Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: Princess L on December 10, 2006, 07:03:44 PM
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This works well...
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Or, another thing is to use word gimmicks. For example, in the morning before work, I remember "G FACE'M" (gee, face them)
G- GREEN TEA
F- FISH OIL
A- ACIDOPHILUS
C- VITAMIN C
E- VITAMIN E
M- MULTIPLE/MINERALS
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This works well...
Yah taking that many pills is healthy ::)
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Yah taking that many pills is healthy ::)
Yes it does help remind you to take your vitamins. Been doing this for years. And yes, taking this many pills, vitamins, minerals, herbs, etc. is great preventive medicine. It is a lot cheaper then getting sick and spending money on doctors, hospitals and prescription medicines.
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Yes it does help remind you to take your vitamins. Been doing this for years. And yes, taking this many pills, vitamins, minerals, herbs, etc. is great preventive medicine. It is a lot cheaper then getting sick and spending money on doctors, hospitals and prescription medicines.
Snake oil.... all of it.
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Snake oil.... all of it.
Another member of the "Flat Earth Society" emerges . . .
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i never noticed anything from taking vitamins so i stopped.
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i never noticed anything from taking vitamins so i stopped.
So you reject science merely because you cannot witness first hand physiological reactions that happen on a molecular level? Again, "Flat Earth" (i.e., I can't physically observe that the planet is round, therefore the Earth is flat).
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So you reject science merely because you cannot witness first hand physiological reactions that happen on a molecular level? Again, "Flat Earth" (i.e., I can't physically observe that the planet is round, therefore the Earth is flat).
The vitamin industry is just as big a scam as the pharmaceutical industry
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The vitamin industry is just as big a scam as the pharmaceutical industry
Your rhetoric in no way resembles compelling argument.
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So you reject science merely because you cannot witness first hand physiological reactions that happen on a molecular level? Again, "Flat Earth" (i.e., I can't physically observe that the planet is round, therefore the Earth is flat).
science never came to the conclusion that vitamins help in bodydbuilding, just general health. Only bullshit companies that don't do any research suggest that vitamins will significantly help you gain muscle. Plus if you eat a variety of food you're getting enough. why pay for something that doesn't give tangible benefits ?
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98% of the vitamins on the maket are synthetic garbage and offer no health benefits. Multi's are useless!!!!!
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science never came to the conclusion that vitamins help in bodydbuilding, just general health. Only bullshit companies that don't do any research suggest that vitamins will significantly help you gain muscle. Plus if you eat a variety of food you're getting enough. why pay for something that doesn't give tangible benefits ?
Several studies have also shown that multi's provide little to no benefit for general health as well. Also too much vitamins have been shown to cause damage, even a surplus of anti-oxidants actually become pro-oxident.
Once again nothing beats what nature provides!
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Several studies have also shown that multi's provide little to no benefit for general health as well. Also too much vitamins have been shown to cause damage, even a surplus of anti-oxidants actually become pro-oxident.
Once again nothing beats what nature provides!
I believe you condemned as "snake oil" as you put it "all of it" which in the context of Loco's post means herbs, minerals, vitamins, etc. Above you are referring to "multi's" and then you seem to limit your position even further ("too much [sic] vitamins").
It seems like the Flat Earth Society can't even agree on what planet they're referring to, much less the shape of it.
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I believe you condemned as "snake oil" as you put it "all of it" which in the context of Loco's post means herbs, minerals, vitamins, etc. Above you are referring to "multi's" and then you seem to limit your position even further ("too much [sic] vitamins").
It seems like the Flat Earth Society can't even agree on what planet they're referring to, much less the shape of it.
They are snake oil. I stand by my statement. Any Vitamins/herbs that you get in pill form are a waste and potentially harmful
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science never came to the conclusion that vitamins help in bodydbuilding, just general health. Only bullshit companies that don't do any research suggest that vitamins will significantly help you gain muscle. Plus if you eat a variety of food you're getting enough. why pay for something that doesn't give tangible benefits ?
Look at Loco's post again. I believe he said "preventative medicine" not "gain muscle." Do you take pleasure in fighting Straw Men or do you wish to attempt to defend the original point?
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They are snake oil. I stand by my statement. Any Vitamins/herbs that you get in pill form are a waste and potentially harmful
When I finally read something that resembles a coherent argument, I will be happy to reply.
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When I finally read something that resembles a coherent argument, I will be happy to reply.
Get your head out off your ass, you can't hear an argument from there.
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Get your head out off your ass, you can't hear an argument from there.
See Exhibit A above.
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" The real truth about vitamins and anti-oxidants" by Judith DeCarva
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v319/ostkuk/Thumb1000.jpg)
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How to Live Longer And Feel Better
by Linus Pauling (1901-1994),
was an American quantum chemist and biochemist and the only person to win two unshared Nobel prizes
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/0870710966/ref=cm_rev_next/002-3864928-0956001?ie=UTF8&customer-reviews.sort%5Fby=%2BOverallRating&n=283155&s=books&customer-reviews.start=11
Linus Pauling was first introduced to the concept of high-dose vitamin C by biochemist Irwin Stone in 1966 and began taking several grams every day to prevent colds. Excited by the results, he researched the clinical literature and published "Vitamin C and the Common Cold" in 1970. He began a long clinical collaboration with the British cancer surgeon, Ewan Cameron, [11] in 1971 on the use of intravenous and oral vitamin C as cancer therapy for terminal patients. Cameron and Pauling wrote many technical papers and a popular book, "Cancer and Vitamin C", that discussed their observations. After three disputed trials at the Mayo Clinic, Pauling, known for his blunt precision and candor[12], pointedly denounced Moertel's conclusions and handling of the final study as "fraud and deliberate misrepresentation" [13], Pauling published critiques of the second Mayo-Moertel cancer trial's flaws over several years as he was able to slowly unearth some of the trial's undisclosed details.[14] However, the wave of adverse publicity generated by Moertel and the media effectively undercut Pauling's credibility and his vitamin C work for a generation.[15] Always precariously perched since his molecular biologically inspired crusade to stop atmospheric nuclear testing in the 1950s[16], the 1985 Mayo-Moertel confrontation left Pauling isolated from his institutional funding sources, academic support and a bemused public. He later collaborated with the Canadian physician, Abram Hoffer, [17] on a micronutrient regimen, including high-dose vitamin C, as adjunctive cancer therapy.
As of 2005, some physicians have called for a more careful reassessment of vitamin C[18], especially intravenous vitamin C, in cancer treatment. The selective toxicity of vitamin C for cancer cells has been demonstrated repeatedly[19], [20]. The Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences [21] recently published a paper demonstrating vitamin C killing cancer cells.
Honours
1931 Langmuir Prize, American Chemical Society
1941 Nichols Medal, New York Section, American Chemical Society
1947 Davy Medal, Royal Society
1948 United States Presidential Medal for Merit
1952 Pasteur Medal, Biochemical Society of France
1954 Nobel Prize, Chemistry
1955 Addis Medal, National Nephrosis Foundation
1955 Phillips Memorial Award, American College of Physicians
1956 Avogadro Medal, Italian Academy of Science
1957 Paul Sabatier Medal
1957 Pierre Fermat Medal in Mathematics
1957 International Grotius Medal
1962 Nobel Peace Prize
1965 Order of Merit, Republic of Italy
1965 Medal, Academy of the Rumanian People's Republic
1966 Linus Pauling Medal
1966 Silver Medal, Institute of France
1966 Supreme Peace Sponsor, World Fellowship of Religion
1972 United States National Medal of Science
1972 International Lenin Peace Prize
1978 Lomonosov Medal, USSR Academy of Science
1979 Medal for Chemical Sciences, National Academy of Science
1984 Priestley Medal, American Chemical Society
1984 Award for Chemistry, Arthur M. Sackler Foundation
1987 Award in Chemical Education, American Chemical Society
1989 Vannevar Bush Award, National Science Board
1990 Richard C. Tolman Medal, Southern California, Section, American Chemical Society
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Pauling#Work_in_alternative_medicine
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How to Live Longer And Feel Better
by Linus Pauling (1901-1994), the only person to win two unshared Nobel prizes
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/0870710966/ref=cm_rev_next/002-3864928-0956001?ie=UTF8&customer-reviews.sort%5Fby=%2BOverallRating&n=283155&s=books&customer-reviews.start=11
Linus Pauling was first introduced to the concept of high-dose vitamin C by biochemist Irwin Stone in 1966 and began taking several grams every day to prevent colds. Excited by the results, he researched the clinical literature and published "Vitamin C and the Common Cold" in 1970. He began a long clinical collaboration with the British cancer surgeon, Ewan Cameron, [11] in 1971 on the use of intravenous and oral vitamin C as cancer therapy for terminal patients. Cameron and Pauling wrote many technical papers and a popular book, "Cancer and Vitamin C", that discussed their observations. After three disputed trials at the Mayo Clinic, Pauling, known for his blunt precision and candor[12], pointedly denounced Moertel's conclusions and handling of the final study as "fraud and deliberate misrepresentation" [13], Pauling published critiques of the second Mayo-Moertel cancer trial's flaws over several years as he was able to slowly unearth some of the trial's undisclosed details.[14] However, the wave of adverse publicity generated by Moertel and the media effectively undercut Pauling's credibility and his vitamin C work for a generation.[15] Always precariously perched since his molecular biologically inspired crusade to stop atmospheric nuclear testing in the 1950s[16], the 1985 Mayo-Moertel confrontation left Pauling isolated from his institutional funding sources, academic support and a bemused public. He later collaborated with the Canadian physician, Abram Hoffer, [17] on a micronutrient regimen, including high-dose vitamin C, as adjunctive cancer therapy.
As of 2005, some physicians have called for a more careful reassessment of vitamin C[18], especially intravenous vitamin C, in cancer treatment. The selective toxicity of vitamin C for cancer cells has been demonstrated repeatedly[19], [20]. The Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences [21] recently published a paper demonstrating vitamin C killing cancer cells.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Pauling#Work_in_alternative_medicine
That article kept contradicting itself
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That article kept contradicting itself
How?
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" The real truth about vitamins and anti-oxidants" by Judith DeCarva
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v319/ostkuk/Thumb1000.jpg)
Apparently, the author of that book is a fraud:
"DeCava's writings also include The Real Truth About Vitamins and Antioxidants, an anti-immunization book, and a newsletter for professionals who prescribed NutriPlex products. Various biographical sketches have included "CNC, PhD" after her name and described her as: a "nutritional counselor" who served for many years as chief consultant for R. Murray & Associates; a "regular writer" for the Institute of Practical Biochemistry; and executive vice president of the Biomedical Health Foundation. "CNC" stands for Certified Nutritional Consultant, a dubious credential obtainable for $150 plus passage of an open-book examination."
QuackWatch
Your Guide to Quackery, Health Fraud, and Intelligent Decisions
http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/Nonrecorg/narb.html
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Apparently, the author of that book is a fraud:
"DeCava's writings also include The Real Truth About Vitamins and Antioxidants, an anti-immunization book, and a newsletter for professionals who prescribed NutriPlex products. Various biographical sketches have included "CNC, PhD" after her name and described her as: a "nutritional counselor" who served for many years as chief consultant for R. Murray & Associates; a "regular writer" for the Institute of Practical Biochemistry; and executive vice president of the Biomedical Health Foundation. "CNC" stands for Certified Nutritional Consultant, a dubious credential obtainable for $150 plus passage of an open-book examination."
QuackWatch
Your Guide to Quackery, Health Fraud, and Intelligent Decisions
http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/Nonrecorg/narb.html
Cool I get it now
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Cool I get it now
You get what exactly?
Judith DeCarva, the woman who says "do NOT take vitamin supplements" is a fraud.
Linus Pauling, the man who says "Do take lots of cheap vitamin C pills throughout the day for better health" is a well known American quantum chemist and biochemist, and the only person to win two unshared Nobel prizes. The man lived 93 years.
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You get what exactly?
Judith DeCarva, the woman who says "do NOT take vitamin supplements" is a fraud.
Linus Pauling, the man who says "Do take lots of cheap vitamin C pills throughout the day for better health" is a well known American quantum chemist and biochemist, and the only person to win two unshared Nobel prizes. The man lived 93 years.
Not worth your time Loco. These people are cult-like fanatics, not much different than the Hare Krishnas hanging out at the airport. They're not succeptible to reason and view everything that contradicts their views as a conspiracy.
Let me guess, his next post will still fail to respond substantively to your point and instead he'll lash out with some lame platitude.
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Not worth your time Loco. These people are cult-like fanatics, not much different than the Hare Krishnas hanging out at the airport. They're not succeptible to reason and view everything that contradicts their views as a conspiracy.
pot...meet kettle.
Keep wasting your money. Fools and their money are soon parted anyways ;D
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Apparently, the author of that book is a fraud:
"DeCava's writings also include The Real Truth About Vitamins and Antioxidants, an anti-immunization book, and a newsletter for professionals who prescribed NutriPlex products. Various biographical sketches have included "CNC, PhD" after her name and described her as: a "nutritional counselor" who served for many years as chief consultant for R. Murray & Associates; a "regular writer" for the Institute of Practical Biochemistry; and executive vice president of the Biomedical Health Foundation. "CNC" stands for Certified Nutritional Consultant, a dubious credential obtainable for $150 plus passage of an open-book examination."
QuackWatch
Your Guide to Quackery, Health Fraud, and Intelligent Decisions
http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/Nonrecorg/narb.html
Anyone outed on quckwatch, are the people that the allopathatic medical society fear. It is easy to call someone a quack if they don't fall into the allopathatic approach. Regardless, unless you understand how nutrients actual work, the requirements for each individual biochemical needs and the how nutrients and minerals can cancel each other out, you are just pissing your money away on commercial vitamins. Yet, to each is own.
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Anyone outed on quckwatch, are the people that the allopathatic medical society fear. It is easy to call someone a quack if they don't fall into the allopathatic approach. Regardless, unless you understand how nutrients actual work, the requirements for each individual biochemical needs and the how nutrients and minerals can cancel each other out, you are just pissing your money away on commercial vitamins. Yet, to each is own.
Well I guess I should pay the $150, take an open book exam and then I too, like Decava, will have the credentials to "understand how nutrients actual [sic] work."
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Well I guess I should pay the $150, take an open book exam and then I too, like Decava, will have the credentials to "understand how nutrients actual [sic] work."
You don't need too. Plenty of info out there to find out on your own.
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Anyone outed on quckwatch, are the people that the allopathatic medical society fear.
Now I know what these Whole Food cultists remind me of. See “The Heart Attack” in Seinfeld (Episode 13, 1991):
“George thinks he is having a heart attack but actually needs a tonsillectomy, leading Kramer to recommend a holistic healer as a cheaper alternative. Jerry warns George that the person Kramer is recommending had spent time in prison ("The medical establishment, see, they tried to frame him," explains Kramer. "It's all politics.") and that he should be treated by a licensed doctor in a hospital. After comparing the cost of an expensive operation in the hospital, and the holistic treatment he would receive, he decides to go with Kramer's advice.
When George meets the holistic healer, Tor, with Kramer and Jerry (who states that he is here only for comic material), he performs a number of unorthodox methods to determine George's real ailment, which he concludes has nothing to do with his tonsils, but with his imbalance with nature. Tor then concocts a tea that would remove his ailment, also prescribing that George take cold showers. George starts drinking the tea, and in the next scene he is shown being transported by ambulance with a purple face, screaming.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Heart_Attack
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Wow I can't believe that you are using a 90's sitcom to back up your arguments ::)
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Wow I can't believe that you are using a 90's sitcom to back up your arguments ::)
Funny, I don't remember you presenting any argument, much less providing backup for it. Anyways, it was for humorous purposes, Loco already handed you your a** on the substance for all to witness. Now we're just laughing at you.
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Funny, I don't remember you presenting any argument, much less providing backup for it. Anyways, it was for humorous purposes, Loco already handed you your a** on the substance for all to witness. Now we're just laughing at you.
Ok "MidniteRambo" ::)
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Anyone outed on quckwatch, are the people that the allopathatic medical society fear. It is easy to call someone a quack if they don't fall into the allopathatic approach. Regardless, unless you understand how nutrients actual work, the requirements for each individual biochemical needs and the how nutrients and minerals can cancel each other out, you are just pissing your money away on commercial vitamins. Yet, to each is own.
Hey, I'm an open minded guy. I actually wanted to read the book you recommended, but I found that it was out of print, had only one review on Amazon.com and when I did a search on the author, that's all I could find...that she is a fraud.
I believe that moderation is key. No supplements at all is too extreme. Mega doses of supplements, or "replacing" whole foods with supplements is too extreme as well. I have grown up eating healthy and I still do eat healthy today, but when I added supplements to "supplement" my already healthy diet, my health improved significantly. I used to waste more money on doctor visits and prescription medicine than I "waste" money now on "snake oil". And my "expensive pee" is beneficial.
I gain muscle easily, naturally. Unfortunately, I also gain fat easily, so I can't consume large amounts of whole foods to meet the same nutrition requirements that I meet today by adding supplements to my diet. Supplements are convenient too. Convenience is key in sticking to a healthy life style.
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Hey, I'm an open minded guy. I actually wanted to read the book you recommended, but I found that it was out of print, had only one review on Amazon.com and when I did a search on the author, that's all I could find...that she is a fraud.
I believe that moderation is key. No supplements at all is too extreme. Mega doses of supplements, or "replacing" whole foods with supplements is too extreme as well. I have grown up eating healthy and I still do eat healthy today, but when I added supplements to my diet to "supplement" my already healthy diet, my health improved significantly. I used to waste more money on doctor visits and prescription medicine than I "waste" money now on "snake oil". And my "expensive pee" is beneficial.
I gain muscle easily, naturally. Unfortunately, I also gain fat easily, so I can't consume large amounts of whole foods to meet the same nutrition requirements that I meet today by adding supplements to my diet. Supplements are convenient too. Convenience is key in sticking to a healthy life style.
I appreciate your even-handed approach and I'm sure I look heavy-handed by comparison. But when someone comes out and labels entire industries "scams" (and by implication, all who work in them "scam artists"), and attacks all (not just some) supplements as "snake oil," the people who take them "fools" and defends "quacks" on the basis they're being persecuted by a conspiracy of the "allopathic medical society," they really aren't entitled to any deference or respect.
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I appreciate your even-handed approach and I'm sure I look heavy-handed by comparison. But when someone comes out and labels entire industries "scams" (and by implication, all who work in them "scam artists"), and attacks all (not just some) supplements as "snake oil," the people who take them "fools" and defends "quacks" on the basis they're being persecuted by a conspiracy of the "allopathic medical society," they really aren't entitled to any deference or respect.
And I apprciate your heavy-handed approach. You have some good posts, here and in other threads.