Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: Tapeworm on June 07, 2007, 01:32:56 AM
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Why don't you ask me? :) I know lots and lots and lots and lots about nutrition, and then some. Did I already mention that I know a lot about nutrition - and also physiology, kinesiology, biomechanics, etc?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Ya got a lot of ground to cover here. Lets start with kinesiology - can you bend spoons with your mind like Uri Gellar?
;D
How 'bout egg yolks - when I go back to drinking raw eggs, is the cholesterol a concern or is it less of a worry if the egg is raw (as opposed to cooked)?
Also, how much protein/ day do you vote for, and in what macro ratio (assuming it's a training day and a clean bulk)?
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High Cholesterol is a made up disease...eat all the eggs you want!!
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High Cholesterol is a made up disease...eat all the eggs you want!!
And then die of a massive myocardial infarction! the link between high plasma cholesterol levels and heart disease has been well established in the literature. You are right that, during the Paleolithic Era, diets composed mostly of game. However, there are three key differences between the situation of caeman and ours:
1. Game meat contains 3% bodyfat - the animals that the Paleolithic cavemen ate ran wild and ate grass, compared to the modern ones that are created in captivity and fed corn and have up to 40% bodyfat.
2. Cavemen were physically active - A lot! They were always chasing prey or running from beasts that wanted to make them prey! You can't compare to the modern sedentary individuals.
3. They diets lacked simple sugars - This is the key difference! Whatever fat the cavemen ate was burned for fule, whereas the fat modern men eats accumulates in the arteries becuase he eats too many carbs that are burned for fuel instead, thus making the fat accumulate in the arteries. This is made worse by the fact that modern man also eats large amounts of fructose which is added to many foods, and this specific sugar raises blood tryglycerides levels dramatically, besides incresing glycation, which hardens the arteries and decreases the ability of the cardiovascular system to clean itself from accumulated saturated fats.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Before we can begin to talk about the real cause and effective treatment for heart and blood vessel disease, we must first look at what is known, or I should say what we think we know. The first thing that comes to mind when one hears about heart disease is almost always cholesterol. Cholesterol and heart disease has been almost synonymous for the last half-century. Cholesterol has been portrayed as the Darth Vader to our arteries and our heart.
The latest recommendation given by a so-called panel of "experts" recommends that a person's cholesterol be as low as possible, in fact to a level so low they say it cannot be achieved by diet, exercise, or any known lifestyle modification. Therefore, they say cholesterol-lowering drugs; particularly the so-called "statins" need to be given to anyone at high risk of heart disease. Since heart disease is the number one killer in this country that would include most adults and even many children. The fact that this might add to the $26 billion in sales of statin drugs last year I'm sure played no role in their recommendations. Or did it?
It was determined many years ago that the majority of cholesterol in your bloodstream comes from what your liver is manufacturing and distributing. The amount of cholesterol that one eats plays little role in determining your cholesterol levels. It is also known that HDL shuttles cholesterol away from tissues, and away from your arteries, back to your liver. That is why HDL is called the "good cholesterol;" because it is supposedly taking cholesterol away from your arteries. But let's think about that.
* Why does your liver make sure that you have plenty of cholesterol?
* Why is HDL taking cholesterol back to your liver?
* Why not take it right to your kidneys, or your intestines to get rid of it?
It is taking it back to your liver so that your liver can recycle it; put it back into other particles to be taken to tissues and cells that need it. Your body is trying to make and conserve the cholesterol for the precise reason that it is so important, indeed vital, for health.
One function of cholesterol is to keep your cell membranes from falling apart. As such, you might consider cholesterol your cells "superglue." It is a necessary ingredient in any sort of cellular repair. The coronary disease associated with heart attacks is now known to be caused from damage to the lining of those arteries. That damage causes inflammation. The coronary disease that causes heart attacks is now considered to be caused mostly from chronic inflammation.
Consider the following points:
a.. It has been found that about 80-90% of all cholesterol in the body is
endogenous (meaning: it has been produced inside the body and does NOT come
from the foods we eat).
b.. Due to the many different climates different ethnicites of humans evolved
under, there is a phenomenon called "biochemical individuality" trying to
pin-point high cholesterol as being the same for everyone is absolutely
impossible, just as trying to assign the same diet to everyone is impossible,
hence the need of Metabolic Typing.
Cholesterol raises due to any one of a number of causes such as:
a.. Inflammation most commonly in the form of "leaky gut syndrome" where the
tight gap junctions of the cells in the gut wall become lose allowing for
undigested food particles called "antigens" to be allowed to pass into the blood
stream triggering an immune response.
b.. Malnourishment by consumption of to many refined carbohydrates/sugars
(even the obese are malnourished!).
c.. Seasonal changes due to the fact that the body will raise its
cholesterol levels in order to lower the freezing point of cells in preparation
for winter!
d.. Excess stress by way of any of the primary 5 forms: PHYSICAL, CHEMICAL,
ELECTROMAGNETIC, PSYCHIC, NUTRITIONAL.
Paralleled to the facts above, cholesterol then plays MANY vital roles in
the body such as:
Precursor to sex hormones, vitamin D, and bile production
Powerful antioxidant to control free radical damage
Cell membrane integrity help maintain proper permeability
Vital to child development in mother's milk
and more.. ...
So, the question ultimately becomes: WHY is the cholesterol too high? (if indeed
is actually is); rather than: What can be taken to lower the cholesterol. If
your cholesterol is indeed too high (which again is very relative),
than the problem is not the cholesterol, as your body has raised its levels in
order to play some type of ESSENTIAL role(s) for your survival. The
problem(s) is the stressor(s) that originally caused the cholesterol to rise
abnormally in the first place. Your cholesterol may be high for a very
good reason(s), and this reason(s) may make it dangerous to tamper with
mechanically via drugs. The key is to rebalance the system(s) that are
operating under excessively stressful conditions to allow the body to lower its
cholesterol on its own. You need an assessment of your total stress
load.
The cool thing about our bodies it is made it so if we do have extra cholesterol, we'll convert it into bile in the liver and poop it out!
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Before we can begin to talk about the real cause and effective treatment for heart and blood vessel disease, we must first look at what is known, or I should say what we think we know. The first thing that comes to mind when one hears about heart disease is almost always cholesterol. Cholesterol and heart disease has been almost synonymous for the last half-century. Cholesterol has been portrayed as the Darth Vader to our arteries and our heart.
The latest recommendation given by a so-called panel of "experts" recommends that a person's cholesterol be as low as possible, in fact to a level so low they say it cannot be achieved by diet, exercise, or any known lifestyle modification. Therefore, they say cholesterol-lowering drugs; particularly the so-called "statins" need to be given to anyone at high risk of heart disease. Since heart disease is the number one killer in this country that would include most adults and even many children. The fact that this might add to the $26 billion in sales of statin drugs last year I'm sure played no role in their recommendations. Or did it?
It was determined many years ago that the majority of cholesterol in your bloodstream comes from what your liver is manufacturing and distributing. The amount of cholesterol that one eats plays little role in determining your cholesterol levels. It is also known that HDL shuttles cholesterol away from tissues, and away from your arteries, back to your liver. That is why HDL is called the "good cholesterol;" because it is supposedly taking cholesterol away from your arteries. But let's think about that.
* Why does your liver make sure that you have plenty of cholesterol?
* Why is HDL taking cholesterol back to your liver?
* Why not take it right to your kidneys, or your intestines to get rid of it?
It is taking it back to your liver so that your liver can recycle it; put it back into other particles to be taken to tissues and cells that need it. Your body is trying to make and conserve the cholesterol for the precise reason that it is so important, indeed vital, for health.
One function of cholesterol is to keep your cell membranes from falling apart. As such, you might consider cholesterol your cells "superglue." It is a necessary ingredient in any sort of cellular repair. The coronary disease associated with heart attacks is now known to be caused from damage to the lining of those arteries. That damage causes inflammation. The coronary disease that causes heart attacks is now considered to be caused mostly from chronic inflammation.
Consider the following points:
a.. It has been found that about 80-90% of all cholesterol in the body is
endogenous (meaning: it has been produced inside the body and does NOT come
from the foods we eat).
b.. Due to the many different climates different ethnicites of humans evolved
under, there is a phenomenon called "biochemical individuality" trying to
pin-point high cholesterol as being the same for everyone is absolutely
impossible, just as trying to assign the same diet to everyone is impossible,
hence the need of Metabolic Typing.
Cholesterol raises due to any one of a number of causes such as:
a.. Inflammation most commonly in the form of "leaky gut syndrome" where the
tight gap junctions of the cells in the gut wall become lose allowing for
undigested food particles called "antigens" to be allowed to pass into the blood
stream triggering an immune response.
b.. Malnourishment by consumption of to many refined carbohydrates/sugars
(even the obese are malnourished!).
c.. Seasonal changes due to the fact that the body will raise its
cholesterol levels in order to lower the freezing point of cells in preparation
for winter!
d.. Excess stress by way of any of the primary 5 forms: PHYSICAL, CHEMICAL,
ELECTROMAGNETIC, PSYCHIC, NUTRITIONAL.
Paralleled to the facts above, cholesterol then plays MANY vital roles in
the body such as:
Precursor to sex hormones, vitamin D, and bile production
Powerful antioxidant to control free radical damage
Cell membrane integrity help maintain proper permeability
Vital to child development in mother's milk
and more.. ...
So, the question ultimately becomes: WHY is the cholesterol too high? (if indeed
is actually is); rather than: What can be taken to lower the cholesterol. If
your cholesterol is indeed too high (which again is very relative),
than the problem is not the cholesterol, as your body has raised its levels in
order to play some type of ESSENTIAL role(s) for your survival. The
problem(s) is the stressor(s) that originally caused the cholesterol to rise
abnormally in the first place. Your cholesterol may be high for a very
good reason(s), and this reason(s) may make it dangerous to tamper with
mechanically via drugs. The key is to rebalance the system(s) that are
operating under excessively stressful conditions to allow the body to lower its
cholesterol on its own. You need an assessment of your total stress
load.
The cool thing about our bodies it is made it so if we do have extra cholesterol, we'll convert it into bile in the liver and poop it out!
What a crock of shit. Everything you've written is made irrelevant by a very simple fact: cardiopathologies were rare to non-existent until the introduction of modern diets, which coincides with the introduction of first fatty meats - from confined animals - adn most recently by refined sugars. All this suggests that it is modern diets that is causing the recent dramatic rise in cardiovascular disease, because all other variables are not likely to have impacted it. You mention stress. I'm sorry, but I think that living in constant fer of being devoured by animals is a much greater stressor than having a 9 to 5 job. Nothing except the change in diet can acont for the massive increase in cardiovascular disease that occured in the last century.
And you are wrong about metabolic variation. All Human Beings respond equally to diets across the range. All Human Beings, regardless of ethnicity, require protein for survival; they all have brains that use exclusively glucose as a source of nergy; they all require the exact same vitamins and minerals. There are a very small number of exceptions such as lactose tolerance, which is restricted to a small number of ethnicities, but a general rule Human Beings are remakably similar in their nutritional needs.
And the body does make cholesterol, but the point is that Humans are ingesting far more than they need of it fro the diet. And you are deluded if you think that most cholesterol is made in the liver: that could have been true a thousand years ago, but nowadays people ingest hundreds of miligrams a day and then don't burn it, which leads the cholesterol to accumulate in the arteries.
As for heart medications, the issue is more complex than what you present. No one is saying that you absolutely must take drugs to lower cholesterol; what happens is that certian drugs allow you to remove cholesterol from the arteries to a degre that is much greater than what is possible from diet and exercise alone. If you have a healthy heart and follow a healthy diet and exercise diet, than including a drug like pravastatin might decrease your risk even further. I am assuming that you have heard the term "preventive medicine" before, right? It basically entail getting something that is already good and making it even better by taking drugs/supplements etc. For instance, ascorbic acid is a marvellous substance, but no matter how much lemon juice you drink, you will only be getting a sub-optimal amount of it. As Nobel Laureate, Linus Pauling, pointed out, ingesting several grams a day from supplements prevents and in some cases even reverses several degenerative diseases. However, the doses necessary to obtain these results require supplementation. likewise, taking pravastatin even if you don't need it might have a protective effect in the hart that you wouldn't get otherwise. As an analogy, learning information and solving logical problems stimulate th formatio of dendrites in neurons and prevents dementia in octogenarians and nonagenarians. However, the same effect is observed by taking codergocrine and other ergoloid mesylates. Likewise, piracetam boosts dopamineric function, which tends to decline with age. Taking these two substances and keeping an active mind has shown a dramatic synergistic effect in preventing dementia in those of ver advanced age.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Dude, I feel sorry for you....you have no clue what you are talking about,.
Do you know what Cholesterol is? It's a Hormone that is produce from your own body.
Without it , we wouldn't be alive..
If you don't even believe that, than you are a long road to nowhere.
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Damnit >:( You'll be arguing about glutamine next! Good discussion tho.
You guys really seem to know your shit, even if you don't agree. Howzabout something every bb worries about:
Also, how much protein/ day do you vote for, and in what macro ratio (assuming it's a training day and a clean bulk)?
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Damnit >:( You'll be arguing about glutamine next!
haha..I did that already with my boy, Usmokepole! ;D
I might not agree with suckmymuscle but at least I respect him because he is the only one who will make the effort to try to debate.
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I respect both, Dr. D. and suckmymuscle. I like how they present completely opposite views. They both know their stuff and I enjoy reading their debates and I learn from them.
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Dude, I feel sorry for you....you have no clue what you are talking about,.
Do you know what Cholesterol is? It's a Hormone that is produce from your own body.
Without it , we wouldn't be alive..
If you don't even believe that, than you are a long road to nowhere.
Guess what? We need water too, but if we drink enough of it we wil drown! Did you understand this simple analogy? The liver also makes cholecalciferol, but if it made too much of it, our bones would calcify to the point where they would become brittle. Modern diets far overload the body with cholesterol that is stored in saturated fats, and this is made worse by the excess of simple carbohydrates which preclude the fats from being burned for fuel.
You also mentioned stress as one of the reasons for modern high cholesterol levels, but there is no eividence that modern populations are subjected to any more stressors than people from the Medieval Era who lived in constant fear of being killed in battle. The only thing that was dramatically modified in the last century or so is diet and sedentarism. There are no other factors. Is it a mere coincidence that the scourge of heart disease, diabetes, high systolic blood pressure and cancer increased by several fold since processed sugars and high fat foods became common in the diet and physical activity decreased? I think not!
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Damnit >:( You'll be arguing about glutamine next! Good discussion tho.
You guys really seem to know your shit, even if you don't agree. Howzabout something every bb worries about:
Protein requirements are determined by bodyweight and the necessary to maintain proper nitrogen blalance. I want to make three things very clear about protein: it is a really lousy energy source, it is bad for health because the by-products of it's metabolisation are toxic and their systemic elimination is troublesome, and finally that you cannot force your body to utilize any more protein that it needs. The only way to stimulate an increase in muscle mass is by stimulating muscle protein synthesis and protein does not have the capacity to do that. Protein is merely one of the many raw materials that the body utilizes to synthesize muscle, but it does not increase this process. The only way to utilize excess protein is by increasing protein synthesis, something that only drugs like anabolic steroids can do. Testosterone and other anabolic androgenic steroids work so well because they go inside the muscle cells' mitochondria and stimulate your DNA to syntheisize more muscle tisssue by increasing inta-cellular levels of the enzyme RNA-transcryptase. RNA is essentially a copy of your DNA that orders amino acids to be arranged in specific ways to make new proteins. Steroids and other anabolic drugs do that; supplements, including extra protein, don't. believe me that the best supplements that you can take are ascorbic acid and DL-Alpha Tocoferol, which scavenge damage done by the infalmmation process after exercise, increase levels of prostaglandins and decrease plasma levels of corticosteroids. No supplement works at increasing anabolism, but a small numbers of supplements have a very mild anti-catabolic effect. Besides vitamins C and E, the amino acids glutamine and leucine does show some mild anti-catabolic actions at extremely high doses. Is it worth it? Again, considering that the effect is mild and that you need lots of either to get it, it is up to you and your budget.
If you eat an excess of protein beyond what your body needs for protein synthesis, one of the two things will happen: it will get burned as fuel or stored as bodyfat. Now, it is unlikely that it will get stored as bodyfat, because the systemic metabolisation is so calorically costly that you would need huge amounts of protein to get it stored as bodyfat. If you eat an excess of protein, the amino acids will be broke down by protease and will be send to the liver. there, through and extremely complicated biochemical process called gluconogenesis, the Carbon atoms attached to the amino acids will be re-assembled into glucose molecules that wil be sent to your bloodstream. If the glucose is too much, it gets further converted into bodyfat and stored. The other by-products of the amino acid break down, such as ammonia, urea and Sulphur, are extremely toxic to the body and must be eliminated. This process of sytemic clearance puts further drain on the liver and also in the kidneys. In other words, eating alot of protein will: not stimulate and increase in muscle massand put a huge amount of metabolic stress o your body, both to transform the amino acids in energy as well as to eliminate the toxic wastes of protein.
As for how much protein you need, studies done with patients who suffer from severe muscle wasting disorders, like Duchenne's muscular atrophy, show that they require no more than 0.7 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight to maintain popoer nitrogen balance. And elt me tell you that wasting disorders, like AIDS, Duchenne, having third degree burns, etc, increase protein need far more than working out with weight do. I know that this is not what you want to hear, but the protein requirments of bodybuilders is not much highert than that of sedentary folks. Now, the caloric and carbohdrate needs of bodybuilders are greater because you need glycogen to fuel your workouts. However, the protein needs are only those necessary to maintain nitrogen balance and to fuel the little extra that the body needs to build to build more muscle. Everything else is pseudo-science used to sell protein supplements. Ask yoursel: did including whey protein to your daily diet make you bigger? Probably not, because eating more protein does not increase protein synthesis. As to what break-down you need between proteins, fats and carbs, this is very simple to determine. First, multiply your weight in pounds by 0.7. If you weight 200 lbs, then that means 140 grams of protein a day. that gives you about 560 calories a day from protein. Now, assume that you need 2500 calories a day for maintanance, and you want to gain muscle. Well, then you will need to increase your caloric intake by 300 calories a day above maintenance, thus yielding 2800 calories a day. So you deduct 560 from 2800, yielding 2240. Now, you need to get 20% of your daily calories from fats, so that's another 560 calories. So you will be eating about 1680 calories a day from carbs - preferably those with low glycemic index -, or about 60% of your daily claories. Hope this helps.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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believe me that the best supplements that you can take are ascorbic acid and DL-Alpha Tocoferol, which scavenge damage done by the infalmmation process after exercise, increase levels of prostaglandins and decrease plasma levels of corticosteroids.
I eat a reasonably balanced diet, take a multi, and take 500mg of C in the morning, but would you ingest C and E as pills right after a workout?
If you eat an excess of protein beyond what your body needs for protein synthesis, one of the two things will happen: it will get burned as fuel or stored as bodyfat. Now, it is unlikely that it will get stored as bodyfat, because the systemic metabolisation is so calorically costly that you would need huge amounts of protein to get it stored as bodyfat. If you eat an excess of protein, the amino acids will be broke down by protease and will be send to the liver. there, through and extremely complicated biochemical process called gluconogenesis, the Carbon atoms attached to the amino acids will be re-assembled into glucose molecules that wil be sent to your bloodstream. If the glucose is too much, it gets further converted into bodyfat and stored. The other by-products of the amino acid break down, such as ammonia, urea and Sulphur, are extremely toxic to the body and must be eliminated. This process of sytemic clearance puts further drain on the liver and also in the kidneys. In other words, eating alot of protein will: not stimulate and increase in muscle massand put a huge amount of metabolic stress o your body, both to transform the amino acids in energy as well as to eliminate the toxic wastes of protein.
What about when carb cycling for fat loss? I tried it once with very limited success. I found I couldn't sustain a good workout and I felt constantly overtrained... maybe I was just being a pussy. Do you think there's a benefit to heavy protein consumption for fat loss and muscle preservation? Or is it just insulin control and "thermic" food?
Now, you need to get 20% of your daily calories from fats
I've been getting 25-30% of cals from fats in hopes of keeping natural test maximized, since I'm 34. Any harm or beneft in going over 20%?
Hope this helps.
Definitely. Exactly the kind of answer I was looking for. Thanks man!
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I eat a reasonably balanced diet, take a multi, and take 500mg of C in the morning, but would you ingest C and E as pills right after a workout?
Vitamin C is worhtless if you take the regular version because it is out of your system in one hour. Take 2 grams of time-released version in two doses - on in the morning and the other in the late afternoon. As for the tocopherol, one capsule of 400 I.U a day is enough. Too much vitamin E actually increases oxidative stress rather than impeding it.
What about when carb cycling for fat loss? I tried it once with very limited success. I found I couldn't sustain a good workout and I felt constantly overtrained... maybe I was just being a pussy. Do you think there's a benefit to heavy protein consumption for fat loss and muscle preservation? Or is it just insulin control and "thermic" food?
Cycling is bullshit. What you get is an insulin spike in the day that you eat lots of the carbs in the cycle and have to start all over again. To lose bodyfat, decrease you caloric intake beneath maintenance level by 300 calories a day all from carbs, and eat only oatmeal and cream of rye as carbs to keep the insulin as low as possible.
I've been getting 25-30% of cals from fats in hopes of keeping natural test maximized, since I'm 34. Any harm or beneft in going over 20%?
Unfortunately, the Testosterone raising effect of fats only apply to saturated fats, and eating saturated fats as your fat source is problematic because it causes insulin resistance, which may stop fat loss even if you are eating only complex carbs. The ratio of fats, carbs and proteins is irrelevant as long as you have a caloric deficit. However, it is preferable to have this deficit from carbs to keep insulin down and so as to increase the protein to maintain as much muscle as possible. Otherwise, your body might chew up your muslce tissue for energy instead of the fat.
Definitely. Exactly the kind of answer I was looking for. Thanks man!
No problemo.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Unfortunately, the Testosterone raising effect of fats only apply to saturated fats, and eating saturated fats as your fat source is problematic because it causes insulin resistance, which may stop fat loss even if you are eating only complex carbs. The ratio of fats, carbs and proteins is irrelevant as long as you have a caloric deficit. However, it is preferable to have this deficit from carbs to keep insulin down and so as to increase the protein to maintain as much muscle as possible. Otherwise, your body might chew up your muslce tissue for energy instead of the fat.
When dieting, would you recommend cutting out sat fats as much as possible or is red meat a couple times a week a good thing for general health and muscle preservation? With daily cardio, would insulin sensitivity be increased enough to offset the resistance caused by sat fats? I love a thick medium rare steak...
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When dieting, would you recommend cutting out sat fats as much as possible
Completely eliminate it. The small boost of testosterone that it gives you does not compensate for the insulin resistance that it causes, which stops fat loss. Eat only two tablespoons of extra virgin olive oil a day over salad or a tea cup of almonds.
or is red meat a couple times a week a good thing for general health and muscle preservation?
It is good for testosterone, but terrible for health. For health, the ideal is to not eat any meats at all. I am not advocating vegetarianism, but vegetarians do live an average o 15 years more thna meat eaters.
With daily cardio, would insulin sensitivity be increased enough to offset the resistance caused by sat fats? I love a thick medium rare steak...
Daily cardio burns fat, but it does not increase insulin sensitivity. As for the red meat, it will certainly decrease the effectiveness of cardio to burn bodyfat because it contains saturated fats. Is it impossible to lose bodyfat while eating red meat? No, as long as you have a caloric deficit, but it does make it harder.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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When dieting, would you recommend cutting out sat fats as much as possible or is red meat a couple times a week a good thing for general health and muscle preservation? With daily cardio, would insulin sensitivity be increased enough to offset the resistance caused by sat fats? I love a thick medium rare steak...
Eat lots of red meat pal. EVERY Thick strong man ate lots. ANyone say diff is a rare cat (Bill Pearl is only one guy)
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Eat lots of red meat pal. EVERY Thick strong man ate lots. ANyone say diff is a rare cat (Bill Pearl is only one guy)
Not for fat loss. Read my thread. I know a lot more about nutrition than you do, so be a good humble student and don't give advice you're not entitled to give. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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:'(
Diet time is still several weeks away, so I'll enjoy the steaks while I can. Thanks man.
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Not for fat loss. Read my thread. I know a lot more about nutrition than you do, so be a good humble student and don't give advice you're not entitled to give. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
First Off Fuck You!
2nd off, unless he's ripping up in final weeks to contest, lean beef wont hurt him.
I recall hes asking about getting biger not so long ago...
Ive never seen too many thick male athletes that DONT like beef! Including fatty stuff like T-bones and Porterhouse
in the off season. Look at any farm community. MOST EVERY one of them boys is thick. WHat do they Eat?
Beef, eggs, chicken, RAW 100% Fat milk...
Almost ALL vegitarians look like SHIT in short order.
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Ya trab, giving myself another couple months to gain before worrying about dieting. Seems like so many guys fall down there and lose muscle and fat 1 to 1, lifts drop, etc, so I want to get it done right when the time comes.
Still waiting on results from my doc. ::) Going that way would dictate it's own schedual obviously.
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Ya trab, giving myself another couple months to gain before worrying about dieting. Seems like so many guys fall down there and lose muscle and fat 1 to 1, lifts drop, etc, so I want to get it done right when the time comes.
Still waiting on results from my doc. ::) Going that way would dictate it's own schedual obviously.
Anabolics REALLY shine in the PRESERVATION of muscle under starvation. Hell, they was 1st major used after
WW II on concentration camp survivors.
You wouldnt believe the SHIT some competitors eat and are still pretty ripped.
Walking pharmacy.
Plenty of big strong Natural guys can bulk up impressive beef, dieting it down is where it turns impossible.
Body treats fat like Gold at the expense of muscle.
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suckmydick, you are an idiot.
Thank you.
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First Off Fuck You!
Typical response of someone who can't hold an argument. ::)
2nd off, unless he's ripping up in final weeks to contest, lean beef wont hurt him.
That's exactly the thing, you dipshit: he did mention that he wanted to lose weight. Read before you post, dumbass. ::)
I recall hes asking about getting biger not so long ago...
Irrelevant, since the question that he asked me was about whether he can lose fat while eating red. He didn't ask me if it is good for putting on muscle mass. Lol...moron. :o
Ive never seen too many thick male athletes that DONT like beef! Including fatty stuff like T-bones and Porterhouse
Yawn...sophomoric argument. The issue is fat loss, not muscle gain. Red meat is good to put on mass during bulking phases, yes, but not for fat loss. And btw, no, you do not need red meat to put on muscle mass. ;)
in the off season.
In the offseason means that they are not losing bodyfat, you incredible moron. :-X
Look at any farm community. MOST EVERY one of them boys is thick. WHat do they Eat?
Anectodal evidence. I can show you pictures of guys who only eat egg whites and turkey breasts who carry 30 lbs of muscle more than these farm boys(nice example, by the way. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ah...) without drugs. ;)
Beef, eggs, chicken, RAW 100% Fat milk...
Yes, and they carry around 15-20% bodyfat. And they are in many cases smaller than guys who only eat lean meats. You're one dumb bunny, aren't you? :-\
Almost ALL vegitarians look like SHIT in short order.
First of all, I don't advocate vegetarianism. Secondly, he asked if beef is good for health, and I replied that the ideal for health is to not eat meat at all. Vegetarians do live an average of 15 years more than meat eaters, so they must be doing something right. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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suckmydick, you are an idiot.
Thank you.
Monkey I.Q meltdown! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Typical response of someone who can't hold an argument. ::)
That's exactly the thing, you dipshit: he did mention that he wanted to lose weight. Read before you post, dumbass. ::)
Irrelevant, since the question that he asked me was about whether he can lose fat while eating red. He didn't ask me if it is good for putting on muscle mass. Lol...moron. :o
Yawn...sophomoric argument. The issue is fat loss, not muscle gain. Red meat is good to put on mass during bulking phases, yes, but not for fat loss. And btw, no, you do not need red meat to put on muscle mass. ;)
In the offseason means that they are not losing bodyfat, you incredible moron. :-X
Anectodal evidence. I can show you pictures of guys who only eat egg whites and turkey breasts who carry 30 lbs of muscle more than these farm boys(nice example, by the way. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ah...) without drugs. ;)
Yes, and they carry around 15-20% bodyfat. And they are in many cases smaller than guys who only eat lean meats. You're one dumb bunny, aren't you? :-\
First of all, I don't advocate vegetarianism. Secondly, he asked if beef is good for health, and I replied that the ideal for health is to not eat meat at all. Vegetarians do live an average of 15 years more than meat eaters, so they must be doing something right. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
YOu are nothing but eye strain.
He was asking me about getting bigger a day ago.
Your overthinking all this nutrition. Ever see Lee priest eat a carton of dughnuts?
Want to get big? Eat Big. Go eat w/ some big strong dudes. Tip they love Beef.
You Know what research shows? what the People paying for it want it to show.
Eat Lots of Beef and fat to the point you just start to lose abs in off season, till you big enough to cut it up.
Ripped looks like shit on small guys anyway. Get some nice puffy muscle w/ good deffinition.
Enough Swim team.
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the question that he asked me was about whether he can lose fat while eating red. He didn't ask me if it is good for putting on muscle mass.
Although I'm eating for clean gains at the moment, I need to find out more about how to diet effectively. I can lift more each week but size & weight gains are slow, so I want to learn as much as I can about preserving muscle in cal debt. I'm semi-ectomorphic so keeping muscle when dieting is a challenge.
Note: I'm happy with my current calories and am fairly satisfied (not that I claim to know it all) that my current rate of gains is a good balance of progress/fat gain for me - additional cals just grow blubber.
Anabolics REALLY shine in the PRESERVATION of muscle under starvation. Hell, they was 1st major used after
WW II on concentration camp survivors.
You wouldnt believe the SHIT some competitors eat and are still pretty ripped.
Walking pharmacy.
Plenty of big strong Natural guys can bulk up impressive beef, dieting it down is where it turns impossible.
Body treats fat like Gold at the expense of muscle.
I'm suprised TA hasn't shown us these guys eating his "diet" ::).
I don't mind eating clean anyway. I'm not tempted by junk that others seem to be, like fast food. It tastes like crap and you know what's in that shit?!? I'll have to quit having a beer with dinner I guess, but that's no big deal either.
If I were to use AAS, I'd probably use it to bulk. I've got a feeling that my dieting needs to be slow 'n gradual, even crazy slow like 1/3 to 1/2 lb per week. Trying to get it done too quickly has gone badly in the past.
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Want to get big? Eat Big. Go eat w/ some big strong dudes. Tip they love Beef.
I eat beef 4 or 5 days/week at the moment, red meat almost every day (lamb if not beef). Not huge quantities, but it's for dinner (meal 5 of 6).
I agree that undereating is suicide, but overeating is ultimately inefficient for me - pile on too much fat and you'll lose time dieting. In the end, I try to eat what I require to feed growth without going hog wild. Don't worry trab, I'm not one of these guys who panics about "losing my abs." ;D
Some speculation: As we eat more, we make gains and increase metabolism, which increases the calorie "ceiling" - so our needs change as we progress (in addition to daily variances which alter calorie needs).
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Fat aint easy to get rid of that sure, so being carefull dont hurt.
But if you look at any massive BBer in Off Season, they Look along the lines of That Big Alex's Photos that are on here. Its simply impossible to gain much size and look like Zane in contest shape.
Now, Alex's look dont look good on a small boned dude either. We need work w/ what we got.
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Everything change as U progress, training, eating, recovery. Need be flexable.
Fast food has very poor Protine quality IMO. Try avoid if possible.
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The name of this thread is "Ask Suckmymuscle". I don't mind debating people who are intelligent and knowledgeable, like Dr.De, but Trab is a moron and really not worthy of my time and effort - the stupidity of what he spills is too easy to prove wrong. Follow his"advice" at your own peril. I am a personal trainer who has personally trained and prepared over 300 bodybuilders for bodybuilding contests, including three guys who competed in the Nationals, I have a degree in kinesiology and am applying for my doctorate degree in physiology.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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The name of this thread is "Ask Suckmymuscle". I don't mind debating people who are intelligent and knowledgeable, like Dr.De, but Trab is a moron and really not worthy of my time and effort - the stupidity of what he spills is too easy to prove wrong. Follow his"advice" at your own peril. I am a personal trainer who has personally trained and prepared over 300 bodybuilders for bodybuilding contests, including three guys who competed in the Nationals, I have a degree in kinesiology and am applying for my doctorate degree in physiology.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
YOu are a personal trainer speaks volumes.
Degrees dont cause much hypertrophy. Want to get big? watch big guys and do what they do Not swim instructers!
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YOu are a personal trainer speaks volumes.
Degrees dont cause much hypertrophy. Want to get big? watch big guys and do what they do Not swim instructers!
::)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Typical response of someone who can't hold an argument. ::)
That's exactly the thing, you dipshit: he did mention that he wanted to lose weight. Read before you post, dumbass. ::)
Irrelevant, since the question that he asked me was about whether he can lose fat while eating red. He didn't ask me if it is good for putting on muscle mass. Lol...moron. :o
Yawn...sophomoric argument. The issue is fat loss, not muscle gain. Red meat is good to put on mass during bulking phases, yes, but not for fat loss. And btw, no, you do not need red meat to put on muscle mass. ;)
In the offseason means that they are not losing bodyfat, you incredible moron. :-X
Anectodal evidence. I can show you pictures of guys who only eat egg whites and turkey breasts who carry 30 lbs of muscle more than these farm boys(nice example, by the way. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ah...) without drugs. ;)
Yes, and they carry around 15-20% bodyfat. And they are in many cases smaller than guys who only eat lean meats. You're one dumb bunny, aren't you? :-\
First of all, I don't advocate vegetarianism. Secondly, he asked if beef is good for health, and I replied that the ideal for health is to not eat meat at all. Vegetarians do live an average of 15 years more than meat eaters, so they must be doing something right. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
brutal self owning, smm.
You are quite easy with the swearing yourself. (I know i am too, but that's a different thing, in fact you did not notice. I flame to flame, not to win arguments like you do. )
You put a lot of effort into this and think you are quite knowledgeable, but in fact you write a lot of shit, you know that...?
maybe you shouldn't be so fast with trab, tapeworm and the doc -- they all know quite a bit about nutrition too.
You are on the way of making an ass off youself and you'll lose credibility on the way.
You look like one of these militant vegetarians.
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brutal self owning, smm.
You are quite easy with the swearing yourself. (I know i am too, but that's a different thing, in fact you did not notice. I flame to flame, not to win arguments like you do. )
You put a lot of effort into this and think you are quite knowledgeable, but in fact you write a lot of shit, you know that...?
maybe you shouldn't be so fast with trab, tapeworm and the doc -- they all know quite a bit about nutrition too.
You are on the way of making an ass off youself and you'll lose credibility on the way.
You look like one of these militant vegetarians.
You insulted me out of the blank, and I wasn't even talking to you. And no, the only one who got owned was "trab", and then you for agreeing with him. He didn't even know what I was replying to, which is the epitome of stupidity. ;) As for me writing lots of shit, then by all means prove me wrong. Let's see. Just warning you that, if you try to argue nutrition with me, you will get owned again and again and again, ad nauseum. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
P.S: For the last fucking time, I am not a vegetarian nor do I advocate vegetarianism; I just replied to "Tapeworm's" question by saying that, when it comes to health, meat is not good for you. I was not talking about muscle growth. Learn to read.
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You insulted me out of the blank, and I wasn't even talking to you. And no, the only one who got owned was "trab", and then you for agreeing with him. He didn't even know what I was replying to, which is the epitome of stupidity. ;) As for me writing lots of shit, then by all means prove me wrong. Let's see. Just warning you that, if you try to argue nutrition with me, you will get owned again and again and again, ad nauseum. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
P.S: For the last fucking time, I am not a vegetarian nor do I advocate vegetarianism; I just replied to "Tapeworm's" question by saying that, when it comes to health, meat is not good for you. I was not talking about muscle growth. Learn to read.
monster insecurity issues. ::) ::)
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Vegatable? ;D
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I'm tired of arguing over the internet. Whatever, dudes. All of you who disagree with me can :-* my ass and be done with it.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Oh we Love you. I didnt even read all you wrote, but lots of theis nutrition gets overlaboured.
Cutting up, most guys ditch the red meat. Im sure yuou can find some that dont and even take anapolon w/ it right to contest and look HARD. Gets to be highly individual.
Ilike lee Priests practicle "This aint rocket science" approach. Train hard , eat and recover.
Oh, yeah,,, and take 5mgs of primobolan a month ;D
He eats crates of doughnuts and buckets of fried chicken.
I have low colestorol and eat eggs, fatty red meat cheeze etc. ALl this science gets overblown.
Yeah there some good stuff in it, but dont let is put the blinders on you. Copy big dudes is #1.
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I don't know enough to render a verdict, but I'm grateful for the info.
When cutting time rolls around (rolls, get it?... nevermind) I'll cut out the red meat, but I'll be enjoying it up until then.
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Oh we Love you. I didnt even read all you wrote, but lots of theis nutrition gets overlaboured.
Cutting up, most guys ditch the red meat. Im sure yuou can find some that dont and even take anapolon w/ it right to contest and look HARD. Gets to be highly individual.
Ilike lee Priests practicle "This aint rocket science" approach. Train hard , eat and recover.
Oh, yeah,,, and take 5mgs of primobolan a month ;D
He eats crates of doughnuts and buckets of fried chicken.
I have low colestorol and eat eggs, fatty red meat cheeze etc. ALl this science gets overblown.
Yeah there some good stuff in it, but dont let is put the blinders on you. Copy big dudes is #1.
Monster retarded, stupid, ignorant, absurd post.
~SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Monster retarded, stupid, ignorant, absurd post.
~SUCKMYMUSCLE
Dude, whats wrong there? nothing that aint true there. You got better development then Lee?
I dont think so.
Have you ever watched what guys that big eat? I have. It aint funny.
Cuttler says he spends > $20,000 yr just on FOOD! I believe it.
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Dude, whats wrong there? nothing that aint true there. You got better development then Lee?
I dont think so.
Have you ever watched what guys that big eat? I have. It aint funny.
Cuttler says he spends > $20,000 yr just on FOOD! I believe it.
Cutler is a hardcore steroid and other anabolic drugs abuser, and he eats that much food in the off-season, not to lose bodyfat. Are you retarded? The guy asked me if red meat was bad for fat loss, and I told him that yes, it is. Why can't you comprehend the difference between a sauced up pro bodybuilder trying to gain mass and an average guy trying to lose bodyfat? :-\
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Cutler is a hardcore steroid and other anabolic drugs abuser, and he eats that much food in the off-season, not to lose bodyfat. Are you retarded? The guy asked me if red meat was bad for fat loss, and I told him that yes, it is. Why can't you comprehend the difference between a sauced up pro bodybuilder trying to gain mass and an average guy trying to lose bodyfat? :-\
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Gee, I allready tried to Kiss and make up ???
BTW - ALL THOSE GUYS USE MINDNUMBING AMOUNTS OF DOPE.
yOU talks alot about "re-tard-eD" are you speaking from experience?
And again, talking and reading aint what does it. Observation and imitation will get you further than a pile of degrees.
What you hope to do with your degree BTW? Not trying to be a jerk, just courious. Good luck with it. Physical Therapy or somthing wouldnt be bad.
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Gee, I allready tried to Kiss and make up ???
BTW - ALL THOSE GUYS USE MINDNUMBING AMOUNTS OF DOPE.
This is exactly what I said! >:( How can you compare an average guy trying to lose bodyfat with a steroid abuser who is in off-season mode trying to gain muscle is completely beyond me! I t was you who brought the example of the steroid users and what they eat to bulk up and told Tapeworm to mimic what they do, you dipshit! :o :-\
yOU talks alot about "re-tard-eD" are you speaking from experience?
The only experience that I have is in identifying retards, like you. When a guy has no idea what he's talking about, and even what is being argued about, and yet still believes that he's right - your case -, then the obvious conclusion is that he can only be retarded. :o
And again, talking and reading aint what does it. Observation and imitation will get you further than a pile of degrees.
So imitating what a drug abusing bodybuilder does to gain mass will help an average trainer to lose bodyfat? My God, you're one stupid fuck! ::) :-X
What you hope to do with your degree BTW? Not trying to be a jerk, just courious. Good luck with it. Physical Therapy or somthing wouldnt be bad.
I'll try to offer my advice to those who are humble enough to realize that they have no idea what they're talking about and need my help. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Olanxapine and Haldiperol - Ask your Dr. 8)
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Fight nice guys ;)
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I tried to kiss and make up :-*, he says I got bad breath ;)
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SMM, do you see any benefits to using high glycemic carbs post workout during the off season?
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SMM, do you see any benefits to using high glycemic carbs post workout during the off season?
First of all, excellent question. I personally think that the anabolic effect of drinking simple carbs after tranining to be very mild. It is likely that it will have only a very small effect on your recovery and growth. Insulin is exceptional at shoving carbohydrates to muscle fibers where they are converted to glycogen, but whether insulin is as effective in making muscle cells absorb amino acids is still not clear. The uptake of amino acids by cells in respose to insulin seems very small.
I believe that this is all dependent on the amount of volume that you do in your training. If you train very hard and heavy for a few sets - as you should -, then taking lots of glucose, sucrose or even complex carbs with a high G.I, like maltodextrin, after training will likely result in them being converted to fat, since your glycogen stores will be relatively undepleted. Conversely, if you do 20 sets per bodyparts training with lower intensity, then I believe that the simple carbs will be converted to glycogen. Even when it does get converted into glycogen, the improvement in recovery will be only mild. So in conclusion: if you do few sets per training, then you will get fat; if you do lots of sets, it might enhance your recovery slightly. Hope this helps. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I've tried dextrose pwo for a few months now and haven't noticed much difference. Tends to give me a headache too sometimes.
I've been thinking about going to boiled potatos (mid GI) pwo with some milk and eggs. Workouts are 40-50 minutes, no marathon sessions. Would this get the SMM stamp of approval?
Also, do you think pwo meals should be complex carb heavy for recovery, light on protein (15g or so) and minimal in fat? Or would you just eat a standard meal with your normal macros?
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I've tried dextrose pwo for a few months now and haven't noticed much difference. Tends to give me a headache too sometimes.
Like I said, the data does not support or shows only very mild anabolic effects from having simple sugars after training. My opinion is that it does provide some mild recuperative benefits, but that those wgho do few sets per training will experience more increase in bodyfat level rather than muscle mass from it. I don't think it's worth it.
I've been thinking about going to boiled potatos (mid GI) pwo with some milk and eggs. Workouts are 40-50 minutes, no marathon sessions. Would this get the SMM stamp of approval?
If your goal is to lose bodyfat - like you asked me -, then you should only eat oatmeal and cream of rye as carb sources. If you want to gain mass without gaining bodyfat, then simply increase your caloric intake by 300 calories a day over 6 meal. You need to keep your insulin as low as possible, so no potato of any kind, ever. Carbohydrates with a high glycemic index are wothless both for mass gain as well as fat loss. They are worhless for mass gain because they increase insulin which results in the carbs being converted more to bodyfat. Your muscle glycogen storage capacity is very limited, so carbs that get to your bloodstream too quickly will be converted to bodyfat because your body won't burn the carbs for fuel and your glycogen stores will be overloaded when that happens. As for milks and eggs, eat as many egg whites as you want, but eat only a few yokes a week. Egg yokes are very rich in essential amino acids and EFAs, and they have lecithin, which acts as an emulsifier and stops too much cholesterol from getting into your bloodstream, but they are still very calorically dense. As for milk: avoid it. Even if you are a Caucasian of Northern European descent - people who are extremely resilient to lactose -, lactose is still a simple sugar that causes insulin relase and increases blood levels of tryglycerides, which is bad for you. If you love milk and have no lactose intolerance, then drinking a few centiliters of the skim milk a week won't hurt you.
Also, do you think pwo meals should be complex carb heavy for recovery, light on protein (15g or so) and minimal in fat? Or would you just eat a standard meal with your normal macros?
Eating lots of carbs in one meal will simply result in bodyfat increase. There is no logic in eating more carbs in one meal than another, because the body will convert excess carbohydrates to fat. You should replenish your glycogen stores while keeping insulin as low as posssible. Like I said, to increase muscle mass without increasing bodyfat, take in 300 more calories all as protein, and keep insulin low. Hope this helps. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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great thread , keep going guys
________________________ ________________________ ________________________ __________________
TRUEPROTEIN.COM 5% DISCOUNT CODE > MOU110
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Eating lots of carbs in one meal will simply result in bodyfat increase. There is no logic in eating more carbs in one meal than another, because the body will convert excess carbohydrates to fat. You should replenish your glycogen stores while keeping insulin as low as posssible. Like I said, to increase muscle mass without increasing bodyfat, take in 300 more calories all as protein, and keep insulin low. Hope this helps. :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
SMM thanks for posting I thing your post are informative and I learn from them. I'm confused as maybe I did not understand your earlier statement correctly, why would you add the additional calories specifically to protein in the offseason? we have determined that to be a waste no? If I am allowed 600 calories from carbs for the day, and decide to split them up for my first meal of the day and pwo, are you saying that i am incresing the chances of fat gain by eating a larger portion of carbs for two meals than 100 calories over six meals? Thank you for the answers kind sir.
oh and by the way. Where in the world can I find cream of rye? and what does it taste like?
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SMM thanks for posting I thing your post are informative and I learn from them. I'm confused as maybe I did not understand your earlier statement correctly, why would you add the additional calories specifically to protein in the offseason? we have determined that to be a waste no? If I am allowed 600 calories from carbs for the day, and decide to split them up for my first meal of the day and pwo, are you saying that i am incresing the chances of fat gain by eating a larger portion of carbs for two meals than 100 calories over six meals? Thank you for the answers kind sir.
oh and by the way. Where in the world can I find cream of rye? and what does it taste like?
The reason why I suggest the extra calories to come from protein is that even a slight increase in carbohydrate consumption can result in bodyfat being deposited. I am not saying that your body will use the extra protein for growth; I'm saying that the body will need the extra calories for growth. Besides, if you read the post on page 1 where I discuss protein, I state that bodybuilders do need more protein than sedentary individuals for growth, but that this is grossly exaggerated for commercial reasons. As I mentioned, protein needs are based on bodyweight and the necessity to maintain nitrogen balance. If you're eating 0.7 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight - which is the most that studies done with people who suffer from severe muscle waisting disorders, like Duchenne's muscular atrophy suggest -, and the amount of calories necessary for maintenance, then you need an extra 300 calories a day for growth. These calories can come from protein, carbs or fats, but I suggest that they come from protein because it causes close to no insulin release, like carbohydrates, and they do not decrease insulin sensitivity, like most fats. The muscles do not need this extra protein to synthesize more actin and myosin filaments, but the body does need the extra calories to grow. Why? Physics: the only way to increase physical mass is by putting in more mass than you burn out. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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SMM,
I'm inclined to agree with your assesment of dex PWO. I've tried it for awhile and haven't noticed any difference in my rate of progress, but I think bf has been creeping up.
Your analysis of various GI carbs makes good sense although I'd probably vary my carb sources a bit more, if only for palatability's sake, but oatmeal has been a staple for quite awhile.
I've been looking into reducing my SHBG levels recently tho, and found that insulin can play a factor (also taking "grape seed extract" and trying to find some "nettle root extract" which Hooker, to his credit, indicated was helpful). I certainly agree that an accelerated rise in bloodsugar will promote fat gain, but I'm running an experiment to see if slightly higher GI carbs (no simple sugars tho) in moderate portions will do any good. I'll get another test near the end of the month. This SHBG issue is probably unique to me, or at least uncommon, so other's wouldn't have these concerns.
Come diet time (about 6 weeks away), I'll certainly return to strictly low GI carb sources unless I have some data which says not to. I'm not going to sabotage my cardio with high blood sugar.
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SMM,
I'm inclined to agree with your assesment of dex PWO. I've tried it for awhile and haven't noticed any difference in my rate of progress, but I think bf has been creeping up.
Your analysis of various GI carbs makes good sense although I'd probably vary my carb sources a bit more, if only for palatability's sake, but oatmeal has been a staple for quite awhile.
I've been looking into reducing my SHBG levels recently tho, and found that insulin can play a factor (also taking "grape seed extract" and trying to find some "nettle root extract" which Hooker, to his credit, indicated was helpful). I certainly agree that an accelerated rise in bloodsugar will promote fat gain, but I'm running an experiment to see if slightly higher GI carbs (no simple sugars tho) in moderate portions will do any good. I'll get another test near the end of the month. This SHBG issue is probably unique to me, or at least uncommon, so other's wouldn't have these concerns.
Come diet time (about 6 weeks away), I'll certainly return to strictly low GI carb sources unless I have some data which says not to. I'm not going to sabotage my cardio with high blood sugar.
If your goal is to lose bodyfat, then there are three things that you mut, by necessity, do:
- Discover what is your daily caloric need for maintenance.
- Reduce calories below maintenance by 300 - more than this will result in catabolism.
- Substitute all carbs for nothing other than oatmeal and cream of rye.
- If after two weeks your bodyfat hasn't decreased after you decreased claories by 300 below maintenance, then go zero carbs for one or two weeks.
- Do very low intensity cardio for up to one hour first thing in the morning On an empty stomach.
- One hour latter drink a carb-free whey drink containing 50 grams of whey protein isolates. This is your first meal. The second only comes 3 hours latter.
- Eat a cople dozen black olives a day or half a cup of macademias to get the monoinsaturated fatty acids that your body needs.
- Eliminate cyclamate derivated sweeteners from your diet, as they may elicit insulin response.
- Eliminate coffee, which contains several substances that inhibit prostaglandins and, thus, fat loss, and substitute it for green tea, which contains a large amount of the catechin epillogallactin galate, which inhibits the breakdown of norepinephrine and thus enhacnes fat loss. Don't drink it at once, but sip it throughout the day.
- Eat lots of organic vegetables, which are necessary to digest all that protein you'll be eating for muscle maintenance as well as to full your stomach and decrease food cravings.
- Take DL-tryptophan before bed to enhance sleep and recovery and decrease hunger - or eat some slices of organic pinnaple.
If you follow this advice, I promise, you will lose 1 to 2 lbs of bodyfat a week consistently. Do not eat medium to high glycemic carbs as they ruin everything, and do not cycle carbs - because it causes insulin respose and makes you go back to square one. Good luck! :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Some good info in this thread.
Thanks mate! :)
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What's your take on brown rice and buckwheat noodles, SMM?
Also, where do you get Omega3 fatty acids from? They are more important than the Omega9 and 6 you get from olives i think.
Thanks.
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What's your take on brown rice and buckwheat noodles, SMM?
Also, where do you get Omega3 fatty acids from? They are more important than the Omega9 and 6 you get from olives i think.
Thanks.
What kind of Scary stuff do them Jap-O-knees girls eat over there DK?
You ought to see what the poor villagers can eat in SE Asia :-X ;D.
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What kind of Scary stuff do them Jap-O-knees girls eat over there DK?
You ought to see what the poor villagers can eat in SE Asia :-X ;D.
I don't give a fuck about SE asia.
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YOu are a personal trainer speaks volumes.
Degrees dont cause much hypertrophy. Want to get big? watch big guys and do what they do Not swim instructers!
Worrd! I also am a big believer that people here overcomplicate nutrition...by the way...red meat = muscle....learn this and u will start feeding the body the right way....whole eggs, red meat , potatoes, raw milk even straight from the cow...add some good hormones and u got the recepy for a " beefy" physique...
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Great advice SMM. Thanks. :)
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i wouldnt go out of your way to eat omega 6 fatty acids as they are pro-inflammatory and our diets are already replete with them. i would opt for as much omega 3, dha,epa,gla as possible as the anti-inflammtory effect will have positive benefits on DOMS and muscle growth.
i avoid egg yolks, all omega 6.
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Worrd! I also am a big believer that people here overcomplicate nutrition...by the way...red meat = muscle....learn this and u will start feeding the body the right way....whole eggs, red meat , potatoes, raw milk even straight from the cow...add some good hormones and u got the recepy for a " beefy" physique...
You are 100% F'n Right!
It's all Pansy ass BS. Recall Lee Priest in front of the Doughnut Box, one in each hand?
Take a look at the Farm Boys in the Mid West by me. They dont make any weak ones. Most are thick and strong or wiry and strong. What they eat?.... Beef (Lots of it) Cheese, milk,EGGS, chicken, Pork, Potatoes and other fresh garden Veggies. You can look at 80% plus pussie ass American suburbs "Body Builders" and they will never have the natural thick muscle base of these guys who many never touch a weight.
Bulking? Eat as much high quality protine and natural carbs and enough fibrous greens to crap.
That's it! Or, empty your wallet to the Supplement Co's for nothing! ;)
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I don't give a fuck about SE asia.
YOU DIDNT ANSWER MY QUESTION YOU THICK HEADED GERMAN! ;D
It's Ok, Im part German, I understand we have thick heads....
Now What kind of shit do them Japonese Girls you Hump eat, Besides German Sausage?
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my dick.
;D
Post more Asian Girl Pics!
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What's your take on brown rice and buckwheat noodles, SMM?
Also, where do you get Omega3 fatty acids from? They are more important than the Omega9 and 6 you get from olives i think.
Thanks.
Bump for SMM, i would like to get an answer on this.
Also, i would like to have an explanation and proof how an artificial sweetener with zero calories can produce an insulin spike. If that was the case, putting plenty of it into whey shakes, creatine and other supps must be the bomb. Insulin without carbs, great thing.
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Bump for SMM, i would like to get an answer on this.
Also, i would like to have an explanation and proof how an artificial sweetener with zero calories can produce an insulin spike. If that was the case, putting plenty of it into whey shakes, creatine and other supps must be the bomb. Insulin without carbs, great thing.
Why dont you just inject insulin then, if thats what you want?
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Why dont you just inject insulin then, if thats what you want?
Why would anyone have to inject insulin, if you could have it all with a legally available artificial sweetener??
What i'm really trying to say is SMM is full of shit, he does have some basic knowledge on nutrition but mixes it with hearsay, asuupmtions and his own fantasy.
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This thread is a minefield!
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This thread is a minefield!
Yes, a minefield of dumb advice, lack of knowledge and insanity with a very narrow non-marked path of acutally valuable basical knowledge.
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Yes, a minefield of dumb advice, lack of knowledge and insanity with a very narrow non-marked path of acutally valuable basical knowledge.
Yup.
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Why would anyone have to inject insulin, if you could have it all with a legally available artificial sweetener??
What i'm really trying to say is SMM is full of shit, he does have some basic knowledge on nutrition but mixes it with hearsay, asuupmtions and his own fantasy.
What a contemptible individual you are: mean, petty and jealous. I ma going to answer your questions only to own your ass, you fucking stupid monkey.
Brown rice is good, but not as good as oatmeal or cream of rye because it has a slightly higher GI and more fat. The fat in brown rice is monoinsaturated and good for you, but it adds calories, which is not ideal if you are dieting.
As for artificial sweerteners, studies have shown that it's sweet taste fools the brain and leads to a release of insulin. It's not as bad as sugar in adding fat, though, because sugar releases insulin and adds lots of calories, which artificial sweeteners don't.
As for why bodybuilders inject insulin rather than taking artificial sweeteners, excuse me, but I assume you are jocking. Otherwise, this is the most stupid question I've ever been asked. Can you get any dumber? Can you? Simply because the amount of insulin released in response to sweeteners is much, much lower than what you get from injecting insulin. And furthermore, why should bodybuilders use sweeteners if sugar releases insulin and add carbs, which is the point of releasing insulin in the first place for muscle growth? Lol...dumbass. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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You are 100% F'n Right!
It's all Pansy ass BS. Recall Lee Priest in front of the Doughnut Box, one in each hand?
Take a look at the Farm Boys in the Mid West by me. They dont make any weak ones. Most are thick and strong or wiry and strong. What they eat?.... Beef (Lots of it) Cheese, milk,EGGS, chicken, Pork, Potatoes and other fresh garden Veggies. You can look at 80% plus pussie ass American suburbs "Body Builders" and they will never have the natural thick muscle base of these guys who many never touch a weight.
Bulking? Eat as much high quality protine and natural carbs and enough fibrous greens to crap.
That's it! Or, empty your wallet to the Supplement Co's for nothing! ;)
Trab, you are a moron, plain and simple. Crates of donuts?! Donuts are loaded with transaturated fats, the worst kind of all for the heart. It is also loaded with stale fat and refined sugar. Donuts are like a cocktail of things that are bad for you.
As for the farm boys - again with this idiotic example -, they are not lean at all. Most of them carry over 15% bodyfat, the result of eating - in your words -, "lots of beef, eggs and milk". There is no point in gaining muscle if you cover your body with lots of fat in the process. Lee Priest becomes a fat pig in the off-season an dhis bodyfat balloons to over 25%, which qualifies him as borderline obese. The only reason why he is able to lose all that fat in three months is because he takes massive doses of thyroid hormones, GH and ephedrine, a cocktail that almost literally melts the fat off your body. I never proclaimed to know everything about nutrition, but you my friend don't know anything and frankly has no idea what you're talking about.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Listen up. Those of you who find my advice to be worthless and are only here to stir up shit can bite me. Ok? I am not getting paid to give out advice, so those of you who don't like it can go f-k yourselves for all I care. If you don't stop trying to shoot me down I will just quit posting here and let you do as you please.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Lighten up Francis ;)
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Guys,
Please refrain from the personal attacks.
okay carry on ;)
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Trab, you are a moron, plain and simple. Crates of donuts?! Donuts are loaded with transaturated fats, the worst kind of all for the heart. It is also loaded with stale fat and refined sugar. Donuts are like a cocktail of things that are bad for you.
As for the farm boys - again with this idiotic example -, they are not lean at all. Most of them carry over 15% bodyfat, the result of eating - in your words -, "lots of beef, eggs and milk". There is no point in gaining muscle if you cover your body with lots of fat in the process. Lee Priest becomes a fat pig in the off-season an dhis bodyfat balloons to over 25%, which qualifies him as borderline obese. The only reason why he is able to lose all that fat in three months is because he takes massive doses of thyroid hormones, GH and ephedrine, a cocktail that almost literally melts the fat off your body. I never proclaimed to know everything about nutrition, but you my friend don't know anything and frankly has no idea what you're talking about.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Dear Dumbass, them Farmboys have a nat muscle base you can only dream of. They could also twist your neck like a bottle cap. You got somthing on Lee Priest? Ha Ha Ha...
Eat lots of good natural food, plenty of protine. Dont wory about some fat. You need put on some fat. Dont turn to a slob. Gettting as fat as Lee in that ad is hard for most ppl to lose. You overcomplicat the supject and turn it to VooDoo. You could forget all suplements except creatins, whey, and a multivit at the most.
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Suckmymuscle....I'll bring u down to planet earth....Lee priest off season eats similar to a powerlifter ...a big one that is...To illustrate that , I'll give u an example Mike Wolfe 860 lbs bench ...a top guy who helped me with my bench...who I kept pestering to tell me what he eats on a typical day...
" MW: Hahaha do you really wanna know that? Yesterday was Sunday and Max Effort day in Columbus. I drive 2 hrs one way to train and leave my house at 5 am. So my first meal was at 5 am it was 2 Bacon, Egg and Cheeses on a Bun, a Fifth Avenue King size Candy bar, and a Giant 44 oz Mountain Dew fountain pop. My second meal was at McDonalds around 9:30 am after we trained it consisted of 2 orders of Sausage Gravy and Biscuits, a Bacon Egg and Cheese biscuit, and a Large Cherry Coke(2 actually I refilled). I got home around noon had a protein shake, then did some errands. I hit the quikee mart while out got a Blue Slurpee and a Beef Jerky. Got back home had another protein shake. Then around 5 pm I ordered a king size pepperoni pizza(20 inches) from Westside Carryout (go figure) I ate probably close to a third to a half of that. Then had another protein shake around 8 pm and then another one at 10 pm. Haha I asked if you really wanted to hear it. My diet on the weekend is really hectic, thru the week it is alot better and more regulated. i'm just always on the go on the weekend so I eat when I can and it is never really healthy."
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hahaha. suckmycock is having a meltdown.
I feel sorry for you, dude. I really do. It must be tough going through life being such a mean-spirited little shit. Take care.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Dude, you are really only focusing on some things. And you are completely wrong about the rice vs oatmeal.
Oatmeal Brown rice
kcal 370 351
carbs 63 74
protein 13 7.4
fat 7 2.8
http://www.fitnessletter.de/kalorien/haferflocken/4937
http://www.vegan-star.com/downloads/naehrwerttabelle.pdf
Plus, brown rice has many many many vitamins and other good stuff. Your diet advice sucks. It's really better to warn people about the fact you wirte BS, and most of your ridiculous claims can be falsified in a second. :-* :-*
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hahaha. suckmycock is having a meltdown.
Dude, you are really only focusing on some things. And you are completely wrong about the rice vs oatmeal.
Oatmeal Brown rice
kcal 370 351
carbs 63 74
protein 13 7.4
fat 7 2.8
http://www.fitnessletter.de/kalorien/haferflocken/4937
http://www.vegan-star.com/downloads/naehrwerttabelle.pdf
Plus, brown rice has many many many vitamins and other good stuff. Your diet advice sucks. It's really better to warn people about the fact you wirte BS, and most of your ridiculous claims can be falsified in a second. :-* :-*
"Yawn"...the information presented in this graphic you posted is flat out wrong. I know for a fact that brown rice has slightly more calories, fats and a higher glycemic index than oatmeal and especially than cream of rye. Just because it's in print doesen't mean that it's correct, you dumbass. I can show you ten graphics showing different caloric values for the same foods. ;) Furthermore, it is in German, and my German is a little rusty. Like I said, I don't give a shit if you like my advice or not, so you can kiss my ass. :-*
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Suckmymuscle....I'll bring u down to planet earth....Lee priest off season eats similar to a powerlifter ...a big one that is...To illustrate that , I'll give u an example Mike Wolfe 860 lbs bench ...a top guy who helped me with my bench...who I kept pestering to tell me what he eats on a typical day...
" MW: Hahaha do you really wanna know that? Yesterday was Sunday and Max Effort day in Columbus. I drive 2 hrs one way to train and leave my house at 5 am. So my first meal was at 5 am it was 2 Bacon, Egg and Cheeses on a Bun, a Fifth Avenue King size Candy bar, and a Giant 44 oz Mountain Dew fountain pop. My second meal was at McDonalds around 9:30 am after we trained it consisted of 2 orders of Sausage Gravy and Biscuits, a Bacon Egg and Cheese biscuit, and a Large Cherry Coke(2 actually I refilled). I got home around noon had a protein shake, then did some errands. I hit the quikee mart while out got a Blue Slurpee and a Beef Jerky. Got back home had another protein shake. Then around 5 pm I ordered a king size pepperoni pizza(20 inches) from Westside Carryout (go figure) I ate probably close to a third to a half of that. Then had another protein shake around 8 pm and then another one at 10 pm. Haha I asked if you really wanted to hear it. My diet on the weekend is really hectic, thru the week it is alot better and more regulated. i'm just always on the go on the weekend so I eat when I can and it is never really healthy."
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I don't give two shits about your long-winded story. Hope this helps.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
P.S: Your body confirms what I'm saying as you are clinically obese.
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"Yawn"...the information presented in this graphic you posted is flat out wrong. I know for a fact that brown rice has slightly more calories, fats and a higher glycemic index than oatmeal and especially than cream of rye. Just because it's in print doesen't mean that it's correct, you dumbass. I can show you ten graphics showing different caloric values for the same foods. ;) Furthermore, it is in German, and my German is a little rusty. Like I said, I don't give a shit if you like my advice or not, so you can kiss my ass. :-*
SUCKMYMUSCLE
haha, yeah sure. Why do you always start to insult people so fast? It really shows your insecurity issues. I posted it in this thread before, you are very fast when it comes to insults.
Now, again you cannot prove me that i'm wrong, you blame it on the german and some uttered phases you give.
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Suckmymuscle....I'll bring u down to planet earth....Lee priest off season eats similar to a powerlifter ...a big one that is...To illustrate that , I'll give u an example Mike Wolfe 860 lbs bench ...a top guy who helped me with my bench...who I kept pestering to tell me what he eats on a typical day...
" MW: Hahaha do you really wanna know that? Yesterday was Sunday and Max Effort day in Columbus. I drive 2 hrs one way to train and leave my house at 5 am. So my first meal was at 5 am it was 2 Bacon, Egg and Cheeses on a Bun, a Fifth Avenue King size Candy bar, and a Giant 44 oz Mountain Dew fountain pop. My second meal was at McDonalds around 9:30 am after we trained it consisted of 2 orders of Sausage Gravy and Biscuits, a Bacon Egg and Cheese biscuit, and a Large Cherry Coke(2 actually I refilled). I got home around noon had a protein shake, then did some errands. I hit the quikee mart while out got a Blue Slurpee and a Beef Jerky. Got back home had another protein shake. Then around 5 pm I ordered a king size pepperoni pizza(20 inches) from Westside Carryout (go figure) I ate probably close to a third to a half of that. Then had another protein shake around 8 pm and then another one at 10 pm. Haha I asked if you really wanted to hear it. My diet on the weekend is really hectic, thru the week it is alot better and more regulated. i'm just always on the go on the weekend so I eat when I can and it is never really healthy."
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Thanks for the Photo Sev. Thats real world muscle mass there. Yes he's high BF, and strong as a Work Horse. If he got in in his head to diet down, and used Tprop, Stan, Var, Trens, Primo. Cardio.... It would blow the punk haters minds whats under the fat. That guys can pick up a frigerator and cary it up a flight of stairs I bet.
First you get big (Eating total trash will help) Then you refine. BTW SMM I do like brown rice and Oats also. And Pizza, and hot dogs, and T-Bones and Porterhouse steaks, eggs and cheese. I also have a 6-Pack comlete w/ setatus and intercostal, obliques... ;D
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Thanks for the Photo Sev. Thats real world muscle mass there. Yes he's high BF, and strong as a Work Horse. If he got in in his head to diet down, and used Tprop, Stan, Var, Trens, Primo. Cardio.... It would blow the punk haters minds whats under the fat. That guys can pick up a frigerator and cary it up a flight of stairs I bet.
First you get big (Eating total trash will help) Then you refine. BTW SMM I do like brown rice and Oats also. And Pizza, and hot dogs, and T-Bones and Porterhouse steaks, eggs and cheese. I also have a 6-Pack comlete w/ setatus and intercostal, obliques... ;D
Meh but how much muscle would he lose while losing the weight? I have to agree with SMM on this that guy is obese. I'd rather lose the fat first then go for the muscle. unless you enjoy wasting your time.
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Thanks for the Photo Sev. Thats real world muscle mass there. Yes he's high BF, and strong as a Work Horse. If he got in in his head to diet down, and used Tprop, Stan, Var, Trens, Primo. Cardio.... It would blow the punk haters minds whats under the fat. That guys can pick up a frigerator and cary it up a flight of stairs I bet.
First you get big (Eating total trash will help) Then you refine. BTW SMM I do like brown rice and Oats also. And Pizza, and hot dogs, and T-Bones and Porterhouse steaks, eggs and cheese. I also have a 6-Pack comlete w/ setatus and intercostal, obliques... ;D
guess what ?? he did diet down 80 POUNDS ! And guess what ??? I got both the diet and pics ...
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" Here is the first phase of my diet after I started working with Chris from At Large Nutrition. I dropped the first 40 pounds with just cutting out carbs after 1pm then it got a little harder.
So Chris from ALN stepped in and helped me drop the last 50. We have refined it some since then. We've dropped the Milk to water and Changed the 4th meal some. We added a few different foods to keep from getting bored. But the Protein intake is about the same we have just dropped calories as we get closer to my goal and deadline of July 15th.
As far as my training I still train the same way for my contest and getting ready but I have incorporated 3-4 20 minute Cardio sessions per week and some ab training.
We are doing an Article right now on dropping the weight and increasing my bench at the same time. It will be published in some mags soon.
Here is the basic diet plan from the start:
~5000 calories
Supplements: Nitrean, Opticen, Creatine 500, Multi-Plus, ETS, Thermocin
Meal 1:
Supplements:
5g of Creatine 500 mixed in orange juice (see below)
3 Multi-Plus tablets
4 ETS capsules
3 Thermocin capsules
5 whole eggs fried in butter (2 teaspoons of butter)
438 cals 30g prot. 5g carb. 33g fat
3 slices of wheat toast with 3 teaspoons of butter (you can certainly substitute a different kind of toast if you like)
297 cals 6g prot. 36g carb. 14g fat
1 cup of whole milk
150 cals 8g prot. 11g carb. 8g fat
1 cup of orange juice
110 cals 2g prot. 25g carb 1g fat
Totals: 995 cals 46g prot. 77g carb. 56g fat
Meal 2:
2 serving of Opticen (mix with a total of 8 cups of whole milk)
1846 cals 168g prot. 140g carb. 68g fat
Meal 3:
Supplements:
3 Thermocin capsules (depending on when you take this meal-don’t take the Thermocin later than 1 P.M.)
2 servings of Opticen (in water)
646 cals 104g prot. 50g carb. 3.4g fat
Meal 4:
1 Quarter Pounder with Cheese
510 cals 29g prot. 43g carb. 25g fat
1 small French fries
250 cals 2g prot. 30g carb. 13g fat
1 medium Coca-Cola Classic
210 cals 58g carb
Totals: 970 cals 31g prot. 131g carb 38g fat
Meal 5:
Supplements:
4 ETS capsules
2 servings of Nitrean mixed with 2 cups of whole milk
520 cals 64g prot. 24g carb. 18g fat
Grand Totals: 4977 cals 413g prot. 422g carb. 183.4g fat "
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Meh but how much muscle would he lose while losing the weight? I have to agree with SMM on this that guy is obese. I'd rather lose the fat first then go for the muscle. unless you enjoy wasting your time.
YOu will stay the same in your development. If you dont bulk, you will never change. Period.
Starvaton requires special steroid that dont retani water. ANtiCatabolics.
You go take shit to that man, He can kill you by strangulation in < 30 seconds with his non dominant arm.
Shit talk is all you have here.
If you want to stay bony and the same follow SMM's theory. Its basicly the old Wieder mantra. Totaly inneffective.
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YOu will stay the same in your development. If you dont bulk, you will never change. Period.
Starvaton requires special steroid that dont retani water. ANtiCatabolics.
You go take shit to that man, He can kill you by strangulation in < 30 seconds with his non dominant arm.
Shit talk is all you have here.
If you want to stay bony and the same follow SMM's theory. Its basicly the old Wieder mantra. Totaly inneffective.
i agree that bulking is necessary but you should cut first then bulk if your a beginner and sure he could strangle me with one arm but if i had a nice big sword i'd cut him up in a second and he'd never be able to catch me and one day when he gets old he is going have all kinds of flappy skin on him cause he's too freakin big i wasn't talking shit i'm just not down with eating quarter pounders with cheese and shit I believe you should get down to 10-15% bf and never rise above 20% otherwise you are just wasting time with muscles like that i could see how you could easily shed BF I believe in bulking just not at any cost it's never worth becoming obese. oh and yea you should never starve yourself thats just dumb and we all know that. I mean seriously why are we here going through the pain of working out everyday? so we can own the ladies am i right? I am so with every 30lbs of fat you gain you will lose 1inch of penis length? is it worth it to be that big and strong and fat if your penis is losing 2-3 inches of length(not to mention the fat hanging all over them when you fuck them i'm sorry but i'm seriously convinced that the thing the ladies care about most is belly fat) i don't think so i mean unless your goal is to be a big mean muscular fag catching mitt then go right ahead........
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i agree that bulking is necessary but you should cut first then bulk if your a beginner and sure he could strangle me with one arm but if i had a nice big sword i'd cut him up in a second and he'd never be able to catch me and one day when he gets old he is going have all kinds of flappy skin on him cause he's too freakin big i wasn't talking shit i'm just not down with eating quarter pounders with cheese and shit I believe you should get down to 10-15% bf and never rise above 20% otherwise you are just wasting time with muscles like that i could see how you could easily shed BF I believe in bulking just not at any cost it's never worth becoming obese. oh and yea you should never starve yourself thats just dumb and we all know that. I mean seriously why are we here going through the pain of working out everyday? so we can own the ladies am i right? I am so with every 30lbs of fat you gain you will lose 1inch of penis length? is it worth it to be that big and strong and fat if your penis is losing 2-3 inches of length(not to mention the fat hanging all over them when you fuck them i'm sorry but i'm seriously convinced that the thing the ladies care about most is belly fat) i don't think so i mean unless your goal is to be a big mean muscular fag catching mitt then go right ahead........
Frankly If you BB to get chicks, your wasting your time. Many dont like us.
Girls like guys they can talk to comfortably.
Want new muscle and strength? Got to Bulk. Then refine.Period.
Or, stay the same.
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YOu will stay the same in your development. If you dont bulk, you will never change. Period.
Starvaton requires special steroid that dont retani water. ANtiCatabolics.
You go take shit to that man, He can kill you by strangulation in < 30 seconds with his non dominant arm.
Shit talk is all you have here.
If you want to stay bony and the same follow SMM's theory. Its basicly the old Wieder mantra. Totaly inneffective.
Lol...the problem is that you'll lose all the muscle that you've gained while shedding off all that fat you gained while bulking up. Lol...dumass. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Lol...the problem is that you'll lose all the muscle that you've gained while shedding off all that fat you gained while bulking up. Lol...dumass. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Bulk, then refine. Just like a sculpture in clay.
You can not add any appreciable amt of muscle Nat eating lean.
Who are you favorite BBers just for interest? What body style do you admire?
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Bulk, then refine. Just like a sculpture in clay.
You can not add any appreciable amt of muscle Nat eating lean
.
No, this is the past. It has been established that you should keep bodyfat increases to a minimum while gaining mass, because wehn you diet to lose the fat you lose more muscle than you gained.
Who are you favorite BBers just for interest? What body style do you admire?
Sergio Oliva.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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.
No, this is the past. It has been established that you should keep bodyfat increases to a minimum while gaining mass, because wehn you diet to lose the fat you lose more muscle than you gained.
Sergio Oliva.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I also very much like Sergio.
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I welcome any questions you might have on the topics of nutrition as it pertains to bodybuilding. :) Questions from the poster, "DonkeyKong", will not be answered and posts from him will not be addressed.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Anything you'd recommend for someone entering a pct phase? I'm up 17 lbs and am leaner. I'm sure I'll drop some water weight, but I want to keep what I can.
I just came off a very light doctor prescribed 8 week cycle (250/week sustanon, 30 mg/ day anavar for the last 4 weeks) and am currently using hcg (1500iu every other day) and 50 mg clomid daily for 10 pct days. Also taking DHEA since my adrenals are too burnt out to make enough.
Obviously not too concerned with bulking or cutting, just securing recent gains and getting the system back to normal. Any recommendations?
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Anything you'd recommend for someone entering a pct phase?
Please elucidate what you mean exactly by the acronym "pct". Do you mean a fat loss phase?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Please elucidate what you mean exactly by the acronym "pct". Do you mean a fat loss phase?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Post Cycle Therapy
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Please elucidate what you mean exactly by the acronym "pct". Do you mean a fat loss phase?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Yep, post cycle therapy (or post cycle treatment). I've reduced training volume, which was pretty low already, since I overtrain faster than anyone I know since I have "adrenal exhaustion" (according to doc). Also eating a higher carb diet to try to avoid overtraining, but am being aware of portion sizes and carb timing.
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Please elucidate what you mean exactly by the acronym "pct". Do you mean a fat loss phase?
SUCKMYMUSCLE
lol...
and you have prepped 300 bodybuilders and 3 national level competitors?
lol..
bwahahahaa...
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I welcome any questions you might have on the topics of nutrition as it pertains to bodybuilding. :) Questions from the poster, "DonkeyKong", will not be answered and posts from him will not be addressed.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
pahahahaha, this is great.
you aren't able to answer my posts, that's all.
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Anything you'd recommend for someone entering a pct phase? I'm up 17 lbs and am leaner. I'm sure I'll drop some water weight, but I want to keep what I can.
I just came off a very light doctor prescribed 8 week cycle (250/week sustanon, 30 mg/ day anavar for the last 4 weeks) and am currently using hcg (1500iu every other day) and 50 mg clomid daily for 10 pct days. Also taking DHEA since my adrenals are too burnt out to make enough.
Obviously not too concerned with bulking or cutting, just securing recent gains and getting the system back to normal. Any recommendations?
To be honest with you, there's nothing that you can do. I would be fooling you if I said that it is possible to maintain mass you've gained while on steroids when you're off. Also remember that lots of that mass is not lean muscle tissue, but water that increses through edema. Steroids work directly in the cell mitochondria increasing protein synthesis by inceasing the expression of genes that produce actin and myosin by increasing levels of an enzyme called RNA-transcryptase. As far as I'm concerned, there are no nutrient that can directly increase gene expression like steroids, so there's nothing that can keep your lean muscle mass in terms of supplements. However, there is an exception to this rule. In several double-blind, placebo-controlled studies, the amino acid, leucine, has shown the capacity to increase protein synthesis mildly. It cannot compare to steroids, obviously, but leucine in very high does seem to increase protein synthesis by means other than gene expression. The other thing that you can do is take creatine with glucose right after training. This will help to keep the water weight you've gained - creatine stores water in the muscles. Furthermore, muscles that are hydrated represent the ideal environment for protein synthesis. So your best bet is to take very high doses of leucine - up to 40 grams a day -, and creatine with glucose right after training. Another very important factor is training. Do few sets of compound exercises past failure while keeping volume to a minimum. Volume cannibilizes muscles that are just comning off steroids. Good luck! :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Your a Idiot w/ no knowledge. Theres lots he can do to preserve muscle mass.
PM me, hes a fraud.
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Your a Idiot w/ no knowledge. Theres lots he can do to preserve muscle mass.
PM me, hes a fraud.
Meltdown.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
P.S: It's "an idiot" and not "a idiot".
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Your "advice" to him is a terrible disservice. Fuck the grammer. ;D
You may know sumfin about NewTrition, but you know nothin about steroids and are 100% wrong
with your comments.
Steroids ARE BBing. Get that thru your head now.
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Meltdown.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
P.S: It's "an idiot" and not "a idiot".
Go teach people about grammer, because you Know no-thing about's BBing!
What increadible idiot statments about steroids. Get a clue.
You knoew what Im sayin is all I care, boy. ;)
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Go teach people about grammer, because you Know no-thing about's BBing!
What increadible idiot statments about steroids. Get a clue.
You knoew what Im sayin is all I care, boy. ;)
double post meltdown
i would agree that some anti-es and hgh etc to kick the hpta into gear will perserve some of the muscle mass gained.
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double post meltdown
i would agree that some anti-es and hgh etc to kick the hpta into gear will perserve some of the muscle mass gained.
So, Ah... You ever used that stuff personaly?
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What a hornet's nest!
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Not a Hornets nest or a "Melt Down". If keying on the net qualifies as a "melt down" for anyone I feel
real sorry for how dull a life they led. Meltdown ought to be somthing REAL and Serious, and
baby boys have never lived life yet to even experiecne sutch.
ANd act as frauds to BS PPL about what they have ZERO experience about.
Way more steroid gain is keepable than you think... Just ask those w/ experience and knowledge and block out pretenders.
1.Tapper
2.HCG at the proper point for your body chemistry
3. ANabolics tappered
4. Clomid
5.HGH is wallet allows.
Then lower the carbs if you tend toward Fat, and lower Training volume and intensity. Compound mvmts
only. 3x a week. If you werer real Bony, special consideraton toward not overtrain.
Please excuse my grammer and smelling. Im a 40ish construction worker, BBer w/ much OCT Steroid experience from being around 100s of user athletes, not a pansy ass little boy pretender.
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Suckmymucle
What you think of the CKD diet?
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Please excuse my grammer and smelling. Im a 40ish construction worker, BBer w/ much OCT Steroid experience from being around 100s of user athletes, not a pansy ass little boy pretender.
Yes, I think that your spelling, punctuation, general knowledge, logical deductive capacity, capacity to infer and abstract, etc, makes it very clear, to the whole World, that you're a construction worker. Now, I can excuse you for your grammer, but I can't excuse you for smelling, because even the stupid should should know that hygiene is good for them.;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Suckmymucle
What you think of the CKD diet?
I think that it is too extreme. I see no reason whatsoever why you should eliminate carbs. It will give you no added benefit of extra fat loss, but it will certainly increase your likelihood of burning up muscle tissue for fuel. When dieting, the single most important thing is to decrease calories beneath maintenance level and switch the type of carbohydrates; what really matters is keeping the glycemic index of the foods you eat low. You still need crabohydrates to fuel your glycogen stores, and your brain still needs glucose to function properly - your body can make glucose through gluconeogenesis or by breaking down long fatty chains, but both processes are slow and ineffective and furnish sub-optimal amounts of glucose to the brain, which makes you sluggish, tired and irritable. When trying to decrease bodyfat, aim to decrease calories by 300 or so beneath maintenance and to lose 1 or 2 lbs of real fat per week. Eat only oatmeal, brown rice and cream of rye as carbs. It is also ideal to decrease the % of calories from carbs and substitute for protein, not because your body need the protein for muscle maintenenance, but because protein is more thermogenic than carbs, meaning that it takes more calories to digest protein than carbs. Good luck! :)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Yes, I think that your spelling, punctuation, general knowledge, logical deductive capacity, capacity to infer and abstract, etc, makes it very clear, to the whole World, that you're a construction worker. Now, I can excuse you for your grammer, but I can't excuse you for smelling, becauuse event eh stupid should should know that hygiene is good for you. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I dont care if you'z a Englosh Major w/ a PHD. You dont know jack about what you talk here, and my own Biz
puts way more money in the bank than your degree ever will - boy.
Now stick to your retarded followers and dont say a word regarding Steriods & diet and ppl may stop laughing so hard at your fraud ass.
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I dont care if you'z a Englosh Major w/ a PHD. You dont know jack about what you talk here, and my own Biz
puts way more money in the bank than your degree ever will - boy.
Yawn...you don't know how to tie your shoes, let alone talk about complex subjects like physiology, nutrition or endocrinology. And when did I ever mention steroids, jackass? I do know more about steroids than you do, but I never even touched the subject. As for you making more money than me, that's extremely doubtful. Construction doesen't pay lots of money unless you're the owner of a construction business. Since you've claimed to be a construction worker, you probably make minimum wage - I'm surprised that you even have the money for an internet connection.
Now stick to your retarded followers and dont say a word regarding Steriods & diet and ppl may stop laughing so hard at your fraud ass.
First of all, I never said anything about steroids. Secondly, I have forgotten more about nutrition and endocrinology than you ever knew in the first place. You are nothing but a low I.Q ignoramus arguing with someone who's smarter than you. You are also persona non grata, considering that you've asked me for advice in the past and now you're attacking me.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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So, Ah... You ever used that stuff personaly?
Stupid analogy. do you ask your GP if hes ever taken the drug personally? and if he says no, do you say you dont know what your talking about.
your stupidity is shining through.
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Stupid analogy. do you ask your GP if hes ever taken the drug personally? and if he says no, do you say you dont know what your talking about.
your stupidity is shining through.
dont even bother with this tool.
he's been exposed by as complete retard on several occasions in this thread and in others gone by.
i actually almost feel sorry for him.
wait a minute, no i dont.
he's an idiot.
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dont even bother with this tool.
he's been exposed by as complete retard on several occasions in this thread and in others gone by.
i actually almost feel sorry for him.
wait a minute, no i dont.
he's an idiot.
what i hate is brotelligence, like the best person to get drug advice from is a pro or some shit. thats why ronnie has chad, thats what jay has chris. its because they are uneducated in drugs, taking drugs does give you experience, but you cant see your lipid values, your liver enzymes etc etc...
being educated on a subject usually trumps experience, especially by meathead juicers.
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Frauds, pretenders, regurgitaters of magazine BS.
That what this gang here is. Little boys. ;)
That phony ballony mag crap is bad enough 1st hand...
Duh,, I train BBers. WTF is PCT... ??? Duh Duh Duh... ;D Fakes.
Run along little boys...
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Frauds, pretenders, regurgitaters of magazine BS.
That what this gang here is. Little boys. ;)
That phony ballony mag crap is bad enough 1st hand...
Duh,, I train BBers. WTF is PCT... ??? Duh Duh Duh... ;D Fakes.
Run along little boys...
do you enjoy a cup of chamomile tea and a mans company by any chance?
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do you enjoy a cup of chamomile tea and a mans company by any chance?
sORRY, I DONT WANT TO JOIN YOU AND SUCK BOY for tea....
But I do ENJOY INJECTING 4cc of Organon Sustanon and Deca...
I also like the pain of a hypo full of Tprop mixed w/ Stanozol...
That'd make you think you were gonna die, Boys.
Why do REAL top level BBers and athletes often ask me for advice on cycles and training and you sit and
wonder what PCT is? Ill tell you why, your frauds.
if they need hep w/ Tea selection, ediquite or grammer/ smelling - I'll refer theim to you punks...
They sure as hell wont take your training, eatin' or other matters of performance enhancment serious..
Hell, they (unlike me) are too smart to even bother w/ punks like you....
But seen as Im retired at 47yrs old w/ a nice golf course view in the country, I can waste some time on
screw'n with pretender little boys who copy out out of magazines...
Magazines full of BS thet have kept iron pumpers from reaching thier goals for decades..
Sorry bout the bad typing, bashed a thumb cuttin wood - a MAN's job you could never do... Boys. ;)
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what i hate is brotelligence, like the best person to get drug advice from is a pro or some shit. thats why ronnie has chad, thats what jay has chris. its because they are uneducated in drugs, taking drugs does give you experience, but you cant see your lipid values, your liver enzymes etc etc...
being educated on a subject usually trumps experience, especially by meathead juicers.
According to the moron, "trab", first hand experience is the only way for one to acquire knowledge. What an interesting theory on epistemology. Going by his moronic logic, we could not possibly know if the Universe is really composed of the same 100+ Elements, since we haven't visited each and every single planet and star in the Universe, collected samples from them and tested the chemical composition of the samples. LOL! This guy has just proved 2500 years of Aristotelean logic wrong. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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ffs ::)
I'm almost afraid to post in this thread by now. I'm tired of walking the tightrope so here it is:
SMM - I appreciate your advice. I believe you have some good nutritional knowledge. I thank you for sharing it and I'm sure I'm not alone in that.
Trab - Your advice has been helpful too. The consensus on the hardcore board is that you know your stuff and I agree.
I like a good flame war as much as the next Getbigger, but add some facts which will help the rest of us in our bodybuilding endevours while you're making the other guy look like a fool. Otherwise this thread has served it's purpose and the mods should lock it up.
Hasta la vista bitches. 8)
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According to the moron, "trab", first hand experience is the only way for one to acquire knowledge. What an interesting theory on epistemology. Going by his moronic logic, we could not possibly know if the Universe is really composed of the same 100+ Elements, since we haven't visited each and every single planet and star in the Universe, collected samples from them and tested the chemical composition of the samples. LOL! This guy has just proved 2500 years of Aristotelean logic wrong. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
How much did Aristhrotle bench anyway? ;D
He had some great arms I bet ???
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How much did Aristhrotle bench anyway? ;D
He had some great arms I bet ???
High high could Werner Von Braun jump? He couldn't jump more than 3 feet up, and yet he build rockets that reached the Moon. You don't need to do something to know how to do something. A skinny physiologist or exercise scientist knows far more about stimulating muscular growth than a gym rat. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE