wife loves baseball now.  ;D

busyB

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #427 on: September 01, 2007, 10:13:04 AM »
On a positive note my wife loves baseball now.  ;D

That is funny because that is the one sport I can not get her to like!

HOWEVER, she is getting into football now and bought me the NFL package for our two year aniversary.

I was really proud of her when she called me the other day and had the Raiders pre-season game on! I almost cried, I was so proud :'(


Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #428 on: September 03, 2007, 02:08:50 PM »
Who here trains with some sort of low volume high intensity protocol? In the past I've always been a relatively high volume guy, but this year I'm drastically changing things and going towards more of a HIT routine. I say more of a HIT routine, but not exactly HIT persay, it's more along the lines of the Dave P. philosophy. Hey, I figure if I'm going to use his dieting methods I might as well add the whole package for the full benefit.

For those unaware of the Dave P. style HIT training, it is again along the same philosophies as actual HIT but slightly a bit more volume, not quite as low volume but not high volume by any means.

Anyway, I dieted this past year using this type of training and really liked it, so this will be my first run at trying to gain using this. Any opinions or suggestions?

trab

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #429 on: September 03, 2007, 02:28:27 PM »
Who here trains with some sort of low volume high intensity protocol? In the past I've always been a relatively high volume guy, but this year I'm drastically changing things and going towards more of a HIT routine. I say more of a HIT routine, but not exactly HIT persay, it's more along the lines of the Dave P. philosophy. Hey, I figure if I'm going to use his dieting methods I might as well add the whole package for the full benefit.

For those unaware of the Dave P. style HIT training, it is again along the same philosophies as actual HIT but slightly a bit more volume, not quite as low volume but not high volume by any means.

Anyway, I dieted this past year using this type of training and really liked it, so this will be my first run at trying to gain using this. Any opinions or suggestions?

I wish I'd tried low volume many years ago, back when I could have REALLY benefited from it.
You can train hard or long, but not both.
 
Getting to the few sets that count as fast as you can, doing them at max weight and intensity without get hurt, and go recover is the trick.

AJ, Your Dad (Arnold Senior  ;D) prolly would have had a even more impressive build at his peak if he could have pried himself out of the Gym a little faster each training session.......

Another thing worth looking at is the top PLers  speed vs max effort day switch up.
Forcing the body to generate various qualities of force. Explosive vs slow moving max effort.
I think that explosiveness is being overlooked by a lot of BBers and they are missing out.
Check out the thickness on some of them fat PLers... Theres some awesome muscle w/ real integrity under all the pancakes and chocolate and beer.
Youall dont have to eat like them, but stealing some of they methods may be of benefit.

busyB

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #430 on: September 03, 2007, 06:30:42 PM »
Who here trains with some sort of low volume high intensity protocol? In the past I've always been a relatively high volume guy, but this year I'm drastically changing things and going towards more of a HIT routine. I say more of a HIT routine, but not exactly HIT persay, it's more along the lines of the Dave P. philosophy. Hey, I figure if I'm going to use his dieting methods I might as well add the whole package for the full benefit.

For those unaware of the Dave P. style HIT training, it is again along the same philosophies as actual HIT but slightly a bit more volume, not quite as low volume but not high volume by any means.

Anyway, I dieted this past year using this type of training and really liked it, so this will be my first run at trying to gain using this. Any opinions or suggestions?

It is the only way I have trained since taking up BB. I learned from Mentzer himself with personal sessions right about the time he went off the deep end. Then modified with a bit more volume, ala Dorian Yates in early 90's. Dorian and I had a candid discussion about Mentzer and tweaking HIT for what works best for you. At that time, I was natty so was by far the best way for results in the shortest amount of time. Few w/u's on first exercise and 2 working sets per exercise. EX: Chest would be a total of about 6-8 working sets at 8-12 reps. If you get 12, too light...

Lately, been studying Dogcrapp version since I am not natty and can hit a bit more often. I have tweaked my Dorain routine a bit since being on with hitting ea. bodypart about every 5th day where in the past was every 7th day. Mark Dugdale trains with a modified version of Dogcrapp+Dorian.

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #431 on: September 03, 2007, 08:28:27 PM »


AJ, Your Dad (Arnold Senior  ;D) prolly would have had a even more impressive build at his peak if he could have pried himself out of the Gym a little faster each training session.......


I agree, Dad would have been even better if he could have figured out that his volume was too high...most of us would be worthless piles of shit if we trained like he did for a very long time. When I first got into lifting seriously I jumped on to the Arnold style of training straight from his book. I started at level one and stuck with that for around 3-4 months. During that time I grew very fast, but I was still pretty fresh so anything would have worked. After that i went to level 2 in his plan and after about 2-3 months of that my progress started going backwards...that's when I started realizing something had to change. For those that have never tried the Arnold style training, he has you hitting every bodypart 3xwk with very high volume, 5sets per exercise and multiple exercises...it's insane and there are probably only a handfull of people all time who could get away with that.

Funny story, 3 years ago at the Arnold Q&A after the ASC, someone asked him to lay out a good delt routine. He said the only way to grow big delts was to hit them with as many sets as possible and that if you did anything under 28sets per delt trainings session then you were short changing yourself. hey, I'm the biggest Arnold fan in the world but when I heard him say this I was already at a place to where I knew he didn't know what he was talking about. I mean come on, 28 sets for delts and you're hitting them 3xwk...I don't' care how much gear you're on, but I doubt any man hear could handle that, lol



Lately, been studying Dogcrapp version since I am not natty and can hit a bit more often. I have tweaked my Dorain routine a bit since being on with hitting ea. bodypart about every 5th day where in the past was every 7th day. Mark Dugdale trains with a modified version of Dogcrapp+Dorian.
DC training seems interesting and I've looked into it. The only thing I don't like is the dieting methods he impores with it...too overboard IMO.

busyB

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #432 on: September 03, 2007, 09:52:34 PM »
I agree, Dad would have been even better if he could have figured out that his volume was too high...most of us would be worthless piles of shit if we trained like he did for a very long time. When I first got into lifting seriously I jumped on to the Arnold style of training straight from his book. I started at level one and stuck with that for around 3-4 months. During that time I grew very fast, but I was still pretty fresh so anything would have worked. After that i went to level 2 in his plan and after about 2-3 months of that my progress started going backwards...that's when I started realizing something had to change. For those that have never tried the Arnold style training, he has you hitting every bodypart 3xwk with very high volume, 5sets per exercise and multiple exercises...it's insane and there are probably only a handfull of people all time who could get away with that.
Funny story, 3 years ago at the Arnold Q&A after the ASC, someone asked him to lay out a good delt routine. He said the only way to grow big delts was to hit them with as many sets as possible and that if you did anything under 28sets per delt trainings session then you were short changing yourself. hey, I'm the biggest Arnold fan in the world but when I heard him say this I was already at a place to where I knew he didn't know what he was talking about. I mean come on, 28 sets for delts and you're hitting them 3xwk...I don't' care how much gear you're on, but I doubt any man hear could handle that, lol
DC training seems interesting and I've looked into it. The only thing I don't like is the dieting methods he impores with it...too overboard IMO.

One possible reason why DAD is so beat up nowadays!

Back then, obviously, the science behind their gear intake was non existant which is one reason he is on Dialysis. They tried to just take as much gear as possible with no rhyme or reason behind their methods to help them recover from the overabundant training. As with drugs, training science has evolved and he is only speaking of what he knew then. 28 sets, no flippin' way!! I trained delts yesterday for a total of 8 working sets and they are brutally sore today!!

As for DC, he does give his "recommendations" but I know guys that use other nutritionist with his training and Dante is really cool with that. He is not one to say he knows everything and will allow the trainee to adjust (diet and training) according to them making progress. Which is one reason I am considering his program.

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #433 on: September 03, 2007, 10:50:22 PM »
One possible reason why DAD is so beat up nowadays!

Back then, obviously, the science behind their gear intake was non existant which is one reason he is on Dialysis.


Arnold's on dialysis? That's news to me...you sure about this? I know he's got the heart condition which keeps him from ever training heavy again, but I've never heard about him being on dialysis.


As for DC, he does give his "recommendations" but I know guys that use other nutritionist with his training and Dante is really cool with that. He is not one to say he knows everything and will allow the trainee to adjust (diet and training) according to them making progress. Which is one reason I am considering his program.
You know when it comes to any type of low volume training, the hardest part for me has been trying to recondition my mind. Basically I've brainwashed myself over the years simply because like a lot of you I love to train just for trainings sake. Honestly, I would much rather train with the highest volume possible, as much as I can physically stand each time because training itself is so enjoyable to me. And of course the old adage "more is not always better," is sometimes so hard to get around in your own mind. But needles to say, as much as I do enjoy training, I am more interested in the training being as efficient as humanly possible...so it's low volume for me for a while. I'm sure as I get into this style of training even more, I'll make adjustments and the sets and exercises may creep up in numbers, then again they may not, it will simply be what ever works best.

busyB

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #434 on: September 04, 2007, 11:27:26 AM »
Arnold's on dialysis? That's news to me...you sure about this? I know he's got the heart condition which keeps him from ever training heavy again, but I've never heard about him being on dialysis.


You know when it comes to any type of low volume training, the hardest part for me has been trying to recondition my mind.

I believe it was about 5 yrs ago or so, before the Governor elections. I could be wrong but I could have sworn I read about him needing dialysis. But then again, you know how rumors fly around in this business. It was seperate from the heart issues.

As for low volume, you are 100% right, it is the mental factor you will need to get used to. Once you find that intensity level to make up for the lack of volume, you might be surprised. But don't talk yourself into more volume, follow protocol young man and give it some time!!

Overload

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #435 on: September 04, 2007, 12:36:20 PM »
When i'm not following a pure powerlifting protocol like westside i use a combination of Max-OT, HIT and DC training. i combined them all to my needs, as i don't like them all completely, i think some leave out important things. i love rest pause training from DC, it works wonders on flyes, pullovers and pulldowns.

i think the more intense you train and heavier you lift, the less sets you can do.

for example on chest day i do about 12 sets at the most! then i try to see how many pushups i can do. some days i can barely get 15 pushups but when i'm fresh i can crank out 50 without a problem. so i know i've fully used all the muscle fibers.

now, when i trained high volume YEARS ago i was doing 20 sets per bodypart and i still had energy in the tank at the end. when i do low volume heavy training i'm drained by 12-16 sets.

in my opinion, and remember i train for strength only(the size comes with it IMO), the heavier and more intense you train, the less sets you need. on the other hand if your a pumper and like to do high reps with light weight then i think you can do alot more sets, like Arnold and Jay cutler.

i never got a single thing from high volume training. every now and then i'll do 20 rep squats or benches but i usually stick to 12 reps or less. on power moves(bench, squat, deadlift) i NEVER go above 5 reps, even on my warmups.

Trab is right, for strength you need max effort day and speed day. heavy weight overload + speed = strength! any strong lifter will tell you this.

IMO Ronnie Coleman's style of training is PERFECT! heavy and basic!

8)

trab

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #436 on: September 04, 2007, 02:15:25 PM »
THe thing about HIgh volume is - You feel Great when all pumped up..
Its addictive (hope they dont make it illegal, better not tell them)
Its hard/ impossible to force a lot of  young guys to cut a workout to 1hr or so.

Thing is their form is usually so bad that if they was doing it right, and heavy, it'd be impossible to go on those marathon sessions.

They ought to put intelligent weight training/ cardio programs in all the schools.
Individually tailor them, this Obesity epidemic is repulsive, expensive and a threat to the country.
We waste a lot of $'z  on stuff thats totally useless in the schools.
 

Overload

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #437 on: September 04, 2007, 02:55:30 PM »
THe thing about HIgh volume is - You feel Great when all pumped up..
Its addictive (hope they dont make it illegal, better not tell them)
Its hard/ impossible to force a lot of  young guys to cut a workout to 1hr or so.

Thing is their form is usually so bad that if they was doing it right, and heavy, it'd be impossible to go on those marathon sessions.

They ought to put intelligent weight training/ cardio programs in all the schools.
Individually tailor them, this Obesity epidemic is repulsive, expensive and a threat to the country.
We waste a lot of $'z  on stuff thats totally useless in the schools.
 

I agree.

i do feel great when pumped up.

it's funny because people give me shit about how i only workout for about 1 to 1.5 hour every day. for some reason they think you need to spend 3 hours to build muscle, which only increases cortisol levels. then i have them train with me and by the end of that 1 hour they are about to die. it makes me laugh because they don't know what "hard work" in the gym is. pumping out 15 reps with 225 isn't a workout to me, squeezing up 475 for 3 reps is a fucking workout, i breathe so fucking heavy after triples and doubles. your body is using MAXIMUM effort to get that weight up. shit, i've almost passed out after a heavy 600 pound deadlift double. try doing that with some pump reps...lol...well, besides squats! i've seen stars after some high rep squats.

8)

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #438 on: September 04, 2007, 06:55:48 PM »
I agree.

i do feel great when pumped up.

it's funny because people give me shit about how i only workout for about 1 to 1.5 hour every day. for some reason they think you need to spend 3 hours to build muscle, which only increases cortisol levels. then i have them train with me and by the end of that 1 hour they are about to die. it makes me laugh because they don't know what "hard work" in the gym is. pumping out 15 reps with 225 isn't a workout to me, squeezing up 475 for 3 reps is a fucking workout, i breathe so fucking heavy after triples and doubles. your body is using MAXIMUM effort to get that weight up. shit, i've almost passed out after a heavy 600 pound deadlift double. try doing that with some pump reps...lol...well, besides squats! i've seen stars after some high rep squats.

8)
You know the another one of the challenges of lifting this way is trying to find that 'right" weight. What I mean is going heavy but not going too heavy to where you aren't working the muscle intended...I've only been at this low volume style for a little while but this seems like it's someting you have to pay a bit more attention to. It's very easy to do on chest moves anyway, but even more so now...at least I've found. And I am anal about this...if I'm doing any type of chest press and I feel my shoulders taking over at all or my tri's taking too much of the brunt away from my chest, then that's too heavy...I want chest growth not a big pressing number.

Am I saying all this clearly? I just read over what I said and I'm not sure if I did or not.

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #439 on: September 04, 2007, 07:36:48 PM »
I don't think I have an actual training method (anymore). I basically trian based on how I feel. I usually set aside a certain number of sets per bodypart, per week. I usually train with moderate to high reps (about 80% of the time). As for rest between sets it all depends on what exercises I'm doing. I'd say on average about 60-90 seconds between sets.

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #440 on: September 04, 2007, 07:38:06 PM »
New topic.

There is a guy I know at my gym who is 24 and I've decided is one of the strongest natural guys I've ever known. For example, this spring when he was 230lbs he was squatting 600+lbs for 6-8 reps ass to calves...and I do mean ass to calves, they touch! He dieted down this summer to 213, again completely natural and is still squatting 500+ lbs for 6-8 ass to calves weighing 213lbs...feet closer then normal, slightly less the shoulder width.

Anyway, he's starting his first cycle in about a wk, and back to bulking...I can't wait to see what kind of weight this guy moves!

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #441 on: September 04, 2007, 07:45:13 PM »
New topic.

There is a guy I know at my gym who is 24 and I've decided is one of the strongest natural guys I've ever known. For example, this spring when he was 230lbs he was squatting 600+lbs for 6-8 reps ass to calves...and I do mean ass to calves, they touch! He dieted down this summer to 213, again completely natural and is still squatting 500+ lbs for 6-8 ass to calves weighing 213lbs...feet closer then normal, slightly less the shoulder width.

Anyway, he's starting his first cycle in about a wk, and back to bulking...I can't wait to see what kind of weight this guy moves!

Damn. Keep us posted on this guy.

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #442 on: September 04, 2007, 07:57:51 PM »
New topic: I just bought a $200 fountain pen on eBay for $75. If my wife finds out she'll fucking kill me. But I've got a weakness for nice pens (especially fountain pens).

Luv2Hurt

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #443 on: September 04, 2007, 08:04:45 PM »
New topic.

There is a guy I know at my gym who is 24 and I've decided is one of the strongest natural guys I've ever known. For example, this spring when he was 230lbs he was squatting 600+lbs for 6-8 reps ass to calves...and I do mean ass to calves, they touch! He dieted down this summer to 213, again completely natural and is still squatting 500+ lbs for 6-8 ass to calves weighing 213lbs...feet closer then normal, slightly less the shoulder width.

Anyway, he's starting his first cycle in about a wk, and back to bulking...I can't wait to see what kind of weight this guy moves!

Thats pretty good!!  I experienced something similar just yesterday.  This dude i know who was a trainer at my gym, hes about 6' 244 lbs now.  Last year he was a natural and did his first show, didn't do too good.  Well over the summer he hooked up with another trainer dude who also used to work at our gym, he is a short maybe 5'5" VERY thick dude about 260lbs and is incredibly strong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I mean I did not believe it till I saw it  :o  The cat inclines 495lbs like it is nothing for like 10 reps  again would not believe it unless I saw it.  This dude squatted 800lbs in the gym for 5 and made it look easy, full ROM.  The dude trains in full sweats with a hood and comes in there like a little bear.  

Anyhow these dudes trained together for a while.  Now the 6 foot dude was when he first started training with the bear was nothing special as far as training and has since geared up and put on some good size to where he is now.  but yesterday I was in the gym training chest and he was training back, the bear has since left the gym but his buddy the 6 footer was doing T-bar rows with the end of the bar stuck in a corner and using the close grip handle on the bar.  Now this was like the dudes 3 or 4th exercises I saw him already deadlifting and doing BB bent rows with some good weights.  I walk by and he says "hey will you stand on the back of the bar so it does not lift up"  I'm like "sure" at this time I look at the bar and the cat has 9 freeking plates on there!!  I'm thinking to myself this is gonna be good expecting to be using all legs and have terrible form, the fu*ker bangs out 9 reps with very reasonable form for that weight......I was amazed and told him so.

Thats what you need to surround yourself with in the gym, people better than you.  Man I'm gonna do a huge offseason cycle this winter and hook up with that dude and get down to some very serious training......If I survive.

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #444 on: September 04, 2007, 08:23:14 PM »


Thats what you need to surround yourself with in the gym, people better than you.  Man I'm gonna do a huge offseason cycle this winter and hook up with that dude and get down to some very serious training......If I survive.
Agreed big time. I've never trained with this guy before but I'm going to start trying to work in with him when are schedules work. Are first session will be tomorrow for legs...should be fun. He's already got a regular partner and he's no slacker himself. Normally I would never want to jump in with 2 other guys, would take to long, but these 2 do not mess around so it should be fine.

I'm telling you this guy is phenomenal, and not just strong. The strength is what caught my eye at first because like the guy L2H just talked about he stays completely covered up most of the time and I never really noticed what he actually looked like.

The guy used to do some BB comps in the teen class when he was younger but hasn't done one in years. But now he is on the war path and has laid out a very nice plan that will have him on stage around June.

I've never made a claim like this about anyone I know because it's never fit IMO, but you guys mark my words, this guy has the genetic stuff, and if he stays healthy I guarantee you'll hear about this guy in the very near future...not a weak point on this brother.

wes mantooth

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #445 on: September 04, 2007, 08:59:11 PM »
New topic: I just bought a $200 fountain pen on eBay for $75. If my wife finds out she'll fucking kill me. But I've got a weakness for nice pens (especially fountain pens).

consider this a "virtual" slap across the face   POW!!!!

i guess there are worse vices than pens......but why pens rimmy?


btw..i have a sweet pilot ill let you have for $15....still got 1/2 the ink left!!!!!

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #446 on: September 04, 2007, 09:13:29 PM »
Agreed big time. I've never trained with this guy before but I'm going to start trying to work in with him when are schedules work. Are first session will be tomorrow for legs...should be fun. He's already got a regular partner and he's no slacker himself. Normally I would never want to jump in with 2 other guys, would take to long, but these 2 do not mess around so it should be fine.

That's cool. Makes me wish I had a training partner again. Since I trained with you in May I've trained with a couple friends here & there. Makes me wish I could find a perminent partner...oh well. I've always been amazed how much more you can lift with someone else there.

 :'(

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #447 on: September 04, 2007, 09:16:56 PM »
consider this a "virtual" slap across the face   POW!!!!

i guess there are worse vices than pens......but why pens rimmy?


btw..i have a sweet pilot ill let you have for $15....still got 1/2 the ink left!!!!!

That's nicer then what she'll do to me when & if she finds out.  ;D Why pens? I don't know but I've always love fountain pens. I used to do a ton of writing (poems, journals, stories, etc). I've considered writing again lately & thought a good pen would be a nice start or at least something to get the ball rolling. Well see. It's really a sharp pen. Now I've just got to buy a shitload of cartridges.

Arnold jr

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #448 on: September 04, 2007, 09:19:48 PM »
That's cool. Makes me wish I had a training partner again. Since I trained with you in May I've trained with a couple friends here & there. Makes me wish I could find a perminent partner...oh well. I've always been amazed how much more you can lift with someone else there.

 :'(
No doubt, it helps a lot but not too many people out there who want to do it consistently...to bad, they don't know what they're missing.

I've had several regular partners over the past few years, but none of them seem to stick. My last training partner was a pretty good one, but we had kind of a falling out this past spring...childish bullshit if you ask me. Even so, our training/BB lifestyles have kind of gotten pretty different anyway, so it was probably for the best in that regard. He's gotten kind of burned out with the whole thing and that can actually bring you down.

Rimbaud

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Re: *****The New Locker Room*****
« Reply #449 on: September 05, 2007, 12:38:05 AM »
New Topic:

Does anyone out there have a PS3? If so what's your opinion of it? Is it worth the money? Thanks in advance.

I'm asking because I'm thinking about getting my wife one for her birthday (it'll also be a present for me too  ;D ).