Death for Craig and life for Kelly?

[Tre]

That's old news.

If he was not involved in this until the "body disposal" phase, then he would have no first-hand knowledge of the actual murder and who did it and the circumstances surrounding it.

All he did was burn or help burn a car, right? 

Sounds like a hundred hours of community service to me.

[bigdumbbell]

imagine he freaked when confronted with the truth

[G o a t b o y]

All he did was burn or help burn a car, right? 

Sounds like a hundred hours of community service to me.

Actually, if he claims not to know anything about the body (and it isn't proven otherwise), and all he did was buy gas for Titus and watch him light the car on fire, he could end up with no jail time at all.  I mean, he knew the car belonged to Titus... add to that the fact he's just a 23-year-old kid doing what a 40-year-old adult told him to, and he could claim ignorance and being naive and could make out okay.

[gh15]

Actually, if he claims not to know anything about the body (and it isn't proven otherwise), and all he did was buy gas for Titus and watch him light the car on fire, he could end up with no jail time at all.  I mean, he knew the car belonged to Titus... add to that the fact he's just a 23-year-old kid doing what a 40-year-old adult told him to, and he could claim ignorance and being naive and could make out okay.

oh ya the little dude is fine. he'll be ok. probation probably

[Man of Steel]

I think it was Colonel Mustard in the library with the candlestick.



MOS

[knny187]

I think it was Colonel Mustard in the library with the candlestick.



MOS

BINGO

 

[NESTOR]

ok ok well lets not forget the prosecutors usually play with the acused minds ...so that way they can try to soft them up and confess ....it is easier for the prosecutor to try this way hoping they will spill all the info try to get a deal and also cuts the job of the cops by at least half ....anyways the police and prosecutor always are going to try to use a lie hoping to get the truth ...example so and so ..in this case that moron in jail right now that it is involved ..told us that u did it and he will testify againts u so tell us whats up better we'll cut u a deal .. again this is only and example of what it could be use to soft them up...

[marsunit]

That's old news.

If he was not involved in this until the "body disposal" phase, then he would have no first-hand knowledge of the actual murder and who did it and the circumstances surrounding it.

So limited value in flipping.

Since he's already made a statement that places Titus at the torching (although he left out the alleged Walmart trip) and that part's on TAPE anyway the deal would probably be to amend his statement so the prosecution can put their ducks in a row. He's not the glamour takedown the prosecutor wants anyway so I can see Gross mowing the lawn at City Hall ala the Runaway Bride (Keith Olberman is so funny).

[suckmymuscle]

I heard mention on another board that Phil Hernon has a reliable source that they are seeking the death penality on Craig and life in prison for Kelly. Unless this is just a BS move on the prosecutions part to rattle them they must have pretty solid evidence that Craig did the deed and it was premediated.

  Only if the charge of first degree murder is accepted in court. Which is possible, though unlikely.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Tre]

  Only if the charge of first degree murder is accepted in court. Which is possible, though unlikely.

In Nevada, can a jury return a verdict of murder two (or lower) if the prosecutor charges murder one? 

[Crusher]

In Nevada, can a jury return a verdict of murder two (or lower) if the prosecutor charges murder one? 

The jury must do what the judge instructs them to do.  Not the prosecutor.  The judge might instruct the jury to render a verdict of only murder one, or he may give them the chance to depart from the original charge and tell them they can opt for murder2, or perhaps manslaughter.  It depends on how the case plays out, what evidence is presented and, sometimes, what the state will agree upon.  Everyone must do what the judge says - he/she rules the court room.  In fact, the judge can choose to reject the jury's verdict.  They could find CT and KR not guilty and the judge could reject the verdict and send them back to deliberate!!

[Norton]

But is just someone stealing from you a bad enough reason to actually commit murder?  Think about it.

The theory that she was OD'd is much more believable.  That she OD'd and Craig/Kelly paniced knowing that news like that would bring heat on them with possible police trouble and sponsorship loss and quite possibly they were high too and not thinking and were simply trying to make the problem disappear.

I don't know, but it will really be interesting when all the facts come out.

This seems more likely than a brutal killing. But who knows. Three fvked up people leading fvcked lives.

[Norton]

(first time poster, long time on/off guest)

Puts a whole new light on Gross' involvement. Initial reports of merely handing over a gas can in the desert to Titus and driving him back wouldn't necessarily mean he knew about a murder. A lot easier to prove accessory being seen at Wallmart loading stuff in the back seat of the Jag."er..again, why won't this stuff fit in the trunk?" I smell a plea bargain not surprisingly.

Also, painkillers for the victim? just gets stranger all the time

Look here you  newbie, who are to open your mouth and give your 2 cents worth?













Just kidding. Figured I would do it before someone else did.

Welcome aboard.

[Tre]

The jury must do what the judge instructs them to do.  Not the prosecutor.  The judge might instruct the jury to render a verdict of only murder one, or he may give them the chance to depart from the original charge and tell them they can opt for murder2, or perhaps manslaughter.  It depends on how the case plays out, what evidence is presented and, sometimes, what the state will agree upon.  Everyone must do what the judge says - he/she rules the court room.  In fact, the judge can choose to reject the jury's verdict.  They could find CT and KR not guilty and the judge could reject the verdict and send them back to deliberate!!

Thanks for the explanation.  It's going to be almost impossible for us to get a history report on the judge, though, so there's no telling what he'll decide.  I know he can't pick sides, but I would imagine that he wants someone to be held accountable for whatever happened here.

[Crusher]

Thanks for the explanation.  It's going to be almost impossible for us to get a history report on the judge, though, so there's no telling what he'll decide.  I know he can't pick sides, but I would imagine that he wants someone to be held accountable for whatever happened here.

Actually, once CT & KR are formally charged with a crime and a judge gets adssigned tot he case we can definitely retrieve his/her history on Lexus Nexus.  The judge's job is to interpret the law, not choose sides It is the jury who will decide CT & KR's fate - even during the penalty phase, if there ever is one.  Few judges will have any sentiment for convicted murderers.  Remember Ted Bundy?  The judge liked him - would have loved to have had Bundy practice law in front of him, but "sadly, you took another pat, partner."  He still sentenced him to death.

[suckmymuscle]

  I find it highly unlikely that Craig will get the needle, or the chair. Capital punishment is usually only given ,to perpetrators, who committed particularly heinous homocides. For the death penalty to be given, there must be demonstrated that the murderer acted with both purpose and malice. Titus killed that woman in a fit of rage. This menas that, if convicted, he'll probably get life without parole, or maybe even only 30-40 years. In any case, he's screwed.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[bigdumbbell]

lets get some facts on the record and then decide the penalty

[Crusher]

<<Titus killed that woman in a fit of rage. >>

Says who?

[TJ-JD]

They could find CT and KR not guilty and the judge could reject the verdict and send them back to deliberate!!

What are you basing this on?

[suckmymuscle]

<<Titus killed that woman in a fit of rage. >>

Says who?

  She was stealing and embezling them. When Titus found out, he lost his cool and charged her, with great wrath.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[bigdumbbell]

doesnt that sound like justifiable homicide to you ?

[suckmymuscle]

doesnt that sound like justifiable homicide to you ?

  Yes, but it was not pre-meditated, or carries out with sadism or overt perversion. If Titus did it, is it murder? Definitely. Is it ABSOLUTELY a murder that must be payed, through the application of the death penalty. Absolutely not. If Titus had killed her by putting poison in her drink, or slowly dismembering her to death, then it would be a case for the death penalty. Believe it or not, killing out of rage is something that anyone of us could do.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[G o a t b o y]

Believe it or not, killing out of rage is something that anyone of us could do.

Of course.

But I wouldn't think many of us would be as bone-headed about getting rid of the body as ol' Craiggers was.

[suckmymuscle]

Of course.

But I wouldn't think many of us would be as bone-headed about getting rid of the body as ol' Craiggers was.

  Agreed. Craig was a dumbass. He should have immediately fled the country, or delivered himself to the cops. Doing, what he did, only worsened his situation.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Mr. Zimbabwe]

  Yes, but it was not pre-meditated, or carries out with sadism or overt perversion. If Titus did it, is it murder? Definitely. Is it ABSOLUTELY a murder that must be payed, through the application of the death penalty. Absolutely not. If Titus had killed her by putting poison in her drink, or slowly dismembering her to death, then it would be a case for the death penalty. Believe it or not, killing out of rage is something that anyone of us could do.

Was a toxicology report on the victim ever released?  (Could they even perform one?) Surely we would need to know if there was any chance of an OD ... especially if Titus tries to use this in his defence?

And "poison" was just mentioned which falls under premeditated-murder. Interesting thoughts.